Any new HNM coming?

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Originally Posted by Dazusu

Wrong.



Wrong.



Wrong.



Wrong.



I believe my posts have asked for HNM that could offer a title, and no drops. Or drops the same as in Abyssea - and at the same rate. Me, myself and I would be completely happy with that. I'm not asking for Ridill 2.0 or Herald's Gaiters 2.0. I'm asking for something that can't be killed with extreme ease by anyone who feels like killing it. Really, MMO's aren't meant to be this easy.

Don't you understand that we're getting all this amazing gear - and there isn't even anything worth testing it on?




Well let's be honest, you pretty much are - due to your previous sentence. In which you essentially said (and I'm paraphrasing); "Even if you can't play 6 hours a night, you should still be entitled to the best gear". So yes, you want it casual, and no, you don't want a level of difficulty that you can't/don't have the time to participate in.

How about a HNM that can't be botted, and had an extremely long window (I'm talking days); and if it were to be botted, it would require a whole prepared Linkshell - for the simple reason the difficulty is so extreme, holding with a PLD,BRD,WHM (like in the 'olden days') wouldn't be possible.

Is this where you argue you don't want to have to be in a Linkshell to kill something, you'd rather do it with your group of friends? Well again, and I'll keep repeating this point: That's fantastic. You have Abyssea.

Now something for the rest of us please.

It's also evident that the old HNM system will not be making a comeback. This was solidified when they announced a year and a bit ago "There will be new HNM in the next version update" -- Then we got VNM.

At that point world spawns were over. Still, I maintain my argument that it wouldn't be hurt to put a multizone HNM in like Sandworm/Dark Ixion. For those of you who hate camping, again, there's absolutely no obligation to participate in it.

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You're my hero.... ;_;

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Originally Posted by Dazusu

People have stated time and time again that the HNM/Fights that are being requested don't have to be 21-24 hour pops, they can pop hourly. So why you, and others like you, are hanging on details of past HNM like this is unknown.

Similarly, if more long spawn HNM are added; you don't have to play at unreasonable hours. If you're not online, you don't kill it. Simple.

But we get it, you don't like HNM. Spend your time constructively instead of whining and posting anti-HNM drivel in this thread. There's casual content out there for you. No one is asking for less of that to be added, so why do you need to sit here and cry because some people are asking for HNM?

Edit:
As for those of you complaining about bots; there are many work arounds SE could use. One of them being DI/SW pop-like systems (and people stating THF or Flee Hackers would always claim them have clearly never camped such HNM). Others include increasing lockout time, then randomly choosing a claimant from all of those who have acted on the monster during lockout. The list is endless.

I don't think the HNM system should be dropped because of Square's inability to fix a problem that's existed for years. How about taking a few days to figure out a fix for bots (like it's hard?) then get some new HNM out there (again, for those who want to participate in that - if you don't, more power to you.)

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Seriously this for the thread.^^

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Originally Posted by Natenn

You ppl aren't gonna deactivate your accounts if free world pops are brought back, like i said b4: old ppl will come back to the game if they do. $ > the rest.

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Pretty sure people will leave en mas if you bring back world spawns.

Really the argument that people running around with ebodys before einherjar worked really hard is stupid. There are people without ebody who had worked just as hard as those who did they were just unlucky.

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Originally Posted by Mrbeansman

Really the argument that people running around with ebodys before einherjar worked really hard is stupid. There are people without ebody who had worked just as hard as those who did they were just unlucky.

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QFT on that note. I've been after W.Legs for nearly 7 years now and have been through God only knows how many Kirins to try and get them. I'm past the point where I think I'm going to really get them, because sky is pretty much dead for most shells now, but I still jump on the oppertunities I get for Kirin runs.

Anyways wether or not they introduce any new HNM's through whatever method they use, I really don't think it would make or break the current system unless there's something in it for potentially every job that totally outclasses Abyssean gear.

Devs should build and open a server for the masochore crowd that claims they enjoy camping and rushing mobs. The server would have all the content before abyssea and lvl 80 level cap. There would be a mad rush of all these so called hard-core players for a couple months and then the place would be desolate when they realize standing in dragon's aery for 3 against 200+ other people is less fun than running salvage with 3-4 of their friends.

There may actually be people out that enjoy the way things used to be but I'm sure most of the people that say they do are only frustrated that newer content is faster.

holy hell, either this thread is full of trolls or just incredibly dense people,

look, we ALL want a challenge, NO ONE wants everything handed to them

what you guys are saying is that because we dont want world pop hnm's is that we want everything on a silver platter and no challenge, seriously? that is what you think?

i welcome challenging fights, i want it, i love it, stratagies are what i love about this game, working them out, seeing them in action, being able to recover from a mistake

what i do not welcome is sitting in one spot for 3 hours hoping i get to fight, when i was in an hnmls i would log on almost praying there was no windows for a while, on my day off of work my day was almost more work, sit in DA for 3 hours, maybe fight dragon, sit in BD 3 hours, maybe fight behemoth, sit in VoS for 3 hours, maybe fight turtle, then most likely camp whitegate for tiamat, cerb, or khimaira pop, then pray we didnt have dynamis or limbus that day

seriously, if you find that 12ish hours of doing nothing fun, then uhhhh, yeah, more power too ya

now, as for having everything handed to us, i have a little story, so after about 7 years of playing i took an extended break and took up some WoW, where a guy in my guild was complaining that it took 2 months or so to get a drop he wanted to which i let him know that my valor surcoat took me over 5 years to get so he should man up and quit crying. i am in no way at all saying we should just have everything handed to us as soon as we create our characters, but 5 years to get one drop, and that 5 years wasnt with me only going to xarcabard 4 times, i ran our dynamis shell and scheduled at least 4 xarcabards a month for 2 years, and had been doing xarcabard for 2-3 years before that just not as frequently, probably 95% of that time i was first in line for the surcoat, it never dropped, never, IT TOOK ME 5 FREAKING YEARS TO GET ONE DROP, do you not understand how stupid this is, this does not equate to better or worse player, this equates to luck pure and simple, ive seen complete tards walk in to their first xarcabard, pull the first group of mobs, kill about 2 or 3, get valor surcoat, continue to suck

as for challenge, ive already told you where to find a challenge, go fight AV, go fight PW, not saying they are unkillable anymore, but they are more of a challenge than ANY of the hnm's you are saying are "challenging", when i was in hnmls our best time for fafnir was 8 mins, heard after i left they got it down to 5 mins, ripped through cerberus in around 15 mins, this is not a challenge, level cap is going to be 99, give me a lvl 120ish mob that is force pop, i want to fight it, i dont want to watch someone else fight every day, that is dumb, i pay for this game to play, not watch others play

what it all boils down to is that you want these mobs just so you can say you have better gear, what difference does it make if someone else has the same gear as you, they are paying for this game too

i dunno, i just dont get it, people that did hnm's for a long time are coming here saying "WE DONT WANT WORLD POP HNM'S" that should say something about the system

Everything he said.

I had the same experience in an HNM LS. The claiming of the mobs, the way it was, pretty much ruined the whole ambiance of the game. You knew some people were botting. You knew some people in your shell were botting also. You knew you could go botless against bots. But your chance of claiming was severely diminished. You had to lower resolution to increase your chances of claiming and the game looked like crap. You had to look for certain things the other LS might do to give away their bot and type of bot, then try to interfere with the bot. You had to choose a job/subjob that gave increased chance of claiming over what is actually a functional job combo. And, that's just my gripes on the claiming part of HNM's. The 21 - 24 hour times is yet a whole different issue.

We aren't asking for easy. We are asking for something that allows more than just a bunch of bots to claim and fight, once a day, at ungodly hours.

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Originally Posted by Dazusu

I believe my posts have asked for HNM that could offer a title, and no drops. Or drops the same as in Abyssea - and at the same rate. Me, myself and I would be completely happy with that. I'm not asking for Ridill 2.0 or Herald's Gaiters 2.0. I'm asking for something that can't be killed with extreme ease by anyone who feels like killing it. Really, MMO's aren't meant to be this easy.

Don't you understand that we're getting all this amazing gear - and there isn't even anything worth testing it on?


Well let's be honest, you pretty much are - due to your previous sentence. In which you essentially said (and I'm paraphrasing); "Even if you can't play 6 hours a night, you should still be entitled to the best gear". So yes, you want it casual, and no, you don't want a level of difficulty that you can't/don't have the time to participate in.

How about a HNM that can't be botted, and had an extremely long window (I'm talking days); and if it were to be botted, it would require a whole prepared Linkshell - for the simple reason the difficulty is so extreme, holding with a PLD,BRD,WHM (like in the 'olden days') wouldn't be possible.

Is this where you argue you don't want to have to be in a Linkshell to kill something, you'd rather do it with your group of friends? Well again, and I'll keep repeating this point: That's fantastic. You have Abyssea.

Now something for the rest of us please.

It's also evident that the old HNM system will not be making a comeback. This was solidified when they announced a year and a bit ago "There will be new HNM in the next version update" -- Then we got VNM.

At that point world spawns were over. Still, I maintain my argument that it wouldn't be hurt to put a multizone HNM in like Sandworm/Dark Ixion. For those of you who hate camping, again, there's absolutely no obligation to participate in it.

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Well then I just wanted to say a lot of the things that you said make sense. If the highlighted is the main thing that you're after, I really don't have a problem with it at all. I'm fine with free spawn HNMs or other events that are a true challenge requiring a decent amount of people. Challenge in of itself is hard to maintain after most people figure out the mechanics behind (which I’ve pointed out before.) Rani was a pretty brutal fight until people figured it out (I beat it without brews it was a fun fight.) Killing it with a brew isn’t even close to the same thing.

As long free spawn HNM don't lead to an exclusionary system based around rewarding people solely on their luck it wouldn't be bad. The problem is that’s what a free spawn HNM system is based around. The problem is I think you're tying up my dislike of an unfair system with a dislike of rewarding people for hard work and team work. That's where the difference is. You should be able to get the same reward putting in the same amount of time as the next person (maybe with a small variance of chance.)

The one thing we'll have to agree to disagree on is that expecting people to play 6 hrs a day 7 days a week is excessive. Hell I've spent more time than that in the past camping HNMs but that doesn't mean it's a good thing. You'd be hard pressed to convince anyone that saying, "oh 6 hrs a day to hunt HNMs excluding exp, questing, crafting, etc. is totally reasonable." I don't even think you buy that as reasonable. You can try but I think you'll be deluding yourself. If you really spend more than 6 hrs a day on FFXI you don't have much of a life.

There's a challenge, commitment, or effort that gives things a larger sense of accomplishment when finished. The old HNM system on the other hand was basically more of an obsession about beating other LSs to the punch.

Edit: Also I want to clarify since you don't seem to understand. Emps are currently the best weapon in the game correct? Can pretty much anyone willing to put the work be able to get one even if they only play like 10 hrs a week? Yes but it'll take them significantly longer than someone who plays the game 6 hrs a day. That's what a fair system of loot availability is.

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Originally Posted by Catsby

Devs should build and open a server for the masochore crowd that claims they enjoy camping and rushing mobs. The server would have all the content before abyssea and lvl 80 level cap. There would be a mad rush of all these so called hard-core players for a couple months and then the place would be desolate when they realize standing in dragon's aery for 3 against 200+ other people is less fun than running salvage with 3-4 of their friends.

There may actually be people out that enjoy the way things used to be but I'm sure most of the people that say they do are only frustrated that newer content is faster.

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This is so funny but so very true. Unless a person is just ignorant. When it came to kings the only reason the majority of people camped them was because they wanted the best gear. Once they got the gear it was time to pursue relics and mythics but why farm dynamis that's for chumps. People tried their hardest to monopolize king/HNM gear to keep the prices on it high so they could simply buy their relics. The majority of the hardcore campers were only in it for the gear and the odd group was in it to rub it into other people's faces. Without the best shinies though sheep wouldn't follow people like that.

I want long windows so the title/gear has more meaning then just the stats, cause of right now all titles/drops don't mean much. Need something that only drops off a hardcore NM that makes it worth killing. 6 ppl should't be enough to do "endgame". GLORY TO THE WORLD SPAWNS!

On that note here is an idea: Do something to ballista to bring it back since i highly doubt the new HNM is gonna be a windowed spawn anyway. Maby make a BP(Ballista point) system that has gear that only comes from ballista. Like normal tier BP you get from participating and then higher tier BP for Broze/Silver/Gold ballistars. Ballista was fun but it died, id go back if we could get it overhauled.

Idk what 6 people being able to kill a monster or not has to do with its spawn time.

The title doesn't really amount to much in either case, since you only need to kill it once, regardless. Why would longer windows make it mean more? All going to get the title sooner or later anyways.

the drops a.k.a half the reason. Every person with the "best" gear on = like a school where kids are forced to wear uniforms. Right now ppl who plainly suck at the game bc its ez access to pop/brew have the same stuff ppl that don't need to brew stuff do. Kinda unfair to ppl with skill that they can actually legit beat the mob but theres no reward from it to distinguish from the noobys who brew anything that requires coordination no?

What does a 21-24 hour timer have to do with them making mobs outside of abyssea that you can't brew?

there were players on my server with full koenig (when it actually meant somethng) that couldnt tank their way out of a wet paper bag with directions, yet i was solo tanking faf

there were players that couldnt tank an xp party (when that was the thing to do) wearing full kaiser gear, yet i was leading my ls through dynamis at breakneck speeds

yeah, the old system sure did show us who the "good" players were


natenn, you are either one hell of a troll, or so delusional that you truely believe what you are typing

Didn't say kings were hard did i? The new stuff needs to be hard regardless of pop conditions. World spawns weren't supposed to be hoarded like they were, they were supposed to be "hard" due to lack of experience fighting it cause of long windows, the new HNM need to be hard even if a gimmick is found just bc the same LSs are gonna try and hoard it. Is claiming a mob every day against ToS? no its not, but if the fight is annoying ppl won't wanna fight it daily, hence theres opportunity for casual John/Jane Doe to go get whooped by it h/e many times till they get it right.

I am very pro-HNM I love camping kings, hell I even want more HNMs strike a challenge but what a lot of you don't seem to understand is you DON'T NEED 21-24 hr respawn with 3 hour windows to make it a "Challenge" the new HNMs could be JUST like camping Nid/King behe and that would be cool. Only thing most people have a complaint about is the long window time why do we need to stand in DA for 3 hours? 5 Hour Sandworm window? Really? Half my day is gone camping an HNM, Why not just lower the timers to a 1 hour window? Also you can't bash SE for making these mobs like this, I'm sure when they made these HNMs they had a mind set that Linkshells would mule at these camps and race for claim but on some servers it got to a point of having a holding party at Tiamat,Khim,Cerb which I'm sure the dev's did not have in mind.

Having a mule sit at a HNM camp and then race 3 other LS's to claim is fun as hell imo, Idk if any of you ever experienced the rush but one of the biggest adrenalin rushes for me was powder boot spam race to Khim,Cerb,Tia(Before nexus cape) trying to get there w/o Agro because if someone Important died along the way or got agro that split second could lose you a claim. THAT is what I miss about HNMs.

1hr window isnt bad, like 20-21hr. But if it pops to much its value goes down. If Tia was a 2hr pop then everyone would have gaiters.

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Originally Posted by Natenn

Didn't say kings were hard did i? The new stuff needs to be hard regardless of pop conditions. World spawns weren't supposed to be hoarded like they were, they were supposed to be "hard" due to lack of experience fighting it cause of long windows, the new HNM need to be hard even if a gimmick is found just bc the same LSs are gonna try and hoard it. Is claiming a mob every day against ToS? no its not, but if the fight is annoying ppl won't wanna fight it daily, hence theres opportunity for casual John/Jane Doe to go get whooped by it h/e many times till they get it right.

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If by average joe, you mean people who just run blindly into the mob w/o looking it up first, sure.

Other than that, one the gimmick is found out, the NM usually no longer poses a threat to anyone(that shouldn't be playing another game instead of this one, anyway), unless its something like AV

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Originally Posted by Catsby

There may actually be people out that enjoy the way things used to be but I'm sure most of the people that say they do are only frustrated that newer content is easier

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Fixed this for you.

However, again, you are 'M I S S I N G' the point.

No one is asking for less content like Salvage, and Abyssea. We're asking for other content too (ie: in addition). I know it's hard to comprehend basic sentence structure, but guess what? Both types of content can co-exist. They did before, they can do so again.

No one is forcing you to take part in the requested HNM. If you don't like it, keep on with the casual content they add.

I love Salvage, I enjoy some parts of Abyssea; I still do Einherjar for fun, Sea, Sky on occasion deserves some love too - I also still kill Tiamat, DI, SW and the occasional ground king. No one asked for segregation.

As it stands, it appears the anti-HNM crowd shout and scream louder though, why not stamp your feet while you're at it? We all know we won't see HNM again in the traditional sense. That development team has long moved on.

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Originally Posted by Dazusu

We all know we won't see HNM again in the traditional sense. That development team has long moved on.

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Actually that team has been promoted to head team for FF11. The orig. team moved to 14, then the new team who made abyssea stepped up only to get demoted for the current one.

While not being an employee of S/E, I can't say this with certainty. But, I'm willing to bet that some of the easing of content revolves around the fact that the original content was designed to slow a player's progress because of limited content. While the easing of some of the hindrances has been overdone, much of the easing of hindrances was way overdue.

natenn, stop saying you want a challenge, because you dont, its incredibly obvious to everyone here, all you want is to have gear others dont


ill say it again, in all caps, if you want i could say it in another language if you can understand it better

IF YOU WANT A CHALLENGE, FIGHT THE MOBS THAT ARE ALREADY IN THE GAME, AV, OR PW, THEY ARE HARD

having gaiters or ridill does not make you a better player than anyone else, all it does is say that you have more time on your hands (and bot, or have botters in your shell), and have better luck, that is it, that is all, i will admit, i am not, was not, prolly will never be the best pld on my server (id like to think i was in the top 10), i had valor cape #5 on my entire server, did that make me better than everyone else, no, it made me lucky in that one particular instance, was i incredibly happy when it happened, your damn right i was, after more and more people started getting valor capes, did i look at mine and say "ho hum, look at this raggedy valor cape, its so played out everyone has it now so im gonna drop it" no, i still loved my cape

you want to have something to lord over other people with, you want to feel superior, you want others to look at you and say "god, he must be a great player cause he has such and such gear", good lord get over yourself, its a game, everyone is just as entitled to that gear as you are whether or not you want to believe it

and as for changing pop windows to an hour or w/e, that will do absolutely nothing, if hnm's were botted at 21-24 hours, what would change when put to 1-3 hour spawns, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING, bot before, bot after, say fafnir spawned every hour, do you really think that he will magically drop a ridill every kill, no, THE DROP RATE SUCKS, meaning you will have one ls botting the everlivinghell out of fafnir to get every single member in their ls one, and since people come and go in ls's, that ls will never leave and you will have a worse situation than you have now, because instead of getting pissed that you got beat once (or 3 times if you camp all 3 land kings) per day, you got beat 15 times just on fafnir, oh wait, that doesnt apply to you does it natenn, cause you can beat any bot on your ps2 right

as for force pop nm's, who says the conditions needed to be met to pop the nm has to be easy, make it hard, but make it accessable, i really dont understand how you equate force pop with simple, it just doesnt make sense

HNM camping got stupid toward the end when people started making packet bots which actually send info to the server that they claimed the HNM before the actual claim window was even open. Basically you didn't even stand a chance at claiming. The whole HNM pop system is pretty stupid because all it did was lead to mass cheating for claims.

I don't even read Surreals full posts, i get to "Go fight old content that you killed already blah blah blah, i don't wanna get beat on claims just gimmi the best gear waaaa waaaa waaaa and 'insertwalloftexthere'"

I beat PW at 75, AV was beatable at 80 via zerg so i have no interst in it now, don't tell me what i should do just because we dont share the same ideas. So what if i want gear others wont get? Thats the point in having it to ppl "like me" as you would say, why should bad players be just as decked out as good ones? We all pay to play and its considered a privilege. SE not gonna give everything on a silver plate, stop QQing @ me because you don't wanna fight for claims. The new HNM are probably not gonna be windowed spawns anyway so i don't know why you get so worked up. If it is a windowed spawn its prolly gonna be very hard anyway just to counter the fact that most botting LS are trash players to begin with, wait for the update and chill out friend.

But you want a challenge. Don't zerg AV. Straight tank it and kill it like a boss.

Edit: I mean really.

If you're going to complain about brews, I don't see why you'd do a perfect defense zerg either.

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Originally Posted by Cream_Soda

But you want a challenge. Don't zerg AV. Straight tank it and kill it like a boss.

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BUT THATS TOO HARD QQQQQQQQQ

What's the deal with the Car air freshener pimp crowns on highly active threads?

I take it back I see some on lower post count threads also. What does it signify?

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Originally Posted by Zumi

HNM camping got stupid toward the end when people started making packet bots which actually send info to the server that they claimed the HNM before the actual claim window was even open.

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*Whistles* Someone doesn't know what they're talking about.

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Originally Posted by Zaknafein

What's the deal with the Car air freshener pimp crowns on highly active threads?

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Its in the Forum update notes. Its for threads Representatives have posted in.

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Originally Posted by Zaknafein

I take it back I see some on lower post count threads also. What does it signify?

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That a community rep has posted in the thread.

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Originally Posted by Natenn

I don't even read Surreals full posts, i get to "Go fight old content that you killed already blah blah blah, i don't wanna get beat on claims just gimmi the best gear waaaa waaaa waaaa and 'insertwalloftexthere'"

I beat PW at 75, AV was beatable at 80 via zerg so i have no interst in it now, don't tell me what i should do just because we dont share the same ideas. So what if i want gear others wont get? Thats the point in having it to ppl "like me" as you would say, why should bad players be just as decked out as good ones? We all pay to play and its considered a privilege. SE not gonna give everything on a silver plate, stop QQing @ me because you don't wanna fight for claims. The new HNM are probably not gonna be windowed spawns anyway so i don't know why you get so worked up. If it is a windowed spawn its prolly gonna be very hard anyway just to counter the fact that most botting LS are trash players to begin with, wait for the update and chill out friend.

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Yeah I mean what a dumb idea making it so everyone can do content. Good gear should come from work not claiming which contrary to popular belief is 90% luck 10% skill.

your right, i dont want to fight for claims, i want to fight mobs

so you beat av at 75, meaning you did it in a zerg fashion or some sort of terrain glitch, cause at 75 thats the only way you COULD do it, you keep saying over and over that you want a challenge, yet you have failed to provide proof that you actually accept challenge, beating av using a glitch or zerg is not challenging, more than just me have pointed you towards challenges that you refuse to accept

i got out of endgame because of the system, and will most likely quit if they bring it back, so heres one oldschool player that will quit if world pop hnm's are brought back

and fyi, having gear that others dont doesnt make you cool irl, regardless of what your mom says, so stop trying to be all elitist on us, elitism is what brought drama to endgame in the first place, you are not better than me, im not better than you, your $15 is worth the same that mine is

and its not a "privilege" to play, it is a right since we pay, it would be a privilege if the game were free

and i think you missed the part about bad players having good gear, the system you cherish so, did allow many many bad players to have very good gear, but you probably know all about that dont you

and you sure did respond to me well considering you dont read my posts anymore lol

oh and i do believe i have said before, theres only one r in my name, kthxbai

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Originally Posted by Mrbeansman

Yeah I mean what a dumb idea making it so everyone can do content. Good gear should come from work not claiming which contrary to popular belief is 90% luck 10% skill.

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not for mr natenn lol, its opposite for him, with his SUPER PS2

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Originally Posted by Sureal

i got out of endgame because of the system, and will most likely quit if they bring it back, so heres one oldschool player that will quit if world pop hnm's are brought back

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Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

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Originally Posted by Sureal

and fyi, having gear that others dont doesnt make you cool irl, regardless of what your mom says

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Basement dwellers accusing other basement dwellers of being basement dwellers is always hilarious.

You are an MMO nerd, you are not cool. If you tell normal people about your hobby they will think that you are a looser.

Accept it.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

HNM camping got stupid toward the end when people started making packet bots which actually send info to the server that they claimed the HNM before the actual claim window was even open. Basically you didn't even stand a chance at claiming. The whole HNM pop system is pretty stupid because all it did was lead to mass cheating for claims.

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I already proposed a way to make bots useless on world pop HNMs:

When the NM pops it would be open to attack from anyone for about 3 seconds, after 3 seconds claim would be passed to a random person on it's hate list. This way you have to pay attention to the spawn and be quick to attack it to get on it's hate list. The excitement of camping and competition are maintained and bots are rendered 100% useless.

I said i beat PW at 75, not AV. I got ppl lined up ready to come back to the game if the old system is revived. I know 5, another guy i talked to said he knows around 15 ppl who will be back. So currently SE stands to gain back 15-20 paying customers. You quiting not gonna make a difference in this case. The only challenges in this game were AV/PW/Claiming/Select few HNM at release. The first Creb/Hydra/Khim were my most memorable moments. LS after LS wiping trying to get that first kill, its like the super bowl, first to kill = morale rocket booster. I remember 7 LS fighting and wiping over a 7-8 hr period till all gave up and went to bed with the first Hydra. First Khim was like Fulmination fest it was awsome. Even Cerb was epic. If you wanna quit i say good, less QQers.

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Originally Posted by Natenn

I said i beat PW at 75, not AV. I got ppl lined up ready to come back to the game if the old system is revived. I know 5, another guy i talked to said he knows around 15 ppl who will be back. So currently SE stands to gain back 15-20 paying customers. You quiting not gonna make a difference in this case. The only challenges in this game were AV/PW/Claiming/Select few HNM at release. The first Creb/Hydra/Khim were my most memorable moments. LS after LS wiping trying to get that first kill, its like the super bowl, first to kill = morale rocket booster. I remember 7 LS fighting and wiping over a 7-8 hr period till all gave up and went to bed with the first Hydra. First Khim was like Fulmination fest it was awsome. Even Cerb was epic. If you wanna quit i say good, less QQers.

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Ok, so more people are going to come back than leave? But there will be LESS QQ'ers? All the people who quit earlier because the game didn't go their way are not QQ'ers? We'd be standing to gain more than we lose, provided you're even correct about more people coming back than leaving.

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Originally Posted by Cream_Soda

Ok, so more people are going to come back than leave? But there will be LESS QQ'ers? All the people who quit earlier because the game didn't go their way are not QQ'ers? We'd be standing to gain more than we lose, provided you're even correct about more people coming back than leaving.

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Raises a valid point.

The likelihood of anyone quitting if World spawns were introduced again is slim to none. People might be pissed, but they are generally the ones who are pro abyssea. That's what they would continue to do. The content they so avidly support. Players who quit because HNM was the entire game to them had no option like that when Abyssea was released. Their whole shabang was toppled in about a week or two when everyone realized the new 76-80 gear destroyed hnm, and was well on it's way to making salvage obsolete.

Now agree or disagree with Nateen, and other pro HNM people in this thread all you like. Hell I don't agree with 100% of what they're saying. However him saying there are a significant # of people who would return if HNM became a valid option again is the truth. I know 20-30 off the top of my head, and those were just ones I worked, and played with in linkshells that I am sure of. Considering my initial statement of people will QQ, but they would still have abyssea can you honestly say more people would leave than would be returning?

This is why we can't have nice things.

I don't think i would out-right Quit if World-Spawn NMs were introduced as a means for rare armor, as well as other events to get good armor.

If they were the only way to get the best gear, tacked a 21-24hr timer, and Ruled by Bots. Yes I think the game would probably end for me. But Thats okay. I have other things to look forward too and i enjoyed my time in FFXI :)

But i don't think we have to worry about that anymore. Judging from the look of the Schedule though. It appears we will likely get a lot of good HNM Content, as well as Several Event-Related content like Salvage/Einherjar/Nyzul/etc. I'm looking forward to a great Balance.