The loot system needs a little bit of a revamp.

I rolled a 98 on a chestpiece from Abyssos (which was the highest, it ended up going to somebody who rolled a 34) But for some reason the game gave me the legs that came after the chestpiece in the loot order (From left to right) Is this just random? I don't understand.

People won't roll on certain things, which causes you to pass on all other items, which if for whatever reason you don't get the one item you need, it causes you to lose out on every other item you passed on because you can't go back and change your choice.

Even if it was gear by gear, somebody may not roll on it because they're waiting for something else, and it creates this infinite problem.

Just a little suggestion because the system is not the greatest at the moment.

Maybe make the gear have a loot order or something, like everyone has to roll on the first one, then second one, then third one, etc.

Everyone finished the roll/passed on the legs first, so it was given away first. It went to you, thus negating your ability to take any other loot that week.

Doing it piece by piece would take forever. Just roll need on the pieces you want, and pass on the ones you don't. If you absolutely MUST have that chest piece? ONLY roll on the chest piece and hope for the best. With 8 items dropping per run, waiting out a timer for each one would be maddening, and wouldn't change much, and may make things worse because then there would be no priority system for things early in the loot order.

Sounds like you need to prioritize what you roll on. The loot system is fine, and it is fair.

Remember to pass on all other items first.

Sounds like you trolled yourself tbh.

Just roll 1 item at a time, you have 5 minutes anyway

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Originally Posted by Hopebot

I rolled a 98 on a chestpiece from Abyssos (which was the highest, it ended up going to somebody who rolled a 34) But for some reason the game gave me the legs that came after the chestpiece in the loot order (From left to right) Is this just random? I don't understand.

People won't roll on certain things, which causes you to pass on all other items, which if for whatever reason you don't get the one item you need, it causes you to lose out on every other item you passed on because you can't go back and change your choice.

Even if it was gear by gear, somebody may not roll on it because they're waiting for something else, and it creates this infinite problem.

Just a little suggestion because the system is not the greatest at the moment.

Maybe make the gear have a loot order or something, like everyone has to roll on the first one, then second one, then third one, etc.

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That's exactly why manypeople don't roll untill all the stuff they don't want has been rolled for.. higher chance then of getting the piece they want. And doing exactly what happened to you. You rolled a 98 and someone beat you with a lower roll..

It can create a bit of an issue if you want the chest but won't roll u till someone's won the legs..

Someone wants the legs but won't roll until someone's won the chest.

And then someone else wants the boots but won't roll until someone's won everything else..

You get 5 minutes. And usually a quick line in party chat is enough to get the loot done quicker. "/p passed everything but x and y.." couple of people usually follow up with "same" or "passed everything except y and z. And then people roll faster on all the stuff you've passed

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Originally Posted by Tyndles

Everyone finished the roll/passed on the legs first, so it was given away first. It went to you, thus negating your ability to take any other loot that week.

Doing it piece by piece would take forever. Just roll need on the pieces you want, and pass on the ones you don't. If you absolutely MUST have that chest piece? ONLY roll on the chest piece and hope for the best. With 8 items dropping per run, waiting out a timer for each one would be maddening, and wouldn't change much, and may make things worse because then there would be no priority system for things early in the loot order.

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When there's 8 pieces of loot, need should take precedence over greed.

If I need 2 items, and greed the rest, the needs should be rolled on first, because I selected Need for those.

Currently, the game incentivizes people sitting on the timer trying to wait people out and it's just frustrating for everyone involved. Frustration is bad design.

They can change like I said above or simply shorten the timer.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

You get 5 minutes. And usually a quick line in party chat is enough to get the loot done quicker. "/p passed everything but x and y.." couple of people usually follow up with "same" or "passed everything except y and z. And then people roll faster on all the stuff you've passed

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This is basically the approach I've taken. "I'm just here for Item X, if ya'll could please roll on it I'd appreciate it."

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

When there's 8 pieces of loot, need should take precedence over greed.

If I need 2 items, and greed the rest, the needs should be rolled on first, because I selected Need for those.

Currently, the game incentivizes people sitting on the timer trying to wait people out and it's just frustrating for everyone involved. Frustration is bad design.

They can change like I said above or simply shorten the timer.



This is basically the approach I've taken. "I'm just here for Item X, if ya'll could please roll on it I'd appreciate it."

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There's no such thing as Need or Greed on non restricted items such as tokens. You Need or you Pass. You have fundamentally misunderstood the purpose of those two options.

Items are rolled for in the order their rolls complete. If item A gets all 8 rolls before item B, it doesn't matter which one you rolled Need or Greed on, item A takes precedence.

Best option it to Pass on everything you don't want first, allowing those rolls to complete first.

If you just want one thing, roll Need on it.

If you want multiple things, roll Need on one, the one you want the most, then wait. If/when you lose that roll, then you roll Need on the second item, and so on.

Obviously if this takes too long it can get a bit obnoxious, so then you use chat and say what you're rolling on, etc.

Pass on the items you don't want....that was in you for rolling on several items in a weekly lockout content. You should always focus on a specific piece each week.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

That's exactly why manypeople don't roll untill all the stuff they don't want has been rolled for.. higher chance then of getting the piece they want. And doing exactly what happened to you. You rolled a 98 and someone beat you with a lower roll..

It can create a bit of an issue if you want the chest but won't roll u till someone's won the legs..

Someone wants the legs but won't roll until someone's won the chest.

And then someone else wants the boots but won't roll until someone's won everything else..

You get 5 minutes. And usually a quick line in party chat is enough to get the loot done quicker. "/p passed everything but x and y.." couple of people usually follow up with "same" or "passed everything except y and z. And then people roll faster on all the stuff you've passed

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That's good advice.

I had no idea this games raid loot was so restrictive.

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Originally Posted by P0sitr0nic

I had no idea this games raid loot was so restrictive.

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Its a pretty standard loot lockout system...

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Originally Posted by Ransu

Its a pretty standard loot lockout system...

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Honestly, it's more permissive than some loot lockouts are. It gives you the pity books, and the gear comes as coffers you can open to get the item for the job you're on when you open it. Rather than "LOL only striking gear dropped for the second week in a row, bet you wish your static's melee wasn't DRG!" It honestly seems about as open-ended as you can get with a loot system without opening the door to Extreme Gear Cheesing (as I've detailed in other threads); I've certainly yet to see any alternative suggested (or implemented) anywhere that wasn't either worse in some aspect, or cheese-able.

Not that "well, it could always be worse (and in fact, was worse in the past)" does anything to lessen frustrations people currently have with the loot system.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Remember to pass on all other items first.

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This. Eliminate competition, then roll on the item you actually want.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

When there's 8 pieces of loot, need should take precedence over greed.

If I need 2 items, and greed the rest, the needs should be rolled on first, because I selected Need for those.

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That gets too complicated because the things you've greeded on might be things others selected need, or everyone went greed, or there's an unresolvable knot of priorities somewhere.

If you win a piece with greed, that means nobody selected need and you're the "highest bidder" so it's yours.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

There's no such thing as Need or Greed on non restricted items such as tokens. You Need or you Pass. You have fundamentally misunderstood the purpose of those two options.

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That's not true. You're still able to roll greed if you are eligible to roll need – doing so simply means your roll is placed at a lower priority than anyone who selects need. I use it frequently for items I'm not fussed about acquiring, but would rather have it than let it drop to the floor.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

Best option it to Pass on everything you don't want first, allowing those rolls to complete first.

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On the contrary, unless it's all or nothing for that specific piece, the best thing to do first would be rolling on the things you definitely want, and seeing whether (1) you get good rolls and (2) the item quickly gets awarded to someone.

If the item sits there unclaimed but you got a good roll, that's when you start passing on the items you definitely don't want, so those rolls can hopefully complete and the first few people get their token and leave.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

That gets too complicated because the things you've greeded on might be things others selected need, or everyone went greed, or there's an unresolvable knot of priorities somewhere.

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If that loot problem arose back when Alexander's first tier was current, would that make it...

*pause for dramatic effect, and to let the audience have a growing sense of horror*

...a Gordian knot? :D

(Because, y'know, the first tier of Alexander was Gordias and... yeah, I'll see myself out.)

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Originally Posted by Packetdancer

... yeah, I'll see myself out.)

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please do :rolleyes:

Be nice if they just made normal gear not loot locked after like 2 weeks, the gears worthless now anyway, its just glam to farm

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Originally Posted by Hopebot

I rolled a 98 on a chestpiece from Abyssos (which was the highest, it ended up going to somebody who rolled a 34) But for some reason the game gave me the legs that came after the chestpiece in the loot order (From left to right) Is this just random? I don't understand.

People won't roll on certain things, which causes you to pass on all other items, which if for whatever reason you don't get the one item you need, it causes you to lose out on every other item you passed on because you can't go back and change your choice.

Even if it was gear by gear, somebody may not roll on it because they're waiting for something else, and it creates this infinite problem.

Just a little suggestion because the system is not the greatest at the moment.

Maybe make the gear have a loot order or something, like everyone has to roll on the first one, then second one, then third one, etc.

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Honestly I play this game.

I pass on everything except what I want. Leaving what I want unrolled on. I'd everything else doesn't drop? I'll roll on it at <7 seconds, pointedly to make sure those trying to "lot on their priority first but will lot other stuff if they lose" miss out.

I'm a little confused how does a 34 roll beat a 98?

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Originally Posted by Krokov

I'm a little confused how does a 34 roll beat a 98?

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If no one rolls need on an item, and someone (we'll just go with 1 player for now) rolls greed, they will win the item because no one else rolled greed on the item. Loot is also passed out in the order it was rolled on. Basically, the OP rolled a 98 on one piece of loot, but because they rolled greed on another item (34), and no one else did, it was handed to them instead because it was likely rolled on by the rest of the party earlier than the item they rolled need on. Unfortunate, sure, but it was easily preventable by not rolling greed on loot they aren't actively trying for when there are weekly lockouts in place.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

If no one rolls need on an item, and someone (we'll just go with 1 player for now) rolls greed, they will win the item because no one else rolled greed on the item. Loot is also passed out in the order it was rolled on. Basically, the OP rolled a 98 on one piece of loot, but because they rolled greed on another item (34), and no one else did, it was handed to them instead because it was likely rolled on by the rest of the party earlier than the item they rolled need on. Unfortunate, sure, but it was easily preventable by not rolling greed on loot they aren't actively trying for when there are weekly lockouts in place.

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Indeed I understand it after reading it.

Savage loot system needs a revamp, it takes too much time to get bis

I agree after killing P5S 3 times and 1 P6S kill and not winning single item feels very disheartening.

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Originally Posted by CaedemSanguis

Savage loot system needs a revamp, it takes too much time to get bis

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You're not supposed to be able to be BiS quickly. That's the entire point of lockouts. The loot system is fine.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

You're not supposed to be able to be BiS quickly. That's the entire point of lockouts. The loot system is fine.

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The argument isn't that it takes time, it's that it takes too much time. No-one is expecting BiS week 1.

It's especially galling for those that can't, or don't want to exclusively play a single job endgame. For a game that encourages playing other classes, it makes it incredibly tedious to actually gear them properly.

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Originally Posted by Iyrnthota

The argument isn't that it takes time, it's that it takes too much time. No-one is expecting BiS week 1.

It's especially galling for those that can't, or don't want to exclusively play a single job endgame. For a game that encourages playing other classes, it makes it incredibly tedious to actually gear them properly.

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i say what i always say
"no it dosnt take to long, and just because you want to use a dozen classes in different roles in endgame at PEAK level ASAP dosnt make it an actual problem"




a small callculation on behest of GNB BIS(BIS is relativly similiar this tier from what i saw in terms of "what we need"
TOMES


a GNB BIS needs 2070 tomes, we could aquire 450 before SVG release, so lets go with 1620 tomes, thats a bit over 3 weeks per Class(or role if your lucky in BiS allotment)


the other items are SVG gear
3 SVG accessorys, the wors possible outcome is "random PF no luck on coffers" thats 12 books, aka 12 weeks of clears, this can be broken down to as little as 3 weeks with good luck


Second floor is similiar, but more expensive overall, worst case 16 tomes(8 gear 8 upgrade materials) 16 weeks if your unlucky, around 4 if you are lucky(averaging at around 8 clears in statics iirc)


third floor is first floor again, but only upgrade materials, so iirc 8 clears at most, 2 clears with amazing luck(6 would be my guess in a static setting)


fourth floor, now that one is interesting.

From what i recall 2 "weapons" drop, 1 coffer, and 1 actual weapon(plus the book) so at the WORST possible in a static would be 8 weeks for everyone to have the weapon and chest at the best possible luck its 4 weeks for the weapons, 8 for the chest





so. you can be done with F1 in as little as 3 weeks, or as long as 12
with F2 in as little as 4 as as high as 16
F3 in as little as 2 and as high as 8 and

F4 is done in 8 weeks at the latest no matter what, as quickly as 2 weeks



sooo, a week one clear person will be done gearing in 16 weeks at the very latest, thats 4 months, thats a lot sure, but its reasonable given lenght between savage tiers.
Someone starting the clears later will be obviously delayed, HOWEVER the game gives you bones for that, not only is gear unlocked before the next tier drops(allowing you to fully gear everything befor ethe next gear drops for a good few weeks)

the upgrade materials also will be available via the alliance raid come next major patch(iirc imidiatly, if not a few weeks later) cutting out 2-8 WEEKS out of F2 and F3 clears(so someone starting after that would have the most required time in F4 at 2-8 weeks)


Meaning, the fastest someoen can gear an entire class to BiS, is technically 3-4 weeks starting from clearing of the latest fight after alliance raid drops

Savage loot needs revamp entirely. You can raid for weeks on end without getting a single drop aside from the guaranteed book. Players should not be punished for choosing to raid by pf instead of statics.

The argument of they don't want us to have BiS sets after a few weeks only applies to either new statics or pf groups. Walking around in cities only confirms this by entire groups already having full sets by using alts.

We have a wide variety of jobs, which are encouraged to play and swap around with. The current loot setup however does not encourage this at all, as unlucky players will be forced to grind for months to even complete a single set.

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Originally Posted by Meowdyj

We have a wide variety of jobs, which are encouraged to play and swap around with. The current loot setup however does not encourage this at all, as unlucky players will be forced to grind for months to even complete a single set

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Correct we have a wide variety of jobs with ability to swap around but at no point during this tier are any of them required to have their BiS as requirement to clear the tier is below that. It will come in handy next ultimate but unless you desire to experiment at the very earliest convenience it's probably not going to be a problem. And by the time next tier rolls out you'll get the limitations lifted so you can freely go on gearing spree.

You do not NEED BiS gear to participate in any content (aside from Ultimate perhaps). You simply WANT it because you want to have it. Expectations need to be tempered.

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Originally Posted by Ransu

You're not supposed to be able to be BiS quickly. That's the entire point of lockouts. The loot system is fine.

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No, 8 weeks for a single class is garbage

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

You do not NEED BiS gear to participate in any content (aside from Ultimate perhaps). You simply WANT it because you want to have it. Expectations need to be tempered.

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why did you farm EX4 weapon ? its useless, even more than savage gear (criterion savage & ultimate)

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Originally Posted by CaedemSanguis

why did you farm EX4 weapon ? its useless, even more than savage gear (criterion savage & ultimate)

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glamour, of course. save 'em up to desynth when glowies are made available. :)