Why so much hate from players?

I ran a lvl 50 speed run last night and the tank wanted to clear thrash if we had one wipe okay that's fine just a game to me. One of the DPS's was not okay with this and basically started a fight with the tank then quit playing while bashing the tank. The tank bashed the DPS's back and fourth blah blah blah. Okay here's my question why get to the point where if you were face to face you would literally fight over a non factor like a speed run?
Can we just enjoy the game and take it at what it is a game?
Why so angry?

I'm not sure either. It seems like its becoming more of an issue as well. Also the more popular the game the more rage. I would like to say youth and hormones but I don't think being 23 I can justify saying so. Seems like what I call modern MMOs have become a solo game and people become frustrated when they have to interact with others. That's just my two cents though can't say why.

Yesterday in brayflox, a whm called me a nerd because i didnt really want him running the dungeon in his swimsuit. it was the most random and ridiculous thing... then after i told him i'd let him get beat on (i was the tank), he kept talking about swimsuits the entire time. oh yeah, and then i told him that if he wore his swimsuit, then i would wear mine, and we would be in for a long dungeon

I wasn't angry when it came to Ifrit run. Was my first time fighting him, tank was horrible and kept using the stone wall even when we knew it didn't work. I said multiple times to use the lancer's limit break and he didn't listen to me for the longest time. So, we died a few more times before he got the picture. Then the right person used the right limit break on that damn nail and all was well. I'm not mad at the players, just the fact that I couldn't beat him. Happens a lot when I play games. When I can't beat something, whether it's my fault or someone else's, I get mad. Did I speak rudely to the tank? No, I just repeatedly told him to leave his limit break alone and don't touch the button because obviously using stone wall with the nail wasn't working. That's all.

I can see where the speed-run folks are coming from, and what they are trying to accomplish (time vs reward). Having said that, the hate in these dungeons is almost always coming form this camp as well, because everyone isn't playing on their level, or with the same goals in mind. Sometimes we forget that this is a video game, and others still tend to take it to a level that would otherwise have been considered inappropriate. But with the way the DF works, it's pug city, and you get what you get. People who want to take it easy and enjoy the game need to be ready for the speed run elites, and the uber hardcore folks need to be ready to deal with a player who wants to enjoy their game. We are all paying for it, and it shouldn't be dictated by someone else how YOU will play YOUR game that YOU are paying for.

My $0.02 ^___^

Forget about a wipe, let one DPS die as a tank and all hell breaks loose o_o

There's still hope, though. For the Garuda fight the end result for 4/5 wipes was me and a DPS fighting after the healer and other DPS died over and over from Garuda one-shots. Still, each time we would get back up and try it again. Nobody quit, nobody yelled, no one was angry(at anyone but Garuda, of course :P), and in the end we beat her. This was Duty finder.

Maybe there's just a lot of people who take things a bit too seriously, I guess? I've noticed particularly on these forums, people deign to exemplify their own immaturity by supporting THEIR argument only by saying the OTHER PERSON'S argument is false, poor, stupid, don't know what they're talking about, etc. without offering any factual evidence backing their own. Makes it easy to spot the WoW kiddies, though.

I started the game a week ago but I'm trying to take it slowly and at my own pace. Last night I ran Halatali for the first time with a random Duty Finder party.

The healer and the other DPS apparently knew each other and were chatting during the whole thing. Sometimes the Healer just stood there doing nothing for minutes. The tank had little HP and was killed twice, once during the final boss, because the Healer only healed me and the other DPS (who just used spells from far away). Everyone but the healer died during the list fight.

In the end they just split the loot among them and said "garbage tank and dps" and left.

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Originally Posted by Hanabira

Yesterday in brayflox, a whm called me a nerd because i didnt really want him running the dungeon in his swimsuit. it was the most random and ridiculous thing... then after i told him i'd let him get beat on (i was the tank), he kept talking about swimsuits the entire time. oh yeah, and then i told him that if he wore his swimsuit, then i would wear mine, and we would be in for a long dungeon

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Lmao... thats awesome. So did you tank in your swimsuit?

I have to say, so far I have never seen such a horrible community as the one that is developing so far in this game. I personally have not been the one to bear the brunt of peoples attitudes but I have seen some truly terrible things done to people who may not have been the best gamers but were friendly and nice people who tried hard.

Entitlement, elitism, instant gratification, impatience, ect. The list goes on. These traits are very common in any MMO. It's no different than the real world, except people tend hide these traits less online due to anonymity. Just blacklist them on move on, they are not worth your concern.

What's even sad is the attitude of players BEFORE an instance. We had some guy shouting for experienced players to run HM Titan. However, he indicated if you died "even once", you would be kicked from the party.

agreed these things happen in MMO's. But the people here so far make even WoW's community look like saints...

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Originally Posted by dryxaline

Lmao... thats awesome. So did you tank in your swimsuit?

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dont actually have one, but the bluff worked. he stayed in his gear lol

While I'm against being rude to people, there's some players that literally don't know what they are doing, I've been in 2 DF groups where the DPS (Lancer) kept attacking the mobs before the tank could hold agro and kept spamming the LB even after we explained to wait for tank to pull and to save the LB for the boss, on my other group there was another DPS that kept rushing ahead attacking everything on sight... by some miracle our healer kept healing him and he stayed alive the whole dungeon but he was making things really difficult for the whole group and we actually talked with him to stop rushing and wait for everyone but he kept on doing it.

I always try to be polite in this kind of situations but I can imagine that some players might lose their minds if they encounter people like that.

Stick to running parties within your FC, it reduces the chances of incidents like you described. If you are going to pug my advice stay quiet and keep your head down.

The community is horrible and I'm honestly ready to let people die. I have shout turned off because it's not used the way it should be and when it is people start to bitch and complain that it's spam. I'm scared to queue up for the DF because I have no idea what I will be stepping into. I'm to the point where I don't know if I can even play this game anymore because of other people. And now with this iLvl thing it can only get worse.

I know it's just wishful thinking, and I understand the whole point of DF is to group you up with other people instead of having to form your own group. But when registering for a Duty it would be nice for some sort of option maybe to gauge your skill level with the dungeon or just in general. You could also check a box maybe for "Willing to teach new people" or something of the sort. Would be something cool to see.

This way you can get the hardcore people with the hardcore people, and help train the people with less knowledge on it.

Honestly I think a lot of these bad apples will be gone in a month or two though you'll always have the elitist. I would say if they get really mouthy to just report them for harassment, maybe some time in jail will mind their tongue.

As for speed run vs normal dungeon I think SE needs to step up and alter how rewards are earned. If you kill all the trash mobs you should get some kind of bonus like Allagan pieces.

I also noticed FFXIV players are generally worse then FFXI. People are less patience and lack cooperation in group fight. When I was doing CoP missions back then wiping was part of the game and you rarely had people left after 1-2 wipes even with XP loss. Also people are much better coordinated in group fight with skill chain/magic burst and doing crowd control and stun duty. I suppose the solo friendly nature in this game makes player weaker in group fight.

I like how people are friendly when FATE grinding together. When it comes to dungeon/instance time, however, the nasty side of people comes out. Quite unfortunate.

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Originally Posted by Aoshi1

I can see where the speed-run folks are coming from, and what they are trying to accomplish (time vs reward). Having said that, the hate in these dungeons is almost always coming form this camp as well, because everyone isn't playing on their level, or with the same goals in mind. Sometimes we forget that this is a video game, and others still tend to take it to a level that would otherwise have been considered inappropriate. But with the way the DF works, it's pug city, and you get what you get. People who want to take it easy and enjoy the game need to be ready for the speed run elites, and the uber hardcore folks need to be ready to deal with a player who wants to enjoy their game. We are all paying for it, and it shouldn't be dictated by someone else how YOU will play YOUR game that YOU are paying for.

My $0.02 ^___^

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Oh so true had the same today with me as a healing. All three new to the place aside of the tank,. Wich hardly explained anything and gave me a confusieng explanation for the boss which lead to some bad wipes and me being declared a bad healer and did ragequite. We got a replace and suddnely we had no problem at all. :)

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Originally Posted by Sil3ntxR3qui3m

I wasn't angry when it came to Ifrit run. Was my first time fighting him, tank was horrible and kept using the stone wall even when we knew it didn't work...

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I don't even have limit break on my bar. It seems completely pointless as a tank at the lower dungeons from my experience so far.

My dps experiences have varied from amazing to horrible. Had an archer last night that just absolutely refused to kill adds on boss fights (those fire orbs in that mine dungeon that explode when they reach the boss), making tanking the boss incredibly difficult because now I'm dpsing so we don't wipe which means I don't have TP for savage strike combos, or not attack the MT for trash (even when marked), making aoe tanking a pain in the ass because I'm forced to constantly reposition and chase mobs around the entire damn dungeon.

I'll never forget the one run of Sastasha I accidentally queued into early on into the game. Sure, it's pretty much the easiest dungeon in the game. But the way my party members started acting at the last boss was confusing, hilarious, and worrisome all at the same time. We wiped a total of 4 times. After the first wipe was when the bickering started. The CNJ kept blaming the GLD for moving away from heals. The GLD kept blaming the THM for telling him to move close to the grates. The BLM kept blaming the CNJ for not healing properly. After we finally downed the boss, everyone acted like nothing had happened and started saying to each other, "Good job guys, this was a good group." and "Yea, everyone actually did really well."

I don't get it. Maybe this game causes extreme mood swings in players. Either way, I'm usually the one staying quiet, because I don't want the rage redirected at me. :c

I've encountered my fair share of angry and terrible people. As a healer with years of MMO healing experience I tend to turn even the worst groups into success (for 4 man content). I will typically keep my mouth shut and let those people run their mouths that want to talk and act like they are 13. I suggest finding a Free Company with like minded people as yourself and avoid DF as much as possible. People are generally nicer to someone that doesn't disappear into a void after an hour.

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Originally Posted by Eclipsed

But the people here so far make even WoW's community look like saints...

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I firmly disagree, played WoW from launch, and try to play as many different MMOs as i can. WoW had numbers on it's side, so you got a wider range of people, but the worst people were in games with pvp as a bigger focus. I've had some bad runs here, but have yet to be called a racist or homophobic name here for any mistakes or just existing. There have been wipes here, but i've had more runs where we wiped so hard and so often, in other games people would call names and leave, but here they have said "I guess we learn as we go, it's fun." WoW was more the "gogogogogo!" people, or trying to speed run all dungeons, much less willingness to fail or try again.

Granted, i haven't really run much end game (hit 50 and started working on side classes after finishing story), but i'm seeing more bad experiences mentioned here in the forums than in game.

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Originally Posted by Lexin

The community is horrible and I'm honestly ready to let people die. I have shout turned off because it's not used the way it should be and when it is people start to bitch and complain that it's spam. I'm scared to queue up for the DF because I have no idea what I will be stepping into. I'm to the point where I don't know if I can even play this game anymore because of other people. And now with this iLvl thing it can only get worse.

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One of the reasons I haven't done Aurum Vale yet, haha. I cringe every time I unlock a new dungeon for the first time because I practically have to go in and say "Hi, I'm your tank, and this is my first time in this dungeon. Please don't be too angry with my cluelessness at first". I've had people be awesome about it explain bosses, generally we always do fine, and I've had people up and leave instantly. Worse yet there are the screamers who are angry, I guess at me, for having not done the mission yet. I'm not looking forward to the End-game dungeon unlocks ;_;

I've started running end game dungeons using the DF saving for Darklight gear and my experiences so far I have to say the community is one with massive contrast. On the one hand I've encountered rude, elitist impatient players that take it all way too seriously but on the other I've partied up with some of the nicest and considerate players I've encountered in game to date.

the only thing that bug me is that I can't add these people to my friends list to keep playing with them because they're on a different server lol xD

It comes to the point that some people, needed to be spanked but weren't, so they become what you see here... annoying. Just ignore those people, enjoy the game, and know that someday Karma will come back at that person and will repay them 10 fold for the simple fact of being a jerk. Heck who knows, maybe it's already happening. Enjoy the game, and be happy doing it.

Every time I get verbally assaulted for wanting to hear a strategy in one of these groups (usually on my first run, which I gladly announce at the beginning when in a DF run) it ends up with, "I am trying to farm this and you are slowing the group down." which is then usually met with silence from most of the group. Don't get me wrong, if I draw the short straw and end up the minority in a group intent on farming I will gladly make space for someone who would like to play at that capacity. I would only expect the same if the opposite were true of group intent. I will not stand to be insulted by some punk sitting behind a monitor in "who knows where".

I am an advocate for farm/speed run with your Free Company or Linkshell and not out of DF. It is a free world (for the most part) so do what suits you.

Just help the community as a whole and speak up when you see this pseudo-bullying or brow beating towards yourself or anyone else in a group with you. No one deserves to have their experience disrespected because you or someone else has a different idea of how they want to play the game. Beyond that, no one deserves to be disrespected by anyone for no reason in real life or a game. The constant immaturity, trolling for amusement, content locusts and general a$$hole behavior has to be stopped by the community - in the game and on the forums.

Said it before, will say it again, screenshot it and post it here w/o names blocked; This way I can update my list of jackholes and just leave any DF group with anyone of them in it.

SE should make a new server called Elite and let these "elite" players do a free transfer and do speed run with each other all day. :D

People get frustrated, I get it, but it is so funny people seem to think bitching about it helps. I had done a few Ifrit runs perfectly today, but then I just got into a party where we wiped a couple of times and I'll admit I was playing poorly. People started bitching about it calling me a noob and w/e, in the end I just left. I don't want to play and get bashed when I try my best, even if I have a bad run. It just takes away all the fun with the game. I think this exists in most mmos, but with the duty finder working the way it does it has gone pretty rampant in ARR, hopefully SE can find a way to make people tone it down some.

I don't even know why dds are so vocal now a days, back when I played the majority of my mmos dds were silent types that just sat back and did damage, now they are usually facerollers who need attention in an online game. It used to be "i'm a dd, and I have the least responsibility, I'll let the tank and healer figure this out", now its "omg I totally am going to argue with every person ever because I'm not good at anything in real life, and if I admit I'm not good in this, then really I have nothing I'm good at...at all" Even in 1.0 dds weren't argumentative like this, probably cause we had a smaller community.

I mean i don't mean to single out dds, i've had losers of all classes. Its just a dd is more likely to start crap with the tank or healer when it was totally his fault to begin with.

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Originally Posted by n1MB1s

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When this happens, usually those people get bored with the game and move on, I have yet to see those kind of people from those that are chilled like majority of TRUE final fantasy player base, actually enjoy the content and don't mind taking a little extra time in doing it, as it's still a good experience, AND it helps get better at the dungeons, so it almost becomes like second nature.

I"d just be fricken happy at managing to get a group for Ambador. Between DD que times + server trying to reserve an instance for you... jeeezzuussss. Time to shut up, if see a problem try to give a few pointers and/or shut up if someone is hostile or say you're welcome if they actually say thank you.

I still don't understand how speed runners use DF then get pissed when not everyone wants to do a speed run. If you want a speed run make a group. Otherwise take what you get and shut up. However playing a healer I've gotten used to just keeping my mouth shut and following the tank. If we wipe I quickly blame myself even if it was someone else who screwed up to keep people from arguing. Would much rather them yell at me while we run back and finish than stand around while idiots make fools of themselves.

It's like that in every MMO that comes out now a days. I can't tell you how many times we wipe one time on something and a tank or healer get mad and leave, like for real? It's a game and not every one has ran the same thing 100 times like you have lol. I just hope in about 5 months a lot of people leave, feel kind of bad saying that but half of these people dont need to play if they just like to solo and complain all game.

Because the game is at launch. The bigger the MMO, the more often this happens. When you can get in the group finder and never run in to the same player twice you can get away with being an a-hole. My suggestion is really to join a guild and play with people you know. Mutual respect goes a long way in party success and a guild is the best way to achieve that.