[dev1029] Warrior

[Byrth]

http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/106...=1#post4830267

[Nynja]

This nerf is not minor. The cap to Restraint was halved and the rate at which it charges was also halved.

There is nothing minor about that.

How was the charge rate nerfed? It took 10 melee rounds before and it takes 10 now, unless I missed something?

[Gokku]

10 melee rounds pre nerf would get you twice the buff it does now

i.e

lets say 10 hits got you 20% dmg
soon 10 hits will get you 10% dmg

[Nynja]

Other than the fact that 10 was an arbitrary number to give equal testing, which I wasnt aware of...it doesnt change the fact that the charge RATE was nerfed...implying it takes longer to cap out.

[Greatguardian]

Other than the fact that 10 was an arbitrary number to give equal testing, which I wasnt aware of...it doesnt change the fact that the charge RATE was nerfed...implying it takes longer to cap out.

No. If the Rate and the Cap were both nerfed proportionally (they were), it will always take the same amount of time to cap out (it will).

If it took you 10 hits at 5% WSDMG/hit to cap at 50% pre-nerf, it will take you 10 hits at 2.5% WSDMG/hit to cap at 25% pre-nerf. Obviously, hit number is arbitrary. Byrth discusses the proper formula in the thread linked above.

Tangent: Either people in this thread just play with really shitty SAMs or they don't do enough 90+ content. Outside Abyssea, SAM is beyond broken.

Tangent 2: I think the Suicide JA is retarded. SAM is overpowered right now, that doesn't make WAR underpowered. If you want to give some ridiculous suicidal AoE JA Haste buff to any job in FFXI, give it to Dark Knight so they can /emo out and make a dozen threads on these forums about how much it sucks and how they're all quitting next update.

[Leonlionheart]

@GG

I found it nearly impossible to find a decent anything (job) on Asura.

There were around 5~9 players that I played with more than once that I could honestly say were very good. Maybe at most 10. The rest, even those who had 4~5 emps and 2~3 relics did less damage than my DRG that still uses Ares body.

So no, I've never played with a SAM that has out parsed any WAR. Took 3 WAR's to zerg VW for wins, on WAR I did 28% damage, the other two did 18/22%, (Hverg w/ dusty wing says hi)SMN did 12, (Masa)SAM did 10, the rest was BLM's and procs. This was a reoccurring thing too, not just one fight that favored WAR's high accuracy or anything.

SAM gains a lot of ground outside abyssea, but even on a Salvage boss I've out parsed masa sam using 2 hour (On a short fight ~6 WS's should make up most of the damage quickly) though only by a small percentage. We were both Paralyzed, but Retaliation made it so my DPS was higher than his even with all that WS damage.

If you're good enough at WAR that you can take the hits with retaliation up, there's no job conceivable that can out do you.

[Monchat]

I did, and I did. SAM is about equal, still not as good in my experience. The SAM-WAR relationship seems reversed to 75. SAM used to be slightly ahead, now WAR seems slightly ahead.

what? Sam was a terrible DD at 75 except 2 situation: zerg ( polearm) amd HNM. WAR and mnks completly own it everywhere else ( at least +25% dmg), MNK/WAR and WAR/SAM being about equal. Your averge noob thought SAM was good because getting TP w/o meleeing is so awsome!! Oh wait, its not. The very reason SAM was good on HNM was the reason it was bad on non-HNM ( capped attack on WS). Considering relic was the only good great katana, and SAM were compelled to wield a polearm ( -50 acc -50 att), I'd say SAM was a pure failure except for the two above situations.

SAM shits on WAR, period.

Unless you base FFXI off Abyssea which no one should.

You should explain with math what made SAM awsome. Unless you mean relic SAM shits over ukon war ( lolz). They sure did ungimp it. I think its just as bad as before honestly ( i.e avergae DD). I don't see how it can come close to MNK and WAR outiside abyssea. Go ahead please.

[Alhanelem]

10 melee rounds pre nerf would get you twice the buff it does now

i.e

lets say 10 hits got you 20% dmg
soon 10 hits will get you 10% dmg

It's not "charge rate" nerf. You look at it like this.

Let's say 10 hits gets you the maxmium effect.
Soon 10 hits will get you the maximum effect.

No change in 'charge rate." The amount of time it takes to get the most bonus possible is still the same.

[Greatguardian]

It's not "charge rate" nerf. You look at it like this.

Let's say 10 hits gets you the maxmium effect.
Soon 10 hits will get you the maximum effect.

No change in 'charge rate." The amount of time it takes to get the most bonus possible is still the same.

The rate of charge is decreased. The time it takes to reach maximum effect is not. It's semantics, but you're confusing the terms. Both you and Gokku are correct in your numbers, but he is correct in his terminology.

[Chriscoffey]

@GG

I found it nearly impossible to find a decent anything (job) on Asura.

There were around 5~9 players that I played with more than once that I could honestly say were very good. Maybe at most 10. The rest, even those who had 4~5 emps and 2~3 relics did less damage than my DRG that still uses Ares body.

So no, I've never played with a SAM that has out parsed any WAR. Took 3 WAR's to zerg VW for wins, on WAR I did 28% damage, the other two did 18/22%, (Hverg w/ dusty wing says hi)SMN did 12, (Masa)SAM did 10, the rest was BLM's and procs. This was a reoccurring thing too, not just one fight that favored WAR's high accuracy or anything.

SAM gains a lot of ground outside abyssea, but even on a Salvage boss I've out parsed masa sam using 2 hour (On a short fight ~6 WS's should make up most of the damage quickly) though only by a small percentage. We were both Paralyzed, but Retaliation made it so my DPS was higher than his even with all that WS damage.

If you're good enough at WAR that you can take the hits with retaliation up, there's no job conceivable that can out do you.

Something that is a recurring theme in any melee vs melee discussion is people play differently. Some take the game seriously enough to research and develop a tedious gear selection fine tuned to their playing. There are the others that just play for fun that don't care either way. This leads to discussion such as this that players compare people to each other and have no fundamental basis for a comparison.

The warrior job itself involves figuring out your weapon skill properties and adjusting your gear selection for it. A person then brings in another factor like a critical hit rate inside and outside abyssea which changes drastically according to that said selection. I have tried to explain why people with Uko. seem to suck outside abyssea where they are not geared accordingly but it falls on def ears. I just wish people would research and actually TRY the damn gear sets instead of always being sheep.