Hvergelmir WTF SE

[Dallas]

Prove that it's wrong then.

You were there when I did YEARS AGO and I resolved the issue long before Kegsay came along. I don't need to do it again, because I'm the only one here who ever did. It is absolute BG ignorance of SMN to show up defending a formula that makes an AVATAR as strong (not fast, just strong) as a well geared WARRIOR.

I know what Kegsay's fault was, and I've said here, in this thread, to you. The slope is WRONG. Go ahead, take the Bat Galkan single-point approach to back into avatar attack @95. Might want to bring that WAR in here for lulz.

[Kimble]

All I read is someone talking out of their rear.

[Dallas]

All I read is someone talking out of their rear.

If you want to be part of the ignorant Bat Galkan masses that believes avatars are as strong as warriors, no one is stopping you.

[Byrth]

What are you talking about? Avatars have low base damage against monsters of similar level (because fSTR -> 0), and fairly high attack. They also likely obey a different pDIF function than melees.

To put it in "melee terms", they're swinging a ~D45 weapon with fairly high delay, fairly high attack, and 0% DA/TA/etc. That's like a level 95 PLD gearing entirely for Attack and using Gluttony Sword. It's freaking laughable. The formulas don't predict it would compare to a Warrior in the least.

Also, why do you keep going on about "oh man, the slope is too steep!!!"? Are you an idiot? You're suggesting "the slope is too steep, so we should lower it and the multiply by a scalar." That's the same thing as having a higher slope to start with.

[Lambtor]

i always expected that a mage relic or empyrean or whatever weapon would give the wielder access to a spell you'd never get to use otherwise. like ultima or meteor or something. i think that'd fix the stupidness of mage staves, but who knows if it'd ever happen.

[Shadotter]

Or maybe at least find a way to make them worthwhile for casting, it looks like they tried that with the blm mythic by giving it a lot of MAB, but unfortunately it just doesn't compare to the elemental potency from the ele staves. Mythic did seeem to be designed as something to be used either in between casting or when you can't cast due to a lack of mp or silence, and while the greater damage from it might be a viable way to keep your damage up, in most cases it would likely be a better choice to just use an echo drop or rest your mp up. Not sure what they were thinking of with Hvergelmir, maybe that we would melee and ws to keep our mp up, but aside from that I'm not seeing too much good for it aside from maybe for use when meleeing while solo or in things like campaign. Really one change they should add to at least one of the special staves would be to give it an effect that gives like mayb +10 elemental potency matching day or something similar.

[Dallas]

Byrth, if you want to invent some new pdif formula to defend yourself, do it. Otherwise, your "kegsay pdif" is 11/10 = 1.1

Figure out that mob defense and tell us your "Kegsay attack."

[Alhanelem]

He's not inventing anything. Until you come forward with a 100% accurate formula and an explanation, his "invention" is as accurate as anything else we've got.

[Dallas]

Sorry Al, but in the midst of Byrth's mindless support of this formula, there's a melee SMN using well established rules that is kicking the absolute SNOT out of avatar melee. There are no make-believe rules for melee SMN damage. Byrth's delusions are constrained by well known formulas and results.

If Byrth can't extend Kegsay's work to L95, the formula dies with the bat-suit.

[Alhanelem]

Still waiting for you to come forward with this 100% accurate formula and well established rules. Until you do, you're talking out your behind more than he is.

You NEVER present actual data or evidence, you always attack the person, a fallicious method of argument.