Since no one seems to have posted yet: Final LB fight

Please please please for the love of god keep the fight tough for a full party of 6 caped at 95, i want to test my "Limit" before becoming lv.99 Think about the fan base for once on this one thank you!

Then after a few months think about nerfing it to be easier.

Why not make it assign you a random BCNM zone to ease congestion. Make it so that if you're in a party with people, you're guaranteed to get the same zone as everyone in the party.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Ehh, thats not fair.. even in the days when FFXI was significantly tougher there were people soloing things (rdm Genbu?) but the 'let me solo/low man everything' mentality is no good either.

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I been playing for like 7 or 8 years now and still run my LS in a way that I get as many involved with any event I do. I would hate to do everything solo, or ever log into a game with thousands of people playing just like me and have 5 people in the LS. I like my large LS that we can all do stuff hang out, chat with each other and do things as a group. I guess I'm more old school. I like strategy, planning, getting opinions from LS members, help from LS members, giving help to LS members, etc. I dont want to sound like I'm bashing everyone that just solos in the game but why play an MMO just to solo? I never really could understand that concept.

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Originally Posted by Camate

Also, in regards to suggestions that say to offer different battlefields, each one has different sizes as well as different entrance/exits, so this would create a bottleneck because players would select the easiest area. After testing various areas out we decided to go with the Qu’Bia Arena.

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I dunno, mun. They're all equally as annoying to run to and I think Qu'Bia may be the worst of the bunch which might be the point of it's choice. Whether we get ported to them or not, and also to add, I don't foresee the problems you guys do with different arenas. Still, having the option to go to any of them isn't a bad idea. If you choose one of them then everyone for certain will go there. I know it's a pain in the butt to do the extra work but we're going to need it I think.


I'm playing for myself so it just does not effect me whether someone else can get lv99 or not. I just don't care. So make it easy or hard, neither is going to stop me in my tracks. But I will say a group setting for the final limit break quest is asking for bottleneck trouble.

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Originally Posted by Unleashhell

I been playing for like 7 or 8 years now and still run my LS in a way that I get as many involved with any event I do. I would hate to do everything solo, or ever log into a game with thousands of people playing just like me and have 5 people in the LS. I like my large LS that we can all do stuff hang out, chat with each other and do things as a group. I guess I'm more old school. I like strategy, planning, getting opinions from LS members, help from LS members, giving help to LS members, etc. I dont want to sound like I'm bashing everyone that just solos in the game but why play an MMO just to solo? I never really could understand that concept.

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well, for the most part I agree... on occasion I do like to solo things, when im feeling too lazy or w/e ...

Just don't feel like people who solo should be alienated.. I do believe that the majority should be group content (actually I think I miss group exp parties the most, not fully sure why lol)

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Originally Posted by Natasha

well, for the most part I agree... on occasion I do like to solo things, when im feeling too lazy or w/e ...

Just don't feel like people who solo should be alienated.. I do believe that the majority should be group content (actually I think I miss group exp parties the most, not fully sure why lol)

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You prolly miss actually having to pay attention to the game instead of "Do a call when you guys get yellow" lol...

not to mention when you used to level up, it seemed more meaningful. Now its just like "cool you leveled"...

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Originally Posted by Camate

Howdy!

I have a bit of information to share with you regarding the final limit break quest.

Battle Balance
We’re currently making adjustments to the battle so that you don’t need to have a full party of six members to win. This doesn’t mean it will be “easy”, but there will be more victories as a result of the change.

We have seen feedback from those that would like a battle and those that think a battle is unnecessary. As a result of looking over everyone’s opinions, we decided it would be good to create a battlefield that wasn’t as tough as the Maat fight, but have you all take on a slight challenge to differentiate this as the final limit break quest.

Congestion
Some players have been worried about possible battlefield congestion. We’ll be adding a step to this quest that will require players to obtain an item before actually entering the battlefield, which should stagger the amount of players entering at once. Also, in regards to suggestions that say to offer different battlefields, each one has different sizes as well as different entrance/exits, so this would create a bottleneck because players would select the easiest area. After testing various areas out we decided to go with the Qu’Bia Arena.

Helping Others
You won’t need to obtain the entry item when helping others. We’re also in the process of preparing an NPC that will teleport you to battlefields located in original areas as a reward for completing the final limit break quest.

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I was looking forward to doing this challenge 'hard mode' with friends. I could look over trading Kindred Crests, random-rock-paper-scissors minigames and laying eggs in front of everyone (wth...) because I expected at the end of the road some epic showdown. Now you're telling me it'll be a cut-scene, swing dagger four times and get back to afk in Port Jeuno? People used to skillup, gather equipment, research battle strategies, perfect their macros to beat Maat @66. And now just a walkover?
I'm dissapoint

It's very simple

This is the last limit break quest we'll ever get

SE did well (for the most part, not perfect but for the most part) on the last limit break quest to get to 75. It was an accomplishment back then.

This is our last one we will ever get, I highly doubt that they will ever go beyond level 99.

This shouldn't be a pushover, this shouldn't be easy. It needs to be challenging. If anything for the first month then nerf it just like SE nerfed CoP to get to sea. There is nothing like this left in the game besides relic and mythic, and relic is slowly moving closer and closer to that line between just crazy dedicated and just slightly dedicated.

Not saying make this as hard as a relic lol... I'm saying make it as hard, if not harder, than the difficulty level 75 maat was when it came out. Can always adjust it later to allow the people struggling through, although since you can use more than one person that shouldn't ever be the case.

If this was a solo fight, I might be more accepting to making it easier since not everyone is skilled and has great gear. But this is a group fight, and you can get anyone to help you. If the fight is fun people would be willing to help anyways, a lot of people just sit around jeuno and do nothing so it would be something to do.

If you don't think people are going to be willing to help players get through after finishing theirs, give some incentive to players who have already completed the quest and fight. Just like those mini expansions give the players a key and trade it to the chest to get a random augmented item. Make it something that players would be interested in doing.

It's a group fight, it needs to be difficult. This is our last one SE don't mess it up~

Guess I'll join the minority and agree to an intermediate difficulty to the fight. I would hate to be the guy who finally starts playing a year from now, gets to 95 and finds himself hitting a roadblock because no one will help him (without incentive). Sees that everyone already broke the level cap and it's old hat...talk about soul-crushing.

Hell, I'd even support a solo fight versus the alternative of the inevitable classism/rigid profiling that would result from such a difficult trial. "You don't have such-and-such equipment? [Hmm.]" "I'm sorry, but we need this class combo for the final slot." "Do you have xxx/xxx? Can you come as that please?" Doesn't inspire faith in the game when the whims of others allow or prevent you from proceeding in the game. But like someone said previously, it's hard to balance a solo challenge between a multitude of classes, and some folks would come out of that deal unhappy. There's really no way to please everyone...so 'greasing the skids' to facilitate an easier path to victory is the realistic decision.

Well, even as somebody who thought the fight as is is inappropriate, I will say that a blanket nerf rather than a redesign isn't really what I had in mind. I would have prefered removing Asuran Fists and weakening Enfire (and maybe his normal hits), and then compensating by adding things that put more pressure on the rest of the group, like AoE or (better yet!) moving the timer from 15 minutes to 10 or even 7. That way, more potential tanks could handle it, and the competence of the DDs involved would actually matter.

One thing I'd add is that the entry item is a great idea, but make sure it drops from a whole bunch of mobs. Maybe a KI from Voidwatch or +2 Abyssea NMs?

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Originally Posted by Zannon

Please please please for the love of god keep the fight tough for a full party of 6 caped at 95, i want to test my "Limit" before becoming lv.99 Think about the fan base for once on this one thank you!

Then after a few months think about nerfing it to be easier.

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Many of the fanbase are casuals, making an very hard battle will just cause a lot of people to quit. The way the game is heading, many people are on the fence. And before saying, well see ya, many of these people keep this game from not getting cancelled.

I was about to post that making us get an item before going to the arena will do absolutely nothing to reduce congestion, it will just redirect it. I remember back when we had to overcamp for Kazham keys because everyone and their mother wanted it and there were only a scant handful of mobs with a low drop rate of the item.

This is sounding like it's going to be more of the same. The congestion will simply be in whatever arbitrary zone we have to farm for the items *as well as* the BCNM itself, and that waiting room is not large. I remember the long line waiting to do the Fellow NPC fight...

I like that there seems to be damage caps in place so as to(I presume)limit job favoritism. That might actually go a long way in helping all jobs being useful in some form. In such a case I don't see why it couldn't be harder than not.

"Also, in regards to suggestions that say to offer different battlefields, each one has different sizes as well as different entrance/exits, so this would create a bottleneck because players would select the easiest area."

Wrong, so wrong. Fyi, moogle warps you to your choice of bcnm area, size of area is irrelevant, you can kite just as well in that area as any other down the tunnel. ta da, problem solved.

I understand that takes a bit of thinking, but there you go. Implement it, we are done.

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Originally Posted by Raksha

Can't watch it all due to shitty internet, but of the parts that I have stuttered through looks like this guy did.

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Ofcourse a BST solo'd it, using a billion Dawn Mulsums.

Anyways, a question to pierce through all the bickering, although it probably doesn't make very much of a difference:

Is the fight capped at 95?

I'm gonna have to help my friends do this, but if I can do it before hand with a well equipped group to get an edge on helping them, I might.

This final limit break fight should not be made easier because a few people complained. The difficulty is fine as it is. Nerfing content before its out is dumb takes away all the challenge from the game. I wouldn't mind if they nerfed it in a later patch. But when its originally released it should be hard.

Please keep the fight hard. This is the final limit break in the game it should be something special and very difficult to win at first. I don't want some pushover fight where I go in and win really easy. Whats the point of even having a limit brake fight if its just going to be so easy? If that's the case save everyone the trouble and just make it something like turn in 20 merits like the last one.

Also making everyone get some item to do the bc does nothing for congestion. It just moves it to another spot. Remember how awful getting those seed things for ACP was. All these people trying to claim too weak mobs like they were fafnir.

Don't make the fight easy guys come on, if its our final one lets go out with a bang and have a real challenge. I think I speak for most when I shout: BRING IT ON! Then again maybe I am over thinking that. XD Maat fight was to challenge us to knowing our job, knowing just what gear to have, what items to take, and to plan out and macro our stuff accordingly.

I noticed some suggested +2 nms having the item. That is still going to create a major congestion because of farming the K.I. for it not including poping them. My opinion (like it matters) is to have this item drop from regular mobs in multiple aby zones that have a short spawn timer. That should cut down on congestion to a certain degree, spread out the congestion that is caused and give people a fighters chance of getting their item for L.B.

I also took note about how to get completed people a reason to do the fight again. To be honest, most of the people I've seen on my server charge to help with darn near anything these days regardless if it helps them out in the end or not. I understand its their time and they have a right to charge but at the same time SE if having observed the servers long enough should take note more and more people don't want to help others just to help even if there is a prize at the end of it or not. Good example is my ls. I have members there that came to it due to just that problem. Granted we now are a tight net group but we will still help because hey at least we get skill ups, merits, and experience from it; not including getting to meet someone new. Main point being made is I just don't think unless S.E. starts shelling out either high selling items as prizes or a but load of gil for redoing it that there will be very many to stand up and help out others.

Now with that all being voiced it was just an opinion and probably one that will not make a lick of difference anyways but I did just want to point out that I am agreeing with most that this fight needs to be kick butt awesome and that the item for it needs to be easier to get.

I do like a challenge, and I would wanna experience the fight before the nerf, but on the other hand, Im sure there are gonna be some money sharks swimming around PJ looking to sell a spot for a win. Which makes it kinda hard for the people who dont have all +2, relics/empys, and the correct job. I know a few people who swear by certain jobs just because they enjoy it, not because its needed. And I dont think they should have to pay for their decision on what job they play (IE not being able to complete the fight)

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

OH GAWD GRANDIA II MUSIC GOT ME FROM THE START. AOFISFDJGFKDLHMDTJ

Best game ever.

Carry on

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I may be late to this thread but...

So glad I'm not the only one that noticed the music.

The final limit break should have been a solo fight of a difficult nature. This making everything in the game stupidly easy, and then jumping to nerf it further when crappy/lazy players complain is pathetic. The maat fight was a test of your ability. Alone. Some jobs were easier than others, but at the very least it was one player doing the work. With this last limit break that should have been the model. All this group fight will achieve is for lazy people to pay others to get their clear if they can't muddle through on their own. Disappointing.

the pooor pain of the new people 6 months from now when the current rush > 99 is done :( i helped 3 people this week shouting in port to try and get lb 1 and lb2 done as it is free not like the money grubbers that will come around for 99 :(

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Originally Posted by xbobx

Many of the fanbase are casuals, making an very hard battle will just cause a lot of people to quit. The way the game is heading, many people are on the fence. And before saying, well see ya, many of these people keep this game from not getting cancelled.

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What's a casual player going to be able to accomplish at 99 that they won't be able to at 95? If you're casual and you can't win the battle then it really shouldn't bother you. If it does bother you seeing others at level 99, then take an hour to read a wiki, do a shout, and try it again. Don't come here whining about how hard it's going to be because you read somewhere that only Ochain PLD's can help you win it. Also, to whoever suggested that it should be easier than the Maat fight can shove it. Why should fighting Maat's master be easier? This battle sounds like the perfect kind of challenge before we ascend to level 99. So, Devs, reverse your reversal. Seriously.

Now see this is why I say people treat the test server as a PREVIEW SERVER and not a test server.

Anyway I want a challenge myself but I refuse to presume I know what's going on because I'm part of the 99.999% who hasn't tried the BC fight on the test server. Even if it stayed as is the thing is already easy as far as I am concerned. Weak HP pool and you have to deal with hundred fists. Whoa I'm scared I've never dealt with HF mobs before, whatever will I do. That's the impression I get from watching a video of it. PET PT, co tank PT, RNG shadowbind in PT, THF perfect dodge in PT, RDM chainspell stun in PT, BLU stun lock, call it a day. Or if it's going to resist stuff then pet pt or have a THF to accomp the tank and PD it. What's the worst that can happen?

http://media.desura.com/cache/images...aceDancing.gif

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Originally Posted by Cybernetic_Empire

Don't come here whining about how hard it's going to be because you read somewhere that only Ochain PLD's can help you win it.

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I have no clue how people came to the conclusion you needed an Ochain Paladin. I've watched some videos of this fight, mainly the ones here of the three people who went in with a Paladin, a Beastmaster and a Red Mage and wiped, and one of a Beastmaster solo.

If a Beastmaster can solo the fight - even using a ton of Dawn Mulsum - then a balanced party can take this thing down by paying attention.

Easy strat: WHM, RDM or BRD, two tanks and two DD.
Slightly harder strat: RDM or BRD, any other healer, two tanks and two DD.
Even harder strat: RDM, WHM, PLD, any DD.
lolstrat: SMN + SAMx5.

Whoever said you need a PLD with Ochain is wrong. It only thing Ochain does is make the fight really easy. I am sure most party set ups could beat it without that much trouble assuming they know how to play.

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Originally Posted by Camate

Howdy!

I have a bit of information to share with you regarding the final limit break quest.

Battle Balance
We’re currently making adjustments to the battle so that you don’t need to have a full party of six members to win. This doesn’t mean it will be “easy”, but there will be more victories as a result of the change.

We have seen feedback from those that would like a battle and those that think a battle is unnecessary. As a result of looking over everyone’s opinions, we decided it would be good to create a battlefield that wasn’t as tough as the Maat fight, but have you all take on a slight challenge to differentiate this as the final limit break quest.

Congestion
Some players have been worried about possible battlefield congestion. We’ll be adding a step to this quest that will require players to obtain an item before actually entering the battlefield, which should stagger the amount of players entering at once. Also, in regards to suggestions that say to offer different battlefields, each one has different sizes as well as different entrance/exits, so this would create a bottleneck because players would select the easiest area. After testing various areas out we decided to go with the Qu’Bia Arena.

Helping Others
You won’t need to obtain the entry item when helping others. We’re also in the process of preparing an NPC that will teleport you to battlefields located in original areas as a reward for completing the final limit break quest.

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Is there something in the works for a Maat Cap version2? Completion of all lv75 & lv99 Battles for each Job? I would like to see something creative like a "New" Fight when competing all the fights. A Maat maybe that can use all Abilities and Spells...? I would also like to see it be a 6 group fight.

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Originally Posted by Camate

Battle Balance
We’re currently making adjustments to the battle so that you don’t need to have a full party of six members to win.

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Terrible, terrible idea. >.<

LBs that require groups are a terrible idea, this is a CHARACTER progression event, you shouldn't need others' help. G2 should have been the last time we saw this terrible idea.

One fundamental problem with this: unlike back in the day, when everyone of a particular job could reasonably be expected to have the same gear, now there's a huge disparity in gear some casual 95s will have compared with the hardcore.

Balance the fight for casuals and the hardcore QQ, balance it for the hardcore and the casuals won't stand a chance.

Fail idea to make this a group fight in the context of the itemisation the game has now. If it were a solo fight it could be tuned to the gear the player has.

Also, some 95s like me aren't decked out in Aby phat lewt, so what chance of getting into groups will I have, given the elitism this game is riddled with?

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Originally Posted by Zumi

Do you guys remember most of the classic limit breaks took groups to do. the 55 one took an alliance even during classic FFXI.

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Yes, it was a damned stupid idea back then, too .. that just makes it a 'classic stupid idea'.

If they're going to make it 'easy' and you want a challenge... solo it.
In fact, they should give it a 1 person limit, but if you fail, you can take 2 people the second time, 3 the 3rd time, 4 the 4th time etc. Shouldn't actually become easy until the 5th or 6th time.
The only problems with making it hard is that the more people fail, the more people are trying to do/redo the fight and the more lag there will be.

I agree with the new changes.
People complain that there want it hard, I'm sorry but LB quest have never been hard.
There have been a changeling, but something that is can be done with a few good set ups.

In Final Fantasy there are gamers of all level skills and time.
Is it relay fare that you people that have so much time on your had and want a game so difficult that it penalise casual players?

I agree with harder fights, but only if the reward is better.
4 level increase is not as good as having say a very powerful weapon skill or gear.

I'm happy with what SE is doing here.
The game should never be about elitist or hardcore players.
It should be for everyone.
And since LB quest is for everyone, as its character progression and not about earning elite skills or gear.

I'm sure that if you ask SE nicely that there could make a special bcnm fight with this npc and make it a lot harder where you are rewarded with something better than just a level increase for all you blood thirsty players.

I am much more fearful of congestion than any fight. Really not looking forward to splitting heirs type lines, probably much worse actually. I don't agree with SE's reasoning on this at all, I would go the furthest bcnm gladly to avoid hours of waiting. Already figure I won't even try for the first week or so.

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Originally Posted by Siiri

I am much more fearful of congestion than any fight. Really not looking forward to splitting heirs type lines, probably much worse actually. I don't agree with SE's reasoning on this at all, I would go the furthest bcnm gladly to avoid hours of waiting. Already figure I won't even try for the first week or so.

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Well I'm going to get the quest start and do everything right up to the fight part, on the off chance that I get draged in to one by ls member or friends.

But will be focusing on my AFv2+2 and by then the congestion should have cool down some what.

hey i have an idea, create 2 fights, 1 impossible hard fight for all those players that think their so great and 1 fight that the rest of us do by going in and cast dia on the mob and win.

see everyone will be happy.

and if se think there will be no bottlenect they are bigger morons than i though and i knew they were massive morons already

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Originally Posted by Camate

Congestion
Some players have been worried about possible battlefield congestion. We’ll be adding a step to this quest that will require players to obtain an item before actually entering the battlefield, which should stagger the amount of players entering at once.

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So to relieve congestion at the battlefield, you're going to add congestion elsewhere as people compete for this item? Great Plan! oh wait.... it's not. Just letting the fight occur at any BC would of been better.

lol i remember cape terrigan the day of the level 75>80 limit break when people needed kindreds .........

a suggestion i made on FFXIAH forum :

square-enix will make it easy to please all the mass of players
but as mentioned earlier we will loose the pleasure to get a real challenge and a special last instant like the maat fight was

there's something square could do !!!

after this last genkai ( for the mass of people) adding a last challenge @ 99 versus a master of our own job

for example for sam a fight versus noillurie
for drk a fight against zeid etc etc ...

the fight would be hardcore and will give you a special item 99 for your job or a new job ability

and for hardcorehardcore gamers finishing fights against the 20 heroes with the 20 jobs will allow you to gain a mega special item like : maat cap II

what do you think about it ?

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Originally Posted by thania

a suggestion i made on FFIAH forum :

square-enix will make it easy to please all the mass of players
but as mentioned earlier we will loose the pleasure to get a real challenge and a special last instant like the maat fight was

there's something square could do !!!

after this last genkai ( for the mass of people) adding a last challenge @ 99 versus a master of our own job

for example for sam a fight versus noillurie
for drk a fight against zeid etc etc ...

the fight would be hardcore and will give you a special item 99 for your job or a new job ability

and for hardcorehardcore gamers finishing fights against the 20 heroes with the 20 jobs will allow you to gain a mega special item like : maat cap II

what do you think about it ?

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I like this idea.
A Final Showdown at lvl 99 for anyone up for the challenge, and a chance to win an exclusive job abiltiy for that job you fight for, for the successful completion of a very difficult challenge.

But I think getting acsses to this fight should be a challenge as well.
A Quest to prove that you are ready for the fight.

I think this would win the hearts of the ppl that want a greater challenge.

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Originally Posted by Crawlerbasher

I agree with the new changes.
People complain that there want it hard, I'm sorry but LB quest have never been hard.
There have been a changeling, but something that is can be done with a few good set ups.

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When the Maat fight was first introduced, it was hard.

Over time with the introduction of new gear and proven battle strategies it became a pushover.

Some jobs need a strategy, some jobs don't.

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Originally Posted by Crawlerbasher

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Originally Posted by thania

a suggestion i made on FFIAH forum :

square-enix will make it easy to please all the mass of players
but as mentioned earlier we will loose the pleasure to get a real challenge and a special last instant like the maat fight was

there's something square could do !!!

after this last genkai ( for the mass of people) adding a last challenge @ 99 versus a master of our own job

for example for sam a fight versus noillurie
for drk a fight against zeid etc etc ...

the fight would be hardcore and will give you a special item 99 for your job or a new job ability

and for hardcorehardcore gamers finishing fights against the 20 heroes with the 20 jobs will allow you to gain a mega special item like : maat cap II

what do you think about it ?

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I like this idea.
A Final Showdown at lvl 99 for anyone up for the challenge, and a chance to win an exclusive job abiltiy for that job you fight for, for the successful completion of a very difficult challenge.

But I think getting acsses to this fight should be a challenge as well.
A Quest to prove that you are ready for the fight.

I think this would win the hearts of the ppl that want a greater challenge.

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I think that is a great suggestion, and the quest to get there is also a nice touch.

I'm not sure if a JA is appropriate, I think a lot of people would complain over you getting a JA over some piece of gear.

Personally would like the JA myself.

Edit: Also, a major problem with the JA idea (same for gear too, but more so for JA) is that if the JA/gear doesn't please the masses that job won't really ever do the challenge. SE is known to not make everything equal in upgrade power among the jobs when releasing updates like this.