Ternary Flourish : post here if you think it needs to be buffed or removed

[scaevola]

By no means at all am I saying dnc sucks. In fact! Its most definitely my pride and joy, which is why I want to see it excel.

This is your problem right here. Your sentimental attachment to one particular job is preventing you from seeing the big picture, which might be understandable in an MMO where working on a job means focusing on it at the expense of others. FFXI's biggest strength is that mastery of one particular job means one tool in a potentially much larger arsenal.

Whether that's better or worse than the prevailing MMO strategy of "pick a job and min/max the hell out of it", I can't say, but I've always thought the whole point of Abyssea was to encourage players to explore flexibility by making each successive trip to 90 on a new job easier than the last. I'm pretty sure SE wants you to have 6 jobs and switch between them as necessary. I think everything should have a niche (and I think DNC's is soloing, which is valuable in itself) and the danger is one job being so good its role that there's no reason to play a different one, which is why I think WHM needs a heavy nerf. Like, a "get rid of cureskin completely" level of nerf.

Now basically what im say is. Why not give ppl the option of playing that job and still be as capable as if they were to come said ideal job?

Because doing so would come at the expense of job-switching itself. FFX-2's job system was awesome until I unlocked Dark Knight and Alchemist, which were so much better than anything else I never bothered to switch jobs again.

I understand that in some cases a change of job is in order but like in most other ff games if not all of them there were always ways of making a strong combo with said desireable job, if you catch what im saying.

This was either because other FF games had jobs that were intentionally OP as an endgame reward or were just generally so easy that it didn't especially matter what job you played.

For the record, I don't think FFXI has ever really been difficult enough to shut certain jobs out completely; you can't tell me that endgame content designed for up to 18 people to participate but routinely completed by 6 or fewer is difficult.

Whm will never, NEVER be replaced as a healer. I mean whm has always been a main healer and its only right that a whm more than likely if not always be in need. I think whm should be left as it is and just enhance other jobs to do better, but still not as good as whm.

WHMs could not stake a serious claim at being FFXI's best healers until the Afflati were introduced.

Barspells and Raise Machines until the sun goes down, baby.

I may be contridicting myself some where here, but anyway my bottom line is make dancer a stronger option in party support and defensive debuff to make us a viable option to bring. I dont want to see all my blood, sweat, and tears just fade away before my eyes because of what seems to be the only way of doing things.

Dancers do not need a stronger party support buff than Haste Samba, and having no defensive debuffs is the only thing keeping us from being Ninjas-with-a-5-Minute-Cooldown-Invincible before Waltzes are even taken into account.

[FrankReynolds]

Well, in my defense, I'm mostly responding to Shiyo and DeathRose saying DNC sucks because it doesn't particularly excel exactly the way they wish it would. You'll get no argument from me if all you're saying is that Ternary Flourish is pointless.

I just want dancer to have enough to offer a group setting. So that when its time for a VNM or w/e other new Hard content they add, and I say " I have Dancer, Thief, Ninja, Monk, Blue Mage, Black Mage, Red Mage, White Mage and Warrior... I am on Dancer right now." the LS leader doesn't say "Switch to anything but dancer.". Well, at least not all the time. Obviously no job is perfect for every event (except white mage)

[Sira]

Ternary is quite possibly dnc's most useless JA currently, i'd sooner use desperate flourish or wild flourish before ternary see's the light of day. the ability costs you 3 finishing moves which at the very most minimum costs you 30 tp not including what you can get out of them with reverse, additionally it costs you the use of Climactic flourish and Striking flourish on top of a terrible recast time. if you plan to use it for a WS which is what this seems to be meant to use for, since using it on a normal attack will only return you roughly 10tp netting -20tp to use this ability, you should be using climactic or striking, i mean we have 4 good weapon skills: dancing edge, evisceration, pyrrhic kleos and rudra. everyone of those weapon skills but rudra has a very high APR so this ability would be wasted for those. So that leaves us with rudra and i dont know anyone in their right mind who would give up climax/strike so they can lose the ability to crit but gain the ability to triple attack at nearly double the cooldown length of climax (an ability you SHOULD be using for rudra to begin with)


Face it SE, you screwed up, save face and remove the ability all together (making it possible to crit with this ability will NOT make up for it)

[Deathrose]

Dancers do not need a stronger party support buff than Haste Samba, and having no defensive debuffs is the only thing keeping us from being Ninjas-with-a-5-Minute-Cooldown-Invincible before Waltzes are even taken into account.[/QUOTE]

You make a valid point on everything you said but I cant quite agree with this part in a way. So what makes it right for nin to have a stp boost ability along with subtle blow boost, tp inhibit along with its other debuffs and we cant get a simple paralyze or slow. Fan Dance only works for pdt. Its not accurate to say invincible even though I do kinda catch what your saying. Fan dance also inhibits the use of sambas which takes a little more use out of it. Nin has a null dmg jutsu which btw is cool but still hello! that effects both magical and physical plus they get to still use our prized haste samba. In addition to this they also have our Curing waltz 3 which imo is our most useful CW due to recast, on top of their A- evasion skill. If you ask me they made nin into the image of what dnc should have been.

[Shiyo]

Oh btw, nin/dnc is a far superior soloer than DNC/NIN ever will be. You can also dual box nin/war + WHM or something and do better at soloing/faster than a DNC ever would :/

Also, yes, WHM is completely broken. I don't understand how there aren't more complaints about there being ONE viable healing job in a MMO with TWENTY jobs. No other MMO I've ever played has only had one healer, and they had far less job choices. This game has 20 and only 1 healer........something is horribly wrong and out of whack when something like that exists. There is no reason for only 1 healer to exist.

[scaevola]

Oh btw, nin/dnc is a far superior soloer than DNC/NIN ever will be.

Explain. Provide examples.

You can also dual box nin/war + WHM or something and do better at soloing/faster than a DNC ever would :/

Yes, you could do that. You could dualbox BRD/NIN + WHM and do almost as well, too.

Also, yes, WHM is completely broken. I don't understand how there aren't more complaints about there being ONE viable healing job in a MMO with TWENTY jobs. No other MMO I've ever played has only had one healer, and they had far less job choices. This game has 20 and only 1 healer........something is horribly wrong and out of whack when something like that exists. There is no reason for only 1 healer to exist.

But here's the thing: RDM, SCH, BLU, and even DNC are all perfectly viable healers. All they have to do to be "viable" is good enough to meet the healing demands of a given encounter, and they by and large are; if not alone, then certainly in a pair.

This is why WHM being so overpowered is a bad thing: either content has to be easy enough for a RDM to heal, in which case a WHM trivializes it (Abyssea), or it has to be hard enough to challenge a WHM, in which case the RDM is totally hopeless (harder Voidwatch).

[Shiyo]

Or they could make RDM/SCH not so far behind WHM that they aren't even on the same scale. Pretty much all DD's are within 5-10% of eachother except WAR and SAM slightly ahead by a bit more making them the best(outside). Healers shouldn't be so far behind WHM..but it's obvious by now SE has no plans to make more than 1 viable healer in a game with 20 jobs, so I give up.

[FrankReynolds]

Not saying Ninja is better, But I prefer it because I can enfeeble the mob and Proc yellow without carrying a million different tools and It seems to do better damage while soloing, where dancer feels a little slower on the kills to me. Just a preference though. Not a fact.

Also.... I don't know if its an added effect from AF2 +3, or just a bug in the game, but I swear I see a ton of messages saying a shadow absorbed the attack, but I don't lose a shadow. Love that.

[Juri_Licious]

This move SUCKS, and is WORTHLESS.

Give us something better that deals with attacking.

[Sira]

Oh btw, nin/dnc is a far superior soloer than DNC/NIN ever will be. You can also dual box nin/war + WHM or something and do better at soloing/faster than a DNC ever would :/

i fail to understand how dual-boxing = soloing

also as scaevola said: provide examples of how nin is actually superior at soloing than dnc is.