SE's stance on Cure V

[Lilia]

Don't be dishonest. Back in the old Cure V thread the numbers were done, the only thing separating RDM/SCH from WHM is Cure V and stona, and SCH/RDM gets stona. After that there is no reason to bring a WHM over one of those other two, all three would have the same healing potential while the RDM and SCH would have more utility. This is a failure of SE to set the mage class's apart from each other or make healing magic skill actually mean something.

no reason for whm?
Benediction
Afflatus solance (sscure)
Divine caress
Sacrosanctity
curaga ,regen4, esuna
-na ga with af3head
setbonus by proc 0 mag dmg
and and
Rdm can NOT replace whm in 100 years.
only in lvl ~75 events but not in the new endgame

sure you can go rdm ,
were have rdm too in events but after 1-2 nm , the rdms change job ..... why? lol

"You just gotta stop thinking RDM = Cure IV Haste Refresh"
invite as melee, or nuker?
i know rdm can do many jobs, but now he lack in all.
he can do from all a bit , but is that enough now, no
can he heal good-not more, nuke good-sure ,but you not invited for that part, enfeebl.-
....., buffs .. wait phalanx2..
when you see the partys or allis, rdm is replaced by whm, blm, smn,blu,,, more and more

sorry but idk one " rdm is a rly good job, and is all ok" rdm.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

i think rdm should really get cure5 by 99, because everyone else will have cure4 while using rdm sub job. it isn't fair that almost everything rdm is good for can be gained from using it as a sub. before, cure4 was the main cure spell and cure5 was kinda overkill. now cure6 is kinda overkill, so why don't they make cure5 the regular cure spell? :/ and didn't rdm actually have access to cure5 at 75 when the game was new? i have an old guide that says it did. if it was originally considered at 75, i don't know why it would be out of the question at 99.

They were on the scroll, but were removed before it was even added in the game.

Don't be dishonest. Back in the old Cure V thread the numbers were done, the only thing separating RDM/SCH from WHM is Cure V and stona, and SCH/RDM gets stona. After that there is no reason to bring a WHM over one of those other two, all three would have the same healing potential while the RDM and SCH would have more utility. This is a failure of SE to set the mage class's apart from each other or make healing magic skill actually mean something.

Just about every single "give me cure V" person is angling to be desired as a main healer, by definition that means replacing White Mage. White Mage was better then Red Mage at healing in the past, that didn't stop people from going with a Red Mage, especially in the non-tank parties.

Now who's being dishonest, Cure V is NOT the only thing that separates WHM from RDM and SCH. Stopping two jobs natural progression down the spell line doesn't instantly fix WHM it only ruins two other jobs.

If they don't want RDM to heal and want them only to Enfeeble, remove WHM's and BLM's enfeebles (bar Sleep and Repose) and leave them only on RDM. If SCH are the Enhancers then they should have access to enhancing magic outside of subjobs and WHM should NOT do it better than them.

[Monchat]

RDM had 44% cure potency at 90 and now they easilly go over the cap (49% without the voidwath body), and gain nice cure casting time reduction. Honestly outside of abyssea you only need cure 5 for stuffs like vw . As long as you are fighting weak stuff, cure4s for 600 HP is more then enough ( dynamis, KCNMs etc). I rarely use cure 5 on WHM when farming curency for example.

Stop complaining about cure 5 they said you will not get it. Last week-end, I levelled my RDM mule from WHM 47-->95 for abyssea/dynamis purpose ( yeah WHM/WAR or WHM/THF is better than RDM/???, but that is due to -na spells..). It took me 2 days to farm max autorefresh gear and curepotency. Its easy, just do it.

The thing RDM needs imo is tier III enfeebles period.

[tarolin]

To be honest i agree with the devs on this one and i think its the best call to make. Lets face it if sch and rdm got cure 5 we will have posts like this complaining about job stealing from a whm point of view. I think whm should be the main healers and are allowed the more powerful versions of the cure spell and this is coming from a player that has played rdm for 3 years. Ok i know rdm is not having the best of times but the job is still good in many ways without cure V , same for Sch it has it uses. Cure V wont happen for any other job , whm deserves to have this spell alone.

[saevel]

They were on the scroll, but were removed before it was even added in the game.




Now who's being dishonest, Cure V is NOT the only thing that separates WHM from RDM and SCH. Stopping two jobs natural progression down the spell line doesn't instantly fix WHM it only ruins two other jobs.

If they don't want RDM to heal and want them only to Enfeeble, remove WHM's and BLM's enfeebles (bar Sleep and Repose) and leave them only on RDM. If SCH are the Enhancers then they should have access to enhancing magic outside of subjobs and WHM should NOT do it better than them.

Go see monchat's numbers. WHM ends up curing for 20~30 more then RDM with Cure V.

And ALL people care about is your ability to spam cure's and -na's, that's it. Cureskin was a good idea from SE but they capped it way too low and didn't raise it after the level increases. XP loss is a joke now, so no need for R3. And ... that's it, there is nothing else in WHM's toolbag for healing other then ... lol Cure VI (go ask them what they think about that). Curaga III+ ~sounds~ nice on paper, until you realize that hitting an entire group of people with that is ridiculously hard unless your in a pure melee party, and even then the hate generated from that is enough to get you killed the moment the NM does it's hate reset move on the tank. You'll be riding at capped CE and they won't be able to create hate fast enough before the NM makes a bee line towards the WHM. As a RDM even in RDM/SCH support mode I've frequently been the target of the mega boss's anger after it hate stripped our tanks, the cause was the Cure IV spams I do to support out WHMs.

But please tell me how awesome Auspice is, or Esuna, during big boss fights (what we're discussing here).

[Dantedmc]

Go see monchat's numbers. WHM ends up curing for 20~30 more then RDM with Cure V.

And ALL people care about is your ability to spam cure's and -na's, that's it. Cureskin was a good idea from SE but they capped it way too low and didn't raise it after the level increases. XP loss is a joke now, so no need for R3. And ... that's it, there is nothing else in WHM's toolbag for healing other then ... lol Cure VI (go ask them what they think about that). Curaga III+ ~sounds~ nice on paper, until you realize that hitting an entire group of people with that is ridiculously hard unless your in a pure melee party, and even then the hate generated from that is enough to get you killed the moment the NM does it's hate reset move on the tank. You'll be riding at capped CE and they won't be able to create hate fast enough before the NM makes a bee line towards the WHM. As a RDM even in RDM/SCH support mode I've frequently been the target of the mega boss's anger after it hate stripped our tanks, the cause was the Cure IV spams I do to support out WHMs.

But please tell me how awesome Auspice is, or Esuna, during big boss fights (what we're discussing here).

I really don't see how an instant 400 cureskin on cure VI and very close to that on cure V is not enough. Thats more than the base stoneskin cap and its free.

Cure VI is amazing in all the situations where WHM is the only choice (voidwatch and abyssea) because there is no way you're running out of mp and having another high hp cure to use is great. It's also another low enmity cure.

curagas are also amazing, especially when the NM is charging up a ja/aga IV spell. Time it correct and you'll barely notice the pt took damage and no you won't die from pulling hate 99% of the time. IIRC Curaga V is also rumored to have the same enmity mods as cure V.

Whm also has the fastest na's, 20 or higher boost spells which are alot outside of abyssea, the best barspells by far, sacrifice which is becoming even more useful when so many nms are gaining multiple status ailments (ex: all stats -100) and divine caress which is slightly useful. Auspice while not gamebreaking is still useful and I reapply it every chance I get when fanatic's is up along with boost-str and barspells in voidwatch.

Honestly Cureskin alone would make me still go whm if sch got cure V.

[saevel]

I really don't see how an instant 400 cureskin on cure VI and very close to that on cure V is not enough. Thats more than the base stoneskin cap and its free.

Cure VI is amazing in all the situations where WHM is the only choice (voidwatch and abyssea) because there is no way you're running out of mp and having another high hp cure to use is great. It's also another low enmity cure.

curagas are also amazing, especially when the NM is charging up a ja/aga IV spell. Time it correct and you'll barely notice the pt took damage and no you won't die from pulling hate 99% of the time. IIRC Curaga V is also rumored to have the same enmity mods as cure V.

Whm also has the fastest na's, 20 or higher boost spells which are alot outside of abyssea, the best barspells by far, sacrifice which is becoming even more useful when so many nms are gaining multiple status ailments (ex: all stats -100) and divine caress which is slightly useful. Auspice while not gamebreaking is still useful and I reapply it every chance I get when fanatic's is up along with boost-str and barspells in voidwatch.

Honestly Cureskin alone would make me still go whm if sch got cure V.

Go do your research again. And then come back.

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Afflatus_Solace

Cureskin has a hard cap of 300, no amount of additional healing will grant a higher skin. It lasts for 30s, the only ones who realistically can make use of it are the tanks. Also there is no cureskin for curaga's, only single target Cure's.

Sacrifice has a really BIG problem, namely that you must then remove all those status ailments from yourself, potentially having the tank die in the process. The key block here is Erase has a really annoying /recast even on RDM. SE needs to create Erase II for multiple removes and make Erase a 5s recast instead of 15s.

I was waiting for someone to mention Auspice / Gain spells. Their useless in big fights, specifically VWNM's, like Barspells. White Mage run's in, starts to cast Ausc.. *BAM 2K AOE* White Mage is now dead. White Mage hits yes on reraise ... long animation ... rising from ground ... *BAM ANOTHER AOE* White Mage is dead again. VWNM's tend to go *HUGE AOE* -> Tier IV Ga or Ja -> HUGE AOE -> Tier IV Ga or Ja -> HUGE AOE -> Tier II AM -> HUGE AOE. Trying to get up while your within 15 feet of them is suicide, the tank has to pull it away potentially killing other people. Tractor counts as zoning and won't work. We've had our main WHM weakened for 15 min straight due to aoe spam, and this is without trying to cast barspells. Simply put, on anything that can aoe one shot a white mage, you don't use those spells on. And if they can hit my Red Mage for 1700 through a 380 point stoneskin, then they will one shot a White Mage.

So again we're back to ..
Cure V
Erase
-na

Seriously, you guys should be making arguments about stona if anything. Its the one status removal that we can't get /WHM or /SCH and there are some fights that removing petrification are key. But the fact that no one has actually mentioned it just leads me to believe people actually really want to just replace White Mage outright.

[Monchat]

you can get stona from /whm lol its level 39. and yeah, a level 95 WHM is basically a level 75 RDM with cure V and stona, a level 95 RDM is a level 75 RDM with refresh II and stona, as far as healing go. Cure 5 does 1k ish cure 4 does 600. not much difference if you think about it, since cure V is typically used for the lesser enimity and dont always cure for that much. I use cure 5 if i have to heal 700+ HP, otherwise cure 4.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Any decent Whm should be curing in Bliaud +2, which raises the cap to 400, and Whm can still cap cure potency even without the body slot, or get within 2% of it.

If your tank has def/mdef down etc I just sacrifice it and not even care it's there.

[SpankWustler]

Go do your research again. And then come back.

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Afflatus_Solace

Cureskin has a hard cap of 300, no amount of additional healing will grant a higher skin. It lasts for 30s, the only ones who realistically can make use of it are the tanks. Also there is no cureskin for curaga's, only single target Cure's.

Sacrifice has a really BIG problem, namely that you must then remove all those status ailments from yourself, potentially having the tank die in the process. The key block here is Erase has a really annoying /recast even on RDM. SE needs to create Erase II for multiple removes and make Erase a 5s recast instead of 15s.

I was waiting for someone to mention Auspice / Gain spells. Their useless in big fights, specifically VWNM's, like Barspells. White Mage run's in, starts to cast Ausc.. *BAM 2K AOE* White Mage is now dead. White Mage hits yes on reraise ... long animation ... rising from ground ... *BAM ANOTHER AOE* White Mage is dead again. VWNM's tend to go *HUGE AOE* -> Tier IV Ga or Ja -> HUGE AOE -> Tier IV Ga or Ja -> HUGE AOE -> Tier II AM -> HUGE AOE. Trying to get up while your within 15 feet of them is suicide, the tank has to pull it away potentially killing other people. Tractor counts as zoning and won't work. We've had our main WHM weakened for 15 min straight due to aoe spam, and this is without trying to cast barspells. Simply put, on anything that can aoe one shot a white mage, you don't use those spells on. And if they can hit my Red Mage for 1700 through a 380 point stoneskin, then they will one shot a White Mage.

Assuming the White Mage in question is both naked and incompetent, you made a lot of good points.