This isnt working, we need to try something else (Kaiten Post)

In case you haven't heard about the live letter, Yoshi-P mentioned that he is planning on fixing how auto-crit works in tandem with abilities that increase crit chance, as one of the many things that the disastrous 6.1 SAM changes totally botched was that it was no longer viable to be buffed by anything that increases crit chance since it would not stack. This heavily implies that they are keeping the terrible changes, as opposed to listening to the many voices who are all crying out against them

this is in total ignorance of the hundreds of threads on the forums and thousands elsewhere, where they explicitly want us to post our opinions. this is also in total defiance of Yoshi-P himself asking us to, quote, "try it out," implying it had any chance of being reverted if we simply asked enough.


this is the same dev team who has had the Heart of Sabik improperly appear in the English version of the Praetorium all the way from 2.0 to 6.1. Clearly, they do not care for the opinions of English-speaking players or otherwise do not check the English forums, so we will have to branch out. I believe we must enter the Japanese forums to have our voices heard. We all agree with the premise that SAM's 6.1 changes were universally terrible, and all we need to do is get the attention of whoever reads the Japanese forums. I suggest we use Google Translate if you do not have the ability to write in Japanese, in order to have our voices actually heard, as this is an absolute travesty. I will begin the pleas for the devs to read the English DPS forums immediately after posting this, and I implore that you do as well.

Here's hoping it works

Oh, and it should go without mentioning: lay on the politeness. Make sure they know that your problems are with SAM's 6.1 changes and not the devs themselves. Ensure that your words cannot be misconstrued, intentionally or unintentionally, to be impolite or harsh, and simply ask for their consideration. This is likely our last chance to get the class that we love back, and we must seize it.

as well: I was given the idea to have the original English translation in the post. this is because Google Translate is rather bad at conveying intent, and so posts are likely to end up as a mass of jumbled garbage.

And yet calling me troll on the other post?

Got to love the irony…

It’s already settled & just adapt to your current SAM or roll another.

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Originally Posted by Vencio

And yet calling me troll on the other post?

Got to love the irony…

It’s already settled & just adapt to your current SAM or roll another.

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you are intentionally going around to unrelated threads and beginning conflict that was not otherwise there for no reason other than conflict itself. that is peak and defining troll behavior, and doing it makes you a troll.

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

you are intentionally going around to unrelated threads and beginning conflict that was not otherwise there for no reason other than conflict itself. that is peak and defining troll behavior, and doing it makes you a troll.

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Please be more specific,

And I do respond to threads freely as much as anyone has & vice versa.

What exactly am I doing that’s Trolling given how I am in opposition to you & most of anyone’s SAM that still persist on about SAM given the current live letter’s highlights not mentioning it?

Then again your determination is admirable but fruitless

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Originally Posted by Vencio

Please be more specific,

And I do respond to threads freely as much as anyone has & vice versa.

What exactly am I doing that’s Trolling given how I am in opposition to you & most of anyone’s SAM that still persist on about SAM given the current live letter’s highlights not mentioning it?

Then again your determination is admirable but fruitless

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Are you aware that job changes don't get covered in much detail until part 2 of the live letter? That's exactly how it was for the one leading up to 6.1 and same for other prior patch cycles.

Yes,

Till now it is what it is & we’ll wait yet to see

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Originally Posted by Vencio

Yes,

Till now it is what it is & we’ll wait yet to see

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Indeed. And no matter what happens, there's no need to rub in the results as a form of gloating to anyone here. The results will speak for themselves in another couple months.

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Originally Posted by xAFROx

Are you aware that job changes don't get covered in much detail until part 2 of the live letter?

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part 1 of the live letter mentioned changes to auto-crit working with crit buffs. auto-crit was, afaik, a mostly-unused mechanic until SAM's overhaul. in particular, after 6.1, a complaint was that SAM was no longer a candidate for DNC's Dance Partner as DNC's crit buffs were incompatible with a major part of SAM's kit. The timing heavily implies that SAM is NOT getting Kaiten back and that the changes will NOT be reverted.

hence, the outcry about the live letter from myself and a few others. furthermore, if we wait until things are officially announced to start complaining about SAM's changes, chances are they will not be reverted at all. Now is the time to ask the devs, as things are not set in stone and can be changed.


that the Porta Documana's Heart of Sabik's English bug is not fixed after 10 years implies that the devs do not speak English by and large, which means if we are to be heard we must go to where they can actually read - the JP forums


all of that combines into this post - a plea to the community to go to the JP forums so we can show them that the majority opinion is against SAM's 6.1 changes before patch 6.2 "fixes the problems with the job," making it have 0 chance of ever being reverted. This is likely our last chance to have our opinions be heard.

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

Oh, and it should go without mentioning: lay on the politeness.

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Dunno, they whipped up a patch within 5 seconds after Yoshi-P was getting roasted directly on the PvP forums.

In all seriousness though -

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

if we wait until things are officially announced to start complaining about SAM's changes

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I'm not sure where you've been but there have been dozens of threads before and after the 6.1 changes, including one I made myself, a few of which have been perpetually on or near the front page. We've done the best we can so far on official and unofficial platforms. The general consensus has been that 6.1 was a disaster for PvE gameplay design across multiple jobs, particularly SAM, and that arguments in favor of the changes don't really have a leg to stand on.

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

Clearly, they do not care for the opinions of English-speaking players or otherwise do not check the English forums, so we will have to branch out.

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All of our concerns have already been mirrored in every region, including regions that have not even suffered the effects of 6.1 yet. They are as keenly aware of the situation as we are.

It is the job of the community managers to relay our message to the devs in whatever language is necessary.

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

auto-crit was, afaik, a mostly-unused mechanic until SAM's overhaul.

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A total of 6 jobs now have sources of guaranteed critical damage. Critical buff synergy has been an issue for a while.

Personally, I'm being patient until LL part 2 before my final judgement on the situation. Excluding actually beneficial things like the Third Eye timer increase and Meikyo adjustment, if they don't address the 6.1 changes directly with a full reversion, I expect them to catch a lot of heat, both polite and impolite.

Just do what I'm doing: unsub. If they don't want to listen to feedback and are just going to barrel through with awful changes then why bother paying to play?

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

snip

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I know the devs have said something to the extent of wanting content creators to cater to them regarding the language barrier to some degree, but I am not a content creator, nor should I have to go the extra mile to speak on a foreign language platform they should have teams dedicated to this side for each region they don't already natively speak.

And to top it off, I'm to understand the changes have been criticized in every region of play already. While I get what you're saying, the onus should be on them to be putting their own money where their mouth is. They know the things they say goes worldwide, so if they said 'offer your feedback on the changes' then I expect them to have an eye and an ear on their own official sites.

Good luck with Google translate btw, there's another forum thread where someone mentioned doing what you're suggesting and using a different site to translate more accurately than google.

And another note, auto-crit has existed since before the 6.1 SAM changes. Just look at WAR since stormblood. Look at Reassemble on MCH. Life Surge on DRG. Those were back in Shadowbringers.

To say the problem arose just because of SAM is a bit disingenuous to other jobs. It's just exacerbated by the fact that the main source of SAM damage is frequent enough that it makes that anti-synergy more apparent.

Best of luck to your endeavors, I hope Google translate doesn't completely butcher your plea.

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Originally Posted by Reese_Clairdale

All of our concerns have already been mirrored in every region, including regions that have not even suffered the effects of 6.1 yet. They are as keenly aware of the situation as we are.

A total of 6 jobs now have sources of guaranteed critical damage. Critical buff synergy has been an issue for a while.

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in regards to concerns, i'd love any, like, numerical evidence that people in other regions are unhappy. even circumstantial evidence; an unofficial count. i obviously cant read Japanese, so a glance at the forums does nothing for me. i'd love to take your statement at face value. i really would. i just cant with Yoshi-P's complete silence on the matter, especially when contrasted with the obvious example of BLM's PVP on the japanese forums. people are INFERRING that AST and DRG's changes being delayed are because SAM's was received so poorly. as far as i know, the devs have not gone "yeah we fricked up with SAM's changes and are now too scared to change anything else." this lack of mentioning does not give me faith.

but again, there's the matter of timing with critical buff synergy. i can't honestly hope for better when the devs announce changes to the whole shebang after it's relevant for SAM and SAM only. they clearly didn't think it was worth fixing before. it obviously wasn't on their radar. why now?


but then there's the matter of the last paragraph: "if they don't address the 6.1 changes directly with a full reversion, i expect them to catch a lot of heat, both polite and impolite." why do think that that will work THEN when it hasn't been working NOW? are you simply giving up before the bell's rung?

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Originally Posted by Reese_Clairdale

I'm not sure where you've been but there have been dozens of threads before and after the 6.1 changes, including one I made myself, a few of which have been perpetually on or near the front page. We've done the best we can so far on official and unofficial platforms. The general consensus has been that 6.1 was a disaster for PvE gameplay design across multiple jobs, particularly SAM, and that arguments in favor of the changes don't really have a leg to stand on.

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i have been on the English forums. NOT the Japanese forums which inspired them to, quote,

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Originally Posted by Reese_Clairdale

whip up a patch within 5 seconds after Yoshi-P was getting roasted directly on the PvP forums

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NOT the Japanese forums. Hence, this post. I legit don't know how you missed the entire point of this thread.

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Originally Posted by xAFROx

I know the devs have said something to the extent of wanting content creators to cater to them regarding the language barrier to some degree, but I am not a content creator, nor should I have to go the extra mile to speak on a foreign language platform they should have teams dedicated to this side for each region they don't already natively speak.

And to top it off, I'm to understand the changes have been criticized in every region of play already. While I get what you're saying, the onus should be on them to be putting their own money where their mouth is. They know the things they say goes worldwide, so if they said 'offer your feedback on the changes' then I expect them to have an eye and an ear on their own official sites.

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you said it yourself: they want US to cater to the language barrier. I can expect no more of them than what they said to do. I'm trying to do that here, and I thank you for your support.

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Originally Posted by KurenXIV

Just do what I'm doing: unsub. If they don't want to listen to feedback and are just going to barrel through with awful changes then why bother paying to play?

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Bro, I'm not even having fun in the game anymore. I honestly just might if they continue their radio silence and lack of promised listening, as sad as that makes me. I've grown to love the world, but I just can't enjoy the game. I'll probably play the major patches, but not much else. Maybe I'll wait until the next expansion. I've been trying to find a class I enjoy, but nothing hits the same. the closest I got was BLM, but it's just different. GNB was the closest I've found in feel but to such a lesser degree that it's almost insulting.

I'll hold out hope and keep fighting for now. here's hoping.

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

i obviously cant read Japanese, so a glance at the forums does nothing for me.

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It seems like you've barely read the English forums too, I'm just relaying what I've gleaned over the past couple months. Even if I wasn't told how other regions feel, it stands to reason that players across all regions are human beings driven by common sense and will reach similar conclusions about fundamental gameplay changes.

I would say SE's overall silence on the PvE side of 6.1 has mainly to do with the fact that they weren't prepared for such heavy backlash regarding PvE job design. The tone deafness of this has already been discussed to death, but I feel the reason why PvP changes were addressed so rapidly in comparison was because this was a heavily PvP focused patch to begin with, not exclusively because Japan made fun of Yoshi-P. I was making a joke in that regard.

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

are you simply giving up before the bell's rung?

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Genuinely not sure how you reach this conclusion. My very first post on these forums was 1. Direct criticism of 6.1 SAM changes and 2. Offering changes that fall in line with what I think SAM mains would actually like to see using 6.08 as a baseline. In addition to this, I've spent time arguing against people that actively defend SE's nonsense or educating people that don't understand the situation around SAM. All of which is to say, I think I've done more than my part, I'm not sure what more you expect from any individual player here. If SE wants to put me on their payroll I'll gladly spend time fixing SAM and every other job in a way that aligns with community feedback. Until then I am not going to waste more time than I feel is necessary. I'm only even here because I enjoy many aspects of the game and only want to see it become better. 6.1 is a relatively tiny piece in the game's long history. An unusually rough piece, but still.

Meanwhile, your first posts here as far as I've seen were to 1. Bump a troll thread that was making its way off the front page and 2. Create a thread to show disregard everyone's efforts up to this point, because it didn't meet your personal standards. So far the only new game critique I've seen was the Heart of Sabik plot point which doesn't even belong in this subforum. This one example of a lore inconsistency across regions is not definitive proof that staff members never read the DPS forums.

The idea that inundating the Japanese forums with Google translated gibberish is the key to finally affect change is naive as well as impolite, regardless of if it's accompanied by English text. Other people have already cross posted there, probably in proper Japanese and in the appropriate threads. Unless you plan to raid SE headquarters, all of us will have to wait.

If anyone does intend to post on the JP sam thread after reading this thread, I highly recommend DeepL translator instead of Google translate.

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Originally Posted by xAFROx

I know the devs have said something to the extent of wanting content creators to cater to them regarding the language barrier to some degree, but I am not a content creator, nor should I have to go the extra mile to speak on a foreign language platform they should have teams dedicated to this side for each region they don't already natively speak.

And to top it off, I'm to understand the changes have been criticized in every region of play already. While I get what you're saying, the onus should be on them to be putting their own money where their mouth is. They know the things they say goes worldwide, so if they said 'offer your feedback on the changes' then I expect them to have an eye and an ear on their own official sites.

Good luck with Google translate btw, there's another forum thread where someone mentioned doing what you're suggesting and using a different site to translate more accurately than google.

And another note, auto-crit has existed since before the 6.1 SAM changes. Just look at WAR since stormblood. Look at Reassemble on MCH. Life Surge on DRG. Those were back in Shadowbringers.

To say the problem arose just because of SAM is a bit disingenuous to other jobs. It's just exacerbated by the fact that the main source of SAM damage is frequent enough that it makes that anti-synergy more apparent.

Best of luck to your endeavors, I hope Google translate doesn't completely butcher your plea.

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This attitude is why your changes will not be seen, heard or considered. If it was a game based elsewhere, they would definitely make a reasonable effort to be heard and understood. It's their job to create and maintain the game. There's only so much that can be done beyond having some people representing the varied communities. I imagine the NA team is careful not to look too hard at some of these threads with all the chaos that ensues. Even people's insult game is weak and low effort like "oh, you just got a crafter achievement! omnicrafter! you know nothing!" I almost feel bad for you people.

btw, not everyone has to learn Japanese or go through a translator. Find yourselves an ambassador.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

This attitude is why your changes will not be seen, heard or considered. If it was a game based elsewhere, they would definitely make a reasonable effort to be heard and understood. It's their job to create and maintain the game. There's only so much that can be done beyond having some people representing the varied communities. I imagine the NA team is careful not to look too hard at some of these threads with all the chaos that ensues. Even people's insult game is weak and low effort like "oh, you just got a crafter achievement! omnicrafter! you know nothing!" I almost feel bad for you people.

btw, not everyone has to learn Japanese or go through a translator. Find yourselves an ambassador.

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what in thal's balls did I just read

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

Bro, I'm not even having fun in the game anymore. I honestly just might if they continue their radio silence and lack of promised listening, as sad as that makes me. I've grown to love the world, but I just can't enjoy the game. I'll probably play the major patches, but not much else. Maybe I'll wait until the next expansion. I've been trying to find a class I enjoy, but nothing hits the same. the closest I got was BLM, but it's just different. GNB was the closest I've found in feel but to such a lesser degree that it's almost insulting.

I'll hold out hope and keep fighting for now. here's hoping.

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Yeah I feel ya. That's the sad part is I do love the world and the lore and all that. I would be over the moon excited for all the stuff announced in 6.2 if I had something to play I really truly loved as much as SAM, but that's the reality (for me) . . . I simply don't.

I do well enough on NIN and it's engaging but it just doesn't give me the same satisfaction as SAM.

Lot's of other games to spend money on and enjoy though so [shrugs] if LL PT 2 comes out and no big SAM changes for the better then that's all she wrote for this player.

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Originally Posted by butchersblock

what in thal's balls did I just read

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It's not the first time he's made a statement like that. It's definitely absurd, but it's also hilarious to me that people keep posting stuff like that too. Trolls gonna troll, unfortunately. I don't know why they seem to be Elezen though, just kind of a weird thing I've noticed.

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Originally Posted by Ruminous

It's not the first time he's made a statement like that. It's definitely absurd, but it's also hilarious to me that people keep posting stuff like that too. Trolls gonna troll, unfortunately. I don't know why they seem to be Elezen though, just kind of a weird thing I've noticed.

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Role play? Racial stereotyping in a fantasy setting? Early ARR msq players just reaching coerthas? Don't really know, don't really care.

If they're gonna reply to me, I just wish they wouldn't generalize like I'm among the folks looking at people's Lodestone to see what they've unlocked and leveled. That's so beneath my attention I've literally never said anything that wasn't already presented in the thread comments itself.

*shrugs*

Move to japan.

Make huge banner and write what you are protesting about.

Try to protest in front of the SE building.

Realize protesting in front of the SE building is impractical and often isn't even allowed anyway.

Feel tired and get food at McDonalds that on opposite side of building from where you are standing.

Loving it.

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Originally Posted by xAFROx

Role play? Racial stereotyping in a fantasy setting? Early ARR msq players just reaching coerthas? Don't really know, don't really care.

If they're gonna reply to me, I just wish they wouldn't generalize like I'm among the folks looking at people's Lodestone to see what they've unlocked and leveled. That's so beneath my attention I've literally never said anything that wasn't already presented in the thread comments itself.

*shrugs*

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You could have something unlocked and leveled too, but still not have a good idea on how it plays. I don't comment on ranged or casters despite having them all at 90. I just sort of hit buttons getting there, since you know, I don't need to understand the class at all to max it out.

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Originally Posted by Ruminous

You could have something unlocked and leveled too, but still not have a good idea on how it plays. I don't comment on ranged or casters despite having them all at 90. I just sort of hit buttons getting there, since you know, I don't need to understand the class at all to max it out.

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Oh I'm well aware. I just mean in regards to whoever replied to me earlier pointing out my weak arguments by pointing out someone's leveled jobs off the lodestone when I've never done that in any of the threads I've commented in up to now. It's a weird thing to point out when there's like four others in the kaiten camp that keep doing it.

It doesn't necessarily imply that.
They do listen otherwise we wouldn't have gotten the Savage Criterion dungeons, Yoshi-P specifically said that they're adding this because we've asked for it in the West...

Srsly lets give them a chance, we've made our voices heard and he has acknowledged it even before this Live Letter.
The anger towards the Kaiten removal is even why they delayed the AST and DRG reworks.

Auto-crits isn't only a SAM thing, just because he has brought this up as an issue doesn't mean it's somehow directly connected to the auto-crits with SAM.
Kassatsu for example used to cause auto-crit but that was removed and they instead made it increase damage.
And Bootshine for example has been auto-crit since forever.
There's no real point in treating speculation as truth and then getting worked up about it and the crit issue has been an issue long before this it wasn't some sudden thing that they became aware of just because SAM now has the issue too.

Lets at least wait for the second part of the Live Letter first, they've acknowledged the negative feedback now give them a chance.

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

...
The anger towards the Kaiten removal is even why they delayed the AST and DRG reworks.


.

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Do we actually know that, or is this just an assumption?

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Originally Posted by xAFROx

Are you aware that job changes don't get covered in much detail until part 2 of the live letter? That's exactly how it was for the one leading up to 6.1 and same for other prior patch cycles.

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the thing that bothers me is that the outcry for Kaiten and SAM in general has been overwhelming, when it happened every post (bar 1 or 2) was filled with SAMs crying out for them to reconcider.
not many believed that they would instantly just revert, knowing how this game is coded that would likely just break the game in half, sure you had a few but the main issue that I have and I believe many others is the absolute radio silence on the issue.
they could've easily posted something along the lines of "we've heard your pleas all over the forums" blablabla, instead nothing, also yeah, it'll be till 6.2 part 2 LL till we get more concrete changes. (also apparently more reasoning behind a given change)


1 thing that did stood up out to me was that they were postponing the AST and DRG reworks, tells me that they have seen the backlash and are like "maybe this isn't the correct way"

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Originally Posted by xAFROx

I know the devs have said something to the extent of wanting content creators to cater to them regarding the language barrier to some degree, but I am not a content creator, nor should I have to go the extra mile to speak on a foreign language platform they should have teams dedicated to this side for each region they don't already natively speak.

And to top it off, I'm to understand the changes have been criticized in every region of play already. While I get what you're saying, the onus should be on them to be putting their own money where their mouth is. They know the things they say goes worldwide, so if they said 'offer your feedback on the changes' then I expect them to have an eye and an ear on their own official sites.

Good luck with Google translate btw, there's another forum thread where someone mentioned doing what you're suggesting and using a different site to translate more accurately than google.

And another note, auto-crit has existed since before the 6.1 SAM changes. Just look at WAR since stormblood. Look at Reassemble on MCH. Life Surge on DRG. Those were back in Shadowbringers.

To say the problem arose just because of SAM is a bit disingenuous to other jobs. It's just exacerbated by the fact that the main source of SAM damage is frequent enough that it makes that anti-synergy more apparent.

Best of luck to your endeavors, I hope Google translate doesn't completely butcher your plea.

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this really stood out as odd to me when Yoshi requested this.
Drakenstein on Youtube did this and he said it wasn't cheap getting an english to japanese translator, is he really expecting US the players, their customer, who already pay an monthly sub, to also hire an english to japanese translator and do HIS teams job for him?
i get that they don't got someone monitoring and watching videos 24/7, but don't we have english community managers? can't they pass this along to internal translators? we already know that the singer of the primals can speak fluently english and japanese, so getting him to translate a few things wouldn't be out of the question.

Yoshi is honestly getting complacent in his positions, his quest for "making things more casual friendly" is going to get on the players who stay after the MSQ nerves, they've already pushed DRG and AST changes back out of nowhere, guess our complains and bombardment of feedback was heard in some capacity, if only on the JP forums, because in all honesty, Yoshi and most of his team who can't speak/read english are just ignorant.
it's kinda recommended for nearly everyone in the west to know atleast 2 languages (generally your mother lands language and english, as that's the universal language) yet you got Yoshi ... the LEADER of FF14 never speaking a single word, even if it's broken as all hell, the guy next to him speaks poorly english, but understandable and when he speaks english everyone respects him.

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Originally Posted by TyrAtatoskr

in regards to concerns, i'd love any, like, numerical evidence that people in other regions are unhappy. even circumstantial evidence; an unofficial count. i obviously cant read Japanese, so a glance at the forums does nothing for me. i'd love to take your statement at face value. i really would. i just cant with Yoshi-P's complete silence on the matter, especially when contrasted with the obvious example of BLM's PVP on the japanese forums. people are INFERRING that AST and DRG's changes being delayed are because SAM's was received so poorly. as far as i know, the devs have not gone "yeah we fricked up with SAM's changes and are now too scared to change anything else." this lack of mentioning does not give me faith.
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multiple people on the forums here who claimed to be fluent in both english and japanese have said that the JP forums were also blowing up over 6.1 SAM, ofcourse no concrete evidence.
the thing is, why did they randomly postpone those 2 jobs changes? they went full steam ahead after massive backlash for SAM afterall.

I hope it's an good sign, but concidering that especially Japanese companies/developers, they don't like to admit they're wrong.
that's why when Yoshi had to announce the delay of Endwalker he cried on stream, likely because he sees this as an failure on his part (a big thing in Japanese culture) same with a lot of things players are generally not happy about, they don't admit they're wrong because that would mean they failed. (which they did, but being ignorant to the fact you failed is better than knowing you failed)

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Originally Posted by Ceridwen

Do we actually know that, or is this just an assumption?

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we don't, it's copium for sure, but it's an cause and effect kind of situation.
unless they outright tell us, it's not 100% fact, but concidering their current course of "just do it and see what sticks" seems to be in direct conflict with their delay of the DRG/AST changes.
it feels like they saw the outrage, but don't want to admit they were wrong or that the change itself was half baked and rushed for 6.11's ultimate. (come on, an obvious synergy flaw like SAM not synergising with crit chance buffs?)

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Originally Posted by darkdyllon

the thing that bothers me is that the outcry for Kaiten and SAM in general has been overwhelming, when it happened every post (bar 1 or 2) was filled with SAMs crying out for them to reconcider.
not many believed that they would instantly just revert, knowing how this game is coded that would likely just break the game in half, sure you had a few but the main issue that I have and I believe many others is the absolute radio silence on the issue.
they could've easily posted something along the lines of "we've heard your pleas all over the forums" blablabla, instead nothing, also yeah, it'll be till 6.2 part 2 LL till we get more concrete changes. (also apparently more reasoning behind a given change)


1 thing that did stood up out to me was that they were postponing the AST and DRG reworks, tells me that they have seen the backlash and are like "maybe this isn't the correct way"

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I think a lot of us SAM players were hoping it'd be a repeat of the Hagakure/Energy Drain debacle and the reversion would just happen, but that wasn't the case.

Now that the live letter is already happening, it's a lot easier for me to just say "well, wait until part 2 streams" since that's when actual information should be coming out.

I just hope we get a good answer once they speak on it. And I also hope it doesn't just get glossed over or skipped outright because they don't want to face the angry playerbase.

The localization forum seems to receive official replies more often; there’s a thread about Kaiten that already got one for instance when it came to action wording.

we need to try something else... a Billboard maybe? .. it was a Great Advertisement for a Beach Party ^^

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Originally Posted by Vencio

And yet calling me troll on the other post?

Got to love the irony…

It’s already settled & just adapt to your current SAM or roll another.

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Do you even play Samurai?

I'll have to assume you don't, because these changes are bad in a multitude of ways, and "It's already settled" couldn't be further from the truth. I've yet to meet a single samurai player who likes the change.

Kaiten was the lynch-pin ability in Samurai resource management, and without it, the class is broken.

I just don't understand people like you, who feel the need to hop into threads like these just to undermine the OP and people who support him with some snide, dismissive post, that offers nothing of any substance, and is only an indicator of how dispassionate you are on this topic. You could have just not posted, and stayed out of it, but for some reason I personally don't know, you had to come in and post nonsense. I just want to know why. I want to know what goes on in your head. I want to know the thought process behind you, and all the people who do this, because to this day, it still boggles my mind when I see people do it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Poorman

Do you even play Samurai?

I'll have to assume you don't, because these changes are bad in a multitude of ways, and "It's already settled" couldn't be further from the truth. I've yet to meet a single samurai player who likes the change.

Kaiten was the lynch-pin ability in Samurai resource management, and without it, the class is broken.

I just don't understand people like you, who feel the need to hop into threads like these just to undermine the OP and people who support him with some snide, dismissive post, that offers nothing of any substance, and is only an indicator of how dispassionate you are on this topic. You could have just not posted, and stayed out of it, but for some reason I personally don't know, you had to come in and post nonsense. I just want to know why. I want to know what goes on in your head. I want to know the thought process behind you, and all the people who do this, because to this day, it still boggles my mind when I see people do it.

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He doesn't play samurai in anything meaningful, he mostly posts to troll and pretends he isn't, when his entire post history is an open book to us. It's the same, tired routine in every thread that he's participated in here. It used to be funny to watch the mental gymnastics, but at this point it's denial of trolling or intentionally not seeing the trolling. He also cannot read the room and posts nonsense praising SE for removing an ability that he never has to use because he doesn't play it in content that requires you to fully know samurai, or he can and knows that people are mad about it, hence, trolling. Asking what goes through a troll's head is a pointless exercise as well, because you know exactly what they're thinking when they stir the pot.

The question will always be "why does it matter?" and trolls can never offer good answers.

Careful, addressing trolls might be met with unwarranted vacations that's not " Costa Del Sol ". That being said, SE like other companies listens to " money".

Voicing in Mass is 1 method. YT-videos / Streamers / Forum threads and posts etc. Yet if this isn't enough to draw attention, the next step is with our wallets. Un-subbing. But are players willing and organized enough to un-sub together to voice feedback in that manner? probably not.

Players have a myriad of self-interests from playing other jobs, housing, collections, friends, free-company, etc that will have priority over the collective interest to voice feedback through an unsub towards SE, that might or might get heard. Most of the once I know that un-subbed did it because they just do not enjoy playing Samurai in their current state, not even so much to voice a concern.

Shaming is another or meme, like everyone using signatures, or a hashtag and not just in the forums. But, a game should be a game. Not about activism, and yet here we are. We voice cause we care or enjoyed something we loved so much that was lost... and there will be sadly less voices to be heard once people stop caring all together.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CelestiCer

Careful, addressing trolls might be met with unwarranted vacations that's not " Costa Del Sol ". That being said, SE like other companies listens to " money".

Voicing in Mass is 1 method. YT-videos / Streamers / Forum threads and posts etc. Yet if this isn't enough to draw attention, the next step is with our wallets. Un-subbing. But are players willing and organized enough to un-sub together to voice feedback in that manner? probably not.

Players have a myriad of self-interests from playing other jobs, housing, collections, friends, free-company, etc that will have priority over the collective interest to voice feedback through an unsub towards SE, that might or might get heard. Most of the once I know that un-subbed did it because they just do not enjoy playing Samurai in their current state, not even so much to voice a concern.

Shaming is another or meme, like everyone using signatures, or a hashtag and not just in the forums. But, a game should be a game. Not about activism, and yet here we are. We voice cause we care or enjoyed something we loved so much that was lost... and there will be sadly less voices to be heard once people stop caring all together.

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Well said. That's why I'm not re-upping my sub until they fix SAM. It really sucks as there's no other really solid MMOs out there. FFXIV does so many things right but SE seems to be hell bent on ruining their success.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CelestiCer

Careful, addressing trolls might be met with unwarranted vacations that's not " Costa Del Sol ". That being said, SE like other companies listens to " money".

Voicing in Mass is 1 method. YT-videos / Streamers / Forum threads and posts etc. Yet if this isn't enough to draw attention, the next step is with our wallets. Un-subbing. But are players willing and organized enough to un-sub together to voice feedback in that manner? probably not.

Players have a myriad of self-interests from playing other jobs, housing, collections, friends, free-company, etc that will have priority over the collective interest to voice feedback through an unsub towards SE, that might or might get heard. Most of the once I know that un-subbed did it because they just do not enjoy playing Samurai in their current state, not even so much to voice a concern.

Shaming is another or meme, like everyone using signatures, or a hashtag and not just in the forums. But, a game should be a game. Not about activism, and yet here we are. We voice cause we care or enjoyed something we loved so much that was lost... and there will be sadly less voices to be heard once people stop caring all together.

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or a Billboard^^ Last Time some Players did that to advertise their Beach Party, it grabbed Everyone's Attention^^