The term toxic is nearly useless

Nothing of value is shared when a person uses the term toxic within the context of identifying player behavior. Calling another player or community toxic is akin to saying "they hurt my feelings." But your feelings aren't my own and neither are your sensibilities. Labeling somebody toxic is a vain and futile attempt to transform your person-relative opinion into a fact.

Instead of throwing around the word toxic, why don't you explain in detail what your issue is and make an argument?

It is a good way to deflect someones two cents when you don't want to debate. Why should people have to explain when you can just call them toxic. I find it funny myself, and enjoy it when it gets used against me. I can see why it would be annoying to some, when the hive mind gangs up on you.

Whenever I see the term used, it's more about trying to shut someone down or accusing them of being a bad person for daring to have a different opinion.

I don't pay much attention to it in other words. This is a game that has players from many different countries, cultures and backgrounds. On that basis alone there's going to be a lot of different opinions and angles of thinking.

Even in cases where someone is legitimately being 'toxic' I generally just assume they're having a bad day, part ways and go do something else with my time.

We've definitely started using it too often ("we" here being modern internet dwellers) but I've seen behavior in this game and others that really is genuinely toxic. It's a term worth keeping around.

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Originally Posted by Ayuhra

We've definitely started using it too often ("we" here being modern internet dwellers) but I've seen behavior in this game and others that really is genuinely toxic. It's a term worth keeping around.

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Again, that doesn't tell us anything. It's like telling somebody that a container contains strawberry icecream and that strawberry icecream objectively tastes bad. I didn't witness what you think is genuinely toxic behavior and you haven't provided any details. What's more, that "genuinely toxic behavior" may not be genuinely toxic to me.

I dislike it when people use that word (Toxic) in conversations about the community. As far as I'm concerned it's a crude way of insulting people with immunity. It's also to general, being lazy talk.

Toxic people tends to mean "People I don't like" and toxic behavior means "this used vocabulary I didn't like".

There isn't a social problem in this game that isn't solved by ignoring and moving on.

There used to be a time when "toxic" defined a person trying to put others down, insulting them, that was really bad and you wanted toi avoid.

Now anyone use toxic to define anything they don't like.
You could have a super friendly and helpful player being toxic just because he says to his blm sprout to don't stand in aoe.

So...

Good song, though.

Internet snowflakes killed the meaning of it, strong move in Pokemon games

Technically, isn't toxic behaviour when someone does things that promotes other players to perpetuate an action, attitude or likewise the same behaviour to the detriment of a community?

That's what I understand as "being toxic". An example, someone caps-locking in a dungeon after dying, because a tank failed to hold aggro.

Is the anger justified? Sure, maybe, depends on the context. If the context is, the player is a sprout, doesn't know the dungeon, the player in question was pulling more and the healer didn't have the gear or skill to keep the tank up - that's where a player would be considered toxic. The act of exploding in rage doesn't improve the tanks ability, doesn't make the healer "play the class" better and it certainly doesn't make the dungeon go any faster. And before you know it, this new sprout is going to take away your behaviour as the norm, and repeat it one day further down the line towards another new, or less skillful, player

Even if this "ideal" situation isn't considered, it is the act of perpetuating (knowingly or no) these behaviours that makes something toxic. It's like a venom, spreading and killing the host (which in this case is the community).

There's no real good definition for what "toxic behavior" really is...

But it's really just become a term for "person who I disagree with" amongst certain crowds.

which is sad because you'll have genuinely toxic individuals "ironically" wear it like a badge of honour because it doesn't mean anything anymore

Everything I don't like is toxic.

- The typical snowflake

My definition:
- Intense amounts of negativity that is said/acted out with the intent of mentally harming another person or group of people.

For example: A tank who didn't use any CDs telling a healer to kill themselves and that they're useless because they died.

The other term snowflakes is also over used and used to label anyone you disagree with. Toxic is a real word and there is a definition for it. Calling someone a snowflake is the same as calling a person toxic. So what do you call people who perpetuate bad behavior? It spreads like a toxic venom in a game because all the cool kids just have to be the same and anyone who disagrees is a snowflake? So in this thread alone any point you are trying to make is lost and troll is troll.

Toxic is a general term for 'detrimental behavior towards others'. Its actual meaning varies based on context, and it's usually not that hard to figure out if you have a base understanding of common sense.

If you get called 'toxic' on a regular basis, then maybe it's time to re-evaluate how you interract with others or, at the very least, not make a sport out of antagonizing people who's opinions vastly differ from your own.

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Originally Posted by Snorky

The other term snowflakes is also over used and used to label anyone you disagree with. Toxic is a real word and there is a definition for it. Calling someone a snowflake is the same as calling a person toxic. So what do you call people who perpetuate bad behavior? It spreads like a toxic venom in a game because all the cool kids just have to be the same and anyone who disagrees is a snowflake? So in this thread alone any point you are trying to make is lost and troll is troll.

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The main difference is though, that the term snowflake mostly gets used in response to someone using buzzwords to dismiss an argument.

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Originally Posted by Lexis

Toxic is a general term for 'detrimental behavior towards others'. Its actual meaning varies based on context, and it's usually not that hard to figure out if you have a base understanding of common sense.

If you get called 'toxic' on a regular basis, then maybe it's time to re-evaluate how you interract with others or, at the very least, not make a sport out of antagonizing people who's opinions vastly differ from your own.

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you forget that common sense these days is like having a super power

its more rare than a mount drop

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Originally Posted by CaptainLagbeard

The main difference is though, that the term snowflake mostly gets used in response to someone using buzzwords to dismiss an argument.

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It's literally the same thing that is being complained about in this thread! If people would stop labeling everything they disagree with maybe people could have a conversation. Twice in this thread people are called snowflakes, let's replace that word with toxic it's literally the same thing and why are we having this debate on a gaming forum. Here I'm going to create my own label for these conversations it's called 'the WoW effect' it means people going out of their way to turn these forums into WoW forums. Let's argue about everything and try to make this game into a clone of wow because I jumped on the band wagon and quit but I miss my fix! This opinion is mine but it's right below the surface on everyone's mind reading these forums lately sure seems that way to me

It's a characterization; like saying peoples ideas/opinions/personality are distasteful. It's a perfectly valid word if you're trying to express your dislike for a person or community, but it isn't a valid argument if you're trying to make a real point or debate someone else's point.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

It's a characterization; like saying peoples ideas/opinions/personality are distasteful. It's a perfectly valid word if you're trying to express your dislike for a person or community, but it isn't a valid argument if you're trying to make a real point or debate someone else's point.

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So would it be a real point if someone said it was distasteful? Do you realize you just contradicted yourself?

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Originally Posted by Snorky

So would it be a real point if someone said it was distasteful? Do you realize you just contradicted yourself?

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No, I said toxicity is just a characterization, the same way as saying something is distasteful would be. A characterization isn't a real point, it's basically just sharing how you feel about something.

some people in FFXIV community use it as soon someone act slightly as an asshole or being rude. The word has lost meaning.

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Originally Posted by Sotaris

some people in FFXIV community use it as soon someone act slightly as an asshole or being rude. The word has lost meaning.

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People all over the Internet and it is starting to being used in real life as well, sadly

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Originally Posted by Seraph_Immanuel

Nothing of value is shared when a person uses the term toxic within the context of identifying player behavior. Calling another player or community toxic is akin to saying "they hurt my feelings." But your feelings aren't my own and neither are your sensibilities. Labeling somebody toxic is a vain and futile attempt to transform your person-relative opinion into a fact.

Instead of throwing around the word toxic, why don't you explain in detail what your issue is and make an argument?

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Going against a clique is never fun.

The word "toxic/Toxic" within the world of social communication of definition, description, Troma Theater character/theme, pop song and as insult has surpassed the word "casual" in every sense, as well as "ok boomer" and is about to surpass the level of "Hanzo Main"

https://www.pcgamesn.com/overwatch/hanzo-main-insult

It is getting to absurd levels fast, with little to zero regards on how foolish those appear when they use it unironically.

It is at the late 80s early 90s sitcoms level were parents use hip new slang to appeal to their kids. The ones saying it have no clue how unsettling it really is, and all those around are now seeing and feeling embarrassed.

Though, as these words come in fast for certain reasons, and die faster, it is prime to bring back older words in their place, one that have more bang for their buck.

Cause we all know toxic isn't all that and a bag of chips. Only narcs use toxic.

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Originally Posted by Seraph_Immanuel

Again, that doesn't tell us anything. It's like telling somebody that a container contains strawberry icecream and that strawberry icecream objectively tastes bad. I didn't witness what you think is genuinely toxic behavior and you haven't provided any details. What's more, that "genuinely toxic behavior" may not be genuinely toxic to me.

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So here are two actual experiences I have had when I was a BLM in Heavensward:

EXPERIENCE I: "BLM, you should be using Fire II more on trash pulls" <-- not toxic

EXPERIENCE II: "Ayuh'ra, I hear you are the worst player in this game. LOL, just died again yes, CONFIRMED!" <--toxic

Those are extreme but true examples. I think the difference there should be clear.

EDIT: to elaborate the first example is blunt, no attempt at niceties, but not rude. It's just a fact or advice with no extra bells and whistles. Not toxic, especially since people only have so much time to type in a dungeon.

The second example is what "toxic" should be used for: Being rude, insulting, and to a degree that poisons the well and can ruin someone's experience of that content.

Reminder: If you thought someone was toxic to you or to anyone for whatever reason. It's encouraged to report them instead of just blacklisting/ignoring them as it helps SE taking care of the bad apples.
Of course, there are certain criteria used by the support to identify a toxic person from the rest.

I've been told I'm toxic, I take that as a compliment considering how people are in alliance raids.

I am a toxic mentor bully prude for existing within the presence of other players...atleast that's what I've been told.

I do agree it's overused and used at the slightest of tilted people.

But can you imagine debating and conversing (arguing?) that someone is being a terrible person during a PF raid ? XD
Make a static called Ace Attorney and fight it out in PF. The boss is just the judge.

Toxic in terms of behavior is still a legitimate term. The issue is that it's lost impact due to overuse and in addition to over use its also very frequently used incorrectly by people trying to convince others that they're better or more intelligent than other people. Similar to the word empathy which gets most of its use from improper use because people will just agree with a point if the word is used because they think they'll look foolish for arguing due to not knowing what the word actually means.

It's just another catch-all term for someone else displaying behavior of which one either disapproves of, or dislikes. If this were not 2018-2021, then people would be using other words instead of 'toxic', such as 'bad', as in, "your behavior is bad, please stop."

As a catch-all descriptor for behavior one dislikes, the argument that the term is useless is clearly incorrect, as:

A) The term is widely used slang, ergo, it has use. If the word were never used anywhere, one might argue it doesn't have use. However, the people speaking (typing) clearly differ. 'Toxic' is very common slang.
B) Humankind has always had use for subjective descriptors ("jerk", "bad", "idiot") for behavior they don't like. Even the word 'cool' was used this way back in the 1950s. Substitute any of those for 'toxic' in the common usage of the term, and you'll see it fits. Soon 'toxic' will fade, and something else will take it's place.

The argument to define the behavior that the term is labelling is futile. Bad behavior - dare I say toxic behavior - is subjectively defined by the individual. While we might come to a general consensus on obvious issues ("we shouldn't glorify human suffering"), it's virtually impossible to nail down a definition of 'bad behavior' on the fringes of the issue. Is cursing bad and toxic? For every 100 responses, you'd get 100 different answers on whether cursing is good / bad / toxic / idiotic / funny and the different examples of where cursing is and/or isn't appropriate.