Behavior of English VAs and localization staff on social media

Look, I normally don't give a **** about others' politics, beliefs, or anything else.

But at this point, the conduct of English VAs and localization staff is egregious.

https://imgur.com/a/d7WoRQc

https://i.imgur.com/vOBzovf.jpeg

If I conducted myself remotely similarly to this on social media, insinuating customers are racist or that they- or even I- for that matter have an obligation to push for specific, unrelated ideas, I would be fired.

This is not acceptable conduct from persons associated with or employed by Square Enix.

Just don't follow her, then? I swear some of you people are obsessively monitoring everything this woman does to find any excuse to hate on her.

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Originally Posted by PercibelTheren

Just don't follow her, then? I swear some of you people are obsessively monitoring everything this woman does to find any excuse to hate on her.

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I hardly think being called racist, by contributors to a paid product, is an excuse to be frustrated. This is the feedback forum for localization, and I am providing feedback. I fail to see the issue.

Has this been an issue before with the english cast or only after they hired americans?

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Originally Posted by Barachim

Has this been an issue before with the english cast or only after they hired americans?

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To my knowledge, this is new. I know some Americans were involved in ARR, but they were seasoned. I've never heard of anything like this with the English VAs.

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Originally Posted by BigBoom550

I hardly think being called racist, by contributors to a paid product, is an excuse to be frustrated. This is the feedback forum for localization, and I am providing feedback. I fail to see the issue.

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you will never get an answer for this. People like him will drop the dont follow her / stop playing the game / stop insert whatever the problem is here and then will never talk to you again. comming to the topic, you dont need an "excuse" if you are frustrated you can raise your voice. Thats called freedom of speech event if some posters dont want that in their little world. statements like this or the one where she defended to punch women and ill stop here before i get banned, should be handeled more professional / neutral in my opinion. If you decide to get into this topic personally it is fine but then expect backfire. If i would post my feelings and mindset with my company account i wouldnt get any money and problably no job in this branche... Anyway calling customers things is wrong in anyway and i know that a small indie company like SE will never even adress this... its a shame but i dont think this will ever change. Just wait untill the character is irrelevant in the pre patches and noone even will talk about this VA.

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Originally Posted by Dante131

you will never get an answer for this. People like him will drop the dont follow her / stop playing the game / stop insert whatever the problem is here and then will never talk to you again. comming to the topic, you dont need an "excuse" if you are frustrated you can raise your voice. Thats called freedom of speech event if some posters dont want that in their little world. statements like this or the one where she defended to punch women and ill stop here before i get banned, should be handeled more professional / neutral in my opinion. If you decide to get into this topic personally it is fine but then expect backfire. If i would post my feelings and mindset with my company account i wouldnt get any money and problably no job in this branche... Anyway calling customers things is wrong in anyway and i know that a small indie company like SE will never even adress this... its a shame but i dont think this will ever change. Just wait untill the character is irrelevant in the pre patches and noone even will talk about this VA.

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I know. Give me the most absurd position and I'll find someone to defend it. I've dealt with flat earthers, creationists, religious fundies and every other flavor of nutter butter bar you can find.

I've found people's positions bother me far less than their conduct. I just wage my little war one polite rebuttal at a time.

As said in another thread, I'm not going to comment on this beyond saying that I really don't feel 'Smile' is "Black Gospel Music" and feel that it's the sort of comment someone who only has a rather vague awareness of that music genre would say.

The idea that there's probably a relationship between anti-black gamers vocally hating on Smile and the fact that Smile draws inspiration from black gospel music is a basic, room temperature, obvious take. Anti-black folks don't like black-inspired things? Who knew!?

And I say that as someone who loves gospel music but dislikes Smile. I don't feel offended by this statement because she's calling a spade a spade, and I'm not a spade.

There may be times when it makes sense to bring out one's inner-Karen and ask the manager to stop something; this is far from one of them.

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

she's calling a spade a spade

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The reason there is an assumption of otherwise, is that people dont walk up to others to announce a spade is a spade.
If you pick up a cup to drink some water, and someone is just saying "Hey, theres only water in that cup." It may be true, but it comes off suspicious. Given the recent issues both in DT and political climate, ppl are used to accusatory rhetoric sounding just like her post. Its may not be intending offense, but it's not completely unreasonable for ppl to doubt the intent.

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Originally Posted by PercibelTheren

Just don't follow her, then? I swear some of you people are obsessively monitoring everything this woman does to find any excuse to hate on her.

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Kinda hard to not notice this when everyone and their brother is making a stink about it on not only Twitter but reddit. I don't even follow her and I got blasted by people talking about it.

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Originally Posted by Barachim

Has this been an issue before with the english cast or only after they hired americans?

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I don't think so. I know G'raha, Thancred, and Alphy's VAs are pretty chill with fans and Bakool's VA thinks it's hilarious how much people like his character.


I find it kind of annoying that this turned into people now trying to defend the song and anyone who goes "hey I don't like the song for *insert valid reason here*/I'm Black and didn't like the song" gets harassed about it. Saw someone trying to say "no one has a valid reason for disliking it". Uh.... I don't like how the vocalist sounds at points when I know she's very good otherwise? How about that?

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Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

The reason there is an assumption of otherwise, is that people dont walk up to others to announce a spade is a spade.

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One thing to be cautious of is accidentally making false equivalencies by comparing unlike situations; in-human social norms are meaningfully different from social media social norms. On social media, it's the most common thing in the world to post whatever thoughts you have about literally anything. So with respect, that's not a reasonable critique of her Tweet.

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Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

Given the recent issues both in DT and political climate, ppl are used to accusatory rhetoric sounding just like her post. Its may not be intending offense, but it's not completely unreasonable for ppl to doubt the intent.

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It's great to doubt things. If you doubt something, that's a good reason to be cautious, or perhaps to try to get more information to either verify or disprove your doubts. I encourage everyone to feel doubts, as there are plenty of things in life that warrant such caution.

But this thread goes far beyond doubting. This is a public post requesting that a company exert control over their employee's actions. If you are suggesting that merely feeling some doubt provides ample justification for going after someone's livelihood, then I strongly disagree.

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

One thing to be cautious of is accidentally making false equivalencies by comparing unlike situations; in-human social norms are meaningfully different from social media social norms. On social media, it's the most common thing in the world to post whatever thoughts you have about literally anything. So with respect, that's not a reasonable critique of her Tweet.


It's great to doubt things. If you doubt something, that's a good reason to be cautious, or perhaps to try to get more information to either verify or disprove your doubts. I encourage everyone to feel doubts, as there are plenty of things in life that warrant such caution.

But this thread goes far beyond doubting. This is a public post requesting that a company exert control over their employee's actions. If you are suggesting that merely feeling some doubt provides ample justification for going after someone's livelihood, then I strongly disagree.

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You mean like Ms. Bryer has in the past?

Setting aside that Poison was trans (1989, when it was an actual statement) before Bridget was a twinkle in someone's eye (bridget being 1999, I believe), she demanded Bridget's VA step down because the VA was cis. I don't think that's remotely appropriate conduct and given that, alongside previous examples, I'm not inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt.

I likewise feel no guilt about it, as if it was appropriate for her to do, then it remains appropriate to hold her to account for her behavior.

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Originally Posted by BigBoom550

Setting aside that Poison was trans (1989, when it was an actual statement) before Bridget was a twinkle in someone's eye (bridget being 1999, I believe), she demanded Bridget's VA step down because the VA was cis. I don't think that's remotely appropriate conduct and given that, alongside previous examples, I'm not inclined to give her the benefit of the doubt.

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We were never talking about a statement that needed the benefit of the doubt, as what she literally said was banal. There were only ever two possibilities: that you misunderstood what she said, or that you were willfully misrepresenting what she said.

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Originally Posted by BigBoom550

I likewise feel no guilt about it, as if it was appropriate for her to do, then it remains appropriate to hold her to account for her behavior.

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With respect, I recommend holding yourself to higher standards. I'm all for pushing back against folks who do ill, but if your means are dishonest then you'll alienate people who could have otherwise been your allies. When you willfully misrepresent what someone said, it's just going to give people who don't already agree with you a legitimate reason to stop listening to you and see you as a villain. So if you actually care about your cause, and if you actually have something worthwhile to say, then you're sabotaging yourself by making a sensationalized thread like this. Stick to the facts and you'll get farther.

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

We were never talking about a statement that needed the benefit of the doubt, as what she literally said was banal. There were only ever two possibilities: that you misunderstood what she said, or that you were willfully misrepresenting what she said.


With respect, I recommend holding yourself to higher standards. I'm all for pushing back against folks who do ill, but if your means are dishonest then you'll alienate people who could have otherwise been your allies. When you willfully misrepresent what someone said, it's just going to give people who don't already agree with you a legitimate reason to stop listening to you and see you as a villain. So if you actually care about your cause, and if you actually have something worthwhile to say, then you're sabotaging yourself by making a sensationalized thread like this. Stick to the facts and you'll get farther.

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Very well.

Sena Bryer, judging by her tweets, believes that she (as a transwoman) should have access to cisgender female roles. Now, to be clear on my stance, I do not care what's inside a person's pants when it comes to voicework. They can have an exceedingly large bowl of granola for all I care.

However, she also has explicitly stated that casting directors should keep in mind one's gender identity, culminating in the seeming position that she should have access to both cisgender and transgender roles, but cisgender women cannot take trans roles and must forfeit them if they have them.

This is already internally inconsistent. Either gender identity matters, or it does not. It's not a convinience, it's a state of being. Leeloo Dallas Multi-Trans is not on the table here.

If we follow the line of reasoning that one's genitals are irrelevant, then demanding Bridget's VA step down was wrong, and she needs to refrain from any implications of that in the future. An apology and deletion of the tweet- which is still up as of a few hours ago- would be part of this.

If we follow the line of reasoning that one's genitals and gender identity *are* relevant, then she should step down from the role of Wuk Lamat of her own accord, as Wuk Lamat is a cisgender female.

So please, defend her reasoning to me because I frankly just see someone entitled who now faces rightful criticism, and is cowering behind the shield of 'transphobia' when rightfully criticized. Her commentary's coming to light, and people are not happy about it.

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Originally Posted by BigBoom550

Very well.

Sena Bryer, judging by her tweets, believes that she (as a transwoman) should have access to cisgender female roles. Now, to be clear on my stance, I do not care what's inside a person's pants when it comes to voicework. They can have an exceedingly large bowl of granola for all I care.

However, she also has explicitly stated that casting directors should keep in mind one's gender identity, culminating in the seeming position that she should have access to both cisgender and transgender roles, but cisgender women cannot take trans roles and must forfeit them if they have them.

This is already internally inconsistent. Either gender identity matters, or it does not. It's not a convinience, it's a state of being. Leeloo Dallas Multi-Trans is not on the table here.

If we follow the line of reasoning that one's genitals are irrelevant, then demanding Bridget's VA step down was wrong, and she needs to refrain from any implications of that in the future. An apology and deletion of the tweet- which is still up as of a few hours ago- would be part of this.

If we follow the line of reasoning that one's genitals and gender identity *are* relevant, then she should step down from the role of Wuk Lamat of her own accord, as Wuk Lamat is a cisgender female.

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This is a great post, thanks for writing it. You've done a great job of highlighting something you see as hypocritical and explaining your thought process, in a way that reads as reasonable and relatable.

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Originally Posted by BigBoom550

So please, defend her reasoning to me because I frankly just see someone entitled who now faces rightful criticism, and is cowering behind the shield of 'transphobia' when rightfully criticized. Her commentary's coming to light, and people are not happy about it.

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I honestly don't know what her reasoning is; at the very least, based on what you said, her reasoning doesn't seem obvious to me. I could make some guesses, but I feel like I'd invariably miss the mark in some way and I wouldn't want to accidentally put words in someone's mouth.

That said, the Internet being what it is, I'd be surprised if someone hasn't already asked (or demanded) that Sena explain her reasoning. Are you aware whether she's provided any manner of explanation, rationale, etc for either or both of these stances? I don't think it's impossible for both of these ideas to simultaneously exist, but I do agree that it isn't entirely obvious at a surface level. That being the case, some manner of further explanation seems like a reasonable ask from her to get everyone on the same page.

Regardless, thanks for taking the high road with me. ^^

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

This is a great post, thanks for writing it. You've done a great job of highlighting something you see as hypocritical and explaining your thought process, in a way that reads as reasonable and relatable.


I honestly don't know what her reasoning is; at the very least, based on what you said, her reasoning doesn't seem obvious to me. I could make some guesses, but I feel like I'd invariably miss the mark in some way and I wouldn't want to accidentally put words in someone's mouth.

That said, the Internet being what it is, I'd be surprised if someone hasn't already asked (or demanded) that Sena explain her reasoning. Are you aware whether she's provided any manner of explanation, rationale, etc for either or both of these stances? I don't think it's impossible for both of these ideas to simultaneously exist, but I do agree that it isn't entirely obvious at a surface level. That being the case, some manner of further explanation seems like a reasonable ask from her to get everyone on the same page.

Regardless, thanks for taking the high road with me. ^^

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You're very welcome.

As far as her justifying/further explaining that stance, I haven't seen anything. My loose guess would be she livestreams, but you'll forgive me for not going through VOD after VOD attempting to find something that may-or-may-not exist. I certainly didn't see anything on her twitter feed, but... well, it's twitter, and twitter is not something I'd ever call 'well-thought out' in content or purpose.

I apologize if I came across as aggressive before. I've had issues in the past with people misconstruing and misdirecting, and that may have resulted in a lack of clarity. Thank you for your patience.

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Originally Posted by BigBoom550

You're very welcome.

As far as her justifying/further explaining that stance, I haven't seen anything. My loose guess would be she livestreams, but you'll forgive me for not going through VOD after VOD attempting to find something that may-or-may-not exist. I certainly didn't see anything on her twitter feed, but... well, it's twitter, and twitter is not something I'd ever call 'well-thought out' in content or purpose.

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That's a good point; Twitter is usually a place where you can find a quick sound-byte, but rarely a nuanced explanation of anything.

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Originally Posted by BigBoom550

I apologize if I came across as aggressive before. I've had issues in the past with people misconstruing and misdirecting, and that may have resulted in a lack of clarity. Thank you for your patience.

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I appreciate it. And honestly, it's cool. We've all got traumas of varying shapes and sizes that we can only do our best to navigate through; I know I've got mine! And even if we didn't, nobody's perfect, everyone makes mistakes, and we all deserve the chance to make amends and move on to do better in the future. So it's all good.

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

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This will be abit long, maybe I'll get banned for these thoughts tho I don't believe there's anything wrong with it. Sorry about that

It'll boil down to entitlement/discrimination, she sees the world as an unfair thing that stiffles her and her talent. I'd understand the frustration IF not getting gigs is caused by discrimination, but it could also be that she's not what they're looking for.

In that case her hatred is better directed at the people who are discriminating against her rather than the ones 'taking her jobs away' aka ciswomen. I can't imagine how well this will pass if this happened to someone who wasn't trans, I find it hard to imagine people defending someone so entitled and inflammatory.

She's a prime example of rules for thee but not for me. I want your job, but you can't take mine. I'm allowed to criticize but if you criticize me, then you're transphobic. She's either really unaware of her own behavior...or actually trolling.

So, back to entitlement, she thinks she has the skill and talent and that the ciswomen are the source of her woes. It strikes me as someone who is unable to self reflect but instead it's easy to blame something else. As an artist, I've seen many amateur artists fall into this 'can't handle criticism, must be something else' or end up with inflated ego 'I'm too good! look at this drawing I made', there's a difference between this and being proud of something you made imo.

I don't envy her for getting this level of backlash because I think others are responsible for this too, I don't think she should be the sacrificial lamb so to speak. Yet, she continues to post some strange takes to stir drama, it's hard for me to give her the benefit of the doubt since to me her intentions are clear.

I think plenty of people are frustrated about this prospect that you can't criticize her without it being turned into something about her gender identity when many of us don't care about her identity yet she wants to make it so. You don't like my performance because you're transphobic. Sadly, any criticism towards her is bound to get tainted by people who are transphobic which gives her and the valiant knights that she sends towards others something to latch to- disregard feedback and criticism and point the finger at everyone and call them transphobic.

I'm disappointed with the team, moderation and some players too. She's protected alright, but criticism isn't protected at all. It's easy to lock threads up than having to actually moderate because it's such a hairy subject and can quickly turn problematic because both sides are emotional, one with emotional sympathy and the other is frustrated that no one hears them and that they're speaking to a metaphorical brick wall.

I've seen my favorite game's community (DMC) get split up over the reboot where the people at Ninja Theory were blatantly shitting on the fans, funny how the reboot was an attempt to 'appeal' to western audience by a Japanese company. I don't want the same to happen to this community. I don't want to see people split up into camps by someone intent on causing drama. Yet I think DT might just be that expansion to finally divide us, perhaps we can say SB is shit but I think DT seems way more divisive from what I've seen.

The fact that she's going out of her way to provide us with more of her insightful hot and spicy takes with the intent to set people one against the other is something that leaves a sour taste in my mouth, even more so that she got such a prominent role but is acting so unprofessionally.

She destroys her own credibility with strange takes that even her supporters are fleeing because of how absurd that latest tweet was.

Perhaps you're apathetic towards it and don't mind it/don't feel targeted, to me I think her mentality is pretty bad and that behavior shouldn't be encouraged and called out for how absurd it is. Implying that someone is racist because they hate a song is inspired by gospel is such a wild reach and you'd be grasping at straws to believe it.

I went ahead and listened to some gospel music and I actually don't like it at all, I don't want anyone trying to twist my dislike for music as something racially motivated. It's art, you're allowed to love/hate it. Sure, maybe there's some people who hate it because they hate black people but this isn't the case with Sena. Someone in another thread said the song is inspired by gospel in a very superficial level. Personally speaking, I don't think Sena cares at all about that and I can see that this is an attempt to give herself the moral highground by trying to generally smear the image of the community into something racist/transphobic/bigoted just because some unhinged individuals (allegedly) sent her death threats.

I think it's dishonest to think that people won't see this and run away with it. You already see it if you critique Sena's performance.

She's not the first to weaponize her protected status, and she won't be the last. I don't think it's okay though, she's not above anyone else nor is she better than anyone else. I respect her right as a human being but honestly she's proving to be an awful one from what I'm seeing.

I sure hope that if I voice my opinion about her performance I won't get people twisting it into transphobia. Or if I hate smile, then I'm somehow racist. But if you're still unsure...it's already happening and has happened. Please look forward to being called a racist for hating smile too. People will see it as a greenlight to take it and run away with it.

These are my own thoughts about it anyway. I think Sena is extremely unprofessional and wishes to stir drama within the community to try and distract from the fact that many people don't like her performance. 'If you're focusing on the more pressing very very rotten parts aka racists and the transphobes, you're not focusing on ME'

Sorry if this is long, I couldn't help but be puzzled by your apathy when her behavior has some reprecussions especially when it involves a community as large as ours. If she was some random person on twitter posting on her wall, then I'd understand, but she's the VA of the most recurring character in the current top MMO. I expect a level of professionalism and restraint on her part.

I always thought it'd be best if she disabled her twitter for awhile to let this die off because it eventually will, but I guess all publicity is good publicity.

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Originally Posted by Magikazam

...like the only reason I know she trans in the first place is because people where quick to label me as a transphobe the moment I voiced my dislike of her performance.

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This is one example, I'm sure you'll find many if you look hard enough. Maybe I'll get banned for this but here it is, it'd be funny if I do. The fact that one fears being banned for voicing their opinion is yikes.

thanks for taking all my thoughts together. cant add anything more. Couldnt quote you because SE limits the letters even if you quote ....

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

The idea that there's probably a relationship between anti-black gamers vocally hating on Smile and the fact that Smile draws inspiration from black gospel music is a basic, room temperature, obvious take. Anti-black folks don't like black-inspired things? Who knew!?

And I say that as someone who loves gospel music but dislikes Smile. I don't feel offended by this statement because she's calling a spade a spade, and I'm not a spade.

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Have you even considered the irony of what you just said?

Like you can dislike or even hate the song, or the genre it (supposedly, I never heard it) belongs to and not be racist. You yourself declared yourself as not being a 'spade', yet you're echoing their sentiment.

I think people who are mad about being falsely accused of being racist over a music preference from someone who was involved in the production of the game are justified in their distaste. I think it's very prejudicial and unprofessional for Ms. Sena Breyer to assert that racists speak on behalf of those with a mere music preference.

Obviously it doesn't justify harassment or transphobic abuse, but valid criticism of "don't lump us with those guys" is enough.

This is not English VAs and localization team, this is just Sena and I don't believe whatever she says on her personal social media involves Square Enix in any way, just block her if you feel her takes are bad (they are)

Now people are just grasping at straws to try to get a trans voice acter fired this is just ridiculous... please go touch grass.

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Originally Posted by LilimoLimomo

The idea that there's probably a relationship between anti-black gamers vocally hating on Smile and the fact that Smile draws inspiration from black gospel music is a basic, room temperature, obvious take. Anti-black folks don't like black-inspired things? Who knew!?

And I say that as someone who loves gospel music but dislikes Smile. I don't feel offended by this statement because she's calling a spade a spade, and I'm not a spade.

There may be times when it makes sense to bring out one's inner-Karen and ask the manager to stop something; this is far from one of them.

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FFXIV never had any US-American politics derived problems. You see all of the races in the game in all sorts of skin colour, and nobody ever cared. But now, with Dawntrail, the extremists from both camps come jumping out of their bushes and throwing their mud after us.

That being said, I don't like Smile. I'm more of a metalhead, but 99% of the other songs are fine with me. I'm just not a fan of Disney-musical style songs, especially not when they're used clumsily like while depicting us building a bomb train.

Smile is too Disney like. And it didn't fit AT ALL at the moments it was placed (With the exception of the coronation there it fit about 50%).

I will always associate that song with building a bomb and commiting genocide. Thanks Squarenix.

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Originally Posted by EponaTBHSMH

This is not English VAs and localization team, this is just Sena and I don't believe whatever she says on her personal social media involves Square Enix in any way, just block her if you feel her takes are bad (they are)

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Shes is working for the company... do you have a job ? do you know that you can damage your company with your actions? Shes talking about the game i pay shes picture her account with Wuk as profile picture what do you want more i am not even on twitter and get her takes. Surprise im not happy. Where was your just ignore her mentality with the singer of answers ?

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Originally Posted by Dante131

Shes is working for the company... do you have a job ? do you know that you can damage your company with your actions? Shes talking about the game i pay shes picture her account with Wuk as profile picture what do you want more i am not even on twitter and get her takes. Surprise im not happy. Where was your just ignore her mentality with the singer of answers ?

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And they fired Susan over way less lol

is no one going to point out how absolutely egregious it is to conflate Smile with black gospel music LMAO
this mfer is so ignorant

A trans voice actor wanting trans voice actors to be prioritized for the casting of trans characters in media, while also still being interested in voicing non-trans characters is not an unreasonable or unjustified sentiment to hold. It's like how many black voice actors feel that black voice actors should be prioritized for the casting of black characters, but are also interested in voicing non-black characters. It's a matter of marginalized voice actors being underrepresented in the industry, not because its somehow inherently unethical for the identities of characters and their voice actors to not be the same.