I think the "Limitbreaker" system should be reworked to be more like TESOs

First of all, let me say that I don't mean exactly like TESO does it, but some Features/Design Decisions should be taken into count from The Elder Scrolls Online.

By default, I think that the "Limitbreaker" system in combat can be a nice thing. However, it feels very boring, unless you cast a lvl 3 LB (and sometimes miss the timing like me, lol).

In TESO each class/weapon/role skill tree has unique Ultimates. I am not saying that FF14 needs that too for each class in case function, but perhaps appearance. At the moment I don't have many classes unlocked, but it seems that each role has a shared animation for it. For example Bards/Machinists/co. have a straight-line AoE. Casters like RMG have round AoE and Melee classes have (I think) single target LB. My problem there is, that for all the classes of the same category they look the same in animation.

Second thing I would like to be considered is either removing the shared LB-Energy-Pool and for each player an individual one OR keep the shared LB-Energy-Pool for the team, but add another command for LB an individual LB that has its own LB-Energy-Pool and is capped to 1 charge maximum.

So, to repeat it again:

• Make the Limitbreakers appear more unique for each class/role
• Either add individual ressources for LB or remove the team pool in exchange for an individual one
• Embrace the feature as a "Time to shine"-thing for players

Personally this is just my opinion and should just be considered but not taken as "must be". I think some changes to the Limit Breakers could make the Feature pretty interesting and classes more unique.

When I look at TESO or even games like Destiny, I see classes/roles having more character by offering an own, unique ultimate.

Enjoy the game, feel free to comment. Have a nice day and stay safe :)

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Originally Posted by Athael_Elluvien

• Make the Limitbreakers appear more unique for each class/role

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They already look quite distinct from one another.

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• Either add individual ressources for LB or remove the team pool in exchange for an individual one

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That would relegate them to a non-integral, incohesive analog to the likes of Kenki, Battery, Blood, etc., though, while causing them to be nerfed to some half to eighth of their current value with enemy HP adjusted for whatever difference is thereby afforded. They'd be painfully unimpactful, and likely an eyesore.

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• Embrace the feature as a "Time to shine"-thing for players

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Like how? And how would this be sequenced across a party to make use of those "times to shine", if such is to be different from just having played one's job well without the inclusion of (individual) Limit Breaks?

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

They'd be painfully unimpactful, and likely an eyesore.

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I haven't touched any endgame yet, but as far as I am aware from my experiences in Raids, Dungeons, etc. I see barely anyone use them there. Also, the damage is, for an ability that has to be charged up, sometimes even over the duration of an entire dungeon, not impactful enough.

I have read in party chat only once that we should save limit break for a boss and since then never again. It is, at least while playing with other players older content from ARR-HW, just a mechanic that is sometimes used but doesn't feel really essential to the gameplay.

I am pretty sure most player don't even know what limit breaker is and that there is a command to use it.

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Originally Posted by Athael_Elluvien

I haven't touched any endgame yet, but as far as I am aware from my experiences in Raids, Dungeons, etc. I see barely anyone use them there. Also, the damage is, for an ability that has to be charged up, sometimes even over the duration of an entire dungeon, not impactful enough.

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They are indeed underpowered at the moment, sometimes not worth the top DPS's uptime to cast them unless they just barely finish off the enemy in that cast (making the post-cast stunlock irrelevant), but consider how much less powerful they'd have to be if you then had 8 of them. They should be buffed regardless.

Granted, we could roughly split that by role and increase enemy HP to make up the difference of a tank, DPS, and Healer LB all no longer sharing a resource cost and thus being simultaneously available (with also effectively twice the DPS LB available if we don't want them to feel pathetic in their LB being split twice as far as the other roles), so it'd take extra effort, but a more elegant solution may be possible.

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I have read in party chat only once that we should save limit break for a boss and since then never again.

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That may or may not be good advice. Generally, it's just a matter of portions, overkill, and relative uptime cost. If you normally deal 60% of your damage per target in AoE as in single-target, you should spend your LB in AoE instead, since the LB does 75% damage per target, better than normal combat. That said, AoE situations have multiple HP bars, some of which you may overkill even as you fail to kill others, leaving you unable to attack (due to LB's self-stun) for part of the fight, so the minutia of the decision get... messy.

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I am pretty sure most player don't even know what limit breaker is and that there is a command to use it.

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Probably because it doesn't even put itself on your hotbar.

Similarly, the devs seem to wonder why people die to Duty Action mechanics when there was absolutely no prep to introduce what a duty action would be...

The 1st 2 changes of LB are the same for all classes/roles.
LB 3 has a distinct feature based on the class that uses it

Bard shots an arrow into the sky and it rains a volley of arrows
Machinist summons a giant turret that fires a lazer
Dancer will dash thru the battlefield and after a slight delay, causes an explosion of slashing and flower petals to appear.

While LB1+2 could be adjusted to at least fit a class better (MNK being probably the biggest offender IMO), it really doesn't matter much because LB outside of 3 don't really have a huge impact in fights.

Having said that, I'd rather not have LBs become individual buffs because LB affects some classes worse than others. MNK, as an example has too many opportunity costs with using LB. Losing Twin Snakes, Demolish falling off not to mention the lose of any potential Chakra gained during your normal rotation makes LB 1 a DPS loss in most cases.

I wouldn't mind the ability to earn alternative LB3 animations. If Hien became an optional trust NPC and maxing out his LV gave you his unique LB as a reward which could then be used on SAM instead of the current one(but you can swap between them).

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Originally Posted by Silver-Strider

The 1st 2 changes of LB are the same for all classes/roles.
LB 3 has a distinct feature based on the class that uses it

Bard shots an arrow into the sky and it rains a volley of arrows
Machinist summons a giant turret that fires a lazer
Dancer will dash thru the battlefield and after a slight delay, causes an explosion of slashing and flower petals to appear.

While LB1+2 could be adjusted to at least fit a class better (MNK being probably the biggest offender IMO), it really doesn't matter much because LB outside of 3 don't really have a huge impact in fights.

Having said that, I'd rather not have LBs become individual buffs because LB affects some classes worse than others. MNK, as an example has too many opportunity costs with using LB. Losing Twin Snakes, Demolish falling off not to mention the lose of any potential Chakra gained during your normal rotation makes LB 1 a DPS loss in most cases.

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The only difference they have, are the visuals. They still share the same Range and damage.


As someone who generally wishes for more individuality among all the Jobs in this game, giving every Job their own unique Lb1, Lb2 and Lb3 (that isnt just a different coat of paint) would be a great addition to gameplay elements. I think the best way to do such a thing, would be that Lb1 & Lb2 would be for individual use, and Lb3 would be shared between the party as it currently is. Also, the Person who triggers the Lb3, would of course, lose all his Lb1 & Lb2 Progress from doing so. Also make sure, all Lb forms arent just simple Damage and Healing abilities, there is more than just that out there in the woods that would make a difference.

From what i've heard, PvP is going to get something like this inplimented but i hold my opinion on that until we get more details about it.

I think giving every party member an LB bar is a bad idea.

I think giving each job a unique animation for all limit break levels would be fine though. Seeing a different LB1/LB2 would be a nice change of pace as they've been the same for a very long time and I do find the visuals a bit tiresome at this point.

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Originally Posted by Anhra

The only difference they have, are the visuals. They still share the same Range and damage.


As someone who generally wishes for more individuality among all the Jobs in this game, giving every Job their own unique Lb1, Lb2 and Lb3 (that isnt just a different coat of paint) would be a great addition to gameplay elements. I think the best way to do such a thing, would be that Lb1 & Lb2 would be for individual use, and Lb3 would be shared between the party as it currently is. Also, the Person who triggers the Lb3, would of course, lose all his Lb1 & Lb2 Progress from doing so. Also make sure, all Lb forms arent just simple Damage and Healing abilities, there is more than just that out there in the woods that would make a difference.

From what i've heard, PvP is going to get something like this inplimented but i hold my opinion on that until we get more details about it.

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Considering ESO's track record on how poorly balanced Ultimates are, individual LBs with different effects and damage would be equally unbalanced. Essentially, LB 3 would be reserved for the classes with the best effects and everyone else is screwed.

It doesn't sound particularly fun or helpful in the grand scheme of things.

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Originally Posted by Silver-Strider

Considering ESO's track record on how poorly balanced Ultimates are, individual LBs with different effects and damage would be equally unbalanced. Essentially, LB 3 would be reserved for the classes with the best effects and everyone else is screwed.

It doesn't sound particularly fun or helpful in the grand scheme of things.

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It's already like that. In casual content you will almost exclusively see dps LBs and it's still incredibly rare to see a well executed Tank Limit Break. Healer LB 1 and 2 are practically myths. I use evwry limit break when appropriate and most feel terrible. A Healer Limit Break that doesn't revive the party is basically a Medica 2. Hardly feels worth the time to charge it. The least they could do is make it look better than Standard Step to execute.

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Originally Posted by NobleWinter

It's already like that. In casual content you will almost exclusively see dps LBs and it's still incredibly rare to see a well executed Tank Limit Break. Healer LB 1 and 2 are practically myths. I use evwry limit break when appropriate and most feel terrible. A Healer Limit Break that doesn't revive the party is basically a Medica 2. Hardly feels worth the time to charge it. The least they could do is make it look better than Standard Step to execute.

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Yes, they could be better but there's a difference between better and what OP is asking for.
Do you have any idea how difficult it would be to balance the now 20 different classes, all having LB with their own unique effects? They couldn't balance the 6 cards on ASTs that I couldn't even imagine trying to balance 20 of them.

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Originally Posted by Silver-Strider

Yes, they could be better but there's a difference between better and what OP is asking for.
Do you have any idea how difficult it would be to balance the now 20 different classes, all having LB with their own unique effects? They couldn't balance the 6 cards on ASTs that I couldn't even imagine trying to balance 20 of them.

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This.

More than even that, though, why would we want to take what would be unique job gameplay and divert it through a wonky system like LBs?

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Originally Posted by Kisshu

I wouldn't mind the ability to earn alternative LB3 animations. If Hien became an optional trust NPC and maxing out his LV gave you his unique LB as a reward which could then be used on SAM instead of the current one(but you can swap between them).

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This would be a really neat thing to do if they added enough trusts.

TBH the LB system is kinda "meh" to me... it works, but feels utterly uninspired. Maybe high-end modes have more strategic usage for them, but for the content that the majority of the players tackle is usually saving the LB3 for a healer or using the dps one near the end of the encounter, where usually it what it does is merely save some seconds of a fight - not that thrilling if your group knows the encounter and those seconds won't mean a lot.

The system we have looks flashy and cool, I suppose that warrants it as is... however I would love if the LB 1 and 2 could get unique among jobs too, as it feels kind of lame to be a Dancer and suddenly... you wield 2 crossbows lol.

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Originally Posted by Raikai

TBH the LB system is kinda "meh" to me... it works, but feels utterly uninspired. Maybe high-end modes have more strategic usage for them, but for the content that the majority of the players tackle is usually saving the LB3 for a healer or using the dps one near the end of the encounter, where usually it what it does is merely save some seconds of a fight - not that thrilling if your group knows the encounter and those seconds won't mean a lot.

The system we have looks flashy and cool, I suppose that warrants it as is... however I would love if the LB 1 and 2 could get unique among jobs too, as it feels kind of lame to be a Dancer and suddenly... you wield 2 crossbows lol.

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I'd think the extra animations worth their cost, sure. I don't particularly care for them to have different effects (at least so long as the combat experience is as cut-and-dry as now), but I too would like to avoid the issues "Punchy-punchy guy pulls out a... flaming greatsword?" etc.

what is a limit breaker

I'd love to see limit breaks reworked. While I enjoy that each class has their own special LB3, it is true that a good amount of time it doesn't matter, isn't worth it, or is used by the wrong person. Imo I would say LB1 and LB2 aren't really necessary anymore. I'd almost say it's worth having a LB per role [tank, healer, dps] that grows or perhaps just make them separate. I know making them separate would be complicated to balance, but it may help with making class identity a bit more obvious. I would like to see them changed or modified though.

I like the idea of LB per role. However I’d expand upon it a little. Do something a little different.

Each role consumes a different amount of bars. Tank consumes 1 bar, DPS consumes 2 bars, and Healer consumes 3. Between each role, the effects are fundamentally unequal, and therefore should consume LB resource at differing value.

Tank consumes 1 bar because a defensive use is the rarest use of all. Mostly it is used when content is fresh and a party doesn’t know if it will survive a big hit. Having tiers of this defensive maneuver is redundant because the lowest tiers never need be used.

DPS consumes two. 90% if the time, DPS is used especially to deal the final blow. If you have 3 full bars, you can use 1 Tank, 1 DPS LB back to back. If you decide not to Tank LB at all, you may be able to charge another bar for a second DPS LB, if there is time. Every DPS wants to be able to see their big flashy LB. By this system, instead of most of the time whipping out a Buster Sword or Raining fire, every DPS will get to enjoy their big finisher without having to be in 3 bar content.

Healer, giving the most explicit utility by resurrecting everyone for a second chance in an encounter consumes all 3 bars. Lower tiers are not needed as they are only basic heals that can be worked around with normal abilities.

So that’s the best way I would say LB needs a rework, while preventing LB from being lamed and dumbed down.

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

I like the idea of LB per role. However I’d expand upon it a little.

Each role consumes a different amount of bars. Tank consumes 1 bar, DPS consumes 2 bars, and Healer consumes 3.

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If they're "per role", why remove 2 out of 3 per-role options? If "per role", a tank LB wouldn't drain any LB gauge except the tank's or tanks', etc., etc.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

If they're "per role", why remove 2 out of 3 per-role options? If "per role", a tank LB wouldn't drain any LB gauge except the tank's or tanks', etc., etc.

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I didn’t mean that role shares the bar exclusively. The way Kalichan said above. They just gave me a starting point for my thoughts. The bar is still shared by the party. Apologies, I should have been more clear.

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

I didn’t mean that role shares the bar exclusively. The way Kalichan said above. They just gave me a starting point for my thoughts. The bar is still shared by the party. Apologies, I should have been more clear.

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Then such already describes the current system. The effects of each LB within a given role (Tank, Melee, Physical Ranged, Magical Ranged, and Healers) are identical and the LB is shared by the whole party.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Then such already describes the current system. The effects of each LB within a given role (Tank, Melee, Physical Ranged, Magical Ranged, and Healers) are identical and the LB is shared by the whole party.

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I’m sorry my post was not meant for you to engage with right away as I was still organizing my thoughts, please check it out again. What I said does not describe the current system. What I said, is that each role consumes the resource at different rates. Yes, it is still shared by the party like the current system, as to not nerf LB to standard abilities. the difference is that the whole bar is not consumed upon use, but rather depends on which role is using it. 1 consumed by tank, 2 consumed by DPS, and 3 consumed by healer.

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Originally Posted by AceofRains

I’m sorry my post was not meant for you to engage with right away as I was still organizing my thoughts, please check it out again. What I said does not describe the current system. What I said, is that each role consumes the resource at different rates. Yes, it is still shared by the party like the current system, as to not nerf LB to standard abilities. the difference is that the whole bar is not consumed upon use, but rather depends on which role is using it. 1 consumed by tank, 2 consumed by DPS, and 3 consumed by healer.

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Effectively, then, you've removed LB2 and LB3 (and perhaps buffed LB1) for tanks and removed LB1 and LB3 for DPS (and perhaps buffed LB2)? As such, there's less of a cost for using tank LBs and they can be used more frequently and selectively, assuming it still allows for party survival in situations that used to require a Tank LB3, and there's no chance of a healer accidentally using LB at just short of LB3 and therefore getting nothing of consequence?

My main concern here then is the removed options for light parties. However, you could allow light parties to have access to 3 bars during bosses and 2 otherwise, up from their normal 1-2 bars. In that case, you'd still have access to more than a single type of LB (DPS and Tank, rather than just Tank) during dungeon trash and healers would still have an LB available to them as not to feel left out (even if only on bosses). Such would also remove the issue of full party disconnects removing your third bar of LB gauge.

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For context, my preference would instead be to just reduce the uptime costs (and increase the responsiveness) of the DPS LBs and increase the value of healer LB1 and LB2 (such as by having them also refresh mana and perhaps generate a small, further heal-over-time effect). I can see the benefit to not having to go all-in on a tank LB, etc., however.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Effectively, then, you've removed LB2 and LB3 (and perhaps buffed LB1) for tanks and removed LB1 and LB3 for DPS (and perhaps buffed LB2)? As such, there's less of a cost for using tank LBs and they can be used more frequently and selectively, assuming it still allows for party survival in situations that used to require a Tank LB3, and there's no chance of a healer accidentally using LB at just short of LB3 and therefore getting nothing of consequence?

My main concern here then is the removed options for light party. However, you could allow light parties to have access to 3 bars during bosses and 2 otherwise, up from their normal 1-2 bars. Such would also remove the issue of full party disconnects removing your third bar of LB gauge. In that case, you'd still have access to more than a single type of LB (DPS and Tank, rather than just Tank) during dungeon trash and healers would still have an LB available to them as not to feel left out (even if only on bosses).

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Correct. I think everybody wins with this type of system. That is a good analysis for light party that I hadn’t entirely considered yet, but yes as you say right here would also be my solution to it. Based on what you said seems to me like overall it’s a major quality of life upgrade for the LB system as a whole.