Can we please, have a modernization for the servers. (Specifically, tick/refreshrate)

Hello there,

You know it, we all know it. Server Tick rate in this game makes the game feel inferior, look inferior because people moonwalk across Frontline maps as whitemage with wings and blast you from 10 yards even though on your screen they are inside of you.


I want, this game to be the undisputed number 1 on the market. This is never going to happen if this game doesn't feel like a AAA MMORPG. Free 2 Play games have more responsive servers and feel to it. That shouldn't be acceptable in my opinion.

The amount of people that i tried to get into this game, just for them to try it and feel so turned off by this laggy feel of; Aoe Zones hitting you even though you were out before the circle was gone and the Animation even started.

Hitting a CD and it not going off, but GOING ON COOLDOWN (Looking at you Tank players) Pressing Mudras and it not registering fast enough so you press it again out of sheer reflex and busting your combo. Completing a cast or Heal only for it to vanish into the void because the target died.


This feels, awful, yes you can get used to it, i am too. But i shouldn't have to, and the only reason i was able to is because i love Final Fantasy enough. People that don't have this thematic nostalgia or don't know the Cameos, will find it far more difficult to justify having to get used to feeling bad.


This is not easy, i'm sure. But it should be done, eventually at least.

Please, if you ever noticed it and it bothered you on any level. Make this thread blow up so hopefully it gets attention someone from JP maybe posts this issue there, if the the devs don't check this Forum(This is likely my first time posting here in forever so i don't know).



Or if you disagree with something i said please go ahead, but i don't think so to be perfectly honest.

The graphical update sure will make the game a lot better, but I think they should have worked on a snapshot system revamp for 7.0 and leave the graphics update for 8.0 or do them both on the course of 7.0. The game feels awful to play at times, specially above 70ms, which is like 85% of the NA playerbase. To the point where plugins that mitigate this issues are mandatory if you want to play semi-comfortably. It's a 2010 game, not a 90s game. Please SE...

I wholeheartedly agree with this, and I've mentioned this many times before. Even streamers like Zepla agree that it's a major issue with the game.

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Originally Posted by dasimBaa

people moonwalk across Frontline maps as whitemage with wings and blast you from 10 yards even though on your screen they are inside of you.

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Seems like you are describing ping issues or lag.

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Aoe Zones hitting you even though you were out before the circle was gone

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That does not happen (unless maybe you have 2,000 ping). I play with 200 ping often and don't have any issues at all provided I exit the red circle before it disappears.

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and the Animation even started.

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It is true that the animation often begins after the red circle disappears or after the cast completes. It is true that many gamers are probably used to responding to animations rather than "cast bars" and may always die to everything as a result and feel the game is weird because of it.

But as long as you resolve a mechanic before the cast completes, that is how you solve most mechanics in this game, with a very small number of exceptions where there is an visual cast bar ahead of time before an uncasted one that actually snapshots it.

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Hitting a CD and it not going off, but GOING ON COOLDOWN (Looking at you Tank players)

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True, this can happen with invulns where you press them but die before they activate. But I do not blame a "tick rate" for this. I blame the animation delay, which I believe should be removed for abilities.

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Completing a cast or Heal only for it to vanish into the void because the target died.

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Now, this part is true. Sometimes you can successfully cast on a target and the server accepts the cast without error, but no effect occurs because the target died. This can happen with a hunt target where you get 1 hit in and it was accepted by the server in the battle log, but it didn't result in any rewards because it died around the same time.

In a similar way, you can often still run around for a while after a red circle hit you, but you know you are going to die in 2 seconds because you saw the red circle clip you. What seems to add to this is that I think movement is not something that is thoroughly verified as something you are able to do (probably to prevent rubberbanding), otherwise it would have to return you to the location you were at when the red circle hit you.

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if the the devs don't check this Forum

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It has been posted before. There were even determined efforts to report part of it as a bug.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

It has been posted before. There were even determined efforts to report part of it as a bug.

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The devs, who live in Japan, a small country with their 10 ms, of course not gonna have this problem
Now if we move to say, NA where is just massive the traveling distance is way major want it or not, so of course having over 50-100ms is going to be a thing for many

And if we go to the an extreme scenario, people who play from another country wich happen to be a lot

They really do need to fix it. It's the primary reason PvP feels so bad to play sometimes, too.

It's compounding the issue there because there are two players involved instead of just player and server.

Also for the guy denying it, there's a really good writeup that exists for what the overall issue is. SE just keeps ignoring it and saying it's fine when it's something pretty much everyone experiences outside of Japan. As is often the case with them and anything network related, sadly.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Seems like you are describing ping issues or lag.

That does not happen (unless maybe you have 2,000 ping). I play with 200 ping often and don't have any issues at all provided I exit the red circle before it disappears.

It is true that the animation often begins after the red circle disappears or after the cast completes. It is true that many gamers are probably used to responding to animations rather than "cast bars" and may always die to everything as a result and feel the game is weird because of it.

But as long as you resolve a mechanic before the cast completes, that is how you solve most mechanics in this game, with a very small number of exceptions where there is an visual cast bar ahead of time before an uncasted one that actually snapshots it.

True, this can happen with invulns where you press them but die before they activate. But I do not blame a "tick rate" for this. I blame the animation delay, which I believe should be removed for abilities.

Now, this part is true. Sometimes you can successfully cast on a target and the server accepts the cast without error, but no effect occurs because the target died. This can happen with a hunt target where you get 1 hit in and it was accepted by the server in the battle log, but it didn't result in any rewards because it died around the same time.

In a similar way, you can often still run around for a while after a red circle hit you, but you know you are going to die in 2 seconds because you saw the red circle clip you. What seems to add to this is that I think movement is not something that is thoroughly verified as something you are able to do (probably to prevent rubberbanding), otherwise it would have to return you to the location you were at when the red circle hit you.

It has been posted before. There were even determined efforts to report part of it as a bug.

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I am playing online games of all sorts of genres for over 15 years. I can differentiate "ping issues" or "lag" I have a 17-22 ping range across the day. I have 350 MBIT living alone so there is no chance someone can throttle my connection by downloading etc while im playing.

Don't try to gaslight me into thinking this is not real. Because you literally agree with examples that are directly caused by this. It has nothing to do with the animation delay.

I'm sure you know what slidecasting is. This works, SOLELY because of this delay or "desync" caused by refresh rate, essentially what happens is you press your Cast and youur client sends that info in the upcoming batch of inputs that were collected by the server, every 0,3s MEANING if you press the button it can take up to 0,3 seconds to actually show a Castbar. It's essentially lying to you, the phenomenon that we call "slidecasting" is just moving before the server realized you stop casting and therefore just lets it finish regardless.

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Originally Posted by Arzalis

They really do need to fix it. It's the primary reason PvP feels so bad to play sometimes, too.

It's compounding the issue there because there are two players involved instead of just player and server.

Also for the guy denying it, there's a really good writeup that exists for what the overall issue is. SE just keeps ignoring it and saying it's fine when it's something pretty much everyone experiences outside of Japan. As is often the case with them and anything network related, sadly.

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Unironically PVP would be perfect and the best thing of this game with the proper netcode, i swear is so much of a shame such great gamemode suffers from the base like this

Both Benediction and Hallowed Ground don't actually go off until the end of the animation. I know there used to be some DRG abilities that had the same problem.

My question is, how much of it is SE's fault because 'bad game', and how much of it is just the US having poor internet infrastructure, which SE can't do anything about?

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Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

My question is, how much of it is SE's fault because 'bad game', and how much of it is just the US having poor internet infrastructure, which SE can't do anything about?

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how much of it is just the US having poor internet infrastructure, which SE can't do anything about?

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https://media.tenor.com/Tg1yz5xJx-QA...ege-copium.gif

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Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

My question is, how much of it is SE's fault because 'bad game', and how much of it is just the US having poor internet infrastructure, which SE can't do anything about?

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Look at netcode of every other MMO available on the market right now and FF14's and then I think the answer for if it's SE/game's fault or [bad location, US infrastructure, server localization, Bob's dinner, weather at 6 o'clock, size of Japan] is pretty clear.


I hope it helps!

This is literally top 3 biggest wants other than a change in the 2min meta and glamour restrictions lifted (sans AF sets).

It could positively impact not just job gameplay, but combat design itself - as in maybe opening for new possibilities of mechanics. And not just that, but everywhere else in the game - one of the things that, even playing for so many years, I still can't get used is how the menus and pop-ups are slow, and probably a consequence from the server tick.

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Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

My question is, how much of it is SE's fault because 'bad game', and how much of it is just the US having poor internet infrastructure, which SE can't do anything about?

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Can't even queue Sprint properly 10 years after the release of the game, so surely it is poor US internet infrastructure.

the snap shotting system is the main reason PVP just doesn't work properly in this game.

I'd love this change or at least some improvements on it

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Originally Posted by dasimBaa

Don't try to gaslight me into thinking this is not real. Because you literally agree with examples that are directly caused by this.

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I agree that there is an issue with abilities having delays before executing their effects. I agree there is an ability to continue moving after dying successfully due to the cast snapshot system. I even agree that many people wouldn't be familiar with going by cast times instead of animations.

But a player being at a different location than you see them in PvP? That's a pretty standard issue people have in actual FPS PvP games where precision is a big deal and you have to predict where your opponent will be in the future.

I used to notice it more in The Feast than I do now and I also notice it in Chocobo Racing. If I jump to get an item in Chocobo Racing it doesn't get it successfully unless I jump far in advance. Since I have to guess this, sometimes I don't get items because of it. But it's because from the server's perspective, my chocobo is ahead of where I see it at.

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It has nothing to do with the animation delay.

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I feel like it does, especially since SE has adjusted this delay for certain abilities making them easier to double weave than others, or effects execute sooner after pressing an ability for some than for others.

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I'm sure you know what slidecasting is. This works, SOLELY because of this delay or "desync" caused by refresh rate

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I know what it is and I can do it, but what if, due to the time it takes to communicate with the server, you started moving to cancel the cast, but the server had already reached the cast time when it received the move command? For example, if your ping is 200ms, then if you start moving when there is 0.2 left, by the time it reaches the server, it will already have approved the cast.

I don't know what that would be like if you lived next to the server, so maybe there are other delays, but I don't see why ping would be excluded from being a factor.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

https://media.tenor.com/Tg1yz5xJx-QA...ege-copium.gif

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My sibling in Hydaelyn, no amount of SE tinkering is going to save someone from 150ms (or worse, Hydaelyn forbid) ping because their provider decided copper wires from 20 years ago qualified as 'good enough internet'. I can play on a US server (which are in California, by the way) from the EU, and get at worst 110ms ping, which is better than many people I've seen comment.

And I'm on a Wi-Fi connection using a $40 signal booster from Amazon.

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Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

My sibling in Hydaelyn, no amount of SE tinkering is going to save someone from 150ms (or worse, Hydaelyn forbid) ping because their provider decided copper wires from 20 years ago qualified as 'good enough internet'. I can play on a US server (which are in California, by the way) from the EU, and get at worst 110ms ping, which is better than many people I've seen comment.

And I'm on a Wi-Fi connection using a $40 signal booster from Amazon.

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Fiber Optic cable internet. The best available to the public anywhere...still issues. It can be boths sides fault but with Fiber Optic internet....it's definitely on SEs end.

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Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

My sibling in Hydaelyn, no amount of SE tinkering is going to save someone from 150ms (or worse, Hydaelyn forbid) ping because their provider decided copper wires from 20 years ago qualified as 'good enough internet'. I can play on a US server (which are in California, by the way) from the EU, and get at worst 110ms ping, which is better than many people I've seen comment.

And I'm on a Wi-Fi connection using a $40 signal booster from Amazon.

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You can keep coping all you want.

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Originally Posted by Renalt

Fiber Optic cable internet. The best available to the public anywhere...still issues. It can be boths sides fault but with Fiber Optic internet....it's definitely on SEs end.

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Thank you.

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Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

My question is, how much of it is SE's fault because 'bad game', and how much of it is just the US having poor internet infrastructure, which SE can't do anything about?

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Then I'm sure you have some manner of explanation for people in every other country (including Japan) with access to the game experiencing the same issues, yes? Perhaps you could enlighten us as to how the internet infrastructure in the United States is so poor as to affect players on the on the opposite side of the planet.

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Originally Posted by Rithy255

the snap shotting system is the main reason PVP just doesn't work properly in this game.

I'd love this change or at least some improvements on it

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Yea it's really bad. One time in crystal conflict I managed to pull someone despite their protect being up even on my screen. I am personally not taking pvp seriously regardless but with a structure like that I think no one can. The delay until the self cleanse actually works is also wild.

PvP doesn't exist. It should be called PvEn, because your real opponent is and has always been the game engine itself.

Yes, the slow server tick rate is really awful. I had very often situations, that i try to rescue the tank with an instant heal, the tank still dies and the instant heal is on cooldown. Or you interrupt a cast but the mob still casts.




Cheers

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Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

My sibling in Hydaelyn, no amount of SE tinkering is going to save someone from 150ms (or worse, Hydaelyn forbid) ping because their provider decided copper wires from 20 years ago qualified as 'good enough internet'. I can play on a US server (which are in California, by the way) from the EU, and get at worst 110ms ping, which is better than many people I've seen comment.

And I'm on a Wi-Fi connection using a $40 signal booster from Amazon.

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The reason why nobody takes statements like that serious is because we can directly compare this game to any other mmorpg on the market that don't have this issue.

It just feel cheap. For no reason.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

But a player being at a different location than you see them in PvP? That's a pretty standard issue people have in actual FPS PvP games where precision is a big deal and you have to predict where your opponent will be in the future.

I used to notice it more in The Feast than I do now and I also notice it in Chocobo Racing. If I jump to get an item in Chocobo Racing it doesn't get it successfully unless I jump far in advance. Since I have to guess this, sometimes I don't get items because of it. But it's because from the server's perspective, my chocobo is ahead of where I see it at.

I feel like it does, especially since SE has adjusted this delay for certain abilities making them easier to double weave than others, or effects execute sooner after pressing an ability for some than for others.

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I will grant you this, Animation delay can exacerbate this issue even more clearly, but the core of this issue is still the refresh rate.


Also this being issues with FPS games and rubberbanding this only happens on bad FPS games, which is exactly my point. There is no need to let it stay low quality "because similiar issues exist in some games" The game most affected by this usually is battlefield. But also, DICE is a shitshow of a dev team and under the influence of EA.

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Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

My question is, how much of it is SE's fault because 'bad game', and how much of it is just the US having poor internet infrastructure, which SE can't do anything about?

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WoW doesn't have the server problems XIV does and was made over half a decade earlier.

Even if this were the case, certain third party tools have mitigated ping issues significantly They accomplish this by dynamically shifting the artificial ping XIV forces on you to compensate for users with high ms. It's far from perfect but if they can figure it out, I'm reasonably certain a multi-billion dollar company can. It just costs them money.

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Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

WoW doesn't have the server problems XIV does and was made over half a decade earlier.

Even if this were the case, certain third party tools have mitigated ping issues significantly They accomplish this by dynamically shifting the artificial ping XIV forces on you to compensate for users with high ms. It's far from perfect but if they can figure it out, I'm reasonably certain a multi-billion dollar company can. It just costs them money.

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Are they bannable? Like actively bannable like cheats or bots or is it like parsing.

I haven't heard of those.

Even though I doubt SE even CAN fix the issue at this point, I'm of course 100% in support of it. I only hope SE realizes what a huge issue it is.

PvP in this game would feel a thousand times better if I didn't feel like I had to play 2 seconds into the future. I think you'd get a lot more people interested in the mode with an overhaul of the tick/refresh rate and maybe even snag players from other PvP-centric games.

Here's to hoping they address it at some point in the near future, but I am really not holding out hope for it. It would change too many things in the game as a result (i.e. slide casting, boss aoe snapshots, etc etc)

Honestly this game needs to be Client Side

You folks do realize if this issue is such a big problem you can stop playing the game, yes? You can play other games. You can go outside. Nothing has changed in this area since the launch of the game. Why do you think your next forum post will be the big game changer. It won't. Move on with your life.

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Originally Posted by ElysiumDragon

My question is, how much of it is SE's fault because 'bad game', and how much of it is just the US having poor internet infrastructure, which SE can't do anything about?

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Hi

I'm not from the US

Distance to the servers is a speed of light thing, no matter how good your connection is, even if it's all fiber, there is the distance factor.

I live in the middle of NA and my ping on Google Fiber is 49 ms to the NA DC. NY to LA is 63 ms latency and that is going to be as good as it gets due to speed of light. It isnt unreasonable to ask for the netcode to be optimized to be 100% playable at 100 ms latency.

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Originally Posted by Hyperia

Distance to the servers is a speed of light thing, no matter how good your connection is, even if it's all fiber, there is the distance factor.

I live in the middle of NA and my ping on Google Fiber is 49 ms to the NA DC. NY to LA is 63 ms latency and that is going to be as good as it gets due to speed of light. It isnt unreasonable to ask for the netcode to be optimized to be 100% playable at 100 ms latency.

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Personally would still want a dedicated east coast server with a net code fix. My ping is basically the same to the European server as it is to my so called home server of NA because it's either 3000 mi one way or 3000 mi the other (78 ms vs 83). This being Massachusetts on a Fiber connection, on some very rare days if the routing is screwy it's 90-110. Think in Maine you might as well be connecting to the European server (better ping?)...although I don't know anyone from Maine who plays this game so cannot confirm. If you're from Maine feel free to chime in here.

I kind of got screwed over on the server move from Canada way back when, it used to play a lot smoother at 40 ms but now it's...less smooth and even more noticeable given spell casting has been reduced.

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Originally Posted by Reap00

You folks do realize if this issue is such a big problem you can stop playing the game, yes? You can play other games. You can go outside. Nothing has changed in this area since the launch of the game. Why do you think your next forum post will be the big game changer. It won't. Move on with your life.

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Right let me apply your logic.

If this thread is so bad for your mental health, you don't have to read or reply to it. Infact you don't even have to be on this forum just because this thread is such an issue for you.

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Originally Posted by Katish

Personally would still want a dedicated east coast server with a net code fix. My ping is basically the same to the European server as it is to my so called home server of NA because it's either 3000 mi one way or 3000 mi the other (78 ms vs 83). This being Massachusetts on a Fiber connection, on some very rare days if the routing is screwy it's 90-110. Think in Maine you might as well be connecting to the European server (better ping?)...although I don't know anyone from Maine who plays this game so cannot confirm. If you're from Maine feel free to chime in here.

I kind of got screwed over on the server move from Canada way back when, it used to play a lot smoother at 40 ms but now it's...less smooth and even more noticeable given spell casting has been reduced.

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Honestly, a 80 ping would be workable, if the netcode wasn't a shitshow, like there is people that got used to 100+ pings in League and play high elo there. But if on top of the 80 ping gets compounded on another 0,3 refresh rate and animation delay it becomes fairly ridiculous.

"Meanwhile at Squeenix" : "hey guys, i just read that topic on the forum about the game not being snappy enough ... how about we announce that we will work on it for 8.0 while saying that the resources needed will ask us to increase "major" patch release schedule to 6 months between each one ? Of course it won't be back to normal schedule when everything will be done !"

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Originally Posted by dasimBaa

Are they bannable? Like actively bannable like cheats or bots or is it like parsing.

I haven't heard of those.

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It's essentially the same rules as everything else third party. Think fight club.

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Originally Posted by Reap00

You folks do realize if this issue is such a big problem you can stop playing the game, yes? You can play other games. You can go outside. Nothing has changed in this area since the launch of the game. Why do you think your next forum post will be the big game changer. It won't. Move on with your life.

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Ah, yes. Why discuss things on a Discussion Board and instead just quit the game if you don't love absolutely everything? Nevermind the very director himself tells us to post our feedback here. Don't let that get in the way of you're bootlicking though.

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Originally Posted by Reap00

You folks do realize if this issue is such a big problem you can stop playing the game, yes? You can play other games. You can go outside. Nothing has changed in this area since the launch of the game. Why do you think your next forum post will be the big game changer. It won't. Move on with your life.

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never fail to have the absolute greatest takes huh ?

"have a technical issue with the game ? just quit looool"

seriously, grow up, I get you're annoyed about all the negativity and stuff, I have myself grown annoyed of it especially in the past week or so, but going on with a snarky attitude in every thread telling people to quit (especially in the case of a TECHNICAL ISSUE), is absolutely ridiculous.

Do better.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

never fail to have the absolute greatest takes huh ?

"have a technical issue with the game ? just quit looool"

seriously, grow up, I get you're annoyed about all the negativity and stuff, I have myself grown annoyed of it especially in the past week or so, but going on with a snarky attitude in every thread telling people to quit (especially in the case of a TECHNICAL ISSUE), is absolutely ridiculous.

Do better.

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The crazy thing is, i literally say in my first couple of sentences i want this game to be the best on the market. I don't understand how this is seen as negative. People complaining about the story and the content drought etc, i get it tell them to take a break or something cause they might be burned out. But bruh me wanting this game to feel like what it should be.

They invested so much time in trying to come up with more ways to get people to play PVP, but without these changes i don't see people ever trying for real or actually enjoying it long term. It's just sooo clunky and honestly feels more like early 2000 gameplay.