Dawntrail is too easy, difficulty needs increasing.

While some may think this is satire, its not. I genuinely want more difficulty in FFXIV because I miss the days of Coils.

Dawntrails difficulty ramp up was nice for a little while but now that we got more challenging mechanics with each new fight and they seem to consistently get harder, I think the curve needs to increase further from here.

I loved the dungeon ramp up so far and the new raid mechanics even on caster but I feel there needs to be more mechanics to really drive it home that things are going to start challenging people more than just their first time doing content.

There needs to be progression even in the duty finder and it is fun to see others beginning to struggle on mechanics because it makes me feel as though we all have something to strive for overcoming.

Man I love challenging content as much as the next person, but you're out of your mind if you think this level of difficulty isn't adequate for msq/story content.
I've always been a critic of braindead, afk content, but currently, I think we're very near a difficulty sweet spot for expert dungeons/extreme trials/normal mode raids.
If they're harder, you're just gonna start walling people left and right.
People that want to be challenged have Savage and Ultimate to look forward to.
Only change I'd defend is an enrage on expert dungeon bosses/msq trials- but a very permissive one (like, you could pass if the whole team had weakness for 75% of the whole fight), so the "dps" part of the trinity was at least somewhat challenged in their area of expertise.

(Not that SE would do that to story content after the great Coil disaster of 2013)

Game need to be harder in Job level and mechanic randomness

I respect there is people who is having a hard time.. but we are humans we learn we adapt we grow

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Originally Posted by DaKitten

While some may think this is satire, its not. I genuinely want more difficulty in FFXIV because I miss the days of Coils.

Dawntrails difficulty ramp up was nice for a little while but now that we got more challenging mechanics with each new fight and they seem to consistently get harder, I think the curve needs to increase further from here.

I loved the dungeon ramp up so far and the new raid mechanics even on caster but I feel there needs to be more mechanics to really drive it home that things are going to start challenging people more than just their first time doing content.

There needs to be progression even in the duty finder and it is fun to see others beginning to struggle on mechanics because it makes me feel as though we all have something to strive for overcoming.

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...why did you format your message like that?

The middle-ground with the current situation is that they broke down the single-tiered difficulty from Coils into Normal > Savage > Ultimate. That way those that wanted that experience could go for that content, without compromising on the experience for those doing it for story/lore reasons.

The next question that I have for you, is do you really see it practical for yourself and for everyone else to expect that when they run for Expert Dungeon Roulette, or Trial Roulette, and to a degree Levelling roulette, that it should run the risk of you potentially spending an entire lockout there. Players have to be prepared of the consequences of what they are actually asking for when they say "Ramp it up more".

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Originally Posted by Galvuu

Man I love challenging content as much as the next person, but you're out of your mind if you think this level of difficulty isn't adequate for msq/story content.
I've always been a critic of braindead, afk content, but currently, I think we're very near a difficulty sweet spot for expert dungeons/extreme trials/normal mode raids.
If they're harder, you're just gonna start walling people left and right.
People that want to be challenged have Savage and Ultimate to look forward to.
Only change I'd defend is an enrage on expert dungeon bosses/msq trials- but a very permissive one (like, you could pass if the whole team had weakness for 75% of the whole fight), so the "dps" part of the trinity was at least somewhat challenged in their area of expertise.

(Not that SE would do that to story content after the great Coil disaster of 2013)

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People are so disillusioned by this game's total lack of difficulty in casual content that they're allergic to any wipe that might happen. And they don't realize that what we currently have is still too easy. Plus early expansion and lack of gear.

More difficulty would be welcome, have people actually rack their brain to solve puzzles or execute correctly.

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Originally Posted by Galvuu

Man I love challenging content as much as the next person, but you're out of your mind if you think this level of difficulty isn't adequate for msq/story content.
I've always been a critic of braindead, afk content, but currently, I think we're very near a difficulty sweet spot for expert dungeons/extreme trials/normal mode raids.
If they're harder, you're just gonna start walling people left and right.
People that want to be challenged have Savage and Ultimate to look forward to.
Only change I'd defend is an enrage on expert dungeon bosses/msq trials- but a very permissive one (like, you could pass if the whole team had weakness for 75% of the whole fight), so the "dps" part of the trinity was at least somewhat challenged in their area of expertise.

(Not that SE would do that to story content after the great Coil disaster of 2013)

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Wasn't Shinryu nerfed to the ground because people couldn't progress the MSQ? Sadly I wasn't there to witness it.

I recall my time as a new player in ShB queueing for Titania and having it pop after 45mins...we wiped once and the amazing mentors all left. I firmly believe as 'difficulty' increases people will start abandoning duties. In my eyes this breeds a level of toxicity even if it's not direct. I had to wait quite awhile for my party to fill since everyone left....and I really wanted to progress the story.

Nope.

Normal content should be easy to do so even my irl pet can do them without die once. That's how FFXIV always been, if you want harder content that's why Ultimate exists.

I agree. Gear is going to make these encounters too easy if it hasn't already in some cases.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

I agree. Gear is going to make these encounters too easy if it hasn't already in some cases.

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This is about the only thing I would change; more strict item level on this content so that it does maintain some integrity. I don't necessarily think outgearing encounters should be resolved by just... Making them harder, but rather looking at a way to maintain their current/on-patch difficulty.

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Originally Posted by Rueby

Wasn't Shinryu nerfed to the ground because people couldn't progress the MSQ? Sadly I wasn't there to witness it.

I recall my time as a new player in ShB queueing for Titania and having it pop after 45mins...we wiped once and the amazing mentors all left. I firmly believe as 'difficulty' increases people will start abandoning duties. In my eyes this breeds a level of toxicity even if it's not direct. I had to wait quite awhile for my party to fill since everyone left....and I really wanted to progress the story.

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No, Shinryu was never changed. The biggest difficulty with Shinryu was lack of access to the gear that was locked behind it. Once people started getting that, there were less wipes and less vote abandons. And next expansion they started giving us gear in the MSQ before the final trial.

To the OP, no thanks. MSQ is a decent difficulty. It's spicy but doable. Expert is a step up from that and Extremes a step from that. We don't now how Savage is yet but we can see where that is when it comes out.

Like Kaurz says, outside of Savage or maybe Extreme, nobody wants to spend an entire lockout wiping to something. And even hardcore players need some content we can let our hair down in and chill from the high-performance mode we need in the endgame content. Especially since it's going to be challenging enough for differing levels of playstyle.

I don't feel like the difficulty in dawntrail has increased at all. I have not been challenged by any of the content so far, and I really don't see where the complaints are coming from. The mechanics are literally the same, with a different coat of paint. I would also like the content to increase in difficulty because I can barely keep myself awake through most of the dungeons, raids and trials in the game and doing roulettes is a chore where I struggle to stay awake, rather than struggle to overcome the mechanics. The reality is that the content has been so brain dead easy for so long that people have become familiar with that and they are just afraid of using their brains a little bit. Wipes in normal content should be regular experiences not exceptions.

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Originally Posted by GhrimVenom

I don't feel like the difficulty in dawntrail has increased at all. I have not been challenged by any of the content so far, and I really don't see where the complaints are coming from. The mechanics are literally the same, with a different coat of paint. I would also like the content to increase in difficulty because I can barely keep myself awake through most of the dungeons, raids and trials in the game and doing roulettes is a chore where I struggle to stay awake, rather than struggle to overcome the mechanics. The reality is that the content has been so brain dead easy for so long that people have become familiar with that and they are just afraid of using their brains a little bit. Wipes in normal content should be regular experiences not exceptions.

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It's the "keeping up with the Jones" problem most likely. There is a huge population of migrant players that play the MSQ and then dive out of the game after two or three weeks. Also, a lot of people picked up viper and pictomancers and viper is a job that when someone is learning it and playing it in dungeons they are likely to tunnel vision. Combine that with a lot of new visual effects like a big warning marker in the middle of the screen and new boss mechanics and fights seem a whole lot more interesting.

Now I'm running through dungeons and not really having much difficulty (although Mr Noggin boss in the walk is most definitely the hardest of the non-EX savage bosses). Basically, learning a fight is composed of seeing the mechanic, understanding the timing of the mechanic, and understanding the timing of the rotation of the job that the player is running. It doesn't matter if the fight is a savage fight or normal fight. A lot of the time even in normal mode, the only way someone can understand a mechanic is to see it through to execution which is why a lot of people are standing on the wrong side of a big laser line when it goes off. They see the orange warning marker on the ground and someone might know that there is time to cross, but the person observing doesn't know the timing yet, so they stay and let it complete execution.

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Originally Posted by Tunda

Game need to be harder in Job level and mechanic randomness

I respect there is people who is having a hard time.. but we are humans we learn we adapt we grow

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Tbh we need more fights like Barb EX and M2. While the mechanics aren't random, I appreciate that fight design wise they're testing your ability to dodge 800 AOEs while maintaining uptime. Which to me is way more fun than a lot of fights that are like "watch a youtube video on how to solve this puzzle and stand on this marker when you have x debuff". I'm always awake and alert in fights that make me watch telegraphs and dodge a lot, I brain off a lot in puzzle fights once I know the solution.

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Originally Posted by Maxilor

...why did you format your message like that?

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Because I thought it looked nice.

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

This is about the only thing I would change; more strict item level on this content so that it does maintain some integrity. I don't necessarily think outgearing encounters should be resolved by just... Making them harder, but rather looking at a way to maintain their current/on-patch difficulty.

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Item level definitely needs to be looked at. Currently, difficulty increases in normal content are doomed to be lost by item level scaling. Making normal content harder than DT's current standard doesn't accomplish any meaningful change in gameplay outside the first few weeks of content existing... and I for one would like to enjoy a piece of content for more than just the first few weeks of it existing.

I'm all for it. I think the last Expert at the very least should be somewhat harder than the first expert. It should have some kind of progressive curve!

Negative, Ghost Rider. Where it's at now is okay, leave the more difficult stuff for Ultimate and Savage. Hell I still have a hard time with the Cenote final because of the knock back followed by the punch. Wiped multiple times on that one to the point people voted to abandon