disable cross world selling crafted items

i hope crafted items can only be sold on crafter's home world.

there are too many crafter from atomos & ramuh purposely selling items on aegis at ridiculous prices (they dont even price it that low on their own server) to grief and crash our market.

You can have retainers on other servers?

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Originally Posted by Roth_Trailfinder

You can have retainers on other servers?

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Not on the same character. If you have characters on those other worlds, you can move your crafted items from a character on one world to one on a different world so they can sell the items on their own retainers. Some players have multiple service accounts for ease of access in doing that (and some of those players probably aren't legit players but RMT instead).

I'm not sure it's something that SE could prevent from happening unless they were to program things so retainers can't list items with a Maker's Signature for sale unless the retainer belongs to the character listed in the signature (and they may not be able to program things that far).

There's also the situation where you go to another world and buy cheap then go back to you own world and sell at a markup. Which IMHO is perfectly legitimate.

I often world hop for some consumables and find them at half the price they are on Balmung.

This is partly why I'm concerned about cross-DC travel because there's been no mention of marketboard usage restrictions which means now the filthy rich players can exert influence across their entire DC cluster instead of just their own DC.

I have seen on multiple occasions people attempting to manipulate prices on things by buying out the entire stock of certain glams and such.

It's trivially easy to set up several other characters on another world, more so if there's multiple people involved, and trade items to them to sell. On Primal, as if the market board gil-farming bots weren't irritating enough, there's a handful of them that have begun exporting mass-produced endgame gear to all the other worlds on the data center. Obviously can't name names, but I'm on Hyperion and there's a crafting bot from Excalibur and Famfrit that have a listing for every single piece of Classical gear, on every world's market on Primal.

I'm totally for blocking items from being sold on worlds other than where it was crafted to stop griefing. However, it's very easily circumvented by the gil-farming community.

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Originally Posted by kurumihayashi

i hope crafted items can only be sold on crafter's home world.

there are too many crafter from atomos & ramuh purposely selling items on aegis at ridiculous prices (they dont even price it that low on their own server) to grief and crash our market.

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Funny that you should mention Atomos, we've had the same person or small group of people, trashing our market with low-cost crafted items for quite a while. I don't know what Aegis' economy's like, I'll have to check it out when I get home, but I really don't think those folks are griefing. Based off what I've seen on Atomos it's likely they're moving in to intentionally crash the market and profit via quantity vs. high margin. It was so bad early on in EW that it was a lot more profitable to sell them raw or intermediate materials and buy their finished goods than it was to make your own finished goods and sell them. The Twelve help anyone who was buying all the materials off the board and not gathering for themselves.

I fully support isolating world economies. Seeing as that's not going to happen, all we can do is hope for the best, suck it up, and feed their machine.

the main culprit are accounts from atomos & ramuh. i believe they're the same person multiboxing. thank god ramuh has been sundered but we still gotta deal with the atomos bots.

i created an alt on both atomos & ramuh to sell on their market too, but atomos' price is utterly hopeless.

while ramuh has more expensive prices on classical gear, the sales volume is too low to be worth it, plus having to deal with marketboard bots undercutting means i either need to multibox or have a few PC /service accounts to do so, which doesn't make sense unless I am RMT-ing the gil.

That's why it would be better if SE designate that crafted item can only be sold on crafter's home world (following the signature).

I've submitted multiple reports (2 reports a day) about disruptive behavior but SE can only say that ppl are allowed to price goods as they deem fit. I've given up and taking the L earning pitiful sums of gil for 8 hours of crafting every day.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

This is partly why I'm concerned about cross-DC travel because there's been no mention of marketboard usage restrictions which means now the filthy rich players can exert influence across their entire DC cluster instead of just their own DC.

I have seen on multiple occasions people attempting to manipulate prices on things by buying out the entire stock of certain glams and such.

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I think a lot of the rich players really don't carefor the markets in general..

The economy is so messed up right now that the rich players are getting richer without even touching the markets... (in terms of relative wealth)

I had just over 100 million towards end of 5.0 not mega rich but still rich enough to not care about money..

with the current economy though that 100 million has effectively become 1 billion just because the economy has crashed and prices have plummeted..

in 5.0 250k would get you maybe 1 top tier crafted weapon..
currently 250k can basically get you kit out entirely in top tier crafted stuff. (think it cost me about 270k for all 11 slots of 560 gear for my soon to be 90 ninja)

i'm effectively 10 times richer than i was and i havent done anything...

i know a good number of players that make me look bankrupt tooo so imagine how rich they are about now....

i'd theorize its not the rich folks crashing the markets but the poorer folks grasping for gils... theyre the ones who sit at the markets all day undercutting each other cos they're items must sell first.. richer folks list there stuff and forget about it.. might adjust there prices in 3 or 4 days when they check there retainers,

the biggest issue the richer folks have is there wealth doesn't circulate. which only makes the economy even worse still..

this though comes from the fact that nothing holds value and everything is so easy to obtain that the markets are always flooded. drives prices down.. if those high level nuggets were actually difficult to mine for example they'd be worth a lot more...

They really have to restrict the market board when implementing DC travel.
Or give a high tax towards player from other DCs of like 100%.
And when you are in a different region like NA to EU, it is 200%.

Trading should also be limited by the amount of Gil and item's that can be traded. Also a cool down to make it harder for bots to trade.

trading gil is as easy as listing a random gear on mannequin for X gil and the buyer just need to buy it directly from the mannequin, no tax for either buyer & seller.

charging higher tax still doesnt solve the cross world selling as they just trade items to that world's alt to sell on the invaded world.

yeah its true that 100mil feels like 1bil relative to gear & mats, but house prices (player to player) remain the same.

You know "some people" just buy Home World transfers right? Pay 14 eur/18 usd to travel to a JP data center and buyout the mb since prices there are half what they are on EU/US. Then transfer back after 3 days. That's a possible 1bil gil for 14 eur/28 usd. RMT circles are doing this as well while no one seems to notice/care.

IMO SE should just somehow prevent this from happening. If item x comes from server y, it should only be possible to sell that item on server y. Crap like this totally screws up the server economy. Now imagine if SE made cross region data center travel available for free. The JP data centers will be picked clean by EU/US players and totally crash their markets (increasing prices). I understand why the JP community doesn't want this and thus SE limiting data center travel to local regions.

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Originally Posted by kurumihayashi

i hope crafted items can only be sold on crafter's home world.

there are too many crafter from atomos & ramuh purposely selling items on aegis at ridiculous prices (they dont even price it that low on their own server) to grief and crash our market.

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To my understanding, we can only purchase from other servers, not sell on them. What you're seeing is likely the actions of a small group of Uber Crafters with a bajillion retainers who mass produce things and sell low. We have the same problem on Atomos. It's just an unfortunate reality now that we have cross-world travel. I'd much prefer that people have no access at all to buying, selling, and trading when not on their home world. I believe every world should have its own unique, and entirely separate, economy.

Yes, I RP and visit lots of venues on different worlds. Losing the ability for people to hand out food and drink at cafes, etc is a minuscule price to pay for keeping people from causing serious economic instability or a complete crash of various markets.

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Originally Posted by Prrringles

The JP data centers will be picked clean by EU/US players and totally crash their markets (increasing prices). I understand why the JP community doesn't want this and thus SE limiting data center travel to local regions.

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That is indeed a significant concern for a lot of us on JP data centers. I'm not rich by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm not wanting for money either based on the prices on my home world. However; my relative wealth is pitiful compared to the general population of the NA/EU worlds. If players with many tens or hundreds of millions of Gil visit and buy out things so much that the price skyrockets, people native to the less wealthy world will be locked out of their economy. We've seen this time and again in the real world with people here in the US leaving states with a very high cost of living where their Small House sells for so much that they can buy a Large House in their new location with cash and not blink an eye, leaving people from that area unable to compete for homes.

Intra-data center, inter-data center, and inter-region visitors should be completely and utterly locked out of any form of item transfer, including selling to NPC vendors, when not on their home world. Yes, it's a hard line, but it's the only way to 100% ensure external forces aren't able to damage a given world's economy, temporarily or permanently.

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Originally Posted by Illmaeran

Intra-data center, inter-data center, and inter-region visitors should be completely and utterly locked out of any form of item transfer, including selling to NPC vendors, when not on their home world. Yes, it's a hard line, but it's the only way to 100% ensure external forces aren't able to damage a given world's economy, temporarily or permanently.

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Except I think SE's intent is to try to equalize MB prices between the worlds over the long term. They're less concerned about individual world economies and more concerned the the game economy as a whole. Most competition tends to lead to lower prices overall even if that means a slight increase on some worlds.

They did state their initial intent was to have data center wide marketboards when they added World Visit but they hit technical snags that wouldn't allow them to implement them, and it's still something they want to accomplish.

What players forget is that when prices on certain items they want start increasing, they have the ability to go farm the items themselves. It creates not just the opportunity to get the item for personal use at no (or at least very low) cost, but to get the item to resell for profit.

Locking marketboards to world/data center visitors won't accomplish much when wealthy players can simply transfer their character to a world, buy up the low priced items, then transfer back to other worlds where those items sell for more. It becomes a new form of gil for real money. I doubt SE has the ability to make an item obtained on another world just disappear from a player's inventory. It would be disruptive for players who wish to change home worlds for other reasons.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

What players forget is that when prices on certain items they want start increasing, they have the ability to go farm the items themselves. It creates not just the opportunity to get the item for personal use at no (or at least very low) cost, but to get the item to resell for profit.

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SHOCK AND AWE!!! This is a possibility? *grin*

If it hadn't been for being mostly self-sufficient I'd be a lot lighter in the purse than I am now. The OPs original point hit home pretty hard a month or so ago when I noticed it was cheaper to buy the finished Classical gear than the materials needed to make it.

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Originally Posted by Curisu

They really have to restrict the market board when implementing DC travel.
Or give a high tax towards player from other DCs of like 100%.
And when you are in a different region like NA to EU, it is 200%.

Trading should also be limited by the amount of Gil and item's that can be traded. Also a cool down to make it harder for bots to trade.

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A cross-server tax should be in place right now. Personally, I feel that the resellers buy me out at prices that are "good enough" given the volume and then they relist it and make a profit. Then I put up more and they buy that out too. However, the system is broken. It shouldn't be like this. A high MB tax would probably fix this with relative ease.

they should just add taxes for buying AND selling
everytime you change a price for an item your retainer sells you need to pay like 0,5-1% of listed price

so does fu**ing undercutting and crafting bots need to pay huge amounts of gil to list there items first every 30-60min

It's simple okay. Just lock items to the world they came from. Give them a world signature or something. So if item X was obtained (crafted, bought, dropped, etc) on Moogle for example, it should get the "Moogle" signature and only be able to be sold on Moogle. You should still be able to use or wear the item, but not resell it. Simple solution to this problem.

The whole Chaos data center is flooded with JP items sold by bots who just keep transferring Home World. So A: prices for those items on Chaos drop significantly, and B: you are automatically being undercut every 10 minutes so good luck selling your item. It's funny that I (players in general I guess) am able to figure all this sh*t out by myself, yet SE seems to have no clue. Even after handing SE all the retainer names of the bots and proxy characters used to buy the items on the JP data center nothing happens.

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Originally Posted by Prrringles

It's simple okay. Just lock items to the world they came from. Give them a world signature or something. So if item X was obtained (crafted, bought, dropped, etc) on Moogle for example, it should get the "Moogle" signature and only be able to be sold on Moogle. You should still be able to use or wear the item, but not resell it. Simple solution to this problem.

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So, if I legitimately transfer a character to another world such as to play with some friends/access housing, I would be stuck with everything in my inventory and would not be able sell anything I had prior to the transfer? What about people who travel to another world to buy an item that they need but only find a stack of items while they only need one?

I have no issues selling on the market board though I avoid items such as classical armor as it is too much trouble to craft and the market too competitive (and when you look the the price of mats, many crafters seem to have a “math” problem). There are many other things that are far simpler and cheaper to craft and sell for more. When it comes to stacks of items, I sell in smaller stacks and can thus price higher than the bots and people selling stacks of 99. There are many items that sell pretty well and pretty fast.

As for undercutting, unless it is an item popular with bots, I sometimes undercut or sometimes price higher based on history. If I had the lowest price and someone undercuts me, again I use the history to help me make a decision: maintain my price and wait, undercut or buy the discounted item and resell it.

If I see items priced abnormally low, I won’t hesitate to buy them all and resell them at a mark up or even to an npc as people can sell things well below what npcs will give you. The person got the price they were asking and there is no reason for them to complain.

The opposite is also true: simple vendor items can sell for many times their cost (bought some stuff for 400 gil, resold 25k). Playing with the MB can be fun and the short lived crowd effect can be amazing to watch.

If the upcoming data center travel includes the ability to use the MB we can expect wild fluctuations at first and then it should more or less equalize after a while. I am more worried about the added congestion at aetherytes it may bring during hunts.

In the meantime, SE should take action against the RMT buyers, not just sellers. Sellers don’t care if they get banned. They’ll just keep making accounts and use bots to make gil if they can turn a RL money profit.

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Originally Posted by Toutatis

So, if I legitimately transfer a character to another world such as to play with some friends/access housing, I would be stuck with everything in my inventory and would not be able sell anything I had prior to the transfer? What about people who travel to another world to buy an item that they need but only find a stack of items while they only need one?

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Sometimes you just have to pick the lesser evil. Your scenario will seldom happen whereas the rmt/reseller scenario happens very often. Plus they could make and exception for stackable items/crafting materials. Those are not the items being resold in the first place anyway.

This scenario happens more than you think and SE will want to populate its new worlds. Punish the general population because of a few abusers makes no sense.

I don't care if people resell items. It's super easy to make money with the MB by selling the right stuff (and buy items that are priced too low to resell them. Just made 80k in 5 minutes buying under priced items on my server and selling them to a vendor). Those who buy massively on the JP servers concentrate on specific items anyway and there is plenty of room left. As for me, I will often buy the items that are priced 1 gil above the lowest. I also have no shame to seriously undercut someone if I want to.

In theory, the market corrects itself.

However, the game does not abide by the same rules as a "Free Market".

I have a feeling, once they open visiting other Data Centers, it will really show how bad the markets are.


I think Buying cheap on one server and Reselling on another server is legit.


What if we consolidated the market across all data centers? One market for everyone. What will that do?

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Originally Posted by rahz

What if we consolidated the market across all data centers? One market for everyone. What will that do?

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Their original plan was to have all marketboards on a logical data center merged into a single market when World Visit was first released but they ran into technical problems. They didn't say they've scrapped the idea entirely but they did make it sound like it will be quite a while before they give it another try.

Even if they could get that to work, I doubt very much that any consolidation would extend beyond physical data centers. One server/set of servers would be swamped trying to handle all the market transactions for this size of player base and players on the opposite side of the world from the server location would probably have substantial delays getting search results, resulting in a higher number of failed purchase transactions.

As for player markets, they're bad in any MMO because players value their time differently, don't always have the same time investment to acquire the same item, and have different goals for the currency they earn.

Data center travel probably won't change things much over all outside of the more expensive rare items. Few players make that much use out of world visit for market purchases, it's highly unlikely they'd start using data center travel for it.

I heard a theory that SE regulates the market (or certain items) with their own listings that may appear to be bots.


if the issue is trying to make money... SE has introduced a lot of ways to make money in this game since ARR without having to sell a single item on the Market Board. The quests give a lot more money. Leve quests are always available. Duty Roulettes. There is literally no shortage of gil to be made in this game.

Also, purchasing an item cheap in one server and then reselling it on another server at a higher price is not crashing the market. Market crash is a sudden dramatic decrease in price, not an increase. If we wanted to crash the market, and anybody can since it only shows the first 100 listings of the lowest price, we can list 100 items across multiple retainers and characters to push out the competition. This is a practice we see with players who corner the market on certain items. It is not against the ToS to corner a market and sell things for really cheap.

I can craft 100 items and give it to all my friends. I have no control over them turning around and reselling those items on the MB. It still says my name as the Crafter on the item. Should I be in trouble for "cornering a market" when I had no control over the actions of other players?

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Originally Posted by rahz

I heard a theory that SE regulates the market (or certain items) with their own listings that may appear to be bots.

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I doubt that. They can easily put items on a vendor NPC if they wanted to create some sort of price regulation, like they did with the intermediate crafting materials for HW and SB.

The listings that appear to be bots most likely are bots or players with a lot of time on their hands that prefer crafting/gathering to other game content.

MMOs tend to be hands off when it comes to the player driven economies. It would take a considerable amount of development time to micromanage prices in the player markets when there are tens of thousands of different items to be monitored. They most they do is adjust drop rates or change quantities needed for recipes if needed items become difficult to obtain.

For now, players are mostly fearing what might happen over thinking out what likely will happen. Any market changes are far more likely to end up slow over time then sudden. The biggest risk are the bots rings out there - how are they going to take advantage of data center travel now that it will be easy to move items between data centers?

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

For now, players are mostly fearing what might happen over thinking out what likely will happen. Any market changes are far more likely to end up slow over time then sudden. The biggest risk are the bots rings out there - how are they going to take advantage of data center travel now that it will be easy to move items between data centers?

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I thought I read somewhere that they werent allowing cross data center buying/selling.

I will have to look for that

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...6b65acdbd23850

* Market board items can still be purchased.

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Originally Posted by Kes13a

I thought I read somewhere that they werent allowing cross data center buying/selling.

I will have to look for that

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The information is in the patch notes.

You can't post a sell listing on a different world/data center to sell items since your retainer access is restricted to your home world.

Players are welcome to make purchases from marketboards on other data centers.

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Originally Posted by rahz

In theory, the market corrects itself.

However, the game does not abide by the same rules as a "Free Market".

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Game markets are pure, unfettered capitalism. What we have in the Real World™ is heavily regulated. Markets work much better under "coopetition" instead of the Darwinian horror that you see reflected in game economies.

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Originally Posted by GeminiReed

Game markets are pure, unfettered capitalism. What we have in the Real World™ is heavily regulated. Markets work much better under "coopetition" instead of the Darwinian horror that you see reflected in game economies.

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What we have in the real world is also affected by the need to manage resources.

The game doesn't even come close to replicating that short of rare drops from things like maps. A node doesn't have a restriction on how many players can use it at one time and will respawn multiple times a day.

I agree. There are times when prices on my world are ridiculous and they are cheaper on other worlds. I try to be frugal with my gil. I'm not going to pay a ridiculous price for something on my home world.

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Originally Posted by Little-bunny

I agree. There are times when prices on my world are ridiculous and they are cheaper on other worlds. I try to be frugal with my gil. I'm not going to pay a ridiculous price for something on my home world.

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Fortunately (or unfortunately depending on perspective), not everyone thinks the same way.

I have an example from yesterday. I was checking the price on an item I sell occasionally when I can get a needed material to craft it and it was up in the 1.7-2 million range on Coeurl. I'm thinking that can't be right, it was about 750k the last time I sold it 2-3 weeks ago. Sales history did show 1 recent sale at 1.4 million but otherwise it had been 750k or less. Decided to make use of world visit and data center travel to see what the fair market rate was but tossed it up at 1.5 million as a placeholder until I got back.

Look around, price for the item on most Crystal worlds was about 900k and 900k-1 million on Aether and Primal (other than a few high priced outliers). Went back to Coeurl to drop the price down to 1 million and... it had already sold at 1.5 million.

I guess some find the convenience of not needing to world hop worth it. That's why things can end up selling at the outrageous prices we sometimes see.

Definitely there's room to profit for those willing to take some time to look for bargains.

Would something like https://universalis.app be of use to you?

I mostly avoid apps and related stuff (other than hunt/FATE trackers). Takes part of the fun out of it for me. Thanks for the suggestion, though. I'm sure others will be interested.

It's just supply and demand. I crash prices all the time because I want to liquidate fast, buy more materials and circulate my gil for max profit/time.

eg. I released over 100 Susano weapons essentially crashing it on Aether when it was released. I made a ton of gil because they sold fast and I had gil to buy more materials etc. Eventually, prices stabilise.

Restricting cross-DC market usage just because you want to sell high seems selfish.

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Originally Posted by Prrringles

Sometimes you just have to pick the lesser evil. Your scenario will seldom happen whereas the rmt/reseller scenario happens very often. Plus they could make and exception for stackable items/crafting materials. Those are not the items being resold in the first place anyway.

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True, but if they're coming from a server where it's super cheap to get the mats, THEN move over and craft, they could easily price you out of your own market because you are in fact trapped. In a box. The walls closing in. Your very existence and reality shrinking around you. And the only recourse is to shuffle off from this immortal coil and find a new market and hope they didn't load up on mats for other things as well, lol.

But honestly, as someone who's been at this gig over 3 years at this point, the way it is now is our only saving grace. Because they always find a way, and they will try to beat you down and force you out. And if you can't migrate your own goods elsewhere and try to still make a decent sale, you're out of luck Chuck. And then once you're out they jack the price. Seen it more then once. Some have also utilized Dynamis to come over because it's free to move to a new world and reap madness that way.

I got roped in to all of this early on because someone decided to just tank my stuff and scoop it up and sell it elsewhere, so I quickly forced a bunch of alts in to my DC so I would stop getting pecked to death. Fast forward almost 2 years and the JA player appears acting like they're doing something new, lol. But this time, because of cross world travel, I was getting pecked from multiple angles with no recourse or able to stave it off. And there was no sign of it stopping either. So I then had to force a bunch of alts in to the other DCs and it stopped because I was forced to pretty much homogenize the markets in order to 'make it so'.

I'm glad I did because this seller shows no signs of ever leaving. Regardless of whatever one may think about how it would 'help', remember, this was already a thing long before the cross-world travel. If anything they unlocked the cage. Yea it could benefit them, but with how they run, I'm sure they don't even need cross-travel to do what they do, but allowing it levels the playing field for the casual seller. I would suggest leveling alts elsewhere and utilize your mannequins, or a friend, to move it if needed. It honestly only takes 5-6 hrs tops to go from level 1 to Retainers. About a day, day and a half if you want to go the extra mile and go to 50 and get an apt for mannys. Adventurer in need for extra seals to boost the GC to the point of Expert Deliveries. If you're selling high priced weapons/glams the cost pays for itself quickly from the gil you save on taxes alone. Plus, it's another room to decorate! :o

Any solution that we might think will work they will just adapt to as they always have and we'll just be chopping off our own noses to spite our own faces.

Higher prices benefit crafters though, especially if you have the means to raw mats via gatherers or hunter retainers.