Why Do You Loose Claim On Abyssea Mobs If Everyone Is Not Dead?

[rog]

You are making some pretty poor excuses for an obvious game flaw.

No, i just think there are better ways to fix the problem without creating more problems.

[Tamoa]

Well then, imagine the combination of this suggestion and apoc-zombie'ing? You could basically stand there watching a group take literally hours to kill one NM since as long as one party member is alive, the NM won't go unclaimed.

The only reason to be for this game mechanic is to be a social parasite and steal the pops of others.

Then I will claim that the only reason to be against this game mechanic is because you screwed up, lost claim, lost the NM and are QQing about it.

[Arcon]

And if they do not have the will to fight? What if they want to give it up to someone else, without dying? They just have to die? What you are suggesting is not "pretty much impossible", it is entirely 100% impossible, even when someone WANTS to unclaim a mob.

I've never known anyone who wanted to give up a mob but cared about having to die or zone for it (not like anyone cares about dying, and there's always warp/tele or even a regular zone nearby sometimes), especially considering how the point of wanting to give up doesn't usually come before most of the group is dead already, or recovering and not on the hate list, so it would only affect a few select people out of the group. If SE still cared for that though, they could make another version of CFH, although personally I don't think that's necessary.

And when I said "pretty much impossible" I meant while they still have the will to fight. The only exception should be if they wipe completely.

No, i just think there are better ways to fix the problem without creating more problems.

Then what do you suggest?

Well then, imagine the combination of this suggestion and apoc-zombie'ing? You could basically stand there watching a group take literally hours to kill one NM since as long as one party member is alive, the NM won't go unclaimed.

Not really, as I just said, the Apoc-zombie strategy usually involves dying. Dead = not on hate list = mob unclaimed. And if there's others in your party who aren't dead, then where's the difference to now? This is not suggesting anything ridiculously new, it just makes it easier for people who want it to protect their mobs.

Then I will claim that the only reason to be against this game mechanic is because you screwed up, lost claim, lost the NM and are QQing about it.

Then your reasoning is flawed in two ways. For one, I never got a mob stolen from me, you made a wrong assumption. I still think it's detrimental to the community to allow such behaviour, which is why we don't tolerate doing that in our LS and have rejected people known for such behaviour before. Secondly, you assume that "QQing" (what a ridiculous term, this alone makes me not take you seriously) is inherently bad. If people are "QQing" for a reason, then that reason should be explored, because it can obviously upset the community.

[rog]

I've never known anyone who wanted to give up a mob but cared about having to die or zone for it (not like anyone cares about dying, and there's always warp/tele or even a regular zone nearby sometimes), especially considering how the point of wanting to give up doesn't usually come before most of the group is dead already, or recovering and not on the hate list, so it would only affect a few select people out of the group. If SE still cared for that though, they could make another version of CFH, although personally I don't think that's necessary.

You've never seen someone try to solo something, and quickly realize they are unable to, and give up? Really?

Then what do you suggest?

I dunno. I don't have the answer.

Thoughts on it:

1) add an exception to allow bst to claim a second mob with charm, without unclaiming the original.
2) increase the amount of time it takes for a mob to turn yellow.
3) allow up to two people from the same party to simultaneously claim a mob. This would allow a party to retain claim on a mob if the last person to attack it disengages/dies, even if no one else hits it shortly after.

I think those three things would suffice, particularly the third would make a huge difference, but i dunno. It would not be perfect, but i suspect it would be close enough.

[Tamoa]

@Arcon: I use the term "QQing" because that is exactly what I see a lot of on this forum. People failing at something, then whining about it saying "bawww I screwed up, SE fix the game so it's impossible for me to screw up!!".

Getting pop sets for abyssea NMs isn't hard. Fighting abyssea NMs isn't hard. Making mistakes is human. Mistakes having consequences is normal.

Have I ever lost NMs by them going unclaimed? Yes. Is it annoying? Yes. Did we have anyone else to blame but ourselves? No.

Oh and Rog's suggestions aren't bad at all, I also think those 3 things would help a lot without making it impossible for a NM to go unclaimed short of full wipe/zone.

[wish12oz]

There is absolutely nothing random about it.

You are correct, there is nothing random about how unclaiming mobs occurs, but there is lots of random(different) things you can do to make it happen.

[rog]

You are correct, there is nothing random about how unclaiming mobs occurs, but there is lots of random(different) things you can do to make it happen.

No, the only two things that can unclaim a mob:

1) disengaging
2) attacking a different mob while not engaged.

[hiko]

Yes. I think unclaiming mobs while the alliance still has the will to fight it should be pretty much impossible, short of a total wipe. Sky gods had a nice solution with isolated islands once gods are popped, but that would be hard to do on all NMs. Maybe introducing the Confrontation status while mobs still have hate?



Shit happening (per definition) is shit. Why not fix it when possible? Apoc-zombie is nowhere near the same, there's plenty of times when no one is on the hate list during that tactic, so plenty of times when the mob is unclaimed.

The only reason to be for this game mechanic is to be a social parasite and steal the pops of others. I don't see any reason why this should be encouraged, especially on triggered NMs.

mob turning yellow is part of game, and sometimes turn to be fun: (double fail)
- whm pull tunga, i voke it , we got breakgaed, i die Tunga went yellow!(fail!!!)
- 2nd fail : some other camper claim it before we fully wipe. we said that we get KI when they kill, they let it claimed without touching it (???) never went yellow, after few min they start killing it and we got ki as expected

[Crocker]

Keeping monsters claimed is a pain sometimes. Was on Bukhis 2 tanks I died I went out of AoE range weapon not drawn casting flash using provoke so if the other tank died it would be on me so he dies it went yellow for about 1 sec a mnk/war chi blasts then provokes ... steals it. We also had blms and brds casting on it rngs on it... it shouldn't of went unclaimed but it did. That needs to be fixed even if it is a lousy Bukhis it shouldn't of happened.

NMs should have party hate and rage timers meaning cant go idle or unclaimed unless everyone is dead Apoc zombie wont work with a low rage timer if everyone is dead to make it go idle to reset rage its unclaimed and fair game.

As for the issue of BST getting a new pet unclaiming what they are fighting issue allow multiple monsters to stay claimed at once (lets say 5)

Example Kirin +4 summons they should come out all claimed but they don't cause of this issue. The only way back in the day to keep Kirin claimed was 2 parties - party #1 to kite and hold him and party #2 to kill the mini gods off 1st then form and kill Kirin this would have never happened if this issue was fixed when BST complained about it. About 8 years ago?

If there are monsters that have more than 5 I say make it that number of max claimed.

[wish12oz]

No, the only two things that can unclaim a mob:

1) disengaging
2) attacking a different mob while not engaged.

Random is describing the different things you can do to make mobs unclaim, not saying that it happens whenever it wants to without any cause. Stop misunderstanding what I am saying. And there's also more ways then you listed for mobs to unclaim.