Pray, place thy speculations herein.
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Who wilst depart the mortal realm in 6.0?
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10-04-2021, 01:44 AMtinythinkerWho wilst depart the mortal realm in 6.0?
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10-04-2021, 01:58 AMAnonymoose
Death is difficult to predict in the Ishikawa Era. She's stated that she feels comfortable killing or resurrecting almost anyone if it serves the story well, but also seems to have a very hard time actually killing characters. Shadowbringers saw us kill both remaining Originals at barely any narrative cost despite how often it told us we're sacrificing and losing just so much.
But baseless guessing? Assuming I don't have to take The Sound into account?
Or my even more baseless Presence of Silvertear Lake shenanigans?
I feel like Raubahn's had a target on his back for a while. Which means Lyse is probably safe.
This next few assume people who are Trusts can die...
Thancred is probably safe since he just had a perfectly good death in Shadowbrigers, then just popped up in the next scene wiping the blood off his mouth like, "Hey, guys." and killing him after that would be very ???.
I guess this puts Y'shtola in that boat, too, though we do still have Matoya's ominous warning that putting her spirit under more strain and carrying on as normal will probably get her into trouble someday.
Urianger I'm surprised to find myself putting in the middle column. He has been tied up with the Leveilleur story and prophecies at large the entire time. He could be sacrificed to bring the nature of all that to a satisfying end, especially in defense of his master's grandkids.
Can't imagine this being where Ali or Alphie die, though if one did and the other had to carry on, holy heavy story for the twins all of a sudden.
G'raha in the middle column out of pure spite for his time shenanigans shaking the world-setting to its foundations. Will he be safe after going on that one grand adventure we promised him?
I think the majority of the Scions are more likely to disband and retire while we carry on with who have until now been the B-Team.
Estinien, not impossible. Yoshi P is a fan so that armor's pretty thick. He's a useful plot device in how the Scions function, too. But his core story is long over, in a way, and the fates of Nidhogg and the Azure Dragoon are forever entwined and neither can fully rest while the other lives, even if they're "working together" for now.
Tataru is off limits. She's our last Path of the Twelve member, our last connection to the past, and the conscience of our group. (And the rest of them suck with money and recruitment and bookkeeping.)
Zenos's walking dead already, probably.
Fandaniel's walking dead already, certainly.
Zodiark is in serious danger; we've been told he's the antagonist for so long not fighting him at all feels wrong. But if Zodiark goes, Hydaelyn (as we know her) is gone, too. She exists to be his counter-balance; if he's not there, she's the problem she exists to solve (in the other direction). I have a hard time seeing Venat walking away from this; I think we're putting all the Ancients and their works to bed (for now). (Triple points of she sacrifices herself to block Ultima and we get full narrative symmetry with ARR.).
How the remaining Ascians will be used is a big thing, here. If we're ending the Zodiark story, it could very well be that the other Ascians are going into the grave, too, (I would prefer this even), but I wouldn't put it past SE to just leave a few of them in the wind "just in case" they'd be a useful plot detail. This all assumes Pandaemonium doesn't throw us for a loop, though.
Gaius and Fordola could go either way depending on how they're going to be used in the future but Arenvald is probably safe after his fake-out into hospital. -
10-04-2021, 02:26 AMMansion
As far as we can count on the "end" to have some kind of Tabula Rasa, I can see characters being retired rather than being outright deaded (like Lyse and Yugiri have since 5.0).
My main bet would be Y'shtola. I like her, I don't have anything against her. I just think she didn't have a proper character growth for a while and unless going to Sharlayan brings that occasion in, I think she could retire in Sharlayan (and find a way to go back to Runar perhaps?) Yet she is a main figure for FFXIV, so it would be bold to get rid of her, one way or another.
From a writing point of view, I think one of the twins dying would be a very hard blow to the WoL, because they both had their character growing closer to the WoL in HW and StB. The same could be said about Graha, but him being close to us for a shorter time doesn't equally compare, in my opinion.
I don't feel the WoL is as close with Urianger, Thancred, Y'shtola and Estinien. I'm not sure how significant their death would be in a narrative.
I guess Zenos and Danny are expected to die. But I just hope they won't have a lukewarm bittersweet conclusion like Yotsuyu (which was great), Emet (which was okay) and Elidibus (which was meh). Let the evil ones be evil.
New characters dying close to their introduction can work (Tesleen was her name?) too.
Or something completely unexpected and kind of unrelated to the bigger plot, like if Nero or Cid died for instance, it would be quite sad for the small Garlond ironworks sub-plot. -
10-04-2021, 04:47 AMRyuDragnier
G'raha will likely be replacing Hydaelyn as the one holding the worlds together due to his skill at doing so with the Crystal Tower, as there's too much foreshadowing there and Hydaelyn/Zodiark storyline is wrapping up (meaning she won't likely be here any more).
Y'shtola will likely "die" in a sense in that her body will no longer be able to withstand the price of her being able to see Aether and she'll have us take her soul to the First to help monitor it, with her promising to send Feo Ul our way should anything pop up.
Alphinaud may end up staying in Sharlayan to help bring it back onto the world's stage instead of being so passive to everything, with Urianger staying to help and teach everything learned on the First.
Thancred may very well get an injury forcing him to retire, or he could very well die this time since there's not much more they can do for his story.
Alisaie will likely keep traveling with us, as she isn't the type to stay in one place for too long. Plus her having feelings for the WoL will encourage it along with her knowledge of how to cure Tempering.
Krile and Tataru will likely stay on board with us. Tataru knows that we have a knack for finding treasure and riches, and Krile would want to stay as a link to us should anything come up from Sharlayan. Though tbh with Krile I'm not sure on anything, she doesn't seem to have much story on where she could go.
Raubahn is likely going to be dying at some point to not only finally pass the torch onto Pipin to protect the Sultana, but also to where Lyse can no longer use him as a shoulder for advice on helping/ruling Ala Mhigo, making her stand on her own feet.
Everybody else who is a regular? Likely safe. -
10-04-2021, 04:56 AMKatie_Kitty
The player character
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10-04-2021, 05:13 AMtinythinkerI considered that a while back for a second as it would allow us to return as unknown ala 2.0, but too many players would riotQuote:
Originally Posted by Katie_Kitty
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10-04-2021, 09:04 AMVyrerus
I have a sneaking suspicion that Endwalkers will make like it's going to kill people off, but then only maim them into retirement. Altana forbid our heroes actually suffer the consequences of placing themselves in mortal peril time and time again.
If we lose anybody, it'll probably be a city state leader or two. Thancred might pull a Shadow, and really stick it to Fandaniel or Zenos, but then we won't be able to wait for him or something. Down with the Floating Continent you go, my boy!
Urianger will take an arrow in the knee.
Twins will both come out fine.
If G'raha dies it will be in the first half of 6.0, I think. But given that he's the writer's pet, don't think he's going anywhere. Perhaps another character will take the axe in his stead.
Y'shtola, I want her to die. It's time. I still don't think that SE has the balls to do it though.
Krile is a more likely candidate, being a Lalafell and all.
They've kept their hand face down against the table though. Have no idea how people would actually die if they did actually die. I have no idea exactly how we're going to progress through the zone arrangement, nor how events are going to play out. -
10-04-2021, 09:40 AMWyssahtyn
whatever character(s) gets specifically written or even rewritten for the expac. looking forward to y'shtola using flow to no consequence again.
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10-04-2021, 12:03 PMGoldStarz
Krile dying would require them to think about her for more than 5 minutes which they seem incapable of doing.
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10-04-2021, 02:23 PMKesey
In all honesty, there will probably be a few deaths. But only one will be close and personal, the others will be people that were slightly important at one point and we can now live without.
I also think there will be a retirement of numerous major story players to clear the board for new characters.
I feel like the one of the twins is on the chopping block here. One will die to spurn the other to significant change. Most likely the sacrifice happening so the other twin and the WOL can live. I feel like Ali has the most room grow, but it's also sus to give Alphie a new class if he is just going to bite it.
Retirement is best solution for Thancred, Y'shtola, Urianger, Estinien and Krile. Their role in this story really culminating with Endwalker and retirement lets them freely walk back into the story when needed too.
The only person who is safe is G'raha, as he was narrating the ending to 5.3, which is a G'raha that has seen the end of 6.0. -
10-04-2021, 03:16 PMCleretic
No heroes will die, but there will be close calls that feel like they probably were deaths at some point in the writing process. I'm gonna say this time it's Alphinaud and/or Alisaie, because we might be going for a parallel to FFIV, whose twins also had what by all rights felt like a death scene until they anticlimactically got rescued off-screen.
As for the villains... Zenos is going to survive clashes a few times but bite the dust eventually. We also need to remember a theme that happened in two out of three previous expansions: A currently unknown secondary villain will appear dead but come back to die for real in a trial some time later. Right now we don't have a Nidhogg/Yotsuyu/Vauthry, but reasonably speaking we will have one at some point, and as such we need to remember that Nidhogg and Yotsuyu both had the exact same 'back from the dead' pacing. I'm guessing it's probably the Prime Minister of Sharlayan or something. -
10-04-2021, 03:31 PMYuella
Plot twist: none of the good guys will die
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10-04-2021, 03:52 PMRosenstrauch
Assuming that being a Trust does not guarantee a character's survival...
Urianger and Thancred are the most likely to bite it from some kind of heroic last stand or other kind of sacrifice. My money is more on Urianger than Thancred in this case, since the former is big on "do what needs to be done" kind of stuff and I don't see him getting the opportunity to regretfully sacrifice another of his friends. Meanwhile, Thancred had his big self-sacrifice moment, complete with the scene seemingly ending with his death, only to turn up fine moments later. So even if he throws himself into some impossible to survive moment, I don't expect him to actually die from it.
Y'shtola... at this point, I could imagine her pulling yet another Flow stunt, having everyone mope about because she's totally dead for realsies this time, only to have her Unflow herself and drop a fourth wall shattering line about her popularity like Axel from Kingdom Hearts 3.
The twins are safe. Ignoring the WoL for a moment, they are THE protagonists of FFXIV from 2.0 and onward. No amount of "b-but Palom Porom!"-ing from people who never played FFIV will change that. The player is more likely to "die" than they are.
Speaking of things that definitely won't happen because this is not FFIV, the game will briefly become FFIV as Yda pulls a Gaius and shows up alive, overshadowing her sister to the point of rolling her character back to mid-Stormblood. Then she'll sacrifice herself heroically (and turn up alive and bedridden in Little Solace with little explanation) and allow Lyse to have her character development back.
G'raha will be forced to use up all his royal blood magic to do something. The loss of his special eyes will be treated with all the gravitas of an actual death scene, and threads will pop up on Reddit for the remainder of the game's lifetime about how much the scene made them cry because it's Just. So. Sad. This won't actually stop the writers from using his royal blood as a plot device, by the way, since he's stored so much of it in those handy soul popsicles.
Estinien won't betray us. He's done it twice before, and that satisfied his quota as a Kain expy. He's also basically our liaison with whatever dragon-based societies are out there, so they're probably saving his death/near-death for a Meracydia expansion. If anything, I expect him to be the one who gets us to the moon the first time. Dragons can fly in space, after all.
Tataru will not only be alive, but I expect she'll be the leader for whatever group succeeds the Scions in the event that they disband.
Everyone else is fair game. Except Cid. Per tradition, we require him for at least one of the following: Endwalker Raid questline, Endwalker Alliance Raid questline, and Endwalker relic weapon questline. -
10-04-2021, 04:37 PMTsiron
Cid will be involved in Pandaemonium and blow himself up (and so young...) to seal the Underworld up as we escape -
10-04-2021, 04:55 PMVoidedge_Ragna
Considering how they only killed of unimportant characters for 2 full expansions now ... they got some stuff to catch up on.
A adventuring story no matter how cool w/o risk becomes unbelievable and boring.
You cant tell us like 4-6 years ago that Yshtola is sucking on her own life force to keep up and not do anything with it.
You cant have Ryne be pierced by Hades for 0 consequence
You cant have Thancred go about 500% beyond his limit in that fight and have him been ok 5 min later after a fade out
You cant have Gosetsu and that lady drop into a river collapsed under a building and survive
You cant have Zenos be ok after DIEING no matter how weird your plot device is
You cant instantly bring back ghara with a random plot device after "killing" him, also lets not mention he was shot after innocence died.
Thats just the ones i remember right now ...
Should all of them have died? No ... but dear god if you save EVERYONE ... it becomes boring.
Cept for Ghara i hope he dies by falling down a flight of stairs, that character just needs to go in a non glorious way.
So yea i hope we get some deaths ... because its about time. SE is just worried if they kill Yshtola their creepy doll and other merch wont sell ... -
10-04-2021, 05:40 PMkaynide
Y'shtola is the poster child for the game here in Japan. She's on the time cards, she's in the crossover games, she has a freaking 1,000 dollar doll. She's got plot armor thicker than superman's.
On who would probably have the most impact, in universe, it'd be Alphi. He's not my favorite character, but if we were actually the WoL, his story is arguably the most tied ours. He was on the cart at the beginning, he was the point man for a lot of plot development (and indeed he and Tataru were THE main recurring NPCs in HW).
I mean, as far as I can see he is the main character of this story. We're just the brute force.
..on who I actually see dying on us... Matoya, to give Y'shtola more development. -
10-04-2021, 05:57 PMClereticWhile I generally agree that at this point they're straining disbelief with improbable survival (although I don't think they're ever gonna stop), this one's actually worth talking about because it's the one that's not actually universal across languages.Quote:
Originally Posted by Voidedge_Ragna
English is the only one that outright says 'Y'shtola is sapping her life force', the rest (including the original Japanese) are a lot vaguer in basically saying 'that's dangerous, I'm not sure it's a good idea'. Basically, treated less like the 'she's now on borrowed time' that the English script does, and more like how a worried mother might act when learning their kid is about to ride passenger on a motorcycle. -
10-04-2021, 09:01 PMtinythinkerHis Grand Company of Eorzea dream is a reality, and the main threat to it now is the destruction of the star. Will he go out like grandpa and leave a heavy weight on his twin sister? It could possibly breech whatever has daddy's cheeks clinched so tight. So much pathos-laden regret to fill a series of cutscenes.Quote:
Originally Posted by kaynide
https://astralflamesblog.files.wordp...naud.jpg?w=663
Well, if you play with the Trust for Shadowbringers the game understandably uses what made sense for each phase of the story, so that early dungeons still feature a name in the dialogue text that a character no longer uses.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosenstrauch
Even if characters retire or fade away into obscurity, wouldn't they be unavailable after that point for dungeons that come after any that?
Imagine if a favorite Trust member dies, though, and the only way to see them again outside of the storybook of cutscenes is to run old dungeons with the Trust. -
10-04-2021, 09:47 PMRosenstrauchYes. But one thing you've probably noticed is that the number of available characters never dips below 4. That's because we need a minimum of one character per slot: One Tank, One Healer, and Two DPS. This essentially means that unless we see a significant increase in the available trust NPCs, at least four of the Scions can't be permanently removed from the action.Quote:
Originally Posted by tinythinker
This gets more extreme, however, if the developers expand trusts to include Story Trials. They have talked about wanting to do so in an older interview, so it's possible that Endwalker will launch with all three of its Story Trials being Trust compatible. Unless the number of available trust NPCs expanded considerably, this would not only mean that all 7 currently available Trusts would be guaranteed to survive until the end of Endwalker, but we'd even have to have an additional character join, and they would also have to be permanently available for the duration of the story. -
10-04-2021, 09:47 PMLihtleita
alphinauds dad, redeemed on his deathbed
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10-04-2021, 11:26 PMKeseyI think if Trusts were going to be used in trials, wouldn't they have announced it already?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosenstrauch
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10-04-2021, 11:42 PMGarnix
At the end, all the scions will "ascend".
Y'shtola, Thancred, Urianger, Alisaie, Alphinaud, Estinien, G'raha, Krile, Tataru, Lyse, Arenvald and F'lhaminn somehow force the rejoining of their souls. They become the Twelve. And sacrifice themselves to save the world. And then WoL is sent a few thousands years to the past, and creates a religion based on his fallen friends.
In all seriousness, I think the Twins will have a death fake-out. I can see their mother sacrificing her life to save them or something like that. -
10-26-2021, 09:42 AMtinythinkerWhat about a double-fakeout?Quote:
Originally Posted by Garnix
Like, oh a fake death of twin x, then turn around a BOOM, real death of twin y? -
10-26-2021, 02:40 PMlezard21
I don't think any of the Scions will die, but if one has to then:
- 60% chance it's Alphinaud via a sacrifice to save the realm, mirroring Louisoux's sacrifice. Alphinaud's life dream has been seeing the realm united and at peace so I feel he would sacrifice if it meant seeing that dream come true.
-30% chance it's Urianger via reverse maximum IQ 4d chess xanatos gambit. In the past he has twice, paraphrasing his own words, "bargained with coin not his to spent" so I think it'd be fit that for his biggest plan he would bargain with his own "coin".
-10% chance it's Alisaie. I really doubt this one since the only reason why it would happen is for the sake of having an impact on Alphinaud's arc.
-0% chance it's G'raha Tia or Estinien. They already had their spotlight arcs respectively from which they survived, so killing them now would serve no purpose other than for :GASPIKACHUFACE: shock value
- -10000000000% chance it's Thancred or Y'shlotta. Not only because of their popularity, but also the fact that they both had major death fake outs in Shadowbringers that would have perfectly capped their stories had they sticked, so killing them now would just be dumb and S8 Game of Thrones level of storytelling. -
10-26-2021, 08:14 PMYuella
Both Zodiark and Hydaelyn will be gone. Once we beat The Sound, there will be no need for Zodiark, and then there will be no need for Hydaelyn.
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10-26-2021, 08:29 PMMisutoraru
I have a strong feeling Alphinaud will result someone close to him end up dying.
He have grow a-bit since Crystal Brave, but he is still very idealistic, I am afraid Estinien would be the strong candidate that sacrifice himself protecting Alphinaud for the “mental maturity” -
10-27-2021, 04:00 AMDaemonInazuma
Here's my predictions:
Scions (A team):- 75% Alphi - with his grandfather's dream (and Alphi's) coming to fruition, he's the most likely to bite the dust, Probably in an act of saving his sister from her reckless behavior.
35% Alisaie - highly unlikely, but she is Alisaie, part of the WOL crew after 6.0.
25% Urianger - Potentially saving a twin or both. Retires with Thancred.
10% Thancred - Going to retire due to being "too old for this s***."
0% Y'shtola - Plot armor thicker than a bank vault, off to the First to marry Runar.
0% Graha - Writer's pet, part of WOL crew after 6.0.
0% Estinien - Director's pet, same as Graha and Alisaie especially if Alphi dies.
0% Tataru - She's the only one who pays the bills to keep the lights on in the Rising Stones.
A Scion in name only (B team):- 50% Krile- unless they develop her character more, she's likely to die due to being the catalyst for the Resonant. She's not even on the Endwalker poster. If she lives, moves to A team.
Nation Leaders:- 50% Raubahn - Gets owned by Zenos since they didn't get to fight in SB.
40% Aymeric - I could see a sacrifice to save the WOL, but highly unlikely.
40% Fourchenant - Spills the beans on all of the secrets. Dies saving wife and the kids for redemption maybe.
25% Kan-E-Senna/Merlwyb - Maybe, but not enough evidence besides the new side stories.
25% Hien - Gets saved by Yugiri during a battle with Zenos.
10% Lyse - (Had to edit post because I forgot about Lyse, so did the devs) Saved by Raubahn.
0% Nanamo - Ain't going nowhere near the fight. Will somehow get caught up in trouble though.
Side Characters:- 75% Yugiri - Rematch with Zenos, dies to save Hien.
50% Gosetsu - Dies protecting Yugiri or Hien in battle before Zenos.
50% Fortemps Family - I got a nasty feeling Artoriel is going to bite it, having Emmanulien to take over the family.
50% Lucia - Dies to save Aymeric in battle.
40% Pipin - Could die saving his father or Nanamo.
30% Fordola - Could die in place of Krile. Moves from B team to A team post 6.0.
0% Arenvald - Professor X baby! New Minfilia. Same as Fordola.
Villans/Anti-Heroes:- 100% Fandaniel - Merges with something or other and dies a pathetic Asahi death again.
100% Zodiark/Hydaelyn - Merge to form Ultimate bad. Final Boss. Reveal Zeromus (posing as an Ascian, my bet is on Pashtarot) was behind the Sound. BAM, cue credits and post-6.0 story.
50% Zenos - This can go either way. He either goes full villan or turns coat to help us as our "friend." I'm leaning more to the former unless Emet's secret comes out to play.
- 75% Alphi - with his grandfather's dream (and Alphi's) coming to fruition, he's the most likely to bite the dust, Probably in an act of saving his sister from her reckless behavior.
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10-27-2021, 06:26 AMHiraishinNoJutsuPraying with all my heart and manifesting that Krile becomes extremely relevant in Endwalker. Im convinced Krile is the Scions "Biggest Loser".Quote:
Originally Posted by DaemonInazuma
Eureka talks about it but people don't really care for Eureka. Krile is implied to have Survivor's Guilt after the Isle of Val incident and is prone to blaming herself when things go out of control even if realistically no one could truly blame her for it happening. (I wouldn't be surprised if she harbors some feelings of guilt for getting captured and allowing Zenos to become a resonant even though none of it was her fault)
The reason I went after the Stormblood relic was purely so I could see more Krile and locking one of her stories behind Eureka was a huge injustice. So please Ishikawa do my girl Krile some justice! -
10-27-2021, 06:42 AMStriderShinryu
As a few others have said, I'm thinking it'll more be a case of characters being retired than outright dying. I do think we'll see a fairly substantial refresh of the Scions.
I can see Alphi ending up in Sharlayan as a permanent member of the Forum to represent Eorzea and the outside world.
I can see YShtola taking Matoya's place. Matoya may end up sacrificing her remaining life to return YShtola's sight/aether, or maybe YShtola will just end up retiring partially because of her "condition."
I can see Thancred leaving his life of adventure and maybe even ending up returning to The First in some way to go back to Ryne and Gaia.
Tataru is Tataru.
I'd see Ali, Estinien and Graha sticking with us as the standard adventuring party, to be joined by Fordola as the resident tank. Arenvald will work as a leader/organizer similar to the role Minfilia used to play (and I really, really hope they don't do something stupid like have Cid make him a flying wheelchair or new legs or something. Just let him still be a leader even with his injury)
As much as I'd love to see Graha bite the big one, he's clearly not going anywhere.. sadly.
I really don't know what they'll do with Urianger and Krile. Neither really seems to have a place moving forward unless they give them more to do. I'd love to see Krile essentially take over for YShtola and Urianger as the active intelligence source in the adventuring party but I don't really feel confident in that as a prediction.
If I do see anyone in the main cast dying, it would be Urianger, Krile or Thancred. Thancred especially could go either way, a proper retirement or taking the bullet for someone. -
10-27-2021, 06:53 AMKatie_KittyThis is actually on my wish-list for the .1-.5 patches. I'd like a Sharlayan election arc where we help Alphinaud secure his seat on the forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by StriderShinryu
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10-27-2021, 10:52 AMYuellaI think it's the opposite. Zodiark and Hydaelyn merge to help us fight the Ultimate Bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaemonInazuma
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10-27-2021, 11:46 AMlezard21Regardless wether they live or die, I personally think the end of EW should see all Scions retired. They've already served their purpose to the story and some of them have exhausted all venues for character development they could have. Not to mention that the end of EW would see a conclusion to their primary motivation: the beast tribes, Primal and Ascian threat.Quote:
Originally Posted by StriderShinryu
Come whatever new adventures the WoL would have, I think it'd best be with a brand new group of companions to breath some fresh air into the dynamics of the story. If we go down the Restoration of the Thirteenth route, I can see Unulkahai and Cylva being part of our new team (and maybe the Role Quest NPCs).
The only exception to the Scions' retirement I can see is G'raha, mostly because his primary motivation unlike the others is "going on l33t adventures with my husbando, the WoL", and also because he joined very recently. -
10-27-2021, 02:41 PMRioAlquinThis was my thought exactly. The FFIV parallel is strong with the upcoming content so I am thinking they will sacrifice themselves to save us at some point. Then some time later they will return. This would have almost as much of an effect on FFXIV players as it did to those of us who played FFIV. Overall I feel that people really like the twins, or maybe at least one of them, so this will have a large emotional impact if it happens.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cleretic
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10-27-2021, 05:44 PMMansionI'm not okay with this at all.We are talking "big bad I kill civilians for fun" levels of bad. There is absolutely no way this "friend" awkward boner he has for the WoL should manifest outside of his twisted mind. While I can see something like Zenos realizing he is being used by Fandaniel and thus "helping" us defeating whatever threat comes up, I don't want Zenos to be forgiven for any reason. I'm not saying he needs to die, but he does need a trial for war crimes and contribution to the apocalypse. I'm a bit tired of "the vilain has some background so you can sympathize" too (Fordola, Yotsuyu, Emet Selch, Elidibus and Ascians is general, Mitron...)Quote:
Originally Posted by DaemonInazuma
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10-27-2021, 11:10 PMReynTime
Characters only get killed off in XIV if their death is needed to move another character's development or the narrative into a specific direction.
That's a strategy a lot of stories use, too. Death is a thing that needs to be taken with respect, not for edgy shock-value like Game of Thrones or because actors/actresses had to leave the cast.
Now all that being said...
G'raha should have never returned. But now that ship has sailed and I don't see any narrative reason for him to be killed off anymore. It would also feel forced to have him killed off to give the player character or anyone else some new motivation when that was only going to be effective back in 5.3. He will stay and at "worst" will not be so present in the MSQ after 6.0, busy with other things.
I disagree that Thancred can't be killed off. I didn't mind him returning from the last fake-out, because he was still a necessary "mentor" figure to Ryne. And that last remnant of his development was wrapped up (him being a pseudo-father figure to the closest thing to Ascilia's reincarnation and then saying farewell after struggling for years with the guilt and responsibility that started since Warburton's death). So far, there doesn't seem to be anything else for him. This makes him one of the most likely targets for dying in the MSQ.
Y'shtola is kind of just there to give snarky responses and look cool at this point. Her active role as a character could be filled by anyone, honestly. But I think she's staying alive indefinitely due being a huge fan favorite.
Absolutely no point in killing characters like Lyse or Raubahn. While they still participate in the MSQ, they're already sidelined after finishing their arcs, which is the next closest thing to dying for the plot. They could die if the writers want cheap alternatives to make the gravity of Endwalker feel a bit heavier, but it would have so little impact it doesn't matter.
If Krile didn't die in Stormblood I don't think she will in Endwalker. There's zero signs of impactful narrative consequences for it. She's also way too important to move it forward by being ALIVE for that.
The twins are not dying. They're also the most likely among all scions to stick with us beyond 6.0.
Regretfully I think G'raha is also one of the more likely to stick around longer. While dead or not Y'shtola, Urianger and Thancred are very likely not going to be so active in the MSQ after this saga is over if they really want to do post-Zodiark/Hydaelin content as a turn of a new page.
I don't know where all the speculation of Zenos helping us voluntarily comes from. I see absolutely no foundation for it. He will stay as an antagonist force until we kill him in EW. Same for Fandaniel.
Estinien just joined another Trust slot. I don't think he will die in EW. Besides Arenvald already served as the motivator for Alphinaud's next transformation.
I too wish the "WoL" would die or get canonically nerfed to hell after Endwalker so we could have an excuse to start fresh as an "adventurer" again, because we're already demigods currently and it's getting boring to be worshipped so. I don't think either is happening sadly.
To sum it up:
After Endwalker most Scions will not be so prominent anymore. G'raha will unfortunately be around for at least another expansion. Alphinaud and/or Alisaie will stick with us as well. Estinien will probably retire. -
10-27-2021, 11:29 PMTracewood
Honestly, the retirement angle sounds more plausible. Though Urianger and Y'shtola would be free agents to assist for side content like raids. Also have to consider the trust system too. If say, Thancred dies the only tank would be Graha. Sure the WOL has been 3/4 tank classes for promo material, but that's besides the point. Maybe for 6.x we'll get some new people, or old faces upgraded to a higher status. Alphi I feel will stay behind in Sharlayan, getting the feeling the twins's dad is not long for that world with the way he has been.
If the Scions do disband, Tataru would be heartbroken because she sees them as a family of sorts. We don't know much of her outside that. She tried being a summoner to much fail, and tried her hand and DoL. Maybe the Scions will still exist, but for other things since let's be real there will always still be primals in some shape or form long after the end of EndWalker. Not only that, they've really found their bearings around the Stormblood arc. How else are the scions going to fund expeditions to other continents?
Only way I see the scions disband is if Alphinaud decides he needs to go back to Sharlyan in his father's place to keep the family influence going. Unless their father comes around or we find out midway he's been tempered somewhat. -
10-27-2021, 11:46 PMDaemonInazumaThe reason I see Zenos going either way in the story is he is either Golbez from FF4 or Seymour from FF10. I'm hoping Seymour, but from recent Yoshi-P interviews, they are leaning heavily the Golbez route I feel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mansion
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10-30-2021, 02:49 PMKeseyI think the sub-text of WOL being Zeons' "friend" is to set up that Ancient Zenos and Azem are connected. And if this plot is true, then we have the Golbez situation.Quote:
Originally Posted by DaemonInazuma
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10-31-2021, 01:57 AMDaraliiI wouldn't be overly surprised if Zenos was Hythlodaeus or something.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kesey
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10-31-2021, 10:21 AMClereticI would be, because they really don't have any common threads. Hythlodaeus is an ostensibly intellectually and emotionally intelligent person who at least claims to never take sides or does much of anything to take a stand for much at all. And Zenos is an ultra-destructive fight idiot who's willing to use imperialism as a cudgel while also being willing to burn down an empire, all so he can escalate his senseless violence. They're even set up as different sorts of 'friend' to the WoL; Hythlodaeus is suggested to be a mutual fondness far in the past, while Zenos has an absolutely one-sided obsession.Quote:
Originally Posted by Daralii
The only real thing they have in common is that I don't like either of them.