Billboard FC Banned

https://www.dexerto.com/final-fantas...viral-1864004/

Can anyone confirm this is true?

I'd say it's false. The article is from two days ago, and the latest I'd heard since two days ago is that no action has been taken yet.

From the article:

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Square Enix are yet to make any formal or public statements about the situation so time will tell how they respond.

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I doubt they'd ban and burn the entire free company over the actions of a few who apparently acted unilaterally.

They are not in here: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...s-%28Jul.-7%29

So, no. (or not yet)

I would say ban them and lets build a billboard on their plot! This is a joke btw., it was a stupid idea on their side and you can think of the whole erp scene what you will but in my opinion they don't deserve a perma ban.

they deleted the billboard thread let it go already.

RIP billboard thread

That was nothing but a clickbait article.

They sensationalized the title while everyone else was doing the normal billboard articles, in order to draw people in by making them think SE had given some kind of response.

You can see that easily enough by the final line in the article:

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Square Enix are yet to make any formal or public statements about the situation so time will tell how they respond.

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This, literally in an article that says "Square Enix crack down...."

That alone should be enough to tell you the poor quality of the website and encourage you not to read their articles.

They aren't and still having the event, though we we see how that affects Balmung lol.
Doubt if SE does anything they will ban the whole FC, because only a few of them were in on it. I also don't think people deserve Permabans, just some time off.

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Originally Posted by Infindox

They aren't and still having the event, though we we see how that affects Balmung lol.
Doubt if SE does anything they will ban the whole FC, because only a few of them were in on it. I also don't think people deserve Permabans, just some time off.

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Nah, action on this needs to be pretty harsh. They arguably disrupted an entire server during the launch of a brand new feature (it's hard to say how much would have happened *anyway* given it's Balmung, but... the news story did not help), broke multiple TOS entries, and used copyrighted imagery without permission. They broke actual laws.

Not saying everyone in the FC needs to be banned, that is overly harsh, but anyone involved with the leadership and/or planning of the billboard needs to go. It was too far, and if punishment is insufficient people will just push the boundaries further next time.

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Originally Posted by Atma

Nah, action on this needs to be pretty harsh. They arguably disrupted an entire server during the launch of a brand new feature (it's hard to say how much would have happened *anyway* given it's Balmung, but... the news story did not help), broke multiple TOS entries, and used copyrighted imagery without permission. They broke actual laws.

Not saying everyone in the FC needs to be banned, that is overly harsh, but anyone involved with the leadership and/or planning of the billboard needs to go. It was too far, and if punishment is insufficient people will just push the boundaries further next time.

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Atma is right. People only understand harsh penalties.
If you baby them through stuff, they just keep pushing and pushing.

Lol, not surprised they deleted my thread and not really mad about it, but PLEASE fact check your info around this event and do not take anything for certain.

And don't go harass the FC. Not that I really think people on the forums are doing it.

Let square handle it, at this point. Move on with your lives and have a little giggle, and enjoy the game! We can't hold our breath for whatever action they may or may not take, and certainly won't tell us about more than likely.

It's just yesterday's news.

I don't really see the harm tbh, and if anything it made more people aware of the game. People calling for harsh action to be taken need to relax lol... authoritarian much?

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Originally Posted by Valfreyja

If you baby them through stuff, they just keep pushing and pushing.

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Do you think if they get a slap on the wrist we'll be able to get a blimp next?

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Originally Posted by SonjaRampage

I don't really see the harm tbh, and if anything it made more people aware of the game. People calling for harsh action to be taken need to relax lol... authoritarian much?

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The thing about copyright law is that you have to defend it aggressively and harshly, because if you don't for one person or group of people, it can be used against you the next time someone else violates your intellectual property.

That's why Disney famously went after anyone who even thought about infringing their copyrights, to the point of forcing my elementary school to paint over the Mickey Mouse murals on the walls of the lunch room. The justice system in the US is brutal - so I fully expect lawyers to already be involved. They will likely get nothing more than a C&D for the billboard, but those who data mined and the modders are now rightfully in fear for their own accounts over the incident. They have a right to angry over the issue, although they do not have a right to harass the FC or the members. But now it may be that SE will stop turning a blind eye to modders and data miners on social media, and start banning accounts too, since people went a bridge too far.

SE's media usage policy is fairly generous - and if it was a billboard with no mods and no data mined clothing, I do not think they'd pursue legal action. It's the mods that are going to make this an interesting legal case.

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Originally Posted by Atma

Nah, action on this needs to be pretty harsh. They arguably disrupted an entire server during the launch of a brand new feature (it's hard to say how much would have happened *anyway* given it's Balmung, but... the news story did not help), broke multiple TOS entries, and used copyrighted imagery without permission. They broke actual laws.

Not saying everyone in the FC needs to be banned, that is overly harsh, but anyone involved with the leadership and/or planning of the billboard needs to go. It was too far, and if punishment is insufficient people will just push the boundaries further next time.

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I came back and read your reply, I think that the leadership needs at least the most punishment. I think I was trying to be too nice last night lol

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Originally Posted by SonjaRampage

I don't really see the harm tbh, and if anything it made more people aware of the game. People calling for harsh action to be taken need to relax lol... authoritarian much?

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Well see the problem with that is it made the people aware of the game in the wrong ways. Their website and discord both were connected to NSFW, some I would consider pedophilia ("age play"), even though they can insist on their discord server to have been under age restriction, all too easy to still see it. Not something you would want associated with your brand.

Though at this point is just sit back and see what happens Saturday.

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Originally Posted by SonjaRampage

I don't really see the harm tbh, and if anything it made more people aware of the game. People calling for harsh action to be taken need to relax lol... authoritarian much?

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They used the FFXIV logo. That makes it a trademark violation. At least under US law failing to defend a trademark means losing the trademark. SE may not have any choice but to do something.

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Originally Posted by Myrany

They used the FFXIV logo. That makes it a trademark violation. At least under US law failing to defend a trademark means losing the trademark. SE may not have any choice but to do something.

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Since the FFXIV logo is an in game asset that can be slapped onto any screenshot in sticker mode, that I'm not so sure about. And the media usage license requires that it have the FXIV copyright notice on it.

World travel is a feature now, all this "disrupting" is the same as when people started to travel to Balmung. Just deal with it.

There's a nice lenghty video that covers the legality of everything. Ultimately, it's a question of will they(SE) or won't they. At the bare minimum, it's possible they could give a temporary or permanent ban the player that did the deed.

What the hell, are you guys being paid to shill for square here or something?
The material usage license requires you to "slap" the copyright notice and ffxiv logo onto anything that uses ffxiv assets.
The club owners have a very strong case to argue that the reason they used the ffxiv logo and the copyright notice is to comply with the materials usage license, and I suspect that's exactly the reason why they put those on the billboard.

Using mods is a ToS violation, and using datamined assets is not compliant with the materials usage license.
The former results in action taken against your account, and the latter results in, at worst, a cease and desist letter.

You want them to take it to court and argur a copyright law violation? The funny thing about real life court is that it doesn't work like ingame tos violations, you cannot just have a gm put the accused into gaol and suspend them for 10 days without possibility to appeal, you actually have to go through a trial and, and I know this sohnds ludicrous, give the accused a chance to defend themselves.
I know real life law sounds inconvenient but it is what it is.

The entirety of the "drama" is going to be that SE contacts the billboard company to take down the ads. That will happen because the billboard company(ies) contractually have an out (it is assumed you own the content you are posting) and already have their money so they won't care.

Billboards come down. Drama over. cyberhump-fest goes on with more trolls now and their discord is a clownfest.

.. whee.

It'd be ridiculous to just ban them on the basis of association and be really unfair, it's clear that there was like at most a handful of people responsible for the billboard.
Even people mentioned on the billboard weren't told and had no idea it was going to happen and ended up receiving a ton of harassment.
I really doubt they'd just do guilt by association and it'd be really shitty.

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

What the hell, are you guys being paid to shill for square here or something?
The material usage license requires you to "slap" the copyright notice and ffxiv logo onto anything that uses ffxiv assets.
The club owners have a very strong case to argue that the reason they used the ffxiv logo and the copyright notice is to comply with the materials usage license, and I suspect that's exactly the reason why they put those on the billboard.

Using mods is a ToS violation, and using datamined assets is not compliant with the materials usage license.
The former results in action taken against your account, and the latter results in, at worst, a cease and desist letter.

You want them to take it to court and argur a copyright law violation? The funny thing about real life court is that it doesn't work like ingame tos violations, you cannot just have a gm put the accused into gaol and suspend them for 10 days without possibility to appeal, you actually have to go through a trial and, and I know this sohnds ludicrous, give the accused a chance to defend themselves.
I know real life law sounds inconvenient but it is what it is.

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Yeah I don't think anyone expects anyone to sue anyone. It is more simply pointing out the severity of the infraction that was committed goes beyond simply breaking some rules in a TOS document.

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Originally Posted by Catwho

Since the FFXIV logo is an in game asset that can be slapped onto any screenshot in sticker mode, that I'm not so sure about. And the media usage license requires that it have the FXIV copyright notice on it.

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

The material usage license requires you to "slap" the copyright notice and ffxiv logo onto anything that uses ffxiv assets.
The club owners have a very strong case to argue that the reason they used the ffxiv logo and the copyright notice is to comply with the materials usage license, and I suspect that's exactly the reason why they put those on the billboard.

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The thing with the copyright notice being required is that it goes hand-in-hand with other rules like where the FFXIV assets can be used (basically restricted to personal use on websites) and that they should not be combined with third party content – the end result being that the SE copyright notice is applied to an image that is entirely SE's property.

Breaking the other rules and then applying the notice to the billboard full of altered images and third party logos is probably a worse look than not applying it at all.

(Also, just from memory, I think there was something at one point where they stated that modded images should not have the copyright notice on them so they won't be associated back to SE? Does anyone have a source for that?)

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Originally Posted by Iscah

The thing with the copyright notice being required is that it goes hand-in-hand with other rules like where the FFXIV assets can be used (basically restricted to personal use on websites) and that they should not be combined with third party content – the end result being that the SE copyright notice is applied to an image that is entirely SE's property.

Breaking the other rules and then applying the notice to the billboard full of altered images and third party logos is probably a worse look than not applying it at all.

(Also, just from memory, I think there was something at one point where they stated that modded images should not have the copyright notice on them so they won't be associated back to SE? Does anyone have a source for that?)

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you could argue that in a court but you still couldn't prove that the intent when using the ffxiv and square enix copyright logos were malicious and intended to impersonate square enix or to give the impression that it was an official square enix event
once again real life law doesn't work like the ToS, square enix can't just dictate what is the truth in a court of law.

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

you could argue that in a court but you still couldn't prove that the intent when using the ffxiv and square enix copyright logos were malicious and intended to impersonate square enix or to give the impression that it was an official square enix event
once again real life law doesn't work like the ToS, square enix can't just dictate what is the truth in a court of law.

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You should watch that video. 45 minutes but it directly addresses what you are saying.

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

you could argue that in a court but you still couldn't prove that the intent when using the ffxiv and square enix copyright logos were malicious and intended to impersonate square enix or to give the impression that it was an official square enix event
once again real life law doesn't work like the ToS, square enix can't just dictate what is the truth in a court of law.

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It's not even about it being deliberate or malicious. If they claim they used the notice because it's in the rules that they should, then they can't claim to be unaware of the other rules they also should have been following.

Edit to add: Also, SE has no need to "dictate what the truth is" if it actually is a breach of copyright according to existing laws. I'm not saying it is or isn't a breach, but that would be the reason why SE would go after these people if they choose to.

I guess, nothing will happen to the club owner. Maybe a 3 days ban but nothing more. The game companies only sue someone if they suffer real financial losses. But AFAIK nothing happened in this case. Sueing the club owners could be a huge backslash and could lead to financial losses.


Cheers

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...7/IMG_5782.png

/10characters

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

What the hell, are you guys being paid to shill for square here or something?
The material usage license requires you to "slap" the copyright notice and ffxiv logo onto anything that uses ffxiv assets.
The club owners have a very strong case to argue that the reason they used the ffxiv logo and the copyright notice is to comply with the materials usage license, and I suspect that's exactly the reason why they put those on the billboard.

Using mods is a ToS violation, and using datamined assets is not compliant with the materials usage license.
The former results in action taken against your account, and the latter results in, at worst, a cease and desist letter.

You want them to take it to court and argur a copyright law violation? The funny thing about real life court is that it doesn't work like ingame tos violations, you cannot just have a gm put the accused into gaol and suspend them for 10 days without possibility to appeal, you actually have to go through a trial and, and I know this sohnds ludicrous, give the accused a chance to defend themselves.
I know real life law sounds inconvenient but it is what it is.

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Maybe you should hear from a real lawyer?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiWHa04qugU

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Originally Posted by technole

Maybe you should hear from a real lawyer?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiWHa04qugU

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that video does not constitute legal advice and does not create a lawyer client relationship so it can be dismissed freely
once again my argument is that you need to argue this in a court using lawyers who are in a client-attorney relationship who are giving actual legal advice

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

once again my argument is...

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Your argument up to this point appears to be that SE can't prosecute them for copyright violation "because they'd have to go through a trial and the accused would get to defend themselves".

That isn't a reason why they can't be prosecuted or a reason why SE wouldn't have a case. Of course it would require a trial if SE wished to pursue it, and nobody here has said otherwise.

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

that video does not constitute legal advice and does not create a lawyer client relationship so it can be dismissed freely
once again my argument is that you need to argue this in a court using lawyers who are in a client-attorney relationship who are giving actual legal advice

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It's still a legal analysis of what's known. Saying it can be dismissed freely is pretty silly.

Ultimately, this is between SE and the nightclub operators. SE has to decide if it's worth pursuing.

It feels like the forums are more concerned about this issue that Square is (from an outsider looking in point of view that is)

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Originally Posted by SeiyaSoiya

that video does not constitute legal advice and does not create a lawyer client relationship so it can be dismissed freely
once again my argument is that you need to argue this in a court using lawyers who are in a client-attorney relationship who are giving actual legal advice

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You obviously don't know what you are talking about, did not watch the video, nor read the FFXIV user agreement.

It's spelled out in plain text they will send notice to cease and after 60 days, than SE will submit to arbitration. All for any reason, unless you have money to survive the chokehold. It's actually a more lenient process than many know, but there are still legal ramifications.

Hilarious if true, but I don't believe it for a second until I see the wall of REEEEing and people setting their own hair on fire in protest.

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Originally Posted by technole

You obviously don't know what you are talking about, did not watch the video, nor read the FFXIV user agreement.

It's spelled out in plain text they will send notice to cease and after 60 days, than SE will submit to arbitration. All for any reason, unless you have money to survive the chokehold. It's actually a more lenient process than many know, but there are still legal ramifications.

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If they have 60 days to comply with the C&D, wouldn't that just mean that naturally letting the billboard's contract expire means they would be complying? The event is supposed to be tonight, so they can't have paid for more time than that.

Unless the same group rented out more billboards, wouldn't that mean they have complied and SE wouldn't pursue further legal action?