The hard data on STR/VIT for Glad/PALADIN. Where can i find it?

I came to the forums to see the hard data on what stats is best to be used on an endgame Tank.

But all I see is conjuncture, bias-ism, eyeballing, and raw assumption and nothing supported by hard date. Is no one doing this?

Please don't post anything that says "Well your abilities clearly point to this..." that is not hard data, that is simply an assumption without anything to back it up.

Is no one doing any lvl 50 tests or is eye-balling what everyone is content with?

*eyeballs you*
I like pallies they're the bestestest.
Your abilities clearly show that vit is the premiere stat.
*eyeballs you*

Dictating that all your points into VIT only produces around 100 hp how do you justify something that negligible? again.....

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Originally Posted by Jayded

*eyeballs you*
I like pallies they're the bestestest.
Your abilities clearly show that vit is the premiere stat.
*eyeballs you*

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That's a pretty condescending post for someone who obviously doesn't have the ability to do it himself. You must be from that game that need not be spoken (you all know what I'm talking about :))

The game is new, give it a a little time and all the magical mathematic proof you demand will be presented.

Fail for the day: quoted the wrong person, my B :)

Care to share why you believe it condescending? I would have to referring to someone specifically to do that. I'm pointing out that we have two camps but no one seems to really want to find out they would just rather be safe in their assumption, I'm asking if someone had done the leg work since my self am not blind to the fact I wouldn't know what i was talking about.

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Originally Posted by ReithDynamis

Dictating that all your points into VIT only produces around 100 hp how do you justify something that negligible? again.....

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+30 vit = 100hp ,well maybe you should get your mats right before posting.

The best site I've found for hard data is BLITZBALL. I highly suggest everyone check it out!
B.L.I.T.Z.B.A.L.L.

I found the enmity tables to be very helpful.

According to the Block and Parry tables, I'm not sure STR is that important except for the extra enmity you generate due to hitting harder. It seems that going from <243 STR to 471 will only grant you an extra 6% parry and 4% block. Anyone at end-game can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong if that 6% really is important.

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Originally Posted by Sephirah

According to the Block and Parry tables, I'm not sure STR is that important except for the extra enmity you generate due to hitting harder. It seems that going from <243 STR to 471 will only grant you an extra 6% parry and 4% block. Anyone at end-game can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong if that 6% really is important.

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Yes. 10% less chance to take a full hit.

Honestly as a long time mmo tank, i'm taking the avoidance stats. Vit is nice, but PLDs are built for single target physical damage bosses. More mitigation means a higher EHP.

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Originally Posted by ReithDynamis

Dictating that all your points into VIT only produces around 100 hp how do you justify something that negligible? again.....

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Because the points in STR are also incredibly negligible. The only time it's worth it is when you are approaching a new STR tier, which you can make up with materia. It's far easier to just put everything into vit and use materia to reach new tiers, rather than spend 10k seals every time you get a new piece of gear.

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Originally Posted by Escalith

Yes. 10% less chance to take a full hit.

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It's not 10% less chance to take a full hit.

It's 4% or 6% less damage taken on hits you block or parry, respectively.

STR has zero impact on shield/parry rate (that is DEX).

1 vit = 15 HP at level 50 for tanks. For warriors it's 18.

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Originally Posted by ReithDynamis

Dictating that all your points into VIT only produces around 100 hp how do you justify something that negligible? again.....

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Last time I checked 30VIT gave me 450HP...

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Originally Posted by Nehru

Honestly as a long time mmo tank, i'm taking the avoidance stats. Vit is nice, but PLDs are built for single target physical damage bosses. More mitigation means a higher EHP.

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More HP is also higher EHP. The issue at hand is how much do you get from each option, and no one seems to know the answer to that. Some games favor avoidance/mitigation, and some games favor raw HP. Sometimes it's different even in the same game, depending on class and/or boss mechanics. You also have to consider damage intake. If most fights feature steady intake, avoidance is almost always going to be superior. If fights are "bursty" (a lot of WoW fights behaved this way for a long time), then raw EHP (and consequently Vit/Stam/etc.) tend to be the better choice. When you face a legitimate chance of being two-shot, the only solution is to get enough HP to not die. Relying on avoidance in such a situation is a recipe for pure frustration.

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Originally Posted by Amas

It's not 10% less chance to take a full hit.

It's 4% or 6% less damage taken on hits you block or parry, respectively.

STR has zero impact on shield/parry rate (that is DEX).

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I don't think Dex affects shield/parry anymore that was 1.0. I think they may o changed it for ARR. Definately worth checking out.

I prefer a balanced approach of Str/Vit/Mind. I find having a heal to throw around highly valuable and mitigation is always preferable to HP's, up until diminishing returns of course.

Seconding the link that Sephirah put up. It's probably the closest thing you're going to find to hard data and formulae out there at the moment.

There is a huge table out there somewhere, where someone did a lot of math and calculations specifically looking at str/vit. Str affects your damage mitigation which can help you survive longer than vit... but the problem is, unlike vit, str has certain 'tiers' which must be reached to increase your mitigation. Iirc the highest tier for str mitigation is at 404 or 403 strength. So anything past that number doesn't count, and the rest should be plugged into vit.

Someone linked to that data in another thread, regrettably I don't remember it though, maybe someone else could link it here if they know what it is...

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Originally Posted by PessimiStick

More HP is also higher EHP. The issue at hand is how much do you get from each option, and no one seems to know the answer to that. Some games favor avoidance/mitigation, and some games favor raw HP. Sometimes it's different even in the same game, depending on class and/or boss mechanics. You also have to consider damage intake. If most fights feature steady intake, avoidance is almost always going to be superior. If fights are "bursty" (a lot of WoW fights behaved this way for a long time), then raw EHP (and consequently Vit/Stam/etc.) tend to be the better choice. When you face a legitimate chance of being two-shot, the only solution is to get enough HP to not die. Relying on avoidance in such a situation is a recipe for pure frustration.

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Good point, its all going to be situation based it seems. Like you said we really don't know until we start raiding. Being able to swap materia out is going to be a must it seems.

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Originally Posted by Sephirah

The best site I've found for hard data is BLITZBALL. I highly suggest everyone check it out!
B.L.I.T.Z.B.A.L.L.

I found the enmity tables to be very helpful.

According to the Block and Parry tables, I'm not sure STR is that important except for the extra enmity you generate due to hitting harder. It seems that going from <243 STR to 471 will only grant you an extra 6% parry and 4% block. Anyone at end-game can feel free to correct me if I'm wrong if that 6% really is important.

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Nice site... Hope it's accurate

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Originally Posted by ShinjoDale

I don't think Dex affects shield/parry anymore that was 1.0. I think they may o changed it for ARR. Definately worth checking out.

I prefer a balanced approach of Str/Vit/Mind. I find having a heal to throw around highly valuable and mitigation is always preferable to HP's, up until diminishing returns of course.

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Mouseover Dexterity in your character Log...it tells you that it increases Parry/Block Chance...

If you really put points into MND as a Paladin you're a lost cause anyway. 1MND equals 1 Healing Magic Potency which equals a mere 2-4HP extra cured...I don't see how 15HP more outweigh 2-4HP extra on cures...but hey you seem to know what you're doing, since DEX doesn't affect Parry and all...