Somehow, BLM needs to be buffed up

I know this sounds crazy, considering BLM has been the go to dps for most of FFXI and FFXIV so far, but nowadays they just aren't as good. My BLM has better gear than my BRD, but I'd still rather go to BRD for pretty much everything even though I traditionally love BLM like no other.

1) BLM dps suffers because you have to interrupt yourself every time you move. In actual hard fights, you have to move. A lot. A lot a lot.
2) BLM takes damage like crazy. I feel like the Manaward and Manawall mitigation tools improve me up to BRD-level. Or I could be a BRD and take less damage like all the time. And have more HP and whatnot.
3) BLM doesn't have much utility. I guess I can do Virus or Eye for an Eye, but healers probably got that covered. BRD on the other hand can Ballad, or Paeon, or even debuff with Requiem to make us poor BLMs do more damage. I don't know why anyone would consciously take BLMs if there was a choice, though. Just take more BRDs and DRGs!

BRDs with worse gear are just straight up better than BLMs with slightly to moderately better gear. They can move and shoot, help the PT recover MP or TP, do incredible damage, and are just plain awesome. BLMs... shoot fireballs. Pew pew. The only advantage is that they can Flare. Which is great for cleaning up Garuda's plumes, I guess. Yay.

Please take a look at making BLMs more viable for endgame movefests. For the constant peril they face in terms of taking damage and dying, they ought to do way more damage and/or be able to cast while moving or you know something. I'm not even convinced a BLM could outdamage a BRD while both were able to stand perfectly still and dps, much less when you are running around like a headless chicken.

Thanks for reading!

Edit: I forgot to mention that in terms of utility, every dps has a stun or a silence, while BLM doesn't. Please ignore the silly people below me, because clearly they haven't done endgame fights in their AF or whatever. Unless you have done Titan hard mode or wasted AK with no wipes (focusing demon wall, ignoring adds, killing last dragon while only having to kill 2 adds) you do NOT have an informed opinion about class balance or anything really. Sorry, bros.

Black mage does not have much utility? I my opinion we learn too MANY utility skills we should have more aoe skills that blow people up. Overall I think black mage dps is fine even if we have to move if they bump our dps any higher we would go into broken category.

Black mages take too much damage? We are a caster class.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hiruke

1) BLM dps suffers because you have to interrupt yourself every time you move. In actual hard fights, you have to move. A lot. A lot a lot.
2) BLM takes damage like crazy. I feel like the Manaward and Manawall mitigation tools improve me up to BRD-level. Or I could be a BRD and take less damage like all the time. And have more HP and whatnot.
3) BLM doesn't have much utility. I guess I can do Virus or Eye for an Eye, but healers probably got that covered. BRD on the other hand can Ballad, or Paeon, or even debuff with Requiem to make us poor BLMs do more damage. I don't know why anyone would consciously take BLMs if there was a choice, though. Just take more BRDs and DRGs!

---

1. This is the only detriment I feel there is about BLM right now. I haven't done anything past Ifrit/Dhorne Chimera in terms of difficulty, but there are several fights that a BLM can just stand still most of the time and nuke away, so I think it's a good balance.

2. It's a light armor class. If you're not dodging red stuff that's bad. There's unavoidable damage that you just have to mitigate to the best of your ability or just prepare to be healed.

3. I don't think this is an issue. BLM is primarily a damage class. The utility skills it obtains are from cross classes so you can tell that's not its focus.

It's frustrating to watch Bard run around and still be able to DPS effectively, but I think the trade-off is when BLMs can actually stand still they can dole out huge amounts of damage. In mobile fights you just have to rely on Swiftcast combos and Scathe. I commonly find myself 2nd and 3rd on the threat meter in most fights where I'm keeping up with my rotation alright, so I don't think damage is an issue. There's just certain fights that aren't going to favor BLM well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Orophin

....It's frustrating to watch Bard run around and still be able to DPS effectively, but I think the trade-off is when BLMs can actually stand still they can dole out huge amounts of damage. In mobile fights you just have to rely on Swiftcast combos and Scathe. I commonly find myself 2nd and 3rd on the threat meter in most fights where I'm keeping up with my rotation alright, so I don't think damage is an issue. There's just certain fights that aren't going to favor BLM well.

---

Exactly. My damage is fine. Sometimes I actually do too much damage and have to scale off a bit so the Tank can get the hate. But I think the THM/BLM is fine. If we were able to move like the BRD while keeping our damage levels.....well there really wouldnt be a need to run any other DPS xD Let every class have different weaknesses. You can play another class if you want on the same character if you dont like it, so at least you're not locked in/forced to redo the story :)

You guys clearly haven't done any real endgame fights if you think BLM dps is awesome. You can feel it in Amdapor Keep and every place after that. Please go get to endgame and see how awesome BLM is. Thanks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hiruke

You guys clearly haven't done any real endgame fights if you think BLM dps is awesome. You can feel it in Amdapor Keep and every place after that. Please go get to endgame and see how awesome BLM is. Thanks.

---

Well all the black mages I have talked to feel their dps is fine. Actually your the first person who I EVER seen complain about BLM dps. Wait they all must not be at endgame right? They must not be playing their class properly!

Our dps is fine.

BLM dps is fine. Bard DPS is too CONVENIENT. Stop wanting to be like the top DPS classes -- those are usually the classes that need to be toned down.

Any blm that has done titan will feel we don't belong on high mobility fights. I'm leveling a summoner cause almost all the gear is interchangeable aside from af, and I'll do better dps on mobility fights. Sure I hate the fact that blms are so relient on just not moving, but at the same time I can provide more utility by learning 2 classes.

It seems more like they need to make BRD more complex then to buff BLM. BRD just seems brain dead easy to play.

I'm actually usually top dps in my parties as BLM. The only time someone's even come close to me was a relic BRD in one of my AK runs. Also during one or two of my Garuda HM fights when the other dps could keep up with me, we downed Garuda incredibly fast, right after her 2nd spawn of adds.

Currently BRD is the highest DPS so yes your better geared BRD will do more than your BLM, but I think this is more of a problem of BRD being op than anything else being underpowered (except maybe monk, they just need a greased lighting duration increase I think). Currently BRD beats everything. so it's a bit unfair to judge BLM, or anything really, against a BRD.

(PS. Just to add, I have a 50BRD and 50BLM as well, and my BLM dps's circles around my BRD. But my BRD isn't very geared.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jordie

Any blm that has done titan will feel we don't belong on high mobility fights. I'm leveling a summoner cause almost all the gear is interchangeable aside from af, and I'll do better dps on mobility fights. Sure I hate the fact that blms are so relient on just not moving, but at the same time I can provide more utility by learning 2 classes.

---

Good luck with tombs, can't dot them while a blm in two globals wipes out half a tomb's health.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hiruke

You guys clearly haven't done any real endgame fights if you think BLM dps is awesome. You can feel it in Amdapor Keep and every place after that. Please go get to endgame and see how awesome BLM is. Thanks.

---

AK on Wall and Last boss I pull 220-240 dps, Titan I pull 200-220 dps, Garuda I pull 180-200 dps.

I have my relic weapon and have the gear required for Coil minus my DL chest a ring and my neck. I think My opinion weighs in by your thoughts. BLM are fine, you must be missing something.

BLM are fine.

I typically have to hold back my DD to prevent pulling aggro off relic tanks. The only class that I have seen out-parse me is a no song bard with relic. As soon as ballad or TP songs go up, I pull ahead. If you min/max your positioning or movements, even high mobile fights like Demon Wall or Titan blackmage is hardly effected.

So I'm not sure why this topic even exists.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hiruke

You guys clearly haven't done any real endgame fights if you think BLM dps is awesome. You can feel it in Amdapor Keep and every place after that. Please go get to endgame and see how awesome BLM is. Thanks.

---

If you feel Black Mage DPS sucks, then you don't know much about the other Classes in FFXIV, add "Raging Strikes" lvl 4 Archer skillto your Black Mage.
it will increase all Damage you do by 20% for 20 secs.

and please learn about all the other classes,
Since you never know what skills they have, that you can barrow to help improve your Class / Job.

Hello everybody, this topic kinda interest me because I have a Black Mage lvl 50.
Gear : Relic Weapon, Everything DL cept for bracelet and 1 ring that are Allagan.

I have one of the best geared Black mages in Siren and my spell rotation is done perfectly everytime. I do feel like Black Mages doesn't output enough damage and the Main reason is that we have to Move so much that we got to interupt easily 1/3 of our spells in end game fights.

In a static fight I feel that the BLM does deal quite good damage, it could be a bit higher but I don't mind it.

A way that could help solving the problem would be to reduce SwiftCast cool down to lets say 15 seconds? (A trait only for blackmages of course) Or Maybe have a proc trait that everytime we hit a critical hit next fire spell is instant.

For those purposes I am switching to summoner as we speak.

But Yeah I agree, BLM needs some sort of re-work to let them have more instant spells so they can also deal damage while moving.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lobselvith

If you feel Black Mage DPS sucks, then you don't know much about the other Classes in FFXIV, add "Raging Strikes" lvl 4 Archer skillto your Black Mage.
it will increase all Damage you do by 20% for 20 secs.

and please learn about all the other classes,
Since you never know what skills they have, that you can barrow to help improve your Class / Job.

---

Raging Strikes is also available for the summoner, I do use it on my black mage and I can tell you for sure that I don't do as much DPS as a bard/summoner in Titan, Coil of Bahamut part1-4.

I have to agree that BLM feels very low in damage. During the fire rotation the damage feels right, but as soon as I cast anything other than a Fire spell every other class is pulling way ahead and over taking any progress I made in my Astral mode. And God forbid Boss mechanics force me to drop Astral/Umbral buff and I have to cold cast a long spell to get it back.

I feel it when adds spawn and non-BLM seem to take theirs down just as fast if not faster. And thats when I can STAND STILL.

Only beef I have with BLM is that Flare sucks. Either make it higher dmg, or cost less MP. I really don't understand why the amount of MP I have doesn't effect Flares dmg. If I blow 3000MP on a flare, I would think it would do considerably more dmg but it does the same as when I have 300MP

Black Mage just needs slight utility tweaks.

A) Give us access to Arcanist Raise. Every mage gets access to swiftcast, so it isn't like we'd be breaking the game by getting the nearly-best use of the cooldown.

B)Apocatastasis is utter garbage. It needs to change to one of the following
-A flat elemental damage reduction player-centered Raid Buff to justify the cooldown.
-Be given a mana cost, cast time, and cooldown removal to be a single target magical damage shield. Black Mages have some issues with heavy mobility fights, and having a way to survive one hit when doing a Raging Strike burn session would be amazing.

C) Conversion really doesn't need to be a three minute cooldown.

D) Let Firestarter and Thundercloud stack up to 2 times. Because waiting to see if it procs between spell casts loses far more DPS time if you hit a dry streak than chain casting and double proccing. Easy solution; Let us stack to two charges.

I'm only a level 39 BLM at the moment, so I can't pitch in TOO much about higher level fights.

But it is extremely annoying that we need to interrupt 1/3 or more of our spells do to having to move around. It's either that or take damage, and if you take too much damage, you need to sleep them and cure yourself up. Really the only way to move and still cast if if you are at the very last few seconds of your casting time.

Otherwise, I don't have too many complaints, it's a pretty straightforward job. I can't say that we are out damaged too much, as in a party I usually fall 2nd after tank and sometimes third.

Atleast you look better than a BRD, thats enough right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tribunus

Atleast you look better than a BRD, thats enough right?

---

This is true!

And also, I'm pretty sure BLM out damage Bards on non intensive movement fights and don't fall that much behind in movement intensive fights as well. They do more DPS that bards, and behind summoners. They're in a good spot.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kabooa

C) Conversion really doesn't need to be a three minute cooldown.

D) Let Firestarter and Thundercloud stack up to 2 times. Because waiting to see if it procs between spell casts loses far more DPS time if you hit a dry streak than chain casting and double proccing. Easy solution; Let us stack to two charges.

---

C) is cool, I'd like that

D) is like super-awesome, doesn't fix that I'll never use my firestarter proc if it procs right after I cast my last fire I, but otherwise it would help alot, it would also improve our ability to deal damage if there is a lot movement involved, because I could use the time needed to unload my procs to reposition myself

I think blm is in a good spot brds just need to be toned down.

BLMs are fine. You keep complaining about having to move 1-3 steps in a fight when Dragoons and Monks have to dodge way more skills. You lose 1-2 seconds of cast time while melee classes lose their buff / debuff up-times and lose their positioning. There's a reason why people who want to ezmode BC use 2BLMs 2BRDs.

Btw, I have a 50 Dragoon and a 50 Blackmage so I'm not just assuming. You get a bit less or equal damage to Dragoons in a non movement-heavy fight but in all the fights melee classes are the ones who suffer more because of AoEs.

BLM should be top of the pile in terms of dealing damage, so either it needs adjusting or other classes do.

The rule always used to be that dps classes had a trade off between damage dealt (+support ability) and survivability. Low survivability= high dmg.
BLM is lowest in terms of survivability so should be the biggest hitters in terms of dps.

I think there is a case to argue that it is the fight mechanics rather than the class mechanics which is gimping BLM damage. I don't have a problem with that as long as it is balanced by as many situations where the other classes are disadvantaged. But it isn't. There is an over reliance on high mobility in boss fights which needs to be addressed. Either the mobility reliance or BLM require adjustment.

I can't speak for survivability or utility but most of the BLM I usually run with out dps my bard with mostly equal gear.

I love being a BLM, Yes Fights like Titan are tough as a Black Mage, but we destroyed Titan with two BLM. If used correct, its very easy. My suggestion Scythe, sleep,fire 3, swiftcast, then Fire3. that simple Rotation is great against a hard hitting target, when You don't have a tank, or your questing alone.

I'm no Pro, but that works for me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by David_Bain

I love being a BLM, Yes Fights like Titan are tough as a Black Mage, but we destroyed Titan with two BLM. If used correct, its very easy. My suggestion Scythe, sleep,fire 3, swiftcast, then Fire3. that simple Rotation is great against a hard hitting target, when You don't have a tank, or your questing alone.

I'm no Pro, but that works for me.

---

That rotation...*cringe*

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jcw005

That rotation...*cringe*

---

Please Explain, i am new to the power type and open for idea's. To no degree will i claim to be a pro at the power type.
On the norm if i was in a Dung i'd use,

Lightning 2, Fire 3, fire 1 spam till about 300mp, transpose blizzard 3, rinse and repeat.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hiruke

You guys clearly haven't done any real endgame fights if you think BLM dps is awesome. You can feel it in Amdapor Keep and every place after that. Please go get to endgame and see how awesome BLM is. Thanks.

---

Double black mage in AK. Demon wall (the only boss you could possibly be talking about being hard on mages). Dead before bees spawned. Personally pushed well over 200dps and am not in full darklight nor do I have a relic.

Doing good damage as a mage requires that you pre-emptively position yourself and think ahead about how to get the most casts given any bosses rotation / mechanics.
Don't let Dunken-Krueger get you down on the class. Figure out what you can do to improve your own game. Reap the benefits.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Schtick

Double black mage in AK. Demon wall (the only boss you could possibly be talking about being hard on mages). Dead before bees spawned. Personally pushed well over 200dps and am not in full darklight nor do I have a relic.

Doing good damage as a mage requires that you pre-emptively position yourself and think ahead about how to get the most casts given any bosses rotation / mechanics.
Don't let Dunken-Krueger get you down on the class. Figure out what you can do to improve your own game. Reap the benefits.

---

Problem is. Pretty sure you can down it faster with a summoner or bard. I'm not saying black mage is weak, I'm just saying they do less than summoners or bards and those classes excel in movement intensive fights as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by savant07

Problem is. Pretty sure you can down it faster with a summoner or bard. I'm not saying black mage is weak, I'm just saying they do less than summoners or bards and those classes excel in movement intensive fights as well.

---

Don't get me wrong. As a blm main, I would love a buff to blm.
However, I'm afraid I have to humbly disagree.
I've had no trouble keeping up with bards / summoners of equal gear. However, I'll admit circumstantial evidence is.... circumstantial.
Still, I've seen no evidence to indicate blm is behind overall.

I'd like to see the numbers.
Given bard will excel at movement intensive fights (no demon wall doesn't qualify), and brings some essential utility (think coils turn 2), BLM should bring more basic dps to the table.

Well I've usually heard it from the streams, talking to the people doing coil 4 and 5 and discussing maximum DPS compositions etc, it seems summoners are #1 in terms of single target while BLM do the best sustained AOE. Bards are just on a different level but i do believe they should/are below the black mages and summoners. This is all for ranged DPS, not counting melee into this as that's a whole different area.

Parsers say summoners but they don't seem accurate enough though some people swear they are when you do DPS solo on a dummy (no one nearby, no party members).

"Buffed up" is a tautology; just use "buffed".

They should just lower GCD and cast times. Having 3 sec casts is just not good design for heavy movement fights.

No idea why they insist on keeping combat so slow and dull.

Rofl we have the best CC for instances, also our damage is fine. You need to save your instant casts for when there is movement.

Also i have yet to have any class beat me on damage xD.

Yea... I beat a bard with titan weapon on damage in AK. I've yet to find a tank, who I cannot pull aggro from, aside from this one Paladin in Relic.

I think we're fine, but I'd welcome buffs with open arms.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HoroBoro

Yea... I beat a bard with titan weapon on damage in AK. I've yet to find a tank, who I cannot pull aggro from, aside from this one Paladin in Relic.

I think we're fine, but I'd welcome buffs with open arms.

---

Who knows we may get some considering yoshi plays a black mage! XD