[DEVS] Briarius Helms, sobek Skins and various other Abyssea NM drops

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Originally Posted by Annahya

Don't get me wrong, I don't want Moogles on the street corners handing them out - but this is because I want to earn it through fun and challenging game play,

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It is impossible to make "challenging" gameplay in an MMO like FFXI. There are only two possibilities in a game where actions are based on math and dice rolls.


A. The players figure out a strategy that wins 100%. Everyone then use that Strategy and only that strategy.

B. The mob is just flat out impossible (e.g. Absolute Virtue when the cap was lvl 75)

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Originally Posted by Yarly

I think empyrean weapons should be sold from an NPC for about 1 million gil (that's a LOT of gil!)
This allows for people who have lives like school or work to obtain weapons that those no life elitist players get by playing without sleep.

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No 1 million is not a lot of gil. At that price I could make enough gil for 1 empyrean weapon with one day of fishing and cooking. Or I could just buy 52 of them outright.

Just goes to show, the easier you make something the even easier people want it. You never reach a point where people are happy.

BUT THESE WEAPONS ARE MY DREAM AND THEY ARE TOO HARD TO GET!
ARGHHH WHY DOESNT ANYONE UNDERSTAND??????????????

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Originally Posted by Hayward

That would somewhat justify the obscene number of items required for those trials. S-E really dropped the ball in assuming everyone has connections to linkshells that fight these NMs on such a regular basis. 50 of any of those items at those drop rates is absurd in any other situation.

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I don't think they assumed everyone could obtain them. They're not supposed to be common weapons.

my opinion on the matter is that empy's are fine just as they are, if anything they need to be made harder to get. i say this as a fairly casual player myself, only times i really get to play much are on my days off as i have a job and have bills to pay.

with that kept in mind, i'm working on a twasthar AND a caladbolg. got dagger ready to start getting items from glavoid and just got greatsword on the vnm tier. and all i can say was that getting that far is simplistic, and getting the items won't be that hard either. it takes a grand total of 4 ppl to do a cleave pt to farm triggers for these NMs: whm, war, thf for pulling, blm for capping azure. after that most of these are easily done with groups of 3+ ppl, and a good bit can be duo'd or solo'd as well.

as it stands though, it's too easy as it is, and again i say this as a casual gamer myself. if this is too hard for you then perhaps making friends is in order...

SE should make Empyrean weapons a 100% drop from Level 5 Rabbits in East Ronafure. Otherwise it's way too hard to get one. Wwwaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhh!

Someone explain to me the difference between buying an Empyrean and buying a relic. You can't, because it's the same exact thing. You are skipping doing the work to obtain what you want sooner than later. You can defend buying relics until you are blue in the face. You could even make perfect sense as to why it's "not practical" to do it any other way. I could probably do a better job at it than you, whoever you may be, because I wouldn't have interests or emotions attached. But at the end of the day it is exactly the same thing. You are taking shortcuts to obtain an item faster. It's called double standard for a reason.

With that said, there is one reason alone why this change would be a bad idea and it's all the reason that is required to shut it down in it's tracks: Selling drops in bazaars would create more congestion sooner than later. As it stands, you have to hunt a buyer or seller, go to zone with them, lot drops. It slows you down considerably. It should stay that way.

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Originally Posted by Selzak

I don't think they assumed everyone could obtain them. They're not supposed to be common weapons.

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They are designed for everyone to obtain them. And who says they aren't supposed to be common? If they weren't supposed to be common then they wouldn't be. They'd cost 200 million gil in some form of Abyssea currency that was restricted to linkshells only every 3 days.

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Originally Posted by Lynchilles

SE should make Empyrean weapons a 100% drop from Level 5 Rabbits in East Ronafure. Otherwise it's way too hard to get one. Wwwaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhh!

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That's too easy, stop trolling the forums and let people with REAL ideas post them without having to weed through dumb posts like this one! This isn't BG you know, like amagad.

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Originally Posted by Yarly

That's too easy, stop trolling the forums and let people with REAL ideas post them without having to weed through dumb posts like this one! This isn't BG you know, like amagad.

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Why are you so mean you troll! YOu cant do anything but be mean to other people when they post good ideas! A week is way too much time spent getting a lv 80 empy!

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

It didn't work, they would have read the threads anyway. Just because a staff member posted in your thread, it doesn't mean they did because you put [DEVS] in it.

I have gotten staff responses to threads, and I didn't need to shout out to the staff.

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Top 5 posts on the dev tracker. [to the devs] on the lot of them.

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

People are actually complaining that emps are too hard now?

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Personally, I was not speaking to difficulty at all. I think this is a common misconception running rampant through these forums; when someone raises a concern, the masses rush to this "difficulty" straw-man.

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

It is impossible to make "challenging" gameplay in an MMO like FFXI. There are only two possibilities in a game where actions are based on math and dice rolls.

A. The players figure out a strategy that wins 100%. Everyone then use that Strategy and only that strategy.

B. The mob is just flat out impossible (e.g. Absolute Virtue when the cap was lvl 75)

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This is incorrect in many ways. There are plenty of instances where the "perfect" strategy does not ensure 100% victory, and to blame/credit all resolution on/to math and dice ignores that many of instances that these factors govern must be initiated by a human being. Additionally, it makes little sense to argue that something can be achieved 100% of the time, and in the same thought express that randomness (ie. dice) is of mention.

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Originally Posted by Annahya

This is incorrect in many ways. There are plenty of instances where the "perfect" strategy does not ensure 100% victory, and to blame/credit all resolution on/to math and dice ignores that many of instances that these factors govern must be initiated by a human being. Additionally, it makes little sense to argue that something can be achieved 100% of the time

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Well then we can add a third category.

C. Whether you win or not is based on what the mob does or does not do (e.g. uses some huge nasty attack too many times) and it's luck whether you win or not.

I've never seen that though, generally when people wipe to an NM it's because either they lacked certain gears or atmas or didn't have good enough teamwork. Neither of those things involve "challenge" however.

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

I've never seen that though, generally when people wipe to an NM it's because either they lacked certain gears or atmas or didn't have good enough teamwork. Neither of those things involve "challenge" however.

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Is not the need for this teamwork not capable of being the challenge in question? Your position seems to make profound assumptions regarding the norm of performance, and what constitutes a challenge.

He used the wrong word. Shouldn't be teamwork. Change "didn't have good enough teamwork." to "because they were morons". If you can operate a toaster, you can play FFXI and beat everything that can actually be beaten. The only thing in this game that's ever been a challenge, is when half your group disconnects but you still go on to win anyway with a gimped setup and a by the seat-of-your-pants strategy to facilitate the situation.

Edit: You can add new lowmans in there too, but of course that isn't a challenge created by SE. If you can add more players to beat something, then it isn't challenging by virtue of design.

Nooo. No more bandwagon ninjas!

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Originally Posted by Sparthos

I think Briareus Helms should drop off any Gigas at a low drop rate and Sobek Skins off any Bugards.

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I hope to god you are being sarcastic.

As far as bria and sobek, both are SOLOABLE by a semi-copetent nin/dnc (I know a full pink nin who did it).

The only hard nms, out of all of them, are glavoid and the Khimy nm in the range whose name escapes me.

For building sets, the only sets that take longer than 30 min to build are Chloris and Glavoid. All other sets can be made stupidly fast by two people (dd tank + healer) or is soloable by half the non-mage jobs in the game (and even they can solo a good number of them).

All of the Scars nms are stupidly fast to build and kill with the exception of Bhukis (he just likes to be mean from time to time D:)

I personally am building Verethragna, and yeah, building Chloris sucks, especially since I didn't have WAR leveled until recently, nor do I have NIN leveled higher than sub, but I can solo the sets on one job or another.




tl;dr versoin:
Quit whining and go build it.

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I hope to god you are being sarcastic.

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Said I was, yerp.

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Originally Posted by Sparthos

Said I was, yerp.

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No you weren't. Dont be so modest about your groundbreaking ideas. Do not let those Pecky Fraulein stand in your way!

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Originally Posted by Drhatchet

The only hard nms, out of all of them, are glavoid and the Khimy nm in the range whose name escapes me.

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Glavoid is not hard, Glavoid is ridiculously easy. The only way Glavoid could possibly be hard is if you weren't paying attention and kept healing it.

Bukhis *can* be hard if someone misses a stun and it wipes your cruor buffs or if you get unlucky and can't remove doom in time. However that's just having a crappy stunner for the former and blind luck for the latter.

Even with cruor buffs removed, Bukhis isn't really hard. Apademak (the "Khimy nm") isn't hard either - and no, I'm not talking about brewing it.

Look, if my ninja with full pink gear can't solo it. It's too hard. I don't have 18 people to kill all these monsters like everyone else does. I HAVE A LIFE, LIKE OMG. Don't be hating on me just because you're all no life kids who have no responsibilities!1!1

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Originally Posted by Yarly

Look, if my ninja with full pink gear can't solo it. It's too hard. I don't have 18 people to kill all these monsters like everyone else does. I HAVE A LIFE, LIKE OMG. Don't be hating on me just because you're all no life kids who have no responsibilities!1!1

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first off you don't need 18 ppl for any of these NMs, not a single one. second i'd like to reiterate that even ppl with lives can obtain these rather easily. your full pink nin doesn't have to solo anything, you just need a competent whm. nin + whm can duo probably 90% of all abyssea content, if not all.

also belittling other ppl and assuming we have no lives isn't a very nice way to make a point, in fact it's counter productive. i have a life, work a full time job, and still i'm working on not 1 but 2 empy's. surely finding one whm to help you can't be that difficult. and even if it is you can make a shout group for them and let all the drops go freelot cept your upgrade items.

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Originally Posted by Yarly

Look, if my ninja with full pink gear can't solo it. It's too hard. I don't have 18 people to kill all these monsters like everyone else does. I HAVE A LIFE, LIKE OMG. Don't be hating on me just because you're all no life kids who have no responsibilities!1!1

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Successful troll is successful (judging by the post above mine). :P

aw damn i've been had XD

Can you please give Isgebrind some +2 drops so that it at least can benefit the rest of the people fighting him for my hearts.

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Originally Posted by Tamoa

Even with cruor buffs removed, Bukhis isn't really hard. Apademak (the "Khimy nm") isn't hard either - and no, I'm not talking about brewing it.

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Hard no, able to occasionally doom you anyway despite getting spammed with cursna yes.

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

Hard no, able to occasionally doom you anyway despite getting spammed with cursna yes.

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Yeah I agree, that's the most "difficult" part about Bukhis.

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Originally Posted by Tamoa

Even with cruor buffs removed, Bukhis isn't really hard. Apademak (the "Khimy nm") isn't hard either - and no, I'm not talking about brewing it.

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Apademak has the potential to be easier than Orthrus/Alfard but that completely is based on your ability to stun the spells and prevent level ups.

A poorly stunned Apademak is basically a wipe when every TP move turns into Fulmination. Your WHM can keep you going for a while but when you're being stunned constantly, it's gonna end poorly.

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Originally Posted by StingRay104

Can you please give Isgebrind some +2 drops so that it at least can benefit the rest of the people fighting him for my hearts.

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This would be a nice addition that wouldn't really really mess up the balancing act or what's left of it.

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Originally Posted by Sparthos

Apademak has the potential to be easier than Orthrus/Alfard but that completely is based on your ability to stun the spells and prevent level ups.

A poorly stunned Apademak is basically a wipe when every TP move turns into Fulmination. Your WHM can keep you going for a while but when you're being stunned constantly, it's gonna end poorly.

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Oh yes, most certainly. Need people that know wtf they're doing, otherwise it'll get messy.

As for Isgebind - I just finished my 90 Masamune and kept saying I wish it would drop some +2 items just as a potential reward to those that help.