Get rid of 8 hour windows for Notorious Monsters

[Calintzpso]

I prefer the latter since "actively" amounts to sitting with your thumb up your ass performing repetitive tasks and you don't have to have your thumb in your ass while you're waiting for an NM to spawn.

Kings, HNMS, Tiamat, Vrtra back in the 75 cap days would like you sit down and drink your cup of STFU now.

Cause 3AM phone calls for "Tiamat popped, get on or your kicked from the shell" really makes FFXI a hard game >.> Na it makes Real life with an enjoyable casual retreat(aka FFXI) a hard game.

I play FFXI to get away from retarded wait times, idiots, asshole bosses, and deadend jobs. So i can be somewhat happy and have time to collect my thoughts, all while having some level of social life.

I don't play this game to be like a inception of life. Of shitty life that when inside a game that emulates and takes on a shittier life to create a magnitude of shitty retardedness. So yes, the game should be dam near always enjoyable, regardless if I'm watching paint dry in my mog house or fighting the harbinger of a dev teams Mother in the game.

With the time frame you mentioned you played, i take it you never done any of the kings back then. You have no idea what the retarded wait times in this game has driven people to do or what people have done for this "so called" and "apparently justified" hard worked for loot and treasure.

High wait times like the HNM system has contributed to:

3rd party tools development, cause having my PC's whole screen locked illegally by SE until recently was a lot of fun.

Taking a break from real life. To obtain that Item that would maximize my character. Who needs sleep? Social life? Sex life? money for food? when I got this shinny ridill. (At this time, i'd like everyone to think about Pandemonium warden 18 hour fight, think about it, feel that stupidity, feel it, ok, now run with it. We should now all be on the same page)

Botting. Eventually some players got smart just like a criminal does(70% of our brightest people in the world are in jail for trying to beat the system, they just had poor moral ethics and choices to end up there), why sit around for days on a NM that only pops 1/3rd the year, and has a 1% chance of dropping an item. We've already burned the rule book with windower, why not piss out the ashes and just cheat/probably get banned/quit. Then come back and use the same tool to grind right back up in record time!

[FrankReynolds]

I prefer the latter since "actively" amounts to sitting with your thumb up your ass performing repetitive tasks and you don't have to have your thumb in your ass while you're waiting for an NM to spawn.

Then you either:
A) haven't built a weapon because your time schedule doesn't allow
or
B) Had someone else kill the NMs while you were AFK "BECAUSE FFXI IS TOO HARD!"

Either way, your opinion is now meaningless.

[Selzak]

You're insinuating that because someone doesn't want to put all 10 hours of their playtime into one sitting to camp ONE pop for their trial, that they are lazy.

That's not what I mean to insinuate. The point I want to make is that someone who doesn't put all 10 hours of their playtime into something that will benefit them later instead of instantly shouldn't expect to be rewarded higher than other players. Like it or not, an MMO is going to have the concept of working towards a goal. Some people don't feel like 'working' in a video game, and that's fine and totally understandable- but they can't turn around and expect to benefit from it too. Some people are willing to put in more effort for more reward because that's what's fun to them, and that's really all this is.

lots of irrelevant stuff

What does 75 content have to do with Empyrean weapons? The point I'm making is that they're not that hard to do. You don't need to set your life aside to build an Empyrean weapon unless you're trying to do it in two weeks.

Then you either:
A) haven't built a weapon because your time schedule doesn't allow
or
B) Had someone else kill the NMs while you were AFK "BECAUSE FFXI IS TOO HARD!"

Either way, your opinion is now meaningless.

Saying someone's opinion is meaningless is the best way to make yourself look retarded.

I have built a weapon, and it was easy as shit (specifically, I camped that exact spider NM mentioned here earlier). It may have taken me longer than it does most people, but I'm fine with that because it didn't require me to have any obligations while playing- something that I've never subjected myself to. It's because of this that I know Empyreans are fine. If someone like me, who refuses to let the game wake me up at 3AM (as mentioned above) for some mandatory LS thing can do it, then anyone can.

[FrankReynolds]

Saying someone's opinion is meaningless is the best way to make yourself look retarded.

I have built a weapon, and it was easy as shit (specifically, I camped that exact spider NM mentioned here earlier). It may have taken me longer than it does most people, but I'm fine with that because it didn't require me to have any obligations while playing- something that I've never subjected myself to. It's because of this that I know Empyreans are fine. If someone like me, who refuses to let the game wake me up at 3AM (as mentioned above) for some mandatory LS thing can do it, then anyone can.

No, walking in a forum and shouting :

FFXI IS HARD

I WANT A TOP-TIER WEAPON TO SET ME APART FROM OTHER PLAYERS BUT IT'S MAKING ME DO SHIT I DON'T WANNA DO. FFXI IS HARD.

is the best way to make yourself look retarded.

I say your opinion is irrelevant because you clearly did your trials by having someone in party kill the nms while you were AFK. Which is a perfectly fine way to get them done. But it doesn't earn you the right to call anyone lazy, and it certainly doesn't mean that anyone should care about your opinion.

[Selzak]

I say your opinion is irrelevant because you clearly did your trials by having someone in party kill the nms while you were AFK.

Oh ok, then you're just wrong and like to jump to your own conclusions. Most people do that, I'm sorry for saying it was retarded. Also, something doesn't automatically become an opinion because people are arguing about it. It's a very aggravating misconception that people have here.

But it doesn't earn you the right to call anyone lazy, and it certainly doesn't mean that anyone should care about your opinion.

I called people short-sighted and pointed out that for accomplishment to exist in this game you have to include sacrificing immediate enjoyment for future enjoyment. If anything, playing a video game in the first place is lazy.

Spending your time 'inefficiently' and expecting to benefit from it is just short-sighted, it's not lazy. If we each have 15 hours to play a week, and I spend mine building a powerful weapon and you spend yours having fun that doesn't make you lazy...it just makes my character better than yours eventually. That's how shit works, it's how it should work, and it's how it will work in any legitimate MMO.

This is the same old, "I want good gear, but I don't like to farm for gil because it's not fun!" debate that's been in the game forever. There's nothing wrong with spending all of your time (or more of your time) on the game having fun and neglecting the less enjoyable aspects to build up your character, but you can't turn around and have it both ways because it cheapens the game.

Unfortunately, this whole issue borders on an economics debate and the level of intelligence on this board (for whatever reason) has been ridiculous since it was opened.


As for my first post: Compare it to the OP to get the context.

[Camiie]

Selzak, are you really saying fun cheapens a GAME? Really? Are you sure we're the ones missing the point?

[Selzak]

Selzak, are you really saying fun cheapens a GAME? Really? Are you sure we're the ones missing the point?

What makes the Test Server less fun than the real game?

[Camiie]

Your premise is flawed. You act as though it's all or nothing. It's not 8 hour spawns or press button for gear. There is something in between. You know that. They could simply compromise and adjust the maximum spawn timers just as they've lowered kill requirements for other Magian trials. There are other ways to progress in an MMO. In fact SE themselves have utilized these methods in various aspects of the game.

They have options that while obviously not pleasing to you, would make quite a lot of others happy without making the items free handouts like you seem to think they would be.

[Selzak]

Your premise is flawed. You act as though it's all or nothing. It's not 8 hour spawns or press button for gear.

I'm saying that it's easy enough as it is (which I think is self-evident by the number of empyrean weapons lying around) and that anyone can do it.

Then we got into a series of separate arguments (like the one you brought up) over things like whether or not it should require anyone to do something they don't want to.

[Glamdring]

Wow, I can't comment without sticking my foot in my mouth but the responses are hilarious. I will say this, you don't have to do the trials, SE isn't forcing you to complete them. Nor are they firing those who do to camp out on hours on end to finish a trial in one sitting. That's a personal choice if you want to stick it out and test your luck.

you forget, in PUG that have "elites" you are expected to already have fully upgraded empy weaps (unless you have a relic or a mythic), otherwise "you suck". since /blisting party members is counterproductive, the only alternative is to have the weap. ask the elites, it only takes a week at most. now add up the spawn windows and average them, you'll find that they take longer than a week before you even get to the aby mobs. So the real problem is you get BS quests in the game or BS advice here. Either way, most players aren't fond of playing with dung...