Wake up, "Seekers" is failing

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hayward

50% of jobs is wholly unacceptable. These Developers need to increase Delve's accessibility, which I hope they're in the process of doing, and the playerbase need to start seeing beyond BG-approved bandwagon jobs/gear. If things keep up the way it is, August 27 can't come fast enough and the servers can't close soon enough.

---

its absolutly acceptable, you have a buttong called "Change Job". seriously gearing 4-5 jobs to a very good level should be common today...

and if you dont want to play any of the jobs listed its your own fault. The possibility is there you just need to work on it.

so people who don't enjoy playing those jobs have to suffer? is the expectation in this game put upon me is to magically have all jobs 99 and if i don't want to play the jobs wanted by a select group of players who play this game I should be excluded from it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karah

I actually don't fit into any of those categories, and I loathe delve.

I'm a little annoyed that RME lost their value, but it's due to the fact that I have 20 of them, not Just 1 or 2.

I loathe delve because I don't want to do an event that REQUIRES 18 people. There are not 18 people "good enough" to win 18 man content, unless they form a linkshell. I do not want to join a linkshell.

Oh and, those "vital" jobs listed, MNK WHM SCH BRD COR DRK (GEO)

The rest are "acceptable" the sch can enfeeble as well as the rdm, drg's angon is not vital, its nice to have to speed things up. One could argue that tomahawk would probably be better, as it would change the damage resistances... RNG is "optional". PLD is optional also.

Significantly less than 50%.

---

1. DRG's Angon is actually VERY Vital in those fights, especially on tojil with its AoE attack down aura, and the job is very good when the delve bosses enter their piercing weakness stage point.
2. Tomahawk does shit on the different damage taken stages on bosses, tested, doesnt pan out because its not a mob specific jobtrait of dmg resistance (like piercing to undead) but a phase the mob enters.
3. RNG isnt needed in every run, but its quiet welcoem fro the bee megaboss and for new megabosses. the RNG method is the safest method to get a grasp at whats going on and win fights when you do a beaded run, including a PLD.
4. a PLD can be quiet handy to hold multiple Nms or to sack the entire path to the megaboss + adds a safety net. granted we do that with sleeps and leave the sacking to a BRD. Neverthless the possibility is there.
5. SAM is very vital in foret the hennetiel preNMs and actually also very good on the delve megabosses, but both work SAM and DRK. Situational one is better then the other.

oh and I am sure BLU can pick the pace too once the 1 hander update hits.


and just btw:
you are the category 3 People: you want the easy way out because 18 man content is just sooooo stressfull for you ._., because you know joining endgame linkshells, contributing to teamplay, contributing to a linkshell etc etc is against your BST mentality of playing solo constantly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Umichi

so people who don't enjoy playing those jobs have to suffer? is the expectation in this game put upon me is to magically have all jobs 99 and if i don't want to play the jobs wanted by a select group of players who play this game I should be excluded from it?

---

1. I doint say to get all jobs to 99
2. you will probably be fine if you have 2 of those 11+ jobs I listed at an exeptional state geared and skilled
3. YOUR choice, do it or leave it and focus on other content
or 4. OMG try to setup your own strategys with other jobs!

You cant expect this challenging (not ridiculusly omfg unfair like prenerf legion) fights/mechanics to be designed around ALL jobs, that is just not possible.

'Do it or leave it'. From the looks of things, a decent number are choosing the latter. There are serious, potentially fatal, flaws with the new direction Square is taking this game. To pretend they don't exist, will continue to make this issue far worse. I wouldn't be surprised to even see more server merges in the near term at this rate, which is not a good thing in terms of game longevity.

I think people are frankly being disingenuous when they say that "well, just level a job that's ideal at this event and you'll be fine!" because well... that statement is complete bullshit.

Firstly, unless you're going GEO or COR, you're going to need to gear out your ass in order to compete in Delve. That means getting pieces from various content that may/may not be accessible anymore. See, if you played XI for a while you're fine because well you've been doing things like NNI, SalvageII, Legion or Voidwatch to keep jobs up to date but trying to do those things right now proves to be quite difficult when all that matters is Delve.

Matsui envisioned people going back to gear for the "ultimate event" but as it stands you're either ready or stuck.

For instance, people often cite Ranger as being the easy way to clear this event... if you can gather 99 Relic Rangers decked with ideal sets. It is disingenuous to make it seem like RNG is the ezpz mode when you need ultimate weapons which take months to put together unless you happen to be sitting on piles of cash. Grabbing 4-5 Sureshot/Spelogean RNGs is a sure-fire way to grab hate and wipe.

Samurai needs Murasamemaru from Uptala to ignore those damage resistant mobs like Craklaw and Krabi which is great if you managed to get one of those swords way back when Uptala was being spammed constantly. With the death of VWNM, so has the pool of available pulse cells to get this weapon.

PLD needs Brochain / Aegis to be considered which is months of prepwork.

BRDs ideally have Ghorn and Daurdablas with 4 song access which requires HMPs / Riftcinder which has dried up in recent months.

etc. etc.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sparthos

I think people are frankly being disingenuous when they say that "well, just level a job that's ideal at this event and you'll be fine!" because well... that statement is complete bullshit.

Firstly, unless you're going GEO or COR, you're going to need to gear out your ass in order to compete in Delve. That means getting pieces from various content that may/may not be accessible anymore. See, if you played XI for a while you're fine because well you've been doing things like NNI, SalvageII, Legion or Voidwatch to keep jobs up to date but trying to do those things right now proves to be quite difficult when all that matters is Delve.

Matsui envisioned people going back to gear for the "ultimate event" but as it stands you're either ready or stuck.

For instance, people often cite Ranger as being the easy way to clear this event... if you can gather 99 Relic Rangers decked with ideal sets. It is disingenuous to make it seem like RNG is the ezpz mode when you need ultimate weapons which take months to put together unless you happen to be sitting on piles of cash. Grabbing 4-5 Sureshot/Spelogean RNGs is a sure-fire way to grab hate and wipe.

Samurai needs Murasamemaru from Uptala to ignore those damage resistant mobs like Craklaw and Krabi which is great if you managed to get one of those swords way back when Uptala was being spammed constantly. With the death of VWNM, so has the pool of available pulse cells to get this weapon.

PLD needs Brochain / Aegis to be considered which is months of prepwork.

BRDs ideally have Ghorn and Daurdablas with 4 song access which requires HMPs / Riftcinder which has dried up in recent months.

etc. etc.

---

well then get to work and gather your friends. People had plenty of time the last 3 years to get 4-5 jobs up to an acceptable level of gearing.

i have kept 5 of my jobs constantly geared well and accomodate to what was available, GEO just joined the rank of my 6. job after adoulins release. It was and is doable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Umichi

so people who don't enjoy playing those jobs have to suffer? is the expectation in this game put upon me is to magically have all jobs 99 and if i don't want to play the jobs wanted by a select group of players who play this game I should be excluded from it?

---

You play DRG. Right now you're wanted for the toughest content. The problem is that you're probably not good enough to be invited because you don't know what you're doing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Damane

and just btw:
you are the category 3 People: you want the easy way out because 18 man content is just sooooo stressfull for you ._., because you know joining endgame linkshells, contributing to teamplay, contributing to a linkshell etc etc is against your BST mentality of playing solo constantly.

---

I don't want to do it with them, not because I don't want to, but because they're incapable of doing it, there is a sizeable difference between the 2 scenarios.

I would rather hang from a rusty hook by my eye lids than waste hour after hour after hour watching scrub mnks (with oatixur) fail to properly count to 7 and kill the matamata (true story, multiple times).

Now If I could clone myself. 17x and play all 18 jobs MYSELF, so I know I'm playing with a reliable person, yeah, I might enjoy 18 man content. But until that day, 18 man content is BULLSHIT. Plain and simple.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Damane

well then get to work and gather your friends. People had plenty of time the last 3 years to get 4-5 jobs up to an acceptable level of gearing.

---

....

So cram 3 years worth of events in time to do Delve while Delve is still current? Are you insane? And GEO and RUN are a gimmie for players like you and me who have kept current these past 3 years we're 15/15 in NNI so most of the fun pieces from there are taken care of there's no AF yet so we haven't needed to run around doing that stuff on top of random VW bodies or gear we got while that event was still popping.

So yes I agree with Sparthos there is a slight hint of a disingenuous tone. You cant go from stuck to ready to do Delve with 5 other people who are in the same boat as you AND still be ready to jump into a group in a week from now (as an example). It might be possible if it was 1 person getting geared by 5 other established players (like say a buddy came back from break or w/e) but your whole "Well just go wrangle some friends and lets get this done" advice while still the correct piece of advice comes with the caveat: "You probably won't finish in time by August when Tojil and Co become Old Hat."

That said I do agree with you, yours is the correct answer but it has its downsides, it isn't applicable to everyone because I assume once the time required is mentioned most people will become demotivated and deflated. Matsui and company would have to make serious adjustments (in some cases again) to make VW and salvage and NNI more "crammable" by players who are stuck: make VW lowmannable for drops and for salvage and NNI remove the cooldowns on entry. If Matsui is serious about having 10 years worth of content be the foundation for Delve then changes have to be made where all that is spammable and the fun part is that they don't have the limitations they did back when they first made Neo-Dyna.

They had to balance making it accessible while not crashing the currency demand market cuz Relics and the like were still in vogue and they repeated that balanced approach with Salvage cuz again they didnt want a flood of Alex. Now that we have confirmation that Delve weapons will have the last laugh (remember he said RMEs will get only 1 mulligan and then that's it) then who gives a crap if you can spam Salvage multiple times a day or what have you.

So for the players who are stuck it's a matter of convenience rather than difficulty dealing with content that has many restrictions in place for reasons that have now been rendered void.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alpheus

....

So cram 3 years worth of events in time to do Delve while Delve is still current? Are you insane? And GEO and RUN are a gimmie for players like you and me who have kept current these past 3 years we're 15/15 in NNI so most of the fun pieces from there are taken care of there's no AF yet so we haven't needed to run around doing that stuff on top of random VW bodies or gear we got while that event was still popping.

So yes I agree with Sparthos there is a slight hint of a disingenuous tone. You cant go from stuck to ready to do Delve with 5 other people who are in the same boat as you AND still be ready to jump into a group in a week from now (as an example). It might be possible if it was 1 person getting geared by 5 other established players (like say a buddy came back from break or w/e) but your whole "Well just go wrangle some friends and lets get this done" advice while still the correct piece of advice comes with the caveat: "You probably won't finish in time by August when Tojil and Co become Old Hat."

That said I do agree with you, yours is the correct answer but it has its downsides, it isn't applicable to everyone because I assume once the time required is mentioned most people will become demotivated and deflated. Matsui and company would have to make serious adjustments (in some cases again) to make VW and salvage and NNI more "crammable" by players who are stuck: make VW lowmannable for drops and for salvage and NNI remove the cooldowns on entry. If Matsui is serious about having 10 years worth of content be the foundation for Delve then changes have to be made where all that is spammable and the fun part is that they don't have the limitations they did back when they first made Neo-Dyna.

They had to balance making it accessible while not crashing the currency demand market cuz Relics and the like were still in vogue and they repeated that balanced approach with Salvage cuz again they didnt want a flood of Alex. Now that we have confirmation that Delve weapons will have the last laugh (remember he said RMEs will get only 1 mulligan and then that's it) then who gives a crap if you can spam Salvage multiple times a day or what have you.

So for the players who are stuck it's a matter of convenience rather than difficulty dealing with content that has many restrictions in place for reasons that have now been rendered void.

---

Some jobs benefit hugely form +2 empy gear still, which easy doable by yourself + a mule

NNI is nerfed to the point where its easy to do, but if you dont have 5 friends to do, its not the events fault but yours. Besides NNI gear isnt the best anymore in each slot at all.

Some gear is replaced by normal delve gear (not boss gear). There are plenty of sidegrades options you can take if you cant do one event.

Not to mention that the new colo gear comeing out next version update will help and skirmish 2.0 too, which are both lowman events.

Relic +2 augments can be done solo on almost any melee job that is /dnc.

However the biggest problem is that people dont know how to gear properly, going out all haste with zero accuracy isnt gonna help you much.... neither going out all accuracy with no haste at all.

Even if you follow the shopping lists easily available on sites like FFXIAH or BG you're still stuck needing gear from events that few people give a shit about anymore.

Gonna gather up the band and just farm a Murasamemaru np?

Empyrean +2 gear isn't whats being debated here because Abyssea by and large makes it stupid easy to access to win and get loot even if you have to fight mobs, get no procs and gather up +2 items one by one.

Salvage II got double plans because by and large the event gets little interest from the base. You can shout a while and offer the plans you don't want but chances are unless you find people to static with you, you're boned for a while. Legion? Same problem multiplied by 17 in addition to the extended period of time it takes to get Relics and beat ADLs if you aren't going to just print gil.

If Matsui wanted the gear ladder to work then completely tear down the old walls.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sparthos

Even if you follow the shopping lists easily available on sites like FFXIAH or BG you're still stuck needing gear from events that few people give a shit about anymore.

Gonna gather up the band and just farm a Murasamemaru np?

Empyrean +2 gear isn't whats being debated here because Abyssea by and large makes it stupid easy to access to win and get loot even if you have to fight mobs, get no procs and gather up +2 items one by one.

Salvage II got double plans because by and large the event gets little interest from the base. You can shout a while and offer the plans you don't want but chances are unless you find people to static with you, you're boned for a while. Legion? Same problem multiplied by 17 in addition to the extended period of time it takes to get Relics and beat ADLs if you aren't going to just print gil.

If Matsui wanted the gear ladder to work then completely tear down the old walls.

---

again for salvage II and Nyzul isle if you dont have 2-5 friends at hands that are willing to help you or gear along with you, its your own fault, thats what LSs are there for, and if your social LS cant provide that it fails honestly.

Legion can be done with like 12 people now with the new delve weapons (and no you dont need megaboss weapons). you would probably have the kill speed of pre legion nerf. So the option is there, make a shell!

18 people with new delve weapons and getting decked out on delve pritty much murder Legion now.

Voidwatch:
Sandy bastok and windurst can be done with as low as 6 people. you dont even need procs but you can bother if you want

Zilart and jeuno and upwards can be done with 12 people if you keep the NM at full strenght, EVEN LESS if you weaken them. Considering all you have additional is previous empy +2 gear etc and NQ delve weapons (non boss weapons).

This is of course assuming you have people that dont suck at their jobs

Damane as I said in my earlier post I agree with you on the course of action players who are stuck should take. I was just pointing out that that road has a lot of limitations placed on it arbitrarily to prevent flooding of in game items needed for legendary weapons. Those limitations at the same time hamper people being able to gear themselves up to contribute to delve bosses and the like and its a problem that'll hurt XI if it doesn't get fixed because right now if players are stuck in limbo between Delve Boss attempts or heck even coming up with a group for Delve Boss attempts then their only recourse is to unsub until SE nerfs the fights as SE has mentioned was their intention to do and losing players is never a good thing for a MMO because if that direction is taken to its logical end point then it will be a game populated only with the best of the best which while it sounds nice it'll leave the game barren and that'll be a damn shame.

Damane is spot on in all her post, she even goes as far as giving basic strategies... I have 2 good freinds that i constantly do salvageII/meebles/limbus/sky/aby and I recently joined a linkshell where members alos off to help when they can. My Linkshell has cleared all 3 delve fractures and spams 5/5 Tojil for points and gear. 1 clear tojil run is roughly 70k plasm... and we win 90 percent of the time.

Sparthos, I have only seen you talk about melle jobs, ever think about gearing up a mage job? Lvling geo and capping skill? making a stun set with ToM magic acc staff for stun? One of the reasons this game has lived for so long is that one character can lvl any job. I personally think everyone should have both mage and melle jobs as it makes them a well rounded player. I have great DD jobs and lvl'd rdm and sch because I found an ls that was needing those jobs, geared them above par and now I, schute, am vital player.

I'm gonna repeat it because it seems to be going over your heads still:

It doesn't matter how many guides you post.
It doesn't matter if you think people should have had the right jobs by now.
It doesn't matter if you think people should have had their gear up to snuff by now.
It doesn't matter if NNI is "Super Easy".
It doesn't matter if getting +2 gear for the new "Flavor of the week" job is Duoable.
It doesn't matter if "Anyone can build a relic in a few weeks".
It doesn't matter if VW is super easy with a PUG.
It doesn't matter if "some of the reive / skirmish gear is really good".
It doesn't matter if "This game should be all about 18 man content".
It doesn't matter if "Anyone can participate in delve".
It doesn't matter...

All that matters is that people either feel like they can't, or they just plain don't want to. Everyone here knows why they feel that way. Sitting around telling them to suck less or make more friends or writing a guide isn't going to change that fact because they know what they have to do and they don't want to do it. The game has to be changed to accommodate them or the game will die.

If your goal is to be the last guy left standing around scratching his head going "Pssshhhh... I don't know why all those noobs cancelled. This game is suuuuper easy. Psshhh whatever...".

Then by all means, keep telling the producer it is fine and telling the other players to suck it up. Otherwise, almost every event needs to be retooled to get people up to snuff for delve and delve itself needs to be retooled as well.

*and I have access to all that crap so save the personal attacks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Schrute

Sparthos, I have only seen you talk about melle jobs, ever think about gearing up a mage job? Lvling geo and capping skill? making a stun set with ToM magic acc staff for stun? One of the reasons this game has lived for so long is that one character can lvl any job. I personally think everyone should have both mage and melle jobs as it makes them a well rounded player. I have great DD jobs and lvl'd rdm and sch because I found an ls that was needing those jobs, geared them above par and now I, schute, am vital player.

---

http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/9832/mhg3.jpg

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Damane

Legion can be done with like 12 people now with the new delve weapons (and no you dont need megaboss weapons). you would probably have the kill speed of pre legion nerf. So the option is there, make a shell!

18 people with new delve weapons and getting decked out on delve pritty much murder Legion now.

---

So what you're saying is use Delve weapons to clear Legion so you have the gear to get Delve weapons?

(This Post is not directed specifically at you, Any points that may be taken as such are coincidental :3)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

Then by all means, keep telling the producer it is fine and telling the other players to suck it up. Otherwise, almost every event needs to be retooled to get people up to snuff for delve and delve itself needs to be retooled as well..

---

I agree with a lot of what you say, But saddly theres two sides to the gravy train with MMOs.

If we turn the flip side and make the game super dooper easy, Almost every one of the hardcore players will likely up and leave within in a few months due to having everything or being unsatisfied with the level of content they are receiving, because theres no challenge, and with no challenge there is no accomplishment. No one enjoys a victory when you've basically had god mode on the entire time... At least most players do not, i certainly feel it cheapens the experience.

Now, after that, with content bogged down to Mario levels, people who remain will breeze through and complete it at record speeds, which means SE will either have to pump out content much quicker, which is impossible, or you'll have periods of time where theres stagnation due to events being easy enough to clear and now theres nothing left to do. That or lower drops rates to match the difficulty, which in turn will cause people to complain, and blah blah you see the pattern.

Without Content difficulty, and with things being too easy, you create a rather mediocre game with no reward-feel that most gamers over the age of 8-14 want. Delve is designed to be for the more seasoned players, the ones who have gotten the good stuff and are looking for the gooder stuff. Its not suppose to be something you can step out of Abyssea after a Exp burn to 99 and win. The Producer has already said the Strategy we're using now, while workable, probably wont work on the next two, and that these mobs have behaviors you can learn and use different set ups to win.

And the thing is, with a lot of those types of people who "don't want too" or "feel like they can't", they aren't ignoring it cause of any reason the devs can fix, Its because they're lazy. They're comfortable being Lazy and will make excuses to support their laziness, rather it be blaming difficulty or "elitists", you can make the event accessible to Perle DD and people will still want it to be easier, and the proof is in the pudding, See: demands/Wants to make Abyssea easier.

In reality most people have no idea what they want, and I bet if they made the game easier and easier will find a new reason to complain or a new excuse to simply not do anything cause its too much effort to move their fingers across a keyboard and turn the gears in their head to form cognizant patterns of thought.

Theres enough mid-tier gear thats acceptable for players and could get them in a spot, the problem isn't the content, its the community and their demands for perfection, While this is acceptable as its entirely their choice how they spend their time and not yours, its not something the Devs can rightly fix, cause no matter how easy they make Delve, people will still shout for RMED DD, and Devs cannot fix that... Outside of maybe adding some easily craftable/obtainable "Level ~105" weapons that are weaker than Delve weapons but only slightly so.

Frankly, the jump between Reive/RME and Delve weapons are f**king stupid... Going from D:~60 dagger to DMG:90~100+ Is gd retarded, They need to add DMG:75~85 Weapons in there for mid-range. But that being said even if they do that, Its still unlikely the Playerbase will accept less than RMED... Which is pitiful but true, Almost all the blame falls on the community, not the Devs. (outside of them creating these weapons out of the blue)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Xantavia

So what you're saying is use Delve weapons to clear Legion so you have the gear to get Delve weapons?

---

Do you read what I write? I said NON-megaboss delve weapons, which imho should be achievable by most people.... they dont even need to be maxed out on aguments or have any augments on them

with a little bit effort everyone can get the KI and farm the plasm to buy a delve weapon from the NPC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Xantavia

So what you're saying is use Delve weapons to clear Legion so you have the gear to get Delve weapons?

---

Sounds like the circular logic I see all over our server, love how shouts for Delve are almost always for Delve weapon DDs only.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raksha

http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/9832/mhg3.jpg

---

Funniest part is my PLD being a healthy lvl0.

But yes, for the record I have WHM and SCH at the ready though both are dedicated more to healing than a stungun/nuking setup. Perhaps after the nuking update I'll dedicate some time to preparing a proper nuking SCH if there is sufficient reason to do so.

I'd say GEO is also ready but it just isn't.

I was more posting to show the daurdabla. Single handedly the most sought after mage job (if we consider daurdabla to be a job) of this expansion.

You know why the gear treadmill works so well for WoW? You get the gear you need simply from leveling, and that gear you earned from leveling is good enough to get you the next tier of leveling gear or it can start you down the dungeon path. When the new expansion comes, even if you missed out on the dungeon/raid gear from the previous one, you can still earn the new leveling gear which will negate your need to get that previous expansion's dungeon/raid gear.

This is where SE's tier system falls apart. The closest equivalents we have to WoW's leveling gear comes from Curor and Bayld, and seemingly few players consider those acceptable replacements for the previous content's gear.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camiie

You know why the gear treadmill works so well for WoW? You get the gear you need simply from leveling, and that gear you earned from leveling is good enough to get you the next tier of leveling gear or it can start you down the dungeon path. When the new expansion comes, even if you missed out on the dungeon/raid gear from the previous one, you can still earn the new leveling gear which will negate your need to get that previous expansion's dungeon/raid gear.

This is where SE's tier system falls apart. The closest equivalents we have to WoW's leveling gear comes from Curor and Bayld, and seemingly few players consider those acceptable replacements for the previous content's gear.

---

Sounds exactly what SE did. New expansion comes out and completely negates the need for the previous.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

Sounds exactly what SE did. New expansion comes out and completely negates the need for the previous.

---

No, people full timing Karieyh or Mikinaak still suck, even if they just swap between Adoulin gear, they still suck, previous stuff from events like Abyssea, Nyzul, or Salvage, are still great and needed.

They either should have gone all-in with obsoleting everything and making viable "starter" gear, or they should have just stuck to the sidegrades/minor upgrades philosophy and focused more on storyline and such.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

Sounds exactly what SE did. New expansion comes out and completely negates the need for the previous.

---

And this is the problem some of us are having now. FFXI has a history of keeping old stuff relevent. To suddenly switch directions after ten years is just awkward. For all the complaints with the old system and balance, it kept people playing. To suddenly pull a 180 with everything we have come to expect is poor design IMO.

I think a fair amount of old stuff IS relevant, judging from the gearsets I see out there (armor, not weapons). The point some people seem to be making is that people "feel like" they can't do it or "don't want to,' no matter how lowman or easy the event becomes. And there isn't much that can be done to help that. After all, according to that rationale, if you just keep making X event easier, it won't matter. It's an attitude that originates with the player him- or herself, as is the wrongminded notion that one needs Delve weapons to farm plasm to GET Delve weapons.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mahoro

I think a fair amount of old stuff IS relevant, judging from the gearsets I see out there (armor, not weapons). The point some people seem to be making is that people "feel like" they can't do it or "don't want to,' no matter how lowman or easy the event becomes. And there isn't much that can be done to help that. After all, according to that rationale, if you just keep making X event easier, it won't matter. It's an attitude that originates with the player him- or herself, as is the wrongminded notion that one needs Delve weapons to farm plasm to GET Delve weapons.

---

The majority of my arguments between other people were based on exactly what you just said here. And this is why I thanked you before for seeing it.

To add on to what you already said.
The majority of people who simply say "you don't need that" are taking from their point of view of them knowing and having better gear than the other person who has no clue.. However Sometimes it takes gear to obtain gear. Whether you are wearing Abyssea Perle Set or AF3, the fact is you had to have a decent set of gear allowing you to obtain better pieces because if you just head straight into areas unprepared, Winning is much harder than succeeding. Which leads to failure, wasting valuable time. That was part of the intro to my guide on how certain gear can help you explore higher areas.

While its easy to look up gear sets other people posted on FFXIAH. Gear doesn't make the skill for you. Statistics and mechanics can prove better on paper,but many things can change the overall outcome of what was being proven. Like if you try to prove someone that building a house is better than building a roof yet the person who chooses to build a roof didn't need to build a house since the roof showed to be good enough for what was being accomplished.

Some gears can teach you things other gear doesn't. You might try a haste set but then try using a fast cast set thinking they do the same exact thing only to find out something new on why the pieces are different.

I tried to explain with the example of looking at a gear set on FFXAH tends to lead people to not pay attention to small details.

Someone suggestion using Owl Eyes for Idle Refresh but they totally left out 1 important detail that makes a huge difference.

OWLEYES

[Main] All Races
DPS: 608 DMG:22 Delay:217 Damage taken +10% Adds "Refresh" effect
LV 80 WHM BLM SMN SCH GEO

What's highlighted means, you will take 10% more damage from mobs when equipping this. Which in the case if you are Taru, or have low HP and decide you need MP but ignore this detail, you just put your life in even more danger for not paying attention.

But from laziness, to having no motivation over how to overcome certain obstacles through bad experiences, people tend to give up not because they didn't try, but because they lacked the proper knowledge of accomplishing their goals effectively. Which details were included in my guide.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mahoro

I think a fair amount of old stuff IS relevant, judging from the gearsets I see out there (armor, not weapons). The point some people seem to be making is that people "feel like" they can't do it or "don't want to,' no matter how lowman or easy the event becomes. And there isn't much that can be done to help that. After all, according to that rationale, if you just keep making X event easier, it won't matter. It's an attitude that originates with the player him- or herself, as is the wrongminded notion that one needs Delve weapons to farm plasm to GET Delve weapons.

---

That's why personally they should adjust the older content and only touch the cooldowns on entry so it's more convenient. That way they keep their difficulty while offering the convenience to player's who do want to build themselves up and to be able to catch up with players who haven't taken breaks or what have you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mahoro

It's an attitude that originates with the player him- or herself, as is the wrongminded notion that one needs Delve weapons to farm plasm to GET Delve weapons.

---

It comes from nearly a decade of "new content" meaning "new face-grinding endgame." From Dynamis to Voidwatch, we've been slapped with "new content" where only specific jobs with specific gearsets are of any utility to anybody, not to mention the seemingly inevitable clash of outsized egoes that seem to come with such content. I have long since reached the point where my eyes skip over any update notes pertaining to "new battlefields," in much the same way they skipped over on sections on "chocobo racing."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ziyyigo-Tipyigo

It comes from nearly a decade of "new content" meaning "new face-grinding endgame." From Dynamis to Voidwatch, we've been slapped with "new content" where only specific jobs with specific gearsets are of any utility to anybody, not to mention the seemingly inevitable clash of outsized personalities that seem to come with such content. I have long since reached the point where my eyes skip over any update notes pertaining to "new battlefields," in much the same way they skipped over on sections on "chocobo racing."

---

Lol i was wondering how ever did they decide to allow legion up to 36 people to enter when it's hard to even find 3 people to do Salvage, 16 people to do VW, VNM? PW? I get that they wanted us to depend on others to do stuff so we can make friends than be loners throughout the entire game. But they fail to see that they made it so hardcore in forcing us to depend on others for help that they don't realize "Every person in game has a million things they need to accomplish" that it's hard to help others when we struggle to even get our needs solved.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daemon

Lol i was wondering how ever did they decide to allow legion up to 36 people to enter when it's hard to even find 3 people to do Salvage, 16 people to do VW, VNM? PW? I get that they wanted us to depend on others to do stuff so we can make friends than be loners throughout the entire game. But they fail to see that they made it so hardcore in forcing us to depend on others for help that they don't realize "Every person in game has a million things they need to accomplish" that it's hard to help others when we struggle to even get our needs solved.

---

Not only that, but like I said in another thread - there's the fact of dwindling player numbers in addition to events like Legion and now Delve bosses not being pickup-friendly, aswell as the death of larger event-specific linkshells due to just about everything being lowmannable since the level cap increase. All this contributes to the majority being unable to do endgame reliably and with a decent success rate. Makes me wonder if SE really knows what's actually going on in their own game at times.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tamoa

Not only that, but like I said in another thread - there's the fact of dwindling player numbers in addition to events like Legion and now Delve bosses not being pickup-friendly, aswell as the death of larger event-specific linkshells due to just about everything being lowmannable since the level cap increase. All this contributes to the majority being unable to do endgame reliably and with a decent success rate. Makes me wonder if SE really knows what's actually going on in their own game at times.

---

I agree. As for Delve, numbers, in my opinion, is the reason behind favoritism. Because people keep count of how much plasm can be earned, this leads to wanting to invite certain jobs so parties can net the highest amount. Not saying everyone does it, but a good amount basing performance on that.

I wrote out some suggestions on some ideas I think would make delve better

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...djustment-Idea

Warning, if you don't like to read, it is quite a long article. It's also just opinion based on ideas from my point of view.

The sad truth is, I've pretty much stopped caring at this point. Chances are I won't be around for very much longer, seeing as I absolutely loathe how the game's become and the direction it seems to be going in. Not to mention how vague SE is regarding their future plans for the things that matter to me personally. In my opinion, FFXI has been broken beyond repair.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tamoa

The sad truth is, I've pretty much stopped caring at this point. Chances are I won't be around for very much longer, seeing as I absolutely loathe how the game's become and the direction it seems to be going in. Not to mention how vague SE is regarding their future plans for the things that matter to me personally. In my opinion, FFXI has been broken beyond repair.

---

Yeah I know how you feel. I also wrote this article about how SE could make the game better if they lighten up and allow us to be a little more solo independent.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...iendly-Content

We will have to see how the next two version update plays out though. FF14 is just around the corner. I think the next update will either be a "make it or break it" for those considering on moving over to 14.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daemon

OWLEYES

[Main] All Races
DPS: 608 DMG:22 Delay:217 Damage taken +10% Adds "Refresh" effect
LV 80 WHM BLM SMN SCH GEO

What's highlighted means, you will take 10% more damage from mobs when equipping this.
.

---

Oh wow, is that what that meant?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Asymptotic

Oh wow, is that what that meant?

---

Yeah lol. The way SE does many items. Gives you something good but at a cost. That's why I didn't support the idea of idling this.

Also my huge argument over why it's important to pay attention to small details.

And why it hurts players to look up gear sets and not actually practice, learn and understand the gear they are working with.

I see that you actually read the entire comment I made because I didn't even highlight the bottom part. Makes a huge difference :)

No, I read it. But I don't believe you. Could you perhaps source testing that can confirm that "Damage taken +10%" actually means that I will take 10% more damage?