FFXV

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/9972/ffxv.png

Hi all,

Over on alla some posters with a more astute eye than myself noticed that in the XIV logo the I is pretty diminished... making it almost like XV. It led me to think that perhaps the devs are planning to/toying with the idea of calling 2.0 FFXV.

I'd like to have a discussion as to whether or not such a renaming would be appropriate. I'm pretty sure there are a lot of arguments for and against, but I'll kick things off by throwing a few broad ones out there for people to consider.

For:

- The initial vision of XIV has been drastically altered. The realm is still Eorzea, but very little else remains the same. Take, for example, the armoury system. We moved away from an "everyone can lots of things" model to a more rigid, role defined one (restructuring of class abilities/jobs).
- Dalmud/2.0 will result in an entirely new physical landscape. As the Eorzea initially created for XIV is no more, it is only appropriate that this newly made "world" be given it's own title.
- The story guiding the XIV experience will be completely new come 2.0.
- The game has a lot of stigma to shed off. Giving it a new FF number will draw a lot of media attention and spark renewed interest in the game. Similarly, if will lead those with negative impressions of the launch version to believe that there has been substantial change, and the game is worth checking out again. Moreover, by giving XIV an entirely new FF number SE is very clearly sending out the message that they screwed up XIV, and are committed to making a title worthy of the series name.

To summarize: XIV 2.0 is Yoshi's vision for the game, with enough differences from the previous vision for XIV that it deserves it's own FF name.

Against:

- The vision for XIV, though different, still remains largely the same. All of the foundations of the current version are based in the launch version and this cannot be forgotten.
- The fact that Eorzea will appear differently in 2.0 doesn't mean the game deserves its own FF number. Ultimately, the universe is still the same. All numbered FF titles are set in their own universe; XIV, despite all the changes, should be no exception.
- The 2.0 story will be based on/share a lot of similarities with the current plot; there will not be enough differences to justify such a radical change.
- Giving XIV a new FF number is misleading. Come 2.0 the game will still be at its core XIV, with many improvements.
- A new FF number will not help to shed off the stigma surrounding the title.
- The game does not deserve one FF title, let alone a second one even with all the promised changes delivered.

To summarize: There is not enough difference between the launch version of XIV and 2.0 to justify the XV title.

To put this all more simply: would you be for, or against, renaming 2.0 XV? Why?

It isn't going to happen, at all, ever.

SE would not let a numbered title fail like that. You would have FFI - FFXIII then ???, then FFXV? No way, no how. I think that would be completely stupid.

That would be odd.
People would catch on pretty quick that it was a cheap move to make it look like a new game for marketing. Probably even resent it.

That and not having an FFXIV exist is pretty bizarre in the long run.

It would do SE more damage to lose a numbered FF then to keep it, even if it has a bad rep. But perhaps if they were to release Tanaka's vision of FFXIV, with fixes to all the problems of course, and change 2.0 to FFXV.... nah that would never happen.

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Originally Posted by Gramul

That would be odd.
People would catch on pretty quick that it was a cheap move to make it look like a new game for marketing. Probably even resent it.

That and not having an FFXIV exist is pretty bizarre in the long run.

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Yeah I agree it would be bizarre. But I guess the question is "is there enough new/different content and mechanics to justify calling FFXV"?

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Originally Posted by WinnipegJet

Yeah I agree it would be bizarre. But I guess the question is "is there enough new/different content and mechanics to justify calling FFXV"?

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No, because in the end it's still the same game when 2.0 launches, even Yoshi has pointed this out. Same world, same characters, same plot, and these are the things that make the core of an FF title when it comes down to it.

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Originally Posted by WinnipegJet

Yeah I agree it would be bizarre. But I guess the question is "is there enough new/different content and mechanics to justify calling FFXV"?

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I would say no.
Because all that has been done is a continuation and expansion of the original FFXIV world and content. It would be more appropriate to call it XIV-2, but that would require the original XIV to truly exist, and come 2.0, it will not.

I wouldn't say it's impossible, but it would be pretty strange.

Well, I would think renaming it would help with the stigma behind it...

We actually had somewhat of a discussion a while back on ZAM about this game...and actually rebranding was brought up by Azury.

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If you fail, like FFXIV did, you distance yourself, re-brand, and do whatever marketing tricks it takes to make it look like a totally new product.

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Here is the debate that took place on ZAM :http://ffxiv.zam.com/forum.html?foru...27027&h=50&p=4

It was posted by Azurymber post #196. He suggested that they might want to do this so the stigma of the failed launch would not haunt 2.o. Read on more there if you wish.

I doubt they would eliminate 14 and just release 15 it be a cheesy move to do. I think the answer comes from the whole idea that FF should be the FF experience and they've been trying to add things that do this.

Final Fantasy 10 had a classless system where everyone could learn everything the only limit would special limit breaks. Final Fantasy 5 was a job system where you could mix and match abilities from other jobs, granted it was limited.

-spoiler-
Final Fantasy 10 had a place called the Farplane a place for souls to rest. In 14 we have soul crystals which are the souls of dead warriors which allow us to become said job. The Dalamud pictured in the logo seems to look like a cemetary up top which could suggest that it's a Valhalla.

In Final Fantasy 5 halfway through the story two worlds once cut off between dimensions combine back together as one. In the same sense Dalamud could be a fragment of Eorzea that was split apart for some reason and is now coming down to become reborn in the sense that when Dalamud makes contact with Eorzea everything will change, just like how the continents in FF5 changed.

Also in Final fantasy 5 there was a sealed tower which held the legendary weapons, aka the AF weapons we get may be sealed up in Dalamud or in an area in which our soul crystals will resonate with in order to unlock the hidden passage to find them.

Renaming it wont remove the stigma.
People are smart enough to make the connection.

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Originally Posted by Gramul

Renaming it wont remove the stigma.
People are smart enough to make the connection.

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Maybe, maybe not. I just wanted to post about the similar discussion we had on ZAM for a different perspective. I'm not an economist or marketing guru.

I think they'll change the logo. but not the number

i think that XV could be related to eorzea, but nothing more.

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Originally Posted by LillithaFenimore

Maybe, maybe not. I just wanted to post about the similar discussion we had on ZAM for a different perspective. I'm not an economist or marketing guru.

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The primary obstacle with rebranding here is that it's a numbered entry in the Final Fantasy franchise. It's impossible for fans not to notice a rebranding of FFXIV, because there is a numbered continuity that needs to be upheld in the series. A missing entry in the franchise would stick out like a sore thumb.

If it was rebranded now, the game would appear to have failed a second time and the negative stigma would get even worse, rather than better.

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Originally Posted by Inaaca

The primary obstacle with rebranding here is that it's a numbered entry in the Final Fantasy franchise. It's impossible for fans not to notice a rebranding of FFXIV, because there is a numbered continuity that needs to be upheld in the series. A missing entry in the franchise would stick out like a sore thumb.

If it was rebranded now, the game would appear to have failed a second time and the negative stigma would get even worse, rather than better.

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This is true. However, they aren't targeting just fans, they would be targeting everyone. Try to draw in as many new players as possible. Not everyone plays SE games.

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Originally Posted by LillithaFenimore

He suggested that they might want to do this so the stigma of the failed launch would not haunt 2.o.

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I also thought it was interesting that Yoshida wanting to draw our attention to the logo. Why? I'm not entirely sure, but this seems somewhat plausible.

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And speaking of eyes, you might want to keep one out for the logo we’ve put together for the Legacy Campaign.

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Originally Posted by LillithaFenimore

This is true. However, they aren't targeting just fans, they would be targeting everyone. Try to draw in as many new players as possible. Not everyone plays SE games.

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Sure, but SE fans are also their largest and most dedicated audience. It wouldn't be a very good move to further damage XIV's reputation in the eyes of those who already want to play, and are waiting for it to get better.

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Originally Posted by Sav

I also thought it was interesting that Yoshida wanting to draw our attention to the logo. Why? I'm not entirely sure, but this seems somewhat plausible.

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Well, look at it. That logo shows stuff on the surface of Dalamud that has never been revealed before. Serious foreshadowing is featured in that logo.

It seems more XV than XIV ---> X|V

http://static.finalfantasyxiv.com/pl...001.png?_v=8h2

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Originally Posted by Zottan

It seems more XV than XIV ---> X|V

http://static.finalfantasyxiv.com/pl...001.png?_v=8h2

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So the top is going to say "XIV" then the bottom is going to say "XV"?

Doubtful.

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Originally Posted by Alerith

So the top is going to say "XIV" then the bottom is going to say "XV"?

Doubtful.

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Yeah I agree. I just think it's artist rendition of FFXIV in the photo. However, I am indifferent to the name change, I do think there is too much thought being put into deciphering the photo.

It says XIV in the logo, they just got creative with the logo design, which I personally like.

From a marketing point of view it would make a lot of sense to re-name the game. When the consumer has lost trust in your brand name, it is extremly hard to regain it. Even if the game is totally different and much improved, the consumer will still associate it with the initial first impression which was a total fail. But by making them think it is a new product, they are more willing to give it a 2nd look.

Microsoft did the same with Vista and Windows 7. Windows 7 is essentially vista but patched up and the only reason they renamed it to 7 is because by then everyone associated vista with crappy OS.

IMO they should re-name it, doesn't have to be XV but they can add a subtitle to make it look like a new game.

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Originally Posted by Onidemon

IMO they should re-name it, doesn't have to be XV but they can add a subtitle to make it look like a new game.

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That's what the 2.0 is for.