Petition: clickandbuy the only way no,thanks.

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Originally Posted by Panthera

Would you mind clarifying what exactly you did? First, I'm assuming we're talking about FFXI, and not some other MMO.

You can use Paypal, but not directly. As I understand it, you can purchase Chrysta from Square-Enix via Click'n Buy using a PayPal payment option. That still sounds like using Click'nBuy to me. Please just clarify what you did, not tryin' to troll ya.

Also as a general question to everyone:...

What exactly is UltimatePay getting out of this?

The discussion has focused on Click'n Buy so much, it feels like "the lesser of two evils" has gotten lost in the shuffle. Aren't there some fees somewhere to the buyer? Or are they collecting from SE for using their services?

I did look around. The local Wal-mart didn't carry the cards like UP's website said it did, but a GameStop and a convenience store did. I could buy them, but even if SE did have $1.00 denominations of Chrysta, UP only says $20.00 worth on their cards, so I end up paying for more than I need either way. This is of course strictly academic at this point.

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I play FFXI thats what we paid for, You have to click the Ultimate payment method to purchase cryta, when the popup screen opens, you can see the paypal tab next to Ultimate gamecard. Then you'll be directed to Paypal w/ the SE info already in there. So if it went through anything it wasn't Click and buy.

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Originally Posted by Kimara

So if it went through anything it wasn't Click and buy.

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At this point, the only thing keeping me playing FFXI is the fact that I don't have to use ClickandBuy.

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Originally Posted by Economizer

At this point, the only thing keeping me playing FFXI is the fact that I don't have to use ClickandBuy.

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I agree which is why Saith and I chose to use Paypal instead, however cryptic it was to find it. We had trouble with Click and Buy in the past and good luck ever getting customer support. It reminded me for being on the phone with SE for 6 hours (no exaggeration either) except click and buy just never answers the phone.

Quick question Kimara. Did utilizing PayPal via Ultimatepay require a UP account?

I just wanna know the specfics since i am currently eyeing that route

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Originally Posted by Alpheus

Quick question Kimara did utilizing PayPal via Ultimatepay require a UP account?

I just wanna know the specfics since i am currently eyeing that route

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No it did not, But it WILL charge it as Ultimate pay, but Paypal will handle it. You can see it clearly in your paypal account.

I'd personally go the paypal route... if it wasn't crysta bound and expected me to pay more than the cost of playing.

Still wondering why the "pay exactly what it costs" option is taking so long. Well, I really don't, since paying more means SE makes more money.

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Originally Posted by Kimara

I play FFXI thats what we paid for, You have to click the Ultimate payment method to purchase cryta, when the popup screen opens, you can see the paypal tab next to Ultimate gamecard. Then you'll be directed to Paypal w/ the SE info already in there. So if it went through anything it wasn't Click and buy.

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Now, does Ultimate Pay allow you

A) to purchase Chrysta in $5.00, $10.00, and $20.00 denominations?

B) or do you have to pay them an even $20.00 online (just like you would when you buy one of their cards at Wal-mart or whatever) and then you can buy the Chrysta in SE's denominations? This makes a difference, because if SE sold Chrysta in $1.00 amounts, it wouldn't matter if you have to pay Ultimate Pay in even $20's.

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Originally Posted by Octaviane

10 days to go until "D" day and still no word from SE to acknowledge concerns, much less say they are looking into other options. And I mean from SE themselves, not Mods.

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Remember back when Enfeebling Magic got messed up (or it might have been monster magic evasion, details)? They were awefully sluggish in communicating with us--but that's nothing compared to what we're dealing with now.

I'd at least like a time-frame. "At the present time, we intend to proceed with the new billing methods as described. However, please understand that the process will remain under scrutiny, and we shall make adjustments as needed." That way, we know for sure in advance if our service is going to be interrupted or not if we don't change over. They did say they hear us and will make it user-friendly, but in a way, that just made things more ambiguous. What will they do and when? Go back to Credit Cards before 8/31 (or 8/30, whichever), or go to $1.00 Chrysta in a few months, or Paypal in 2 years, what? when? It seems like we're waiting for fixes that might not happen in time.

What i'm REALLY interested in, is to see SE's subscription numbers before and after this change.
I'd love to continue playing, but I'm not willing to jump through hoops so that SE can charge me more money. I play with a small group of RL friends and we all feel the same way, none of us are renewing our accounts in September. I imagine we're not the only people that feel this way. Not that it makes a difference...haha.

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Originally Posted by Panthera

Remember back when Enfeebling Magic got messed up (or it might have been monster magic evasion, details)? They were awefully sluggish in communicating with us--but that's nothing compared to what we're dealing with now.

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If memory serves, I believe that was more a matter of SE not noticing there was anything wrong. I think I remember posts from people who talked to GMs, and the GM claimed that they had received many reports about it, but were unable to find anything in their investigations. And that's sorta been the whole story with SE all along: slow to understand. So I don't expect much of a reaction from SE until the outrage is put into terms they can digest. If enough people fail to renew, if these forums go dead when ex-members are no longer capable of posting here, if they stop pulling in enough revenue to keep things going without making cutbacks, then they'll understand.

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Originally Posted by Kimara

No it did not, But it WILL charge it as Ultimate pay, but Paypal will handle it. You can see it clearly in your paypal account.

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I see. Thank you very much for answering. ^^

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Originally Posted by Twille

What i'm REALLY interested in, is to see SE's subscription numbers before and after this change.
I'd love to continue playing, but I'm not willing to jump through hoops so that SE can charge me more money. I play with a small group of RL friends and we all feel the same way, none of us are renewing our accounts in September. I imagine we're not the only people that feel this way. Not that it makes a difference...haha.

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That's the exact situation with me and my rl friends. Lookin' at this and realizing it's not worth the hassle/bother. We may feel differently in the future but not any time soon. So, yeah there are others :p

Just canceled and so did my friend.

Speaking with the only language SE will understand.

Take care everyone.

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Originally Posted by Kariel

Just canceled and so did my friend.

Speaking with the only language SE will understand.

Take care everyone.

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Yup same. I give up and take 6 accounts with me. Was waiting until the last second for SE to do something but our area is being threatened by a hurricane and may get too busy with work to pay attention to the deadline.

Please SE take my credit card like you used to, like you do for the JPs and like every *real* business anywhere. I'd probably forgive you

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Originally Posted by Runespider

I think this will start to happen for a lot of the distruntled customers now, they will turn loyal long standing subscribers into fairweather friends. They will take people that have paid monthly non-stop for years into people that will only pay that month if they feel Square have done enough to warrant the fee.

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Yeah there is quite a lot of players that logged on only for a few weeks or less after what is now called major update, then disappeared as they got bored again. The difference is they'd leave the auto billing. I even know two guys that haven't barely logged on since lv80 cap, yet didn't cancel. Think they'll bother adding crysta? They won't even be around to see /servmes or whatnot. Knowing them they will log on in november (2012), see some pop up message "blah blah transfer SE account", laugh at how senseless it is, and log back off. Sure, there will be some who will buy a ton of crysta without even thinking, but it won't come close to making up for this loss.

Now for the fair weather types it'll be "Hey there's lv95 think i'll buy $20 crysta" > a month later they don't bother adding more, till the next update. This will have a huge impact as the updates presumably become less frequent, after the timeline anyway. I may end up doing this since i can't get my friends to even bother making SE account. I'd still like to try out lv99, but keep adding crysta till december or later? SE has never seemed to understand the trickle-down effect of these things, whether hacking or bans or billing fiasco, how friends no longer being on makes the game less enjoyable.

Also in the past, it was annoying to cancel and reactivate due to double billing and the end of month maints. Now we can just, for example, not add crysta until Sept 20 or whenever the update is. Then you still get a month's worth rather than the last 10 days. In that sense i guess it does benefit some players, but doesn't seem at all like wise business decision. I'm curious, there has been a (very) few posts defending this, but i think none even takes a stab at how this "improves security" or whatever that line was about the reason for it.

Does this mean we won!?.. I might continue to play ffxi yea, and now might give ffxiv another look :o
and hope direct CC payment option is in by mid fall.

http://www.playonline.com/pcd/topics...78/detail.html

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You've Spoken and We've Heard You
You, the community, have clearly expressed your dissatisfaction with our billing system transition—and we are listening. We now understand that the options we presented you did not meet the level of service you have come to expect from Square Enix, so we have been working hard to address these concerns.

Accordingly, we will be extending the transfer cut-off date until we are able to implement the following improvements:
- New credit card payment options for Crysta [Available Now]
- The ability to specify exactly how much Crysta you want to buy [Early Fall]
- New recurring payment credit card options [Mid Fall]

We hope these steps show our ongoing commitment to you, our fans. It is our goal to make the FINAL FANTASY XI experience as fun and rewarding as possible.

Also in the days to come we'll reveal details for new offers and incentives to help ease your transition to the new system.

We sincerely thank you for your continued support of FINAL FANTASY XI.

Yasu Kurosawa
FINAL FANTASY XI North American Online Producer

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Now SE need to update POL and enable back the CC payment for those of us having credit card expires this past Aug so we can update our CC info and continue for us to pay them money ... :p

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New credit card payment options for Crysta [Available Now]

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Still only CnB and Ulimatepay options available in SEAM.... I thought they said available now, where do i type in my CC info to buy crysta!? Can anyone figure out? :confused:

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Originally Posted by Niyariko

Still only CnB and Ulimatepay options available in SEAM.... I thought they said available now, where do i type in my CC info to buy crysta!? Can anyone figure out? :confused:

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Click on crysta, then ultimatepay and it'll give you the option of entering in your CC directly, along with paypal and "one more option available"

edit: and I wouldn't call it winning tbh, since it was never a game to begin with. Just good business to keep your customers happy, which I see someone noticed finally :)

OMG OMG OMG I wake up to Hurricane Irene tracking further away from us and THIS!? Should I play the lotto today?

WOOO

The transfer date has been extended so those of us that didn't transfer don't have to worry about it this month? I read it twice, but I'm not awake yet

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Originally Posted by mistmonster

OMG OMG OMG I wake up to Hurricane Irene tracking further away from us and THIS!? Should I play the lotto today?

WOOO

The transfer date has been extended so those of us that didn't transfer don't have to worry about it this month? I read it twice, but I'm not awake yet

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Yes to all.

And send me a portion when you win.

I wonder if Yasu Kurosawa reads these threads lol

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Originally Posted by Niyariko

I wonder if Yasu Kurosawa reads these threads lol

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^

lol if he was hordecore or some other troll

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Originally Posted by mistmonster

The transfer date has been extended so those of us that didn't transfer don't have to worry about it this month? I read it twice, but I'm not awake yet

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Great, so I pay 50% more than everyone else for several months instead of one \o/ I wanna transfer back...

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Originally Posted by Niyariko

Does this mean we won!?.. I might continue to play ffxi yea, and now might give ffxiv another look :o
and hope direct CC payment option is in by mid fall.

http://www.playonline.com/pcd/topics...78/detail.html[...]

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Quote:

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Yasu Kurosawa
FINAL FANTASY XI North American Online Producer

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We didn't win anything since it wasn't in SE's plans to lose the NA market...

And now is a good time to start making practical suggestions on payment to SE.

Now is time to think about a solution and not to complain about an issue.

N.B.: Read the "Easier Payment Options (08/23/2011)" from PlayOnline Viewer since the very same article on Playonline's website is incomplte.

While this is good news... what happens now? Crysta is still involved, so what about those gamers in countries where Crysta still isn't legally accepted as a viable payment option? This announcement hasn't addressed that fact at all... and while SE doesn't want to lose the NA market, what about the rest of the world?

Also... does this mean that those who haven't changed payment option yet (who are still in direct payment mode), their accounts will be locked at the end of the month or what? I'm aware that SE has desires to get rid of POL... but honestly, how can they do that? POL is integral to playing FFXI and to get rid of it, would mean a complete recoding of the game... which I don't think is a viable option for a ten year old game.

Look at the positive side guys, you all have a reprieve. I am assuming that your current method of payment changed or otherwise will be fine.

It took almost a month to get an actual response directly from SE, give them a chance to implement the proposed changes and go from there.

Congratulations and a hearty thank you to everyone, regardless of opinion, who took the time to make and keep this thread visible. :) Good job.

WHA HOOOOOOO

=D

They still said nothing for EU and other countries so while i'm happy for those of you who will be seeing changes, the rest of the world is still going to have issues regarding the payment options.
It would be nice if before rejoycing we would get some help in having our voices heard too.
Thanks in advance.

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Originally Posted by Eroniris

They still said nothing for EU and other countries so while i'm happy for those of you who will be seeing changes, the rest of the world is still going to have issues regarding the payment options.
It would be nice if before rejoycing we would get some help in having our voices heard too.
Thanks in advance.

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I would assume the person/people responsible of updating the EU-site simply has not been able to do so yet (time-zone differences et cetera).

Obviously it is entirely possible the announcement only refers to the NA-customers, but I'd still like to assume it will be aimed to everyone of us. Even if not, sooner or later it should.


From the start, whole this time I was quite certain they will do something like this, I did not really have doubts about that, it was more like why it was not done in the first place.

That said, I would like to offer my thank yous as well to the people making these decisions, and wish the best of luck in solving the remaining issues such as customers with mixed regions of account and current location, and the fact that most if not all the options for payment are not available at certain parts of the world.


I know it's far from simple, and likely wont be easy, but I'm sure you can do it!
Thank you for listening, and your continued efforts in providing a service to the best quality you can.


ほんとにありがとうございます！
がんばれよ~


Kind Regards,
Dragoy (of Fenrir)
The Noob Unlimited


Edit:

Okay, now they've had the time to update the EU-site, but still nothing about this (disregarding twitter). However, I just did check what payment methods are offered now, and there would seem to be more now indeed, as they did state (for purchasing Crysta).

EU POL site finally posting (8/25) the same changes are coming:

http://www.playonline.com/pcd/topics...92/detail.html

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We wish to thank all our players for the support they have shown towards FINAL FANTASY XI.

We have taken your valuable feedback on board and, as a result, we are working hard in tandem with our US team to address any issues you may have encountered with the new billing system. To ensure that a number of significant improvements can be introduced, we have decided to extend the period to transfer accounts in order to benefit our customers in Europe as well as players in other countries.

- New credit card payment options for Crysta [Available Now]
- The option to specify exactly how much Crysta you want to buy [Early Autumn]
- New recurring payment credit card options [Mid Autumn]

We will continue to investigate other viable billing options suited to Europe and other countries and endeavour to keep you informed. We remain committed to providing our players with a FINAL FANTASY XI experience that is as rich, fun and exhilarating as possible.

Once again, we sincerely appreciate all of your ongoing support and hope you continue to have many more exciting adventures in the world of Vana'diel!

FINAL FANTASY XI Online Team – Europe

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Indeed.


Well, I just transferred my other account as well a day or two ago, and now paying around 8-10€ more per month via UltimatePay via PayPal via PlaySpan, purchasing Crysta without any extra costs.
That's roughly 100€ ($144) per year. I used to be able to pay in USD for whatever reason so that's the reason it went up for me.

Not sure if I will be paying for long anymore anyways due to various reasons, nevertheless, I am glad to see they are indeed doing something about all this all around.

Crysta is sadly not available for everyone.
I want to see Paypal for everyone.
Or at least Crysta for everyone (since you can buy Crysta using Paypal)

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Originally Posted by Ahmed

Or at least Crysta for everyone (since you can buy Crysta using Paypal)

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SE can't do that, it's a legal issue. Many countries don't allow crysta. If they did, SE would offer it there as well.

or in some cases, the country allows it, but requires you to treat virtual property like real property. Meaning, you have to issue refunds and what not--players in those areas have a legal right to virtual property they pay directly for (like Crysta), and SE can't arbitrarily take it a way without fair compensation like their ToS clearly states they can (thay can snatch it after your account goes idle for 1 year, immediately if you get dropped for violation, or they can just kill the system any time they want and don't have to refund a dime). So.... SE is simply not offering it to those areas.

I've been playing ffxi since ps2 release in America. thats what 7 years or something like that? my payments been fine till now. For some reason I get that my bill has not been paid. so I do the transfer for the new payandclick thing i pay off my fee, it was the last bit of my money on I had on my debit card till i get paid. I try and reactivate my account and it says I dont have enough money on my card. WTF! every time that I paid a unpaid balance I was still able to reactivate my char for the next month..... I'm at the end of my rope with SE on this one. I'm tired of them spiting in my face over crap like this. I was going to keep playing this game till its final days but F it! Think I'll just hold out till Diablo 3 or something. Its sad how this had to go down. Doubt I'll ever play another SE MMO or care to play another SE game... TBH most SE games are going down the drain and are complete garbage these days. I know SE prolly won't look at this post or even this thread. Its a sad shame they say they want to Liston to the community but pretty much just ignore us.

Does anyone know, if the cutoff for gamers who pay via direct payment was extended to October/November or is that still in place for the end of this month? I'd like to know whether I have to put money into my account to cover this or try to get a friend with a credit card to help out.

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Originally Posted by Revanchist

Does anyone know, if the cutoff for gamers who pay via direct payment was extended to October/November or is that still in place for the end of this month? I'd like to know whether I have to put money into my account to cover this or try to get a friend with a credit card to help out.

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The extension is until mid-fall. I would have to assume that your current payment method will be fine.

Keeps fingers crossed.

it's no big deal to me but it costs me 13.08 a month now to play if I pay through click and buy.

They charged me 25 cents more as a Foreign Transaction fee. So I end up paying $13.20 each month, apparently.

20 cents isn't a lot, but it will add up, and I remember reading that if I payed for XI through ClickandBuy and did nothing else with the ClickandBuy account (such as depositing a balance, etc), I shouldn't incur any extra fees. I wonder why I got charged extra, then. =(

This says it all

Agent Paul Y: Hello and thank you for contacting SQUARE ENIX Customer Support. Just a few moments while I review your question, please.
Agent Paul Y: In order for us to more accurately address your issue, we will require additional information. Please give a brief explanation of the issue you are having and please include any error codes or messages you are receiving.
You: Hello
You: I am trying to reactivate my account, and I am now asked to use click and buy
You: when I try to activate I get this error
You: This offer is not activated for your country of origin.
You: My account is a US account, since I was living in US when I started playing, but now I moved to Netherlands so my CC is from here, what should I do ?
Agent Paul Y: It checks where you are currently playing from
Agent Paul Y: The options are dependant on where you are
You: I cannot get a US card anymore, so what can I do to change my SE account to EU?
Agent Paul Y: You can not
You: so I cannot play anymore?
Agent Paul Y: Unfortunately the payment method is dependant on your region
You: I understood that, then what should I do, I have been playing for years with an EU card and now I have to stop playing ?
Agent Paul Y: Once again the payment method is dependant on your region. You will need to pay for this account if you plan on continuing to play.
Agent Paul Y: Thank you for visiting the SQUARE ENIX Support Center! Take care and hope to see you online!
Agent Paul Y has disconnected.

Even though they extended the billing issues, your account has been cut off unless you have switched to Crysta/ClickandBuy.

I just hope I still get the Chocobo Wand after all that I put up with last night. XD Would have had it done before midnight but...