Is it just me: Frontline

Is it just me that doesn't take Frontline serious? Like this is a legit question. People ask for balance in frontline, upset they aren't winning, making guides, etc.

I'll be honest with you when I care to play I still never took it seriously, it was just great chaos. Balance wasn't a question to me, coordination was the only thing that mattered. Trying to get a whole alliance to follow you was good fun. It's was good exp and a little fun even if I died. Never a test of skill.

So my question again. Is it just me that never took Frontline serious?

Ps. IDC how long you played or how good you are.

Yes it's just you. Everyone else takes it very seriously. We've been meaning to talk to you about this.

In high-end raids, seriousness is the default. Focus is assumed, scrutiny is constant, and if you cause wipes you eat the shame. Nobody pretends it’s life or death—we all know we’re whacking a 3D model and not curing cancer. Yet for some reason the seriousness is so okay doing that and only that. Because reasons.

Frontline has the same contract. It runs on calls, timing, and coordinated execution. Queueing then acting shocked that people want to actually play is like walking into a pickup soccer match and announcing you’ll stroll because it’s “not that deep.” causing the match to fail then just acting like your friends are crazy for being upset at you because you stole what would have otherwise been 20 minutes of fun for everyone, because you wanted to express how chill you think life should be. The double standard is wild: intensity/seriousness is praised in Ultimate/savage, mocked in Frontline.

No one’s saving the world here. Wanting to win doesn’t need a grand cause. For many of us, the joy is playing well together and sharing a clean execution. Treating Frontline as disposable erases the players who log in mainly for PvP. If you join and ignore objectives, you waste your team’s time. If you only want EXP, the game gives you plenty of low-effort options—use those instead of undermining people who queued to compete.

The “it ain’t that deep” line that I see almost every frontline match without failure is a conversation ender. Sometimes the shallow take is insisting nothing deserves effort. Maybe consider that the lack of depth is on you. Empathy runs both ways: if you post something expecting players to respect your chill approach, then its fair for me and players who share my sentiment to expect you to also respect ours. I will never go into content you care about, meme and clown all over it, then treat your dismay with dismissal and gaslighting and telling you that you're the awful person for reacting to someone ruining your experience in something that you enjoy because they think "its just not that deep, bro"

If you press queue for Frontline, you’ve chosen to play it. So play it. It was so normal in local network pvp games like CS:GO for people who are close friends to scream at each other and every match was so intense and competitive. If someone back then stood in the middle of people playing like that and smugly told them that theyre insane because they just dont get his namaste kumbaya take on things.. I'd be the first to throw my drink at them telling them to get out. You're not being edgy with your approach, not you, and not the many frontline players who share it.

I also want to remind you, or anyone who doesn't know, that many players play FFXIV mainly for the PVP. Its the joy they get out of the game. It's the main way they spend their time. I don't think any of them would appreciate someone coming into the time they choose to have fun, and putting that at risk for them. You know.. the same way a prog liar would join your PF and suck the dopamine from the 7 people theyre with until its depleted. Don't be that person. When they're serious, and purposeful, that's them wanting to win, like how you want to clear the savage tier when you do. I can go on and on. Check yourself.

I wonder how a post in the PvE forums would go over if I use the same narrative you are about savage and ultimate. Probably will get lectured to death about how respecting other people's time is virtuous and how me being chill about it means I am (insert very bad trait here).

Yes it's just you, and I'm recently new to PVP.

If you sign up for a competitive, team based game, you should be obligated to put in your best effort.

If you find yourself doing other things while playing the video game why are you even playing it?

Many people say you can’t make a difference in FL, and you might not be able to win on your own, but you can certainly lose for your team.

I’m just tired.

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Originally Posted by Vatom

Is it just me that doesn't take Frontline serious? Like this is a legit question. People ask for balance in frontline, upset they aren't winning, making guides, etc.

I'll be honest with you when I care to play I still never took it seriously, it was just great chaos. Balance wasn't a question to me, coordination was the only thing that mattered. Trying to get a whole alliance to follow you was good fun. It's was good exp and a little fun even if I died. Never a test of skill.

So my question again. Is it just me that never took Frontline serious?

Ps. IDC how long you played or how good you are.

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yes if I catch you AFKing or throwing I will likely report you for lethargic gameplay I'll tell on you so fast xD

sheesh even Exmo has a good opinion here lol

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Originally Posted by Exmo

Yes it's just you. Everyone else takes it very seriously. We've been meaning to talk to you about this.

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Thank you for your contributions. I was asking a serious question. Didn't need snark so from here on I will ignore your comments. Thank you

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Originally Posted by Elephantality

Yes it's just you, and I'm recently new to PVP.

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Welcome hope your enjoying it. Have you tried other pvp or was this your introduction?

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Originally Posted by Kahnha

yes if I catch you AFKing or throwing I will likely report you for lethargic gameplay I'll tell on you so fast xD

sheesh even Exmo has a good opinion here lol

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Fair but this isn't really on topic. Allow me to clarify. When I say take serious, I don't mean afk but play to play even if I don't win. Afk mean you 100% don't care. Not taking it serious is more of I'll try to win but if I don't I'm cool with my exp.

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Originally Posted by OliviaLugria

If you sign up for a competitive, team based game, you should be obligated to put in your best effort.

If you find yourself doing other things while playing the video game why are you even playing it?

Many people say you can’t make a difference in FL, and you might not be able to win on your own, but you can certainly lose for your team.

I’m just tired.

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Is it competitive though? Sure your fighting against teams but there isn't structure to promote competitive interaction.

I don't fully understand this statement

Fair

And I get the constant is my team actually playing would get tiring

This is a lot to unpack spoo, on a phone. I will get back to this

Anything you do that pits you against other people in a competitive setting is something a competitive person considers…serious.
With that being said, frontline doesn’t fall into that category regardless of how an individual may perceive it. Frontline is listed with dailies, dailies are the games true casual content. Frontline, like all other casual content, is meant to prepare you for mid core content so you can eventually progress into hardcore. Ie…standard trail -> Ex-> savage-> ultimate. You play frontline to get use to the difference between PvE and PvP game play. In PvP’s case, frontline -> CC casual -> CC ranked.
For whatever the reason, the community see frontline as more than the resource and knowledge gain it actually is. I’d go as far as saying more the 60% play frontline for the xp, series xp, and fun over actually winning. The few who see it as a replacement for the games REAL competitive PvP are the ones asking for balance changes because they haven’t made the transition to CC (not saying certain jobs don’t need adjusting, stating your opinion would be different with experience playing CC. The jobs feel much more balanced there).
We’d be happy to have you in CC. The game play is completely different, but that’s why casual is there. You’ll find all the truly competitive gamers there.

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Originally Posted by Vatom

Fair but this isn't really on topic. Allow me to clarify. When I say take serious, I don't mean afk but play to play even if I don't win. Afk mean you 100% don't care. Not taking it serious is more of I'll try to win but if I don't I'm cool with my exp.

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oh well in that case you are fine you can't be too serious because you can't control 23 other players, but 1st place gets a better reward than 2nd and 3rd so yes play to win but don't stress it and don't let anyone else stress you out either xD

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Originally Posted by spoo

In high-end raids, seriousness is the default. Focus is assumed, scrutiny is constant, and if you cause wipes you eat the shame. Nobody pretends it’s life or death—we all know we’re whacking a 3D model and not curing cancer. Yet for some reason the seriousness is so okay doing that and only that. Because reasons.

Frontline has the same contract. It runs on calls, timing, and coordinated execution. Queueing then acting shocked that people want to actually play is like walking into a pickup soccer match and announcing you’ll stroll because it’s “not that deep.” causing the match to fail then just acting like your friends are crazy for being upset at you because you stole what would have otherwise been 20 minutes of fun for everyone, because you wanted to express how chill you think life should be. The double standard is wild: intensity/seriousness is praised in Ultimate/savage, mocked in Frontline.

No one’s saving the world here. Wanting to win doesn’t need a grand cause. For many of us, the joy is playing well together and sharing a clean execution. Treating Frontline as disposable erases the players who log in mainly for PvP.).

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I get the appeal of wanting Frontline to feel like a true war — I really do. PvP shines when there’s coordination and intensity. But the mode itself just doesn’t reinforce that level of competitiveness.

Frontline is built as casual content. Rewards push people in for daily EXP, and the scale/chaos means one player’s performance rarely decides the outcome. You can even earn Battle High without a single kill, and the mode has extra PvP actions that don’t exist in CC specifically to make it less punishing. It’s designed for accessibility, not esports-level play.

That’s why no one is obligated to treat it like Savage or Ultimate. Players queue for many reasons — fun, EXP, dailies, testing a job — all of which are valid because the system itself allows them. If someone wants a guaranteed competitive environment, ranked CC or community events are the right place for it.

Frontline, by contrast, is intentionally casual. Expecting raid-level seriousness from a mode that was never designed for it just sets everyone up for frustration.

I understand your emotional about this try to not direct it at me and look at the whole. Cause you don't know how I play, and I don't know how you play. Refer back to my ps

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Originally Posted by Vatom

Is it just me that doesn't take Frontline serious? Like this is a legit question. People ask for balance in frontline, upset they aren't winning, making guides, etc.

I'll be honest with you when I care to play I still never took it seriously, it was just great chaos. Balance wasn't a question to me, coordination was the only thing that mattered. Trying to get a whole alliance to follow you was good fun. It's was good exp and a little fun even if I died. Never a test of skill.

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People toss out 'serious' like it's supposed to be a pejorative word or something.

I'd argue they're also confusing 'serious' with 'enjoying the game mode.' I don't get why it is such a horrible thing to try and educate players or encourage good habits.

Imagine if in a game of Uno (which is 'unserious') someone explains to a new player that you shouldn't just toss a Reverse Card out, but to try and save it for a more important situation.

Then another person at the table pops off asking why the person explaining things is taking Uno so seriously. Same vibes.

You can enjoy the game mode like how you described without trying to put people who enjoy the game mode on blast.

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Ps. IDC how long you played or how good you are.

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What's the point of this, beyond trying to be inflammatory in your totally genuine 'I'm just asking questions' post?

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Originally Posted by Vatom

Is it competitive though? Sure your fighting against teams but there isn't structure to promote competitive interaction.

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You're competing with 2 other teams to reach a set goal before them. It is literally a competition. I have a feeling you're conflating 'competitive' as used in say, an esports context or something similar with the literal meaning of the word 'competitive', which is understandable in a gaming context.

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Originally Posted by Vatom

Welcome hope your enjoying it. Have you tried other pvp or was this your introduction?

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Thank you. It was my introduction. At first I was overwhelmed, but was given a guide to it and since the season was ending, I wanted the glam from the rewards. Also, I don't like to lose, and most especially, I don't like to be bad, so I try to improve while I play. Through all that, I was able to find Frontlines fun. I think you can too if you think of it as a team game. I only played CC like a few times after bashing my head against Frontlines alot.

The reason there’s an air of seriousness around savage/ultimate is because it’s high end game play. Everyone participating is expected to know what to do and how to do it. Maybe you didn’t realize but…you agreed without knowing you did.

Frontline isn’t meant to be taken that seriously and yet, there’s a few who do. It is designed to be casual content no matter how passionately you feel about it.

There is a sizable player base that comes specifically for PvP. I myself log daily for just that purpose. The difference between us and you….we don’t play frontline to satisfy the urge to PvP. We play CC. No one is rewarded for participation, my personal play affects the match outcome, it’s actually coordinated, and I get the real feel of combat.

Frontline is the introduction to PvP. Expecting anything other than that is you bringing yourself unnecessary stress. The mode is for xp, resources, and instant fun. Acknowledging the modes purpose isn’t disrespecting anyone’s time or whatever you said. Nor does it diminish the value of the mode itself.

As far as your PvE point…yes, that conversation has and is happening almost daily. People have trying to define what casual and mid core are for FF.

There’s a bunch more you posted, but it all kinda came off as word vomit(apologies if there’s an actual point in the essay). What I gathered is, you’re one of those who take a casual mode WAAAY to serious. You’re giving off the vibe of being that person who’s spamming insults and reprimanding people in chat during the match. No one likes that guy….I’m sure you already know that by the way your team replies.

Enjoy whatever you play how you want to. All I’m saying (as well as the original post) don’t let your personal feeling for a mode change what it is. You’re stressing yourself out and everyone you play with who’s there for a good time.

CC isn't really that fun nor does it spark the fire within me like Frontlines does. Pushing the crystal doesn't seem that fun to me. CC is really only a mode to help me understand my class for better Frontline performance. At least we can duo queue now though. I don't stress myself out by being passionate about any specific mode or any specific activity in the game, nor will I stop. However people should be kicked for afk'ing. You are there to play. Just as a person afk'ing in Crystal Tower should be kicked. Regardless of how casual you think the mode is.

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Originally Posted by Kahnha

oh well in that case you are fine you can't be too serious because you can't control 23 other players, but 1st place gets a better reward than 2nd and 3rd so yes play to win but don't stress it and don't let anyone else stress you out either xD

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Originally Posted by Trevski

People toss out 'serious' like it's supposed to be a pejorative word or something.

I'd argue they're also confusing 'serious' with 'enjoying the game mode.' I don't get why it is such a horrible thing to try and educate players or encourage good habits.

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I’m all for bettering yourself — that’s not the issue. The problem is treating Frontline like it’s more than casual when the mode itself was never built that way. You can literally earn Battle High without a single kill, and it even has extra PvP actions that don’t exist in CC just to keep it from being overly competitive.

And if we’re using Uno as an example — Frontline isn’t the “save your Reverse card for the perfect moment” kind of game. It’s more like the house rules party version where half the fun is in the chaos. Writing guides for that and expecting raid-level discipline just misses the point of why the mode was designed in the first place.


The point of that line wasn’t meant to be inflammatory. It was just to set an even playing field for the discussion so people don’t lean on “I’ve played X years” or “I’m this good” as a way to dismiss others. I want the conversation to stay about the design of Frontline itself, not player résumés.

You’re right that in the literal sense, yes, Frontline is a competition — three teams racing to a goal. My point is more about structure. Competitive modes usually have systems in place that promote consistent, skill-driven interaction (like ranked ladders, strict balance, or limited actions). Frontline doesn’t have that. It’s designed with chaos, catch-up mechanics, and even extra PvP abilities that don’t exist in ranked CC — all of which keep it from being a true competitive environment.

So sure, it’s competitive by dictionary definition, but it’s casual in design and execution. That’s the distinction I’m making.

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Originally Posted by Elephantality

Thank you. It was my introduction. At first I was overwhelmed, but was given a guide to it and since the season was ending, I wanted the glam from the rewards. Also, I don't like to lose, and most especially, I don't like to be bad, so I try to improve while I play. Through all that, I was able to find Frontlines fun. I think you can too if you think of it as a team game. I only played CC like a few times after bashing my head against Frontlines alot.

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I feel that not wanting to lose is normal. But unless you have at least a full alliance working together developing a guide or secret technique seems redundant.

Maybe that's just me

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Originally Posted by Vatom

I feel that not wanting to lose is normal. But unless you have at least a full alliance working together developing a guide or secret technique seems redundant.

Maybe that's just me

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The guide went over what you can do as a 4 person team, so that actually showed me that is what is needed. I mean, it makes sense because we aren't meant to just 1v1. It does have tips on commanding as well but that's something I will not try until I get good at the mode. Although the team coordination between friends seems more fun than just getting your whole alliance to follow. Like a small strike force. This is why Frontlines is interesting to me. Never have I experienced such a unique mode.

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Originally Posted by Elephantality

The guide went over what you can do as a 4 person team, so that actually showed me that is what is needed. I mean, it makes sense because we aren't meant to just 1v1. It does have tips on commanding as well but that's something I will not try until I get good at the mode. Although the team coordination between friends seems more fun than just getting your whole alliance to follow. Like a small strike force. This is why Frontlines is interesting to me. Never have I experienced such a unique mode.

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That is a cool perspective I didn't see! A small strike force, I respect that. Ok. Get 4 friends see how far you can influence the tide. Not the guides I've seen but that one seems more interesting, while making the best of what you got.

there is no guide for PvP other than the very basics...

this is not PvE Content that follows the same script that everyone can learn and adapt to.

PvP... is about Horde ahead, take points... and don't go in between two groups ending in a crossfire and attacking the alliance that is the most ahead instead of thinking can score points off the underdog.

I'm not a good player, but I just like to have fun in there.
I'll do objectives where I can, and join contested zones in the instances where there are commanders, but the outcome isn't serious for me.
My favourite times are when I don't even know who won but the battles felt great throughout the match.

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Originally Posted by Themarvin

there is no guide for PvP other than the very basics...

this is not PvE Content that follows the same script that everyone can learn and adapt to.

PvP... is about Horde ahead, take points... and don't go in between two groups ending in a crossfire and attacking the alliance that is the most ahead instead of thinking can score points off the underdog.

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https://oliguide.carrd.co/

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Originally Posted by spoo

snip

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Perfect post, wish I could give it more thumbs up

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Originally Posted by Vatom

I’m all for bettering yourself — that’s not the issue. The problem is treating Frontline like it’s more than casual when the mode itself was never built that way. You can literally earn Battle High without a single kill, and it even has extra PvP actions that don’t exist in CC just to keep it from being overly competitive.

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I'd argue that it is at least part of the issue because if you are treating FL in an 'unserious' way, there's no reason to learn the game mode or, and I know this is a dirty word for a lot of people, try.

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And if we’re using Uno as an example — Frontline isn’t the “save your Reverse card for the perfect moment” kind of game.

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Ya, if only there wasn't a big glowy bar...

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Writing guides for that and expecting raid-level discipline just misses the point of why the mode was designed in the first place.

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I'd argue guides that focus on fundamentals, map quirks, etc. are useful, as well as guides that highlight how certain jobs may synergize with each other. You're attributing things to me that weren't said -- I don't expect 'raid-level discipline' or whatever.

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The point of that line wasn’t meant to be inflammatory. It was just to set an even playing field for the discussion so people don’t lean on “I’ve played X years” or “I’m this good” as a way to dismiss others. I want the conversation to stay about the design of Frontline itself, not player résumés.

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I would argue that asking folks on a forum, where not many casual Andys are posting on, in the subforum for a game mode even fewer casual Andys care about, would be leaning towards folks who have experience/are enthusiasts and is naturally meant to rile folks up, intended or not.

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You’re right that in the literal sense, yes, Frontline is a competition — three teams racing to a goal. My point is more about structure.

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It doesn't really matter if it has ladders or whatever. The mode, by its very nature, is competitive and 'casual' games can be competitive.

Should a hypercompetitive, esports attitude be tossed at Frontlines? No. But should people be derided for trying to shotcall or play a team game...like a team game? Also no.

FL is so chaotic and random it can never be competitive. Tbh now I am not even sure about cc anymore because of the win trading situation. Let just say I don't care about anything just here to yap. Because yapping here is fun.

Playing with friends was fun, compared to how I played solo and it was just, suffering. Plus I don't think I lost due to premades, but more so me going along with the team pushing in bad positions, which made it easier for us to be killed. (Of course, my mistake as well) Frontlines is deceptively more complex than one would think. Which is very interesting. (I am trying to restrain my unga bunga and improve my positioning)

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Originally Posted by Vatom

Is it just me that doesn't take Frontline serious? Like this is a legit question. People ask for balance in frontline, upset they aren't winning, making guides, etc.

I'll be honest with you when I care to play I still never took it seriously, it was just great chaos. Balance wasn't a question to me, coordination was the only thing that mattered. Trying to get a whole alliance to follow you was good fun. It's was good exp and a little fun even if I died. Never a test of skill.

So my question again. Is it just me that never took Frontline serious?

Ps. IDC how long you played or how good you are.

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Depends on the reason for why you are playing to begin with. If you are "just here for xp/series xp/tomes", then it makes sense that you would just openly not care.

Others DO care. In my case, it is a grind to get my achievements done. I am almost up to my 1500th win (halfway done with all Frontlines achievements) but still have a long way to go.

For people like me, it can be frustrating when i see our score drop 50 points because 6 of my teammates decided to run off and pick a 6v20 fight and get annihilated. It can be frustrating when people tunnel vision the mid oovo for the first half of the match while totally ignoring outer nodes, then they wonder why we behind the other teams by 500 points.

It bites when i start a match and right away my teammates are saying "i have no idea what is going on" or "just here for xp". As soon as i see that, i figure i might as well put in a ball gag and bend over now. I know where this is going...

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Originally Posted by jesseleewelch

It bites when i start a match and right away my teammates are saying "i have no idea what is going on"

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Yet that was my immediate reaction as a new player to Frontlines, so I'm not ever really that upset over those comments. I just tell them to just try to stay with the pack and keep their map open, and hope for the best.

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Originally Posted by Trevski

I'd argue

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Casual doesn’t mean lazy. You can still queue Frontline, play the objectives, and contribute without treating it like high-end competitive content. My point is the mode was designed to be approachable and chaotic, not structured like ranked CC — so expecting raid-level seriousness from everyone isn’t realistic.

Moving on this analogy isn't going anywhere.


At this point I don’t think this is a serious discussion. You’ve sidestepped the points to nitpick context, so I’ll leave it here.

I understand the frustration jesse- but as much as it cause by other people it's also self inflicted. We can't force people not expect them to play like you. That's all I'm saying. If people wanna be mad at truth go ahead(not you specifically)

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Originally Posted by Vatom

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Technically, you can 'contribute' to ranked CC as long as you hit someone. You're dealing damage, assisting the team in defeating the opponent. Does it mean you are ultimately playing at benefit to the team? No - other factors matter. Who you focus, your approach to play, your own deaths etc.

Are they attempting to coordinate their attacks with their team, or are they just throwing damage wildly and randomly, allowing enemies to escape and heal rather than finish the job? Are they instantly running to 1v5 an enemy team following a wipe, without falling back to regroup, dying again just seconds later? Are they attempting to heal and use elixirs or are they just using death as a reset, forgetting the slowly increasing respawn timer?


It's the same for Frontline. You can't apply this rule to one and not the other.

Sure, someone can spend their whole time playing objectives, which gains points. Does it mean they are ultimately playing at benefit to the team? No - other factors matter.

Are they attempting to coordinate their attacks with their alliance or are they just throwing damage wildly and randomly, allowing enemies to escape and heal rather than finish the job? Are they blindly running into an enemy alliance, totally solo and outnumbered, just to interact with a node in the false hope that this enemy alliance will ignore them and let them take it, dying just seconds later? Are they attempting to heal and use elixirs or are they just using death as a reset, forgetting the loss of team points and BH with each death?


Example:

Shatter

All of their focus on ice, they are unlikely to be contributing much to PvP. When an enemy team comes to take those objectives they contribute little/nothing towards defence. The objective is more likely to be lost, those players who did attempt to defend are more likely to die due to being undersupported, and those casuals who focused the objectives also die because they now have no team to protect them. Not only does the more aggressive PvP team gain huge point boosts from their kills, but they also farm considerable BH, giving them a strong advantage next time. Casuals dealt good damage to the ice, but lost all of the point gain, and their BH, in deaths.


Seal Rock

You're second place. The Flames are in first and aren't far from winning. Maelstrom, third place, is far behind you both on points, though more due to the unfortunate luck of being the North spawn than any kind of poor play. An S rank spawns between you and Maelstrom. Seconds later an A rank spawns between you and Flames. You would not believe the number of objective-focused casuals who will go for the S-rank 'because that's worth more'. You're still fighting Maelstrom for the S-rank while Flames take the A-rank with ease, they then travel up the map to flank you while the casuals are blindly focused on Maelstrom for the S. You wipe, Flames wins.

Would you say either of these contributed?

You’re applying ranked CC logic to a mode that was never built to function that way. Frontline is intentionally designed with respawns, multiple objectives, and alliance-scale chaos — it’s not a 5v5 elimination match where every single decision makes or breaks the game.

Objectives do contribute directly, otherwise they wouldn’t award points or Battle High. Yes, a bad push can backfire — but that’s true of any PvP mode. The difference is that in FL, those swings are part of the design. That’s why the mode has unique PvP actions and less punishing mechanics compared to CC: to keep it from being “serious competitive.”

Highlighting worst-case examples (like people tunneling ice or misjudging node spawns) doesn’t erase the fact that casual play and objective play are valid, intended contributions. FL has always been a casual-friendly entry point into PvP, and its systems reflect that. Treating it like CC just ignores the purpose of the mode entirely.

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Originally Posted by Vatom

You’re applying ranked CC logic to a mode that was never built to function that way

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This isn't just "ranked CC logic'" this is standard PvP logic. The very fact that you seem to consider Ranked CC to be the only 'true' PvP while referring to anything else as being just "chaos", suggests a very narrow view.

FL is large-scale PvP. The same basic rules which apply to CC also apply to FL: coordinate to focus down opponents, be aware of your job strengths and utilise them to support your team, keep together where possible, deaths are costly - a few seconds away to use an elixir beats a respawn countdown.

FL has an RNG element to it's objectives, but to write it off as nothing more than 'chaos' suggests a very limited knowledge of FL. To a good team, those RNG objectives are secondary. Aggressive, tactical, and coordinated team play farms early BH and kills, which allows the easy capture of objectives to naturally follow.
Heavy objective-focus isn't necessary and the greater the proportion of casual players who take on the 'focus ice, let them fight' approach, the lower the chances of winning.

Consider it similar to a CC tank, throwing themselves in and spamming AoEs randomly until they die, respawn, repeat. Is it contributing? They're dealing damage and taking damage which their team would've otherwise taken. So by your FL logic, yes, they're directly contributing. Except their total lack of focus and self heal means they're spending more time dead than assisting. So their minimal contributions are completely outweighed by the negative effects their constant deaths/absence are having on their team. These FL examples are no different.
And these are not 'worst case examples'. They are highly common scenarios, occurring at some point in a large proportion of games, especially around reset times where the greatest proportion of players are casuals just playing for roulette experience.

You’re making the mistake of treating all PvP modes as if they share the same weight. Yes, some fundamentals overlap — coordination and awareness are useful everywhere — but the design intent of FL is not the same as CC.
That’s not ignorance — it’s acknowledging what the developers designed it to be. If SE wanted FL to function like CC, it wouldn’t have roulette incentives, respawns, and RNG objectives. It exists as an accessible, large-scale PvP mode.

Calling common, intended playstyles “wrong” just because they don’t match your preferred meta is where we disagree. FL doesn’t require the same structure or seriousness as CC, and pretending otherwise ignores why so many players queue for it in the first place.

Also please do not refer to my knowledge. Just like told someone else, you don't know how I play and I don't know how you play. Let keep this within the realm of the original post.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Scintilla

Technically, you can 'contribute' to ranked CC as long as you hit someone. You're dealing damage, assisting the team in defeating the opponent. Does it mean you are ultimately playing at benefit to the team? No - other factors matters

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The opening statement here is complete rubbish. You can win at ranked CC by just “hitting people” is the most ridiculous take I’ve ever heard. There’s no participation bonus in CC (battle high off assists or on kills for that matter). You have no idea what you’re talking anbout. After that statement, you need to take a screenshot of your rank and victories. Nothing you say can be slightly considered creditable until then. If a single person dcs in a match, you’re all but guaranteed a loss. I’ve had team mates completely not play in frontline and still won along with most having no idea what they’re doing.

Your other post claims frontline game play is comparable to CC…that’s complete nonsense as well. The number of combatants and objectives completely ruins that stance. Your example of tank play is horribly flawed as well. Just diving in, in CC is a death sentence and since CC is all about the numerical advantage…you just cost your team the match. Misinformation is beyond toxic. Misinformation for the sake of validating your point is even worse.

No matter how you feel about frontline, the facts are stacked against you. It’s a daily, dailies are casual content. Casual content is a bridge into mid-core content. Trying to force your skewed viewpoint on other people with misinformation is toxic. Questioning other people’s intelligence or skill based on your obvious misunderstandings is the real problem here.

Lastly…no one is saying frontline is bad or pointless or discrediting it in any way. The topic was meant to get people thinking about what purpose and place frontline has in PvP. You don’t need to defend yourself here Vatom. This person is taking this post as a personal attack because they are the person that makes a casual mode meant for fun, miserable to play. We’ve all experienced their kind. Constantly spamming the chat insulting people because they are there to have fun…like the game mode was intended. If you intend to play frontline like ranked CC…feel free. It’s extremely bad for your mental health, but hey…I don’t pay your sub. The rest of us looking for that kind of experience are going to play CC or ranked, like SE intended. Save the insults, misinformation, and skill questioning for yourself.

If people are determined to make frontline mid-core/high end, maybe they should be asking Yoshi P for similar version to be added to CC. Chaos mode…8 vs 8 would be a reasonable request.

I play Frontlines semi-seriously, like going on AST to heal the entire alliance or the melees/DNCs putting in work in the frontlines that need a way out. Stuff like that makes it fun for me, we may not always win but I like to think I helped which is enough! On the other hand, when I first started Frontlines it was solely for EXP and for some reason my stupid noob brain always wanted to get away from the crowd and try to sneak on nodes and such stuff. Then I learned to stay with the group as it is the best chance of survival and wins EVEN if you all die together.

Then I learned to not get frustrated when people don't follow Commanders because I used to have a stupid noob brain, and when I apply that stupid noob brain to other players... I kind of understand their perspective. You can't completely control the stupid noob brain, they are just chilling and see Frontlines as a strange but maybe less boring way to get EXP.

The 'chaos' they experience is because they are used to solo/PVE content, the buttons are strange and somehow they get one shot by a sea of Red, Blue or Yellow. This is totally normal at first.

What people need to understand is that many players just go down the list of dailies and Frontlines is one of them, yes they have stupid noob brain in the match [many Frontliners started off like that] but I promise you they are just confused :<