Still the Warrior of Light in 6.x and beyond? [Spoilers through ShB]

I didn't see this covered over the last several months, so my apologies if this has already been debated, but if Hydaelyn is the source of our power as the pre-eminent WoL on the Source in the current era and if she is removed from the equation in 6.0, what happens to our characters? :confused:

Current Status as WOL

To clarify where I coming from, let's review.

• In 2.0 we learn we have the Echo and can hear "the Mother Crystal", a.k.a. Hydaelyn.
• In 2.x we are called the Warrior of Light because the people of Eorzea cannot recall the names or faces of a group of heroes who fought to save the realm during the Calamity and when they try the heroes' faces are obscured by light
• People begin comparing our characters to the Warriors of Light and after a certain point people finally recognize us as the champions of 1.x or as their successors and WoL becomes one of our common titles among the people of Eorzea
• In 2.x the Blessing of Light from Hydaelyn saves us at various times at the expense of draining the Mother Crystal's power
• Due to the last point, Midgardsormr removes the BoL so we can learn to lean less on Hydaelyn and we continue gaining strength even after it is returned, but it is unclear how much this might catalyzed or sustained by our connection to Hydaelyn (This catalysis need not necessarily draw on her power through the BoL)
• We learned that our character's soul is a fragment of an Ancient from Amaurot named Azem, a member of the Convocation of Fourteen of acted very much as our own WoL character does in going out into the world to solve the problems of those in need
• Our character merges with the remnant of Ardbert's soul (another fragment of Azem) and our character's soul becomes even more dense, allowing us ever greater feats of strength, and at this point we haven't heard directly from Hydaelyn in a long while

The End of Hydaelyn

We learn the Hydaelyn is an alpha Primal summoned to contain/limit her predecessor, Zodiark. Based on artwork on the First, there is even the possibility that her summoning/creation split Zodiark in a parallel to the Sundering. She succeeded Zodiark as the Will of the Star.

It is known that 6.0 will be the end of the Hydaelyn-Zodiark storyline, but not what that means. It is possible they will cancel each other out in balance and return their aether to the world to heal and renew/rebuild it. Or that a new soul will enter the reunited Primal as the new Will of the Star. Or something else. It is possible somehow it will just be "Hydaelyn beats Zodiark to become the uncontested Will of the Star" but everything we've learned makes this seem unlikely. Which brings us to...

The Post-Hydaelyn Era

So, if Hydaelyn is neutralized or dissipated, what happens to our character in power and it appellation?

As outlined above, Hydaelyn helped us to become more powerful with her guidance and her Blessing. Yet that doesn't mean it was all borrowed power. A trainer, coach, mentor, or guide can also help people find and hone their strengths without borrowed power.

This tempts me to wonder:

How much of our power was built on or expanded through a platform constructed by Hydaelyn?

Note this doesn't say Hydaelyn supplied everything, but rather helped to increased capacity or offer stability through reinforcement. We know she helped us early on, but what happened if these supports are taken away? Is that the same thing as the removal of the BoL? Or would such supports have been separate? Do they stand on their own?

This may seem like getting lost in the weeds, but it does ask what happens to our own base capacity without the Mother Crystal. Rather than worrying about metaphysical mechanics we can do a quantitative assessment (0% effect to 100% effect). Or we could a generalized qualitative or consequential assessment (struggles to regain inner balance until we get used to her absence, sometimes has trouble controlling power levels in cutscenes during an adjustment period).

I don't claim what the answer would or should be, just curious what people think.

How much of our growth in power used our connection to Hydaelyn?

Basically the same as above, but in relation to our always seeming to get more powerful over time.

What would we be called?

So if we have been the WoL and the WoD and help bring some kind of balance or renewal, what are we now? Both literally in terms of our aether, special status, etc. as per the above two underlines questions, but also our role? And hence our title(s). Does it still make sense to be the Warrior of Light in the "new world" that is coming after 6.0?



Thanks for reading. Thanks even more for responding!

Your first two questions are somewhat answered via Heavensward, as Midgardsormr took away our blessing for a time, yet we still maintained our considerable power for most of the HW MSQ. We also still have the echo, which grants us other benefits.

We'll probably still be referred to as the Warrior of Light, simply because most people aren't aware of our connection to Hydaelyn and the blessing of light.

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Originally Posted by Steelbreaker25

Your first two questions are somewhat answered via Heavensward, as Midgardsormr took away our blessing for a time, yet we still maintained our considerable power for most of the HW MSQ. We also still have the echo, which grants us other benefits.

We'll probably still be referred to as the Warrior of Light, simply because most people aren't aware of our connection to Hydaelyn and the blessing of light.

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Yeah, I considered that, but we've kept growing after the BoL was restored with little indication of our interplay with the Mother Crystal. I don't expect a power drop or shift but our connection to Hydaelyn is still murky.

My assumption is that Hydaelyn is acting as more of a recruiter and protector rather than a structural support, a conduit, a catalyst, or an ignition. Still, there might be some kind of disorientation period that gets played out in cutscenes.

If SE did want to do a power creep reversal of any significant magnitude this could offer them some kind of excuse and open some interesting plot lines for a time the same way the BoL loss did.

I kinda agree on the name thing for the common folk, but if the surviving Scions and faction leaders adopt something else who knows? Plus, being the WoL is just sooooo Hydaelyn-Zodiark Era :cool:

We're strong without Hydaelyn. That's part of why we were chosen. The Blessing helps, but not very often is it required. We didn't use it against Shinryu, for example.

I'm fond of the 'Warrior of the Crystal' moniker from FFXI myself, as it makes sense - we're serving/protecting a Crystal after all, and also using both the Warrior of Light and Darkness titles as well, so rolling that all together under one combined banner works better. :D

And of course references a past FF game. :D (Also the Warriors of the Dawn title was taken already).

...Yes Vyrerus, I know the 'Warrior of the Crystal' term in FFXI ended up meaning something completely different in that game's lore, but here it works as a term used by an adventurer. ;)

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Originally Posted by Vyrerus

We're strong without Hydaelyn. That's part of why we were chosen. The Blessing helps, but not very often is it required. We didn't use it against Shinryu, for example.

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This feels like you're operating under the assumption that the Blessing is a tangible power rather than an unseen buff that affects us within the lore of the story, though, which I'm fairly sure is what it's supposed to be given how characters talk about it.

I think if Hydaelyn is destroyed in EW, as I assume she will be, WoL will be knocked down a few pegs. That's not to say they aren't already incredibly impressive on their own, after all we took down all the 2.0 primals as well as Ravana and Bismarck without the full blessing, just that it will be more understandable if we struggle against some more grounded threats.

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Originally Posted by GoldStarz

This feels like you're operating under the assumption that the Blessing is a tangible power rather than an unseen buff that affects us within the lore of the story, though, which I'm fairly sure is what it's supposed to be given how characters talk about it.

I think if Hydaelyn is destroyed in EW, as I assume she will be, WoL will be knocked down a few pegs. That's not to say they aren't already incredibly impressive on their own, after all we took down all the 2.0 primals as well as Ravana and Bismarck without the full blessing, just that it will be more understandable if we struggle against some more grounded threats.

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I guess it depends on what you mean by tangible? When the blessing kicked in during the Dying Gasp, Hades initially confused it for the lightwarden's aether overwhelming us. It just most often manifests as a shield or barrier.

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Originally Posted by GoldStarz

This feels like you're operating under the assumption that the Blessing is a tangible power rather than an unseen buff that affects us within the lore of the story, though, which I'm fairly sure is what it's supposed to be given how characters talk about it.

I think if Hydaelyn is destroyed in EW, as I assume she will be, WoL will be knocked down a few pegs. That's not to say they aren't already incredibly impressive on their own, after all we took down all the 2.0 primals as well as Ravana and Bismarck without the full blessing, just that it will be more understandable if we struggle against some more grounded threats.

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I made a whole video about this (Here, if you want, it's twenty minutes long), but the Blessing is indeed a tangible aid from Hydaelyn, although it's less of 'a power granted to us' and more of 'a direct hotline to call for her help'. It comes up in ways that are actually very visible:

1. Helped against Ultima Weapon,
2. Made a blade of light to mess up Lahabrea,
3. Ysayle called on it to get aether enough to channel Shiva in open airspace,
4. Ardbert used it to kill one Ascian with a blade of light, and fail absurdly poorly at killing a second,
5. Was probably how we survived fighting Hades

On top of that, Lahabrea and Igeyorhm curse our use of it in the Ascian Prime fight, but given Hydaelyn's aid is normally very visible, and at that point we saw nothing, they might've just been whiny about losing.

While losing access to the Hydaelyn Hotline would suck for the WoL, it's not something that would leave them completely helpless. Like you said, we kept pace for most of 2.0 without it, either almost all of all of Heavensward (since our only possible use of it was the Ascian Prime), all of Stormblood, and almost all of Shadowbringers; we can definitely compete without it.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

I made a whole video about

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Well, there's also the bit where Igeyorhm confronts us on the Tubing Rock that we used to Ishmael, FROM HELL'S HEART I STAB AT THEE! Bismarck. When she holds us aloft using a dark energy tendril she quips that we've recovered our Blessing, albeit at a fraction of its former strength. It's a tendril similar to what Elidibus uses, though a bit less forceful. So the Ascians are capable of analyzing it, and analyzing how much power it has by itself.

It seems as though, at least with the writing stance they were in back then, it did something that was extremely inhibitive towards Ascian powers.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

I made a whole video about this (Here, if you want, it's twenty minutes long), but the Blessing is indeed a tangible aid from Hydaelyn, although it's less of 'a power granted to us' and more of 'a direct hotline to call for her help'. It comes up in ways that are actually very visible:

1. Helped against Ultima Weapon,
2. Made a blade of light to mess up Lahabrea,
3. Ysayle called on it to get aether enough to channel Shiva in open airspace,
4. Ardbert used it to kill one Ascian with a blade of light, and fail absurdly poorly at killing a second,
5. Was probably how we survived fighting Hades

On top of that, Lahabrea and Igeyorhm curse our use of it in the Ascian Prime fight, but given Hydaelyn's aid is normally very visible, and at that point we saw nothing, they might've just been whiny about losing.

While losing access to the Hydaelyn Hotline would suck for the WoL, it's not something that would leave them completely helpless. Like you said, we kept pace for most of 2.0 without it, either almost all of all of Heavensward (since our only possible use of it was the Ascian Prime), all of Stormblood, and almost all of Shadowbringers; we can definitely compete without it.

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The first one (two?) isn't the Blessing of Light though, it's Hydaelyn directly interfering to shield WoL from Ultima, it's why she's so drained after ARR because she spent most of her reserves protecting us from Ultima. Also keep in mind that Nabriales says the Blessing of Light was what repelled the Ascians from ever launching a direct attack on the Scions and their base, directly implying that it's more of an ambient power than a tangible one.

I have a sneaking suspicion we'll lose Ardbert's soul (it'll be sent back to the First's reincarnation cycle) and be brought back down to 8/14 soul density. With the Blessing of Light gone as well, we're likely going to see a lot more Heavensward and Save the Queen style difficulties, where we're going to get knocked down a peg a few times and have actual struggles in the coming expansions.

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Originally Posted by GoldStarz

This feels like you're operating under the assumption that the Blessing is a tangible power rather than an unseen buff that affects us within the lore of the story, though, which I'm fairly sure is what it's supposed to be given how characters talk about it.

I think if Hydaelyn is destroyed in EW, as I assume she will be, WoL will be knocked down a few pegs. That's not to say they aren't already incredibly impressive on their own, after all we took down all the 2.0 primals as well as Ravana and Bismarck without the full blessing, just that it will be more understandable if we struggle against some more grounded threats.

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Hmm, I dunno. I think we're moving in a direction where Hydaelyn and her blessing will become irrelevant. We're becoming more powerful simply on the basis of gaining more of our original soul while simultaneously unlocking abilities based on the fact that we're Azem. I think moving forward that will be the source of our strength.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

I'm fond of the 'Warrior of the Crystal' moniker from FFXI myself, as it makes sense - we're serving/protecting a Crystal after all, and also using both the Warrior of Light and Darkness titles as well, so rolling that all together under one combined banner works better. :D

And of course references a past FF game. :D (Also the Warriors of the Dawn title was taken already).

...Yes Vyrerus, I know the 'Warrior of the Crystal' term in FFXI ended up meaning something completely different in that game's lore, but here it works as a term used by an adventurer. ;)

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Didn't think of any response to this earlier, but...

No wonder nobody can beat us in FFXIV, they don't have an Ark Pentasphere to gather us(our shards, teehee) into the same fight! DIVINE MIGHT BABY!

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

I have a sneaking suspicion we'll lose Ardbert's soul (it'll be sent back to the First's reincarnation cycle) and be brought back down to 8/14 soul density. With the Blessing of Light gone as well, we're likely going to see a lot more Heavensward and Save the Queen style difficulties, where we're going to get knocked down a peg a few times and have actual struggles in the coming expansions.

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I don't think we're going to lose Ardbert, but I do agree that I think for the immediate future we're going to see a de-escalation in threats. WoL is definitely extremely strong on his own but the way most characters talk about the blessing of light in game, it feels to me like it's an intrinsic component of our current power level.

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Originally Posted by Katie_Kitty

Hmm, I dunno. I think we're moving in a direction where Hydaelyn and her blessing will become irrelevant. We're becoming more powerful simply on the basis of gaining more of our original soul while simultaneously unlocking abilities based on the fact that we're Azem. I think moving forward that will be the source of our strength.

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Bro we're not going to get more of the shards of Azem's original soul because that would require literally murdering 6 people for no reason and absorbing them into our aether, which so far we've only seen primal able to do with an unwilling party (ie Leviathan and Thordan). Also I feel people get way to hung up on the Azem reveal since it doesn't really have any actual impact on our character outside of whatever impact you personally choose to put on it. They were very smart to write it in a way that doesn't affect how you have personally imagined your character. From what we know, Azem doesn't have any powers more particularly special than any other Amaurotine we've heard of which makes you about as especially powerful as anyone else who's awakened an Echo around your level (ie Fordola, Mikoto, Krile, formerly Ysayle; although Mikoto and Krile aren't really fighters at this point in time)

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Originally Posted by GoldStarz

Bro we're not going to get more of the shards of Azem's original soul because that would require literally murdering 6 people for no reason and absorbing them into our aether, which so far we've only seen primal able to do with an unwilling party (ie Leviathan and Thordan). Also I feel people get way to hung up on the Azem reveal since it doesn't really have any actual impact on our character outside of whatever impact you personally choose to put on it. They were very smart to write it in a way that doesn't affect how you have personally imagined your character. From what we know, Azem doesn't have any powers more particularly special than any other Amaurotine we've heard of which makes you about as especially powerful as anyone else who's awakened an Echo around your level (ie Fordola, Mikoto, Krile, formerly Ysayle; although Mikoto and Krile aren't really fighters at this point in time)

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I think we will become 14/14, but it's going to be a very temporary thing. Assuming the final battle will be in the Rift between the Source and all the Shards, one could imagine that the "reflections" of ourselves from the Shards will be temporarily redirected to us. A redirection like that lasting just long enough to destroy the final boss could be plausible, without killing them. Think of it as holding a mirror in front of a light with your hand. The light will be redirected elsewhere, but there's only so long your arm can stay in that position before it gets too weak to hold it up.

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Originally Posted by GoldStarz

The first one (two?) isn't the Blessing of Light though, it's Hydaelyn directly interfering to shield WoL from Ultima, it's why she's so drained after ARR because she spent most of her reserves protecting us from Ultima. Also keep in mind that Nabriales says the Blessing of Light was what repelled the Ascians from ever launching a direct attack on the Scions and their base, directly implying that it's more of an ambient power than a tangible one.

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That's literally what I mean. The Blessing isn't a power in and of itself, but more of a connection to Hydaelyn. A connection that can be strong or weak, yes, but it amounts to having the ability to say 'yo, Hydaelyn, help me out'. Apparently, helping against the Ultima Weapon was a big one for her, probably because it was a prolonged, arena-wide thing rather than a single shot like we see in the other cases.

Knowing that the WoL (and plausibly Minfilia, but that's more a theory than anything) have that power at their back would make the prospect of taking a swing pretty risky--but apparently, that risk wasn't enough to repel Elidibus from being a weird nerd for no reason.

Which also explains Igeyorhm's scene post-Bismarck. She can discern that connection is being re-established, but at that point the conduit isn't strong enough to actually scare her. We can't get THAT much through (although, again, I'm still pretty sure we clown on her and Elidibus without it anyway).

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Originally Posted by GoldStarz

I don't think we're going to lose Ardbert, but I do agree that I think for the immediate future we're going to see a de-escalation in threats. WoL is definitely extremely strong on his own but the way most characters talk about the blessing of light in game, it feels to me like it's an intrinsic component of our current power level.


Bro we're not going to get more of the shards of Azem's original soul because that would require literally murdering 6 people for no reason and absorbing them into our aether, which so far we've only seen primal able to do with an unwilling party (ie Leviathan and Thordan). Also I feel people get way to hung up on the Azem reveal since it doesn't really have any actual impact on our character outside of whatever impact you personally choose to put on it. They were very smart to write it in a way that doesn't affect how you have personally imagined your character. From what we know, Azem doesn't have any powers more particularly special than any other Amaurotine we've heard of which makes you about as especially powerful as anyone else who's awakened an Echo around your level (ie Fordola, Mikoto, Krile, formerly Ysayle; although Mikoto and Krile aren't really fighters at this point in time)

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I'm not your "Bro," and actually we don't know where the story is going so kindly refrain from pretending that you've got all the answers.

I believe your character will always be the warrior of light by virtue of deeds and morality = bringer of equilibrium

Whether you will continue to possess the same powers post 6.0 is however a separate subject. Part, if not most, of your power is derived from you being the reincarnate of an ancient which predates Hydaelyn and Zodiark. It was by this ancient power of creation that Hydaelyn and Zodiark were born. While the game might hint otherwise, I don't think that Hydaelyn directly increases your power in any way. Instead what Hydaelyn did was trigger your memories to reawaken some of your ancient powers in the form of the "echo" and gave you the blessing of light so she could directly intervene at choice moments to save you from certain death.

Another theory I have is that Hydaelyn, Zodiark, and all primals are essentially the same beings. They are all aether (= will of the star) given man-made personality and purpose by their worshippers/summoners using creation magic. Hydaelyn and Zodiark being the strongest of these personalities. By end of 6.0, I theorized that Hydaelyn/Zodiark will be depersonified and recreated to become one consistent entity that will maintain equilibrium. This personality is still required as there is something else causing the fabric of reality to fray (mysterious sound emanating from the depths of their star).

I'm pretty positive nothing will change if anything we got stronger because of the exstra rejoining it feels like the type of posts you read on the wow forum about people not wanting to be the hero but a common adventurer it just do not work also why would you play a mmo where the whole theme is being the Hero and complain about being the hero :D

I assume we'll keep the title just because it's a convenient and consistent thing for voice-acted characters to use to refer to the player.

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Originally Posted by GoldStarz

Bro we're not going to get more of the shards of Azem's original soul because that would require literally murdering 6 people for no reason

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If the unsundered Ascians were able to restore the soul and memories of sundered Convocation members by using their soul crystals, then Venat - if withdrawn from Hydaelyn - may be able to restore Azem using his/her crystal which we have in our possession.

But that would require the other shards of our soul. If they've been reincarnated on the remaining Shards (and assuming our shard on the Thirteenth is still viable, considering it's the Void now), then those people would have to die so we could claim their souls.

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Originally Posted by Vflower

If the unsundered Ascians were able to restore the soul and memories of sundered Convocation members by using their soul crystals, then Venat - if withdrawn from Hydaelyn - may be able to restore Azem using his/her crystal which we have in our possession.

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That crystal isn't a soul crystal like the rest, and contains no memories of Azem. It instead includes one of Azem's spells. So it's less like a job crystal and more like a Eurekan memory or Lost Skill from Bozja.

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Originally Posted by Vflower

If the unsundered Ascians were able to restore the soul [...] by using their soul crystals

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They weren't, all they did was restore their memories and basically overwrite the person they are with the person the used to be pre-sundering. They were (and for the remaining, are) still very much sundered hence why Emet is basically willing to write them off if they get fucked up enough (see Eden) and just generally treat them as lesser.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

But that would require the other shards of our soul. If they've been reincarnated on the remaining Shards (and assuming our shard on the Thirteenth is still viable, considering it's the Void now), then those people would have to die so we could claim their souls.

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Not necessarily. Imagine the teleportation spell grabbing their souls while they're sleeping. We temporarily fuse together, destroy the final boss, then separate and push their souls back to their bodies. If anything, they'd be comatose like what happened with the Scions during Shadowbringers. And considering time seems to be nonexistent in the rift or at least heavily warped (considering the images we saw on our way to the First), the amount of time we'd be borrowing the souls would be anywhere from a few seconds to a few hours.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

But that would require the other shards of our soul.

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It only required one shard of a convocation member's soul, the unsundered were able to raise such a broken soul back up to nearly full potential.

Elidibus, Lahabrea, Igeyorhm, Nabriales...
Those are not our true names.
They are merely the names of the seats we occupy.
And so, it is naturally possible for one to be succeeded by another.
Having lived for this long, I have doubtless seen them fall before.
When that comes, all that is necessary is for us to raise another to the same seat.
And the ones most suited to be raised up are their reincarnations.
They… or rather, their original forms, had their soul split into fourteen with a single strike from Hydaelyn.
I suppose that on the upside, you could say that we now have fourteen candidates for each seat.
We original Ascians will, from among those candidates, choose one of them to raise up, and return them their mission and power along with their seat.
Well, it's not as if it's impossible to raise a completely unrelated stranger up the same way, but it is we who originally summoned Zodiark who have had our very souls eroded by him.
...With souls already dyed in his color, there lies no chance of failure.

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Originally Posted by GoldStarz

They were (and for the remaining, are) still very much sundered hence why Emet is basically willing to write them off if they get fucked up enough (see Eden) and just generally treat them as lesser.

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Considering that Fandaniel is threatening our entire world and what Emet-Selch said in the quote above, it does sound to me like raised Ascians gain almost their full ancient powers.
Of course they would still be seen as expendable by the unsundered.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

That crystal isn't a soul crystal like the rest, and contains no memories of Azem. It instead includes one of Azem's spells. So it's less like a job crystal and more like a Eurekan memory or Lost Skill from Bozja.

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Is there a line in the game that states that clearly?
When you find Azem's stone, Hythlodaeus explains:

As you will have gathered, each crystal bears an account of the life of a member of the Convocation as remembered by the unsundered.
Lest you worry, they aren't concepts; they are far too incomplete to be so. But they suffice for imbuing memories within sundered souls, that they might be restored to their office. [...]
Defectors having been deemed unworthy of commemoration, no crystal exists for the individual in question.
Or shouldn't exist, at any rate─and wouldn't, had a friend not created one in secret.
A crystal bearing the forgotten name of her office, along with a magick of her own conceiving─a singular incantation embodying her spirit.

So yes, the stone does contain Azem's title and his/her spell, but is that all it contains?
The English version is - as usual, unfortunately - fairly vague on this, but in other languages he says that "Azem's legacy" was stored in the crystal.

When you use your crystal in the fight with Elidibus, you hear lines likely recorded on it by Emet-Selch:

Herein I commit the chronicle of the traveler. Shepherd to the stars in the dark.
Though the world be sundered and our souls set adrift, where you walk, my dearest friend, fate shall surely follow.
For yours is the Fourteenth seat - the Seat of Azem.

"Commit the chronicle of the traveler" sounds like the stone does contain memories of some kind.

With G'raha we were successfully able to fuse the soul and memories of an 8-shard person into a less dense soul. If our stone does contain the legacy of an unsundered person, I can absolutely see us fusing it with our lesser version of ourselves to become more powerful. There has to be some reason we made sure not to leave that crystal behind on the floor. :)

One element I've wondered about before is whether it's possible that the events in 6.0 could cause most or all of the world to forget us as some aspect of reality gets reset. Similar to 1.0 -> 2.0, only perhaps permanently. If there is any depowering of any degree that would fit well with such a theme. Weirder would be that (dialogue option wise) we forget ourself for a while. Of course if the world is rewoven that could also have a similar effect - stranger in a strange land.

I'm actually wondering whether 7.0 will star the same PC or even take place in the same setting.

This is the "final chapter in the tale of this star," and 6.1 (i.e. start of 7.0 story arc) is supposedly going to have no returning NPCs from 1.0 - 6.0. The only way I can see that happening is if the PC jumps on a boat to Meracydia / New World without telling anyone... or if "Azem" retires after Endwalker (with the 6.x raid content serving as a sort of denouement) and a new protagonist in a new setting (different continent, different shard, different universe...?) takes up the reins. Like the ending of a D&D campaign.

I mean, by the end of Endwalker we will likely have wrapped up all the cosmic mysteries since 1.0, and it's hard to scale things back and still make them exciting. Political squabbles in Ul'dah feel so blasé compared to trying to stop the apocalypse.

Or maybe there will be some timey-wimey shenanigans, "Azem" will just hop on a boat to the New World without saying bye, or some interdimensional shenanigans will be afoot. Hard to say.

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Originally Posted by Cilia

I'm actually wondering whether 7.0 will star the same PC or even take place in the same setting.

This is the "final chapter in the tale of this star," and 6.1 (i.e. start of 7.0 story arc) is supposedly going to have no returning NPCs from 1.0 - 6.0.

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I do not believe this is what they said. They’ve definitely talked about how the main cast will change but that’s not anything as solid as “no returning npcs”.

Not to mention they’ve stressed over and over that while this may be the end of the Hydaelyn and Zodiark saga, it will just be a new saga in the same world. It’ll be a big change, but not drastic as some people are saying.

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Originally Posted by EaraGrace

I do not believe this is what they said. They’ve definitely about how the main cast will change but that’s not anything as solid as that.

Not to mention they’ve stressed over and over that while this may be the end of the Hydaelyn and Zodiark saga, it will just be a new saga in the same world. Itll be a big change, but not drastic as some people are saying.

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Right, I see post 6.0's story being more like FFXI where after the second expansion Chains of Promathia the story moved to other areas of the world with new NPCs (and new storylines) but occasionally linked back to the 'Middle Lands' and NPCs previously introduced (and eventually had everything tied together in a nice little finale under Rhapsodies of Vana'diel). I don't see Yoshi just killing everyone off to make a clean slate moving forward - the whole 'Final Chapter' thing is just the usual overblown theatrics by Emet... again. ;)

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Right, I see post 6.0's story being more like FFXI where after the second expansion Chains of Promathia the story moved to other areas of the world with new NPCs (and new storylines) but occasionally linked back to the 'Middle Lands' and NPCs previously introduced (and eventually had everything tied together in a nice little finale under Rhapsodies of Vana'diel). I don't see Yoshi just killing everyone off to make a clean slate moving forward - the whole 'Final Chapter' thing is just the usual overblown theatrics by Emet... again. ;)

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Still waiting on that boat ride with Lyon, even though I sold my soul to Odin to save Luzaf's so that Aphmau would start crushing on me, in spite of my soul being scoured by BLU's alchemy procedure.

Also, all the work done to reconstitute Lilisette's entire being, and she goes off to save Lilith's world...


By the time I met Arciela all I was thinking was, "Ok, how's this one going to break my heart?"

Was thinking about this from Yoshi P's New Year's letter...

Now then, as its title suggests, Endwalker winds up the tale that has been woven since 1.0. However, FFXIV itself is far from over, and we've already begun creating new journeys for all you Warriors of Light─or adventurers, rather─to embark upon!

What do you think? Have we moved beyond "Warrior of Light"? Is that a relic from the Hydaelyn-Zodiark era? Not to be forgotten, but like something from a box of items from your travels.

EW Spoilers ahead

The player character will probably always be known by the general public as the WoL simply due to their immense fame in, you know, saving the world (and of course, as the WoD in the First), but I think we've come full circle back to 1.0 where the WoL didn't exist - the player was just a very talented adventurer powerful in the Echo. The fact the Scions put on a show suppossedly publically disbanding, in order so they could continue to work clandistinely in the background seems to lean towards this (the Scions' pre-Calamity predecessor the Path of the Twelve was far more secretive and few knew they existed), something I've long actually advocated, as being the world's 'fix-it' team just brought more problems than it offered solutions, not the least it resulted in their safety and security being threatened repeatedly.

Certainly the WoL will no longer be 'Hydaelyn's champion', seeing as Venat/Hydaelyn is finally having a long-overdue rest in the Lifestream with Hythlo and Mr Grumpy, but the WoL still possesses the Echo, and still possesses the Blessing and Crystals of Light as well (that didn't just disappear with Hydaelyn's dissimination) - they're the most powerful warrior in the world, there will continue to be no shortage of challenges that they will face. And ironically it's totally in keeping with the will of the original owner of their soul (Azem) - whose whole job description was travelling the world, helping people with their problems, studying cultures, slaying monsters, defeating villians and well, being pretty damn marvellous, sounds very much like the life of an Adventurer no? ;)

Which I'm certain is why Emet namedropped all those mysterious 'interesting places' in Hydaelyn we just had to visit too - he was nudging us back into a Seventh Astral Era version of Azem's job. ;) (12000 years late perhaps but still, better late than never I guess ;)).

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

EW Spoilers ahead

The player character will probably always be known by the general public as the WoL simply due to their immense fame in, you know, saving the world (and of course, as the WoD in the First), but I think we've come full circle back to 1.0 where the WoL didn't exist - the player was just a very talented adventurer powerful in the Echo. The fact the Scions put on a show suppossedly publically disbanding, in order so they could continue to work clandistinely in the background seems to lean towards this (the Scions' pre-Calamity predecessor the Path of the Twelve was far more secretive and few knew they existed), something I've long actually advocated, as being the world's 'fix-it' team just brought more problems than it offered solutions, not the least it resulted in their safety and security being threatened repeatedly.

Certainly the WoL will no longer be 'Hydaelyn's champion', seeing as Venat/Hydaelyn is finally having a long-overdue rest in the Lifestream with Hythlo and Mr Grumpy, but the WoL still possesses the Echo, and still possesses the Blessing and Crystals of Light as well (that didn't just disappear with Hydaelyn's dissimination) - they're the most powerful warrior in the world, there will continue to be no shortage of challenges that they will face. And ironically it's totally in keeping with the will of the original owner of their soul (Azem) - whose whole job description was travelling the world, helping people with their problems, studying cultures, slaying monsters, defeating villians and well, being pretty damn marvellous, sounds very much like the life of an Adventurer no? ;)

Which I'm certain is why Emet namedropped all those mysterious 'interesting places' in Hydaelyn we just had to visit too - he was nudging us back into a Seventh Astral Era version of Azem's job. ;) (12000 years late perhaps but still, better late than never I guess ;)).

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That's what I meant by not forgetting it but putting it aside. The peoples of the New World and those on the other shards would have no frame of reference for a "warrior of light", and our characters have gone beyond the light/darkness dichotomy. Sure, those realms that have seen the most our work, particularly Eorzea, may be used to that title, but as you say in all of these new places we will just be an adventurer with some surprising talents.

Thus, for the writing, we have transcended or moved beyond the WoL concept for future adventures. It's a title some characters will always recall or use, but there will almost certainly be more titles and new ways of exploring our characters. We've already become the "Warrior of Darkness" on the First. It will be interesting to see how we fit into the lives and narratives of the places our travels and problem-solving will take us next.

I honestly expect we maybe called Adventurer for a while during Season 2 early years story since we will be heading into unknown regions where WoL's fame and events of Season 1 never reached so for them anything involving Season 1 are unknown events and WoL is just another adventurer from Eorzea on a expedition into their region.

WoL's fame only extends to current regions because each one has always made contact with Eorzea in some form but most of the unknown regions may not even get a speck of information about what went on in Season 1 due to how little or no contact they have with Eorzea and regions that do make contact with Eorzea.

Alphinaud: (Gestures grandly to WOL) “This, is your Warrior Of Light!”

Unimpressed Meracydian: “Well, I didn't vote for them.”

Alphinaud: (Flustered) “You don't vote for Warriors Of Light!”

Unimpressed Meracydian: “Well, how did they become ‘Warrior Of Light’ then?”

WOL: (Puts hand to chin, and ponders)

Alphinaud: “The Lady in the Lake - er, crystal…”

(Loporrits begin to hum)

Alphinaud: “...The lady in the lake that’s also in a crystal - her arm clad in the purest shimmering vanya silk, reached out to the warrior, blessing them - to signify by Divine Providence that they were to be her Champion.”

(humming stops)

Alphinaud: “I… was asleep when it happened - but that’s how!”

WOL: (Nods)

Unimpressed Meracydian: “Listen. Strange women hiding in crystals distributing hexes is no basis for a system of government.”

Alphinaud: “Be quiet! It’s not government! We tried that already - and a man lost his arm!”

Unimpressed Meracydian: “Well, you can't expect to wield supreme executive power just 'cause some sparkly tart threw a spell at you!”

Alphinaud: “Shut up!”

Unimpressed Meracydian: “I mean, if I went 'round saying I was an emperor just because some glinty bint had lobbed a conjuration at me, they'd put me away!”

Alphinaud: “Shut up, will you? Shut up!”

Unimpressed Meracydian: “Ah, now we see the violence inherent in the system.”

Please WoL deserve a HOLIDAY. We just fought a spoil brat and a NEET Prince who’d got nothing better to do IN space on a friggin shinryu’s back and probably being served sh** tonnes of carrots there and back again… Imagine holding back in a spaceship trying not to kill a loporitts to make a good rabbit pie; for the entire trip! Hmmhrph A Holiday a good steak and a chilled glass of gin tyvm.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

and still possesses the Blessing and Crystals of Light as well (that didn't just disappear with Hydaelyn's dissimination).

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Can you provide a citation for this? As many understood it, Hydaelyn's blessing very much died with her. The perceived implication being that the Warrior of Light is now powerful enough on their own to not need it anymore.

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Originally Posted by Absimiliard

Can you provide a citation for this? As many understood it, Hydaelyn's blessing very much died with her. The perceived implication being that the Warrior of Light is now powerful enough on their own to not need it anymore.

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"Hydaelyn's blessing" was a simple traveller's ward that Venat used to protect people from aetheric corruption. Does she still need to be alive for it to function? Hard to say, but given the warding scales provide basically the same function to any npc that has one, taking that power away from the WoL now seems a little pointless narratively speaking.

As for the crystals if light, didn't we break them during the hydaelyn fight? Whatever that means.