Bring back Long spawn/Rare WORLD HNM but put drops in legion/einherjar/other bc also

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Originally Posted by Nala

Oy rosina quit double posting.

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its because i hit the character limit. I try to post with (hit text limit) or (text limit) to show i'm not double posting for sake of double posting. It is due to hitting a character limit that I can't control.

You guys really need to stop derailing threads with offtopic insults/remarks about me and focus on the thread itself. I have not done a thing to provoke ppl into insulting me. You guys just dislike how I play. And instead of being mature and realising... "ok this person plays differently, i may not agree but hey.. i don't have to play with them" you guys will be able to keep threads active longer. But all i see is people who say what they want... no sell worthy post then when challanged you act like a child and use school yard pre school insults to discredit the person. I try to not use these tactics as i already know they are not needed.

please do your causes a favor and grow up.... it will help get what you want better.

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Originally Posted by Spiritreaver

Off topic-

Don't know your Assault rank situation, but if you are First LT. you can use 3 of that ranks missions to get hydra, behemoth, and cerb family spells.

I personally went this route to get Tourb(sp.) and it was SO much easier than spending all that time camping a HNM. I had 2 buds that helped me into the assault, but @99 BLU you can solo all three. And if you dont have buds with that rank, do a shout-you'd be surprised how many ppl still need those wins.

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This is true, but I don't have that rank yet. Apart from camping the HNM, I'm also building a pop for the ZNM and building my rank. I'm getting this spell one way or another.

The original poster just wants to be lazy and get rewarded for their laziness.

It's simple math. If one group can Camp the NM and do einherjar or whatever, then they have twice as many chances as the group that can only do einherjar. The first group is basically being rewarded for playing the game at a different time of day from the second group. That's just plain stupid. Especially considering the fact that every update resets the spawn times so that it's almost always the same group of people being rewarded.

And it's been said a hundred times in the past, but here it goes again since the HNM crowd is clearly trying to ignore it:

There are already world spawn NMs in the game. You don't kill them because you don't enjoy camping / killing them. All you care about is the "Exclusive gear" that makes you feel special.

frank
not everyone who wants hnm, wants long timers or wants to do it for gear.. I hope you see that.. I want it for content to do.

I see some baseless assumptions here that doing einherjar = doing kings. Well guess what, thats wrong. Kings average pop time was 5.5 days, and it took 2 weeks per Odin, you got 2-3 of each king for every 1 Odin run. Having a bot was better.

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

And it's been said a hundred times in the past, but here it goes again since the HNM crowd is clearly trying to ignore it:

There are already world spawn NMs in the game. You don't kill them because you don't enjoy camping / killing them. All you care about is the "Exclusive gear" that makes you feel special.

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And this is the correct answer as why HNMLS's want this content back. Their ability to get claim 99% of the time and then hold that gear over others. It's BS, and I laugh whenever they say things like "I just like to camp." DI, Tiamat, SW, Jorm, Vrtra, etc still exist, go camp them for your 'fun' and shut up already.

1) Take your group and stand by the ??? of a pop NM.

2) alliance leader types /random

3) if you got 150 or less, he/she pops the NM

4) if you got 151 or more, you wait 30 mins and repeat steps 2-4

5) if after 3 hours (the 7th time you would /random) you haven't got under 150, you pop it anyway.

6) wait 21 hours from the ToD and repeat from 1)

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Originally Posted by Babekeke

1) Take your group and stand by the ??? of a pop NM.

2) alliance leader types /random

3) if you got 150 or less, he/she pops the NM

4) if you got 151 or more, you wait 30 mins and repeat steps 2-4

5) if after 3 hours (the 7th time you would /random) you haven't got under 150, you pop it anyway.

6) wait 21 hours from the ToD and repeat from 1)

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There you go campers. Problem solved. Have fun!

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Originally Posted by Babekeke

1) Take your group and stand by the ??? of a pop NM.

2) alliance leader types /random

3) if you got 150 or less, he/she pops the NM

4) if you got 151 or more, you wait 30 mins and repeat steps 2-4

5) if after 3 hours (the 7th time you would /random) you haven't got under 150, you pop it anyway.

6) wait 21 hours from the ToD and repeat from 1)

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Liked because it made me chuckle

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Originally Posted by Babekeke

1) Take your group and stand by the ??? of a pop NM.

2) alliance leader types /random

3) if you got 150 or less, he/she pops the NM

4) if you got 151 or more, you wait 30 mins and repeat steps 2-4

5) if after 3 hours (the 7th time you would /random) you haven't got under 150, you pop it anyway.

6) wait 21 hours from the ToD and repeat from 1)

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OMG Best reply to this thread so far. Good humor and hits the nail on the head :)

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Originally Posted by Babekeke

1) Take your group and stand by the ??? of a pop NM.

2) alliance leader types /random

3) if you got 150 or less, he/she pops the NM

4) if you got 151 or more, you wait 30 mins and repeat steps 2-4

5) if after 3 hours (the 7th time you would /random) you haven't got under 150, you pop it anyway.

6) wait 21 hours from the ToD and repeat from 1)

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i can see see this happening too... XD

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Originally Posted by Babekeke

1) Take your group and stand by the ??? of a pop NM.

2) alliance leader types /random

3) if you got 150 or less, he/she pops the NM

4) if you got 151 or more, you wait 30 mins and repeat steps 2-4

5) if after 3 hours (the 7th time you would /random) you haven't got under 150, you pop it anyway.

6) wait 21 hours from the ToD and repeat from 1)

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"Like" times a million. I did HNM's and that really brings back the feeling. Although, I swear S/E weighted the windows. So first window would be 1-10, then 1-20, then 1-30, etc. Almost always guaranteed you weren't going to be doing anything but camping the next 3 hours.

Rose colored glasses. World Spawns can seriously burn. It was fun for a short time but then it got old... quickly.

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Originally Posted by SNK

Rose colored glasses. World Spawns can seriously burn. It was fun for a short time but then it got old... quickly.

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not really rose glasses, it makes the world feel alive. It puts in adventure and danger. I just wish they was on short short timers so all nm/ hnm was up nearly all the time. See all the newbies/ returing players walk thru la theine or kon highland and see those massive rams would be priceless.
This game lost its epic feel to the world. the worlds do feel empty so seeing nm/hnm up would liven it up. Like i said b4, a big WoW factor i had was bloodtear killing my 5 times as a newbie cuz it was up and aggro me.
It made me want to get stronger to hunt and kill it. Thats what this game needs. We need to get out of our lil book burn caves and explore the world with all these returning players. Show them how ffxi aged well to keep them playing.

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Originally Posted by Rosina

not really rose glasses, it makes the world feel alive. It puts in adventure and danger.

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They weren't really adventurous or dangerous activities. If they'd been truly random encounters at random times in random locations then they may have fit. The world didn't really feel alive, just small, out-of-the-way sections of it.

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This game lost its epic feel to the world. the worlds do feel empty so seeing nm/hnm up would liven it up. Like i said b4, a big WoW factor i had was bloodtear killing my 5 times as a newbie cuz it was up and aggro me.

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There's a thin line between epic and disruptive.

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It made me want to get stronger to hunt and kill it. Thats what this game needs. We need to get out of our lil book burn caves and explore the world with all these returning players. Show them how ffxi aged well to keep them playing.

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But it hasn't aged well, and having NMs around constantly to harass new players is more of a step-back than anything.

One thing i do miss is the fun bs that happens between windows. And the actual fights were fun

itt; people whose bot wasn't good enough to claim

Not really a bot kinda guy, especially if it would need to be bought, spend enough money on MMOs already.

come on you're supposed to yell at me and call me a filthy cheater ;/

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Originally Posted by Camiie

They weren't really adventurous or dangerous activities. If they'd been truly random encounters at random times in random locations then they may have fit. The world didn't really feel alive, just small, out-of-the-way sections of it.



There's a thin line between epic and disruptive.



But it hasn't aged well, and having NMs around constantly to harass new players is more of a step-back than anything.

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i don't suggest u play skyrim then it be a step back for you...

my suggestion was based off of ffxiv and skyrim. and hate to say it.. you do learn aggro types pretty quick around hnm.... thats how i learned had to avoid bloodtear. and this was playing 2 hrs a day...

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Originally Posted by Rosina

i don't suggest u play skyrim then it be a step back for you...

my suggestion was based off of ffxiv and skyrim. and hate to say it.. you do learn aggro types pretty quick around hnm.... thats how i learned had to avoid bloodtear. and this was playing 2 hrs a day...

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Not an attack, but Skyrim is a single player game, whereas FFXI is an MMO. You can't use elements from either for a side-by-side comparison of the two games w/o making that distinction up front. And that's said before you even get to the true randomness of adventures in Skyrim(i'm fairly certain that most the "NMs" of Skyrim are only generated once a quest requires them) as opposed to timed NM spawns in FFXI.

I love both games, but really, comparing FFXI and Skyrim can be likened to critiquing a can of PBR against a bottle fine wine. Both are great for their intended purposes, but those purposes are not necessarily the same.

@ spirit reaver... i wasn't talking dragons. : ) more like gaints and mammoths. those can 1 shot u @ lvl hell 1 mammoth sent me running @ lvl 7 when i tried to get a tusk for a quest in whiterun. But I also did mention ffxiv... which nm pop every 15 min on the dot. so they pretty much always up.

pretty much skyrim or any TES game can mimic an mmo due to the sheer size of it. And most mmo now a days are solo... ffxi included. I was establishing that when u explore as a newbie you want a sence of adventure, exploration, and danger. As i stated i was an ffxi newbie when i say bloodtear this my first mmo. And i knew next to no one. I don't see bloodtear killing me as a step back I saw it as a goal. If ppl gonna quit ffxi from getting aggro by a hnm... then this wasn't the game for them from the get go. You need a sence of awe when exploring. Seeing massive deadly monsters does do that.

also i was comparing rpg to rpg. and TES kinda does play like an mmo minus the seeing of ppl. but w/e.

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Originally Posted by Rosina

@ spirit reaver... i wasn't talking dragons. : ) more like gaints and mammoths. those can 1 shot u @ lvl hell 1 mammoth sent me running @ lvl 7 when i tried to get a tusk for a quest in whiterun. But I also did mention ffxiv... which nm pop every 15 min on the dot. so they pretty much always up.

pretty much skyrim or any TES game can mimic an mmo due to the sheer size of it. And most mmo now a days are solo... ffxi included. I was establishing that when u explore as a newbie you want a sence of adventure, exploration, and danger. As i stated i was an ffxi newbie when i say bloodtear this my first mmo. And i knew next to no one. I don't see bloodtear killing me as a step back I saw it as a goal. If ppl gonna quit ffxi from getting aggro by a hnm... then this wasn't the game for them from the get go. You need a sence of awe when exploring. Seeing massive deadly monsters does do that.

also i was comparing rpg to rpg. and TES kinda does play like an mmo minus the seeing of ppl. but w/e.

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The dynamics of meta between an MMO and a single player game are WAAAAAAY different even if the share the same genre. also just a extra note: Skyrim wasn't as exactly random as you think it is. The only notable random factor in the game is also it's claim to fame, dragons. Other things such as unique encounters are one time and usually follow a type of pattern. That sort of meta doesn't bold well for an MMO.

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Originally Posted by Rekin

The dynamics of meta between an MMO and a single player game are WAAAAAAY different even if the share the same genre. also just a extra note: Skyrim wasn't as exactly random as you think it is. The only notable random factor in the game is also it's claim to fame, dragons. Other things such as unique encounters are one time and usually follow a type of pattern. That sort of meta doesn't bold well for an MMO.

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oi lol .... ok i never said anything about the randomness of hnm. That was camie. I'm saying take out the random factor, there you have all the hnm up roaming around areas of the zone. Much like a single player rpg as in skyrim. Where you walk around and can be attacked my spriggins in the forests or gaints and mammoths in the tundra. Or those ice wraiths, wisp spirits. And you either 1) know how to fight/ are the lvl to fight) or find a good escape route. Thats why i suggested 15 min spawn timers so all the nm/hnm in ffxi will most likely be up for anyone to try and kill.

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Preatty much what I'm getting at is The TES games do in a basic way.. act like an mmorpg. You have this huge world you can freely explore, you kill creatures out in the wild, do quests and craft gear, weapons and potions.

there needs to be an adventure to be had in ffxi... more then solo to 10, then leech/burn in dark caves, then leech burn in a high lvl zone. People barely see what ffxi has to offer outside of this. Thats what i miss, see all these different areas. Fighting all these different mobs with different types of styles. Learning how each style works and can be defeated. Seeing huge deadly foes that can rip me apart if i'm not too careful. Thats why i kept playing ffxi for 7 years. I thinklow pop hnm will help liven up the areas.

Just stop thinking about the randomness we see now. And think of how the areas would be if we constently see nm/hnm. heck the coolest thing in the world for me was seeing a group of 75 killing steel fleece.

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Originally Posted by Rosina

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Preatty much what I'm getting at is The TES games do in a basic way.. act like an mmorpg.

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I don't agree with this assessment at all. I think the two genres are radically different and that you are mistaking superficial similarities for genuinely synonymous game design.

HNM Monopolization DO NOT WANT , HNM Camping for 8 hrs on end for a chance at a item man you must be a troll.

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Originally Posted by Rosina

@ spirit reaver... i wasn't talking dragons. : ) more like gaints and mammoths. those can 1 shot u @ lvl hell 1 mammoth sent me running @ lvl 7 when i tried to get a tusk for a quest in whiterun. But I also did mention ffxiv... which nm pop every 15 min on the dot. so they pretty much always up.

pretty much skyrim or any TES game can mimic an mmo due to the sheer size of it. And most mmo now a days are solo... ffxi included. I was establishing that when u explore as a newbie you want a sence of adventure, exploration, and danger. As i stated i was an ffxi newbie when i say bloodtear this my first mmo. And i knew next to no one. I don't see bloodtear killing me as a step back I saw it as a goal. If ppl gonna quit ffxi from getting aggro by a hnm... then this wasn't the game for them from the get go. You need a sence of awe when exploring. Seeing massive deadly monsters does do that.

also i was comparing rpg to rpg. and TES kinda does play like an mmo minus the seeing of ppl. but w/e.

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Gonna have to flat-out disagree now.

TES games(hell, you can throw in the Fall-Out games too) are pretty close to an archetypal example of what a single-player RPG should be at the genre's current level of technology imo. If anything, FFXI is more like a single-player RPG that received a quick MMO make-over and was super lucky it had the Final Fantasy brand name to fall back on, than the other way 'round.

I mean really think about it a sec and tell me outside of the AH system, what part of FFXI would not be better suited to a single player venue? Relic/Mythic/Empy? Mission lines? Crafting? I can easily see those working tons better in a single-player RPG than FFXI(or at least how they were implemented in FFXI).

But i digress and gonna bring my point all the way back if i can.

HNM, for good or ill, happened. If that type of content is ever again made relevant by SE, so be it. Some ppl loved the faux-PVP aspect it brought to the table-good for them, nothing wrong with that. I personally hated every min i spent in that cesspool of a scene(and a point ppl seem to forget, for a good while there back in the day, HNM camping WAS EG. If you didn't take part in it, no EG for you), and that's fine too.

I'm just, sorry, not gonna buy that newbs getting mowed down en masse by a rampaging NM is a good thing for the game. Have to find a better example of HNMs being good for the game to convince me of that.

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@ the thread and the ongoing argument in general

There is a place for HNMs and the hunting of them in FFXI. But SE devs have to step up and structure any future implementation of such content from the start. We only have to look back to see how the scene worked when players were left to their own devices.

Either that or address the root issue at play, PVP or FFXI's lack thereof.

Man-up and develop a real PVP option for those that want that type of gameplay. Or finally state definitively that true PVP has no place in FFXI, lose that small group that wants that action(possibly) and build from there.

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Originally Posted by Rosina

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Preatty much what I'm getting at is The TES games do in a basic way.. act like an mmorpg. You have this huge world you can freely explore, you kill creatures out in the wild, do quests and craft gear, weapons and potions.

there needs to be an adventure to be had in ffxi... more then solo to 10, then leech/burn in dark caves, then leech burn in a high lvl zone. People barely see what ffxi has to offer outside of this. Thats what i miss, see all these different areas. Fighting all these different mobs with different types of styles. Learning how each style works and can be defeated. Seeing huge deadly foes that can rip me apart if i'm not too careful. Thats why i kept playing ffxi for 7 years. I thinklow pop hnm will help liven up the areas.

Just stop thinking about the randomness we see now. And think of how the areas would be if we constently see nm/hnm. heck the coolest thing in the world for me was seeing a group of 75 killing steel fleece.

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Efficiency

Its more 'efficient' to develop a character the way you layed out. Is that the only way? No. Do i even personally prefer that way? Not at all, but good luck finding enough like-minded individuals do try any of the other ways. There are adventures still to be had in FFXI currently, its just more efficient to stay with the 'mob' than do otherwise.

Efficiency, that's what's now and always has had a strangle-hold on 'Adventure' in FFXI.

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I think low pop hnm will help liven up the areas.

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They might, who knows? But unless they have some really nice drops, they will be quickly forgotten after the initial 'new car smell' wears off. And if the do have great drops, even with low pop times, what's that going to do about all the old baggage associated with HNM camping from popping up again? Nothing and then we've gone full circle back to the old bad days.

Like i essentially said before, unless the devs implement any new timed HNMs properly; what's the point?

And what IMO constitutes new 'properly' implemented HNMs? Not for me to even comment on. All i know is FFXI is atm littered with half-assed, broken, or flat unused content and i would rather SE not resurrect flawed yrs old content(yet again...) in lieu of taking the time to craft and give us something that works right out of the box.

I've got high hopes for SoA. Let's pray after 10+ yrs, SE has learned to take their time on it. Its prolly gonna be their last shot at excellence as far as XI is concerned.

Will continue to re-post for relevance:

There are already big mean baddie NMS roaming around in game, that can kill bystanders. No one fights them because they only care about gear. I think what Rosina is talking about is more an issue of lack of story line than lack of HNMs.

I say, if they are to reintroduce kings, put them on a completely random timer. Forget make their spawn truly random. Say once or twice at any given time or day per conquest tally. This way nobody can has the estimated pop window, it's up to pure chance. They just have to be lucky and be around when it pops AND pray that enough of their ls is around to kill it.

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

Will continue to re-post for relevance:

There are already big mean baddie NMS roaming around in game, that can kill bystanders. No one fights them because they only care about gear. I think what Rosina is talking about is more an issue of lack of story line than lack of HNMs.

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I agree there are plenty of HNM that spend loads of time waiting around to be killed, no disagreement there at all. But i don't see Rosina asking for a storyline for HNMs in his/her latest batch of posts on the subject.

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I think low pop hnm will help liven up the areas.

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Don't see how there could be much sub-context there. Low time spawn HNMs somehow revitalizing much of the empty areas off of the beaten path in FFXI. That's what i took from his/her posts anyway.

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Originally Posted by Spiritreaver

I agree there are plenty of HNM that spend loads of time waiting around to be killed, no disagreement there at all. But i don't see Rosina asking for a storyline for HNMs in his/her latest batch of posts on the subject.

Don't see how there could be much sub-context there. Low time spawn HNMs somehow revitalizing much of the empty areas off of the beaten path in FFXI. That's what i took from his/her posts anyway.

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She was saying that she wanted HNM wandering around and to give low level players a sense of adventure etc.. It just sounded like quest / mission content was what she really wanted to me. That is the only thing I could think of that would make a low level person want to hang around an area where something was waiting to eat their face. I probably shouldn't try to read between the lines in this case though.

I sort of miss HNM days, but then I think back to spending hours and hours waiting for people to show up to a HNM, waiting up to 3 more hours to note its TOD, and then going back the next day only to find 2 or 3 others online in ls who showed any interest in camping it while the other 10-20 people only bothered to join in after it popped. Then there was another very active HNM ls I was in which camped HNMs religiously that the entire day was spent camping HNMs. I wanted to play the game, but because I was online I was expected to show up to HNMs or get kicked for not showing up to HNM events. And the drama between HNM linkshells, oh dear god. "You used hacks!" "No way did you claim that properly, you voked before it spawned, I'm reporting!" "Everyone spam cure their tank so it flails!" "Pulling a spider train to their group, everyone get ready to claim it once they wipe!" I'd rather not live through that again, I have a life and I don't want to spend it glued to the screen again watching endlessly for a mob to spawn and then suffer the insults and accusations of 2 dozen people because someone outclaimed them.

There are still HNMs that pop after 21-23 hours like Cassie, Serket, Roc, Simurgh. I haven't camped any of them since returning to FFXI but I have killed Serket and Cassie at least once because they were there.

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Originally Posted by cidbahamut

I don't agree with this assessment at all. I think the two genres are radically different and that you are mistaking superficial similarities for genuinely synonymous game design.

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only difference is 1 is online 1 is not... so no real difference actually they both are rpg @ heart.

what i'm getting @

newbies runs to gusgen mines and sees steele fleece* OMG THERE IS THIS MASSIVE RAM OUT HERE!!!! can i kill it?
LS: no but lets come out and help you
n: ok!!
*ls join parties with newbie and kill SF for him he gets to loot the drop"
n: OMG U GUYS ARE AWESOME I CAN'T WAIT TO HIT 99.

ffxi retains 1 player...

Excuse me sir, there is a Tiamat in my soup.

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Originally Posted by Sayomi

Excuse me sir, there is a Tiamat in my soup.

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lol this made me laugh.

oh btw that example i gave really happen was pretty cool to see. made me happy i was was a member of that LS at one point.

But i think you guys became jaded after playing ffxi too long. You forgot what it was like to be a newbie, or a mmorpg newbie. And really if ppl quit the game over an nm death... they never was gonna stay here long from the get go. You can't only win... there are times where you do have to loose to learn something. With out defeat winning becomes meaningless.

I just would think the cool factor of seeing nm and hnm up 2 would liven up the world and only reason content is dead is because of jaded ffxi vets who don't wanna "help" for the "millionth time". most newbies don't even know most the content >.> all they see is solo to 10... leech/burn in gusgen. leech/burn in cn. leech/burn in abyssea. and more often then not... ur LS mates are leech/burning and "too busy" to help/reply.

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Originally Posted by Rosina

only difference is 1 is online 1 is not... so no real difference actually they both are rpg @ heart.

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You are absolutely positively delusional if you actually believe this.

Guys! Guys! Skyrim is exactly the same thing as FFXI only it's offline!

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Originally Posted by cidbahamut

You are absolutely positively delusional if you actually believe this.

Guys! Guys! Skyrim is exactly the same thing as FFXI only it's offline!

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mmoRPG ..... what does that say??

To me it says you don't know what in the world you're talking about and have no understanding of game design and lack the ability to differentiate game genres.

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Originally Posted by Rosina

mmoRPG ..... what does that say??

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Your ignoring the important part. MMO. That part alone changes everything in how an RPG's meta is handled, from how strong monsters are to how stats are handled. Once people are thrown into the equation, in this case a lot, everything changes in how an rpg or any game for that matter is built.