ACTION RPG aproaching

In my point of View MORPGs shouldnt be like the typical off-line RPG, and to be honest they are not... usually MORPGs are most closest to the "action RPG" style, i be seen however people here get all mad over post mentionin anything about action RPG features related to FFXIV.

Porpouse of this post is to watch how many actual gamers would like to watch more "action rpg" features beign implemented into FFXIV or at least "new stuff" based on such features.
Click "Like" on this post if you would like to watch any feature that resembles or be inspired on "action rpg" features implemented on FFXIV and post whats is it that you want to get added here.

If you dont like the idea, please dont multi-post nonsense raging like kid, and just post the reason why you are against it, and what you wouldnt like to see implemented, and why.

In general, if you want something to be implemented, or you are against it, please post about it but make sure to also give a reason of why you do or dont want it.

Sooo... If i click the "Like!"-button there, you guarantee that we get more of this "Action-orientated" thingamabob you mentioned? No crossing fingers behind your back? Promise?

I'm just yanking ya. I'm not quite sure what do you mean by [Action RPG], but if it has anything to do with the current battle mechanics, and changing the flow of it to a bit more "smoother" and less "stuttering", i could agree. A game where every skill-related animation locks you in place, is not fun. It can't be.

I mean, at the moment, it seems we pretty much run from spot to spot, and do our things by slamming the buttons. Usually, i wouldn't be too concerned about that sort of gameplay mechanic, as that's pretty much every game so far has been played so far, and prolly will be played like (let's not count some movement-related stuff, like Kinect, here), if it weren't for the dang anilock.

The lag itself is alredy adding a certain difficulty element to a game that's played in realtime from all over the world. The anilock is pretty much a total moodkiller for me. I personally keep getting my group wiped when i'm tanking Coincounter in AV because:
1. There's lag which tells the server that i'm on the Swing range, even though i've actually already ran behind my group on my screen, and
2. Animation locking has prevented me from running or dodging the 100k-series moves, and the one-timer skills like Featherfoot or Foresight are either on cooldown, or won't proc.

Now, as if these weren't annoying issues in theirself, i can't help myself thinking how will the future PvP look with all this. Think of it. I try to land a skill to a fleeing opponent, who is "out of range" even if i'd run in front of him, and when i finally manage to get a skill off, the anilocking has already slowed me down so much, that the enemy flees without any problems.

TL;DR
I wants more action-oriented thingamabobs without too much stuttering gameplay. Looking towards TERA atm.

The main issue with the action rpg style for MMOs is the focus on "How fast can you press that button!?!?"
I personally don't find that interesting for long and feel there are more than enough of those type of MMOs around. I prefer a more slower/tactical feel to most games I play.

The issues I have with FFXIV's gameplay won't be fixed until we get the new server structure.

even in offline games, action RPG is such a vague term....
Star Ocean... Monster Hunter... Zelda series... Dark cloud... Elder Scrolls.... Fable, Witcher, Fallout... You can go on all day....

Positional conditions for combos is action based... as is dodging attacks...
I do agree with digirotta, we can't really even consider more action mechanics until the lag is in check post 2.0

But once that happens... I would love it if more combat involved some action...

I love the idea of the Ifrit dodging... and with less latency and a better positional system, I think it will be really cool...

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Originally Posted by Rydin

action RPG is such a vague term.

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It's generally the term scribed to dungeon crawlers like Diablo, Torchlight, and the such are rolled into the "ARPG". Typically speaking of course.

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Originally Posted by Jynx

It's generally the term scribed to dungeon crawlers like Diablo, Torchlight, and the such are rolled into the "ARPG". Typically speaking of course.

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but everything from dot/hack to deus ex could fall into the category of action RPGs

All I know is.. right now FFXIV has a couple competitors right now, couple as in I've tested a few games, two of them are quite solid. You guys think this game is fast pace? You're joking? You think PLD has you smashing buttons every half second? LOL @ you.. you're just too slow, I mean that without condescension.

Fact is, SE is gonna need to bump up the "fast pace" and the "action" in this game if they plan to climb up the latter of today's RPGs, MMO or not.

I'd love to see FF13/FF13versus action in an MMO, one day, but i dont believe SE will be the ones to do it, i think they prefer to stay nested, well anything is up in the air with the new team, but i dont see it happening in XIV.

I think it's too late.

They already went back to FFXI with the combat system, and I remember Yoshi said they only have one shot at a combat redesign, otherwise they will blow their budget. It's weird because they are taking all the bad ideas from contemporary MMOs (like silly oversized weapons and dungeon finder) but are loath to accept the good things like more dynamic combat (with emphasis on positioning and better targeting mechanics).

The "combat revamp" was a lie. Combat devamp more like.

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Originally Posted by bobbygunz

I think it's too late.

They already went back to FFXI with the combat system, and I remember Yoshi said they only have one shot at a combat redesign, otherwise they will blow their budget. It's weird because they are taking all the bad ideas from contemporary MMOs (like silly oversized weapons and dungeon finder) but are loath to accept the good things like more dynamic combat (with emphasis on positioning and better targeting mechanics).

The "combat revamp" was a lie. Combat devamp more like.

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One small and simple step forward would be to remove animation lock. Animation lock is just... so yuck. I forget the mental sickness or nerve paralysis where you literally can't do two things simultaneously (walk and chew food/gum), but I swear every time I experience animation lock.. it reminds me of someone with this disability.

Good job SE, you make my character feel like a mental herp derp.

Im probally in the minority here, but i prefer a slower, tactical style of combat, over a twitch based combat.
i want to be able to eyeball not only what im doing but what my comrades are doing. i most definately dont want to stare and click at my UI or have to install add ons that basically put me on auto-pilot. ive watched friends play faster paced mmo's, some look like arcade style fighting, all i see is pew pew pew ... pew pew pew... i dunno.. i just remember my favorite fights being the ones were i saw the tide turn, or just a cool move being pulled off by a team mate. just sayin,, there is such a thing as too fast.. isnt there?

I really liked how in XI all classes had their "spots" or "locations". Thieves went back and forth, pld just straight tanked and mages kept their distance. Apart from occasional knockbacks i don't recall there being much movement, though. Now we're taking a livelier direction gameplay-wise with combo directions, which i totally forgot when i was writing my last post. Not to mention Iffy has nice, directed attacks and Moggle is some wild, fun kiting madness. But by how far can SE go with the current mechanism?

Now, i'm not fluent in Korean, and i really don't know much about TERA (apart from what Youtube and a few fanforums has to offer), but when i see some good action, i'm all for it. So here's me taking a potshot at a MMO that's just around the corner for western release: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XkibMimRU4

Look at that battle mechanic. Basically, you have your simplified skillbar and the tank does her main attacks by holding down mouse1, and blocks by holding down mouse2. Look at it! Holy Seiryu! Now that's some straight-forward, simplified tanking. And look, the knockback isn't just a random bump. The boss's skill either pushes you backward, or runs over you.

Surely you can see lots of anilocking during the video, but at least the blocking is more relevant to player's own reactions, and you actually aim your own hits, rather than let some unexplainably horrid and unbalanced algorithm do all the dirty work for you. And hey, the boss is not one-shotting you!

That's.... That has to be what grinds my gears the most. No matter how well buffed my tank is, no matter how much dualmelds and HQ gears i have equipped, i still get one-shotted by a frickin' midboss in AV! Sometimes it's because my own judgement error, or a stupid risk and sometimes it's just FFXIV and it's just the all lovely UI-lag-anilocking-whatever.

How far can SE stretch his "one shot at the battle revamp?"

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Originally Posted by Fionlagh

Im probally in the minority here, but i prefer a slower, tactical style of combat, over a twitch based combat.
i want to be able to eyeball not only what im doing but what my comrades are doing. i most definately dont want to stare and click at my UI or have to install add ons that basically put me on auto-pilot. ive watched friends play faster paced mmo's, some look like arcade style fighting, all i see is pew pew pew ... pew pew pew... i dunno.. i just remember my favorite fights being the ones were i saw the tide turn, or just a cool move being pulled off by a team mate. just sayin,, there is such a thing as too fast.. isnt there?

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In an MMO setting, i agree.
But with everything (music for example) there will continue to be fusion among fusion of genre's & sub-genres.

As long as it remains fun at the end of the day, i can handle sacrificing a few things in my comfort zone.
FF14 feels like a good mix between FF11 & Most other MMO's in terms of combat speed.


EDIT: I'm also fed up with the cheap 1-shotting aspects FF14 keeps presenting as well. I hope they rework stats again come 2.0.

Where's the dislike button?

This is so far from action-RPG.

For action RPG, it should be something like this :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EiEmnI4wjcg

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Originally Posted by Alise

For action RPG, it should be something like this :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EiEmnI4wjcg

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I think i just creamed a bit ._.

Seriously, that's... wow. Amazing.

i dont think terra will be a threat being a korean mmo = grind & gear dependant like crazy.

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Positional conditions for combos is action based... as is dodging attacks...
I do agree with digirotta, we can't really even consider more action mechanics until the lag is in check post 2.0

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alot of lag in this game is people hardrive reading too slow, i have zero lag with a ssd. but 2.0 should run hell of alot faster if its gonna work on a ps3.

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Originally Posted by bobbygunz

I think it's too late.

They already went back to FFXI with the combat system

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Wait.. how so?

I say no, because I fail at action RPG. I'm just not good at it so if FFXIV went that route I would not play just like if they incorporated platformer type jumping puzzles as I fail at that too.

I like a slower type action in my RPG where its what ability I choose next that matters, not how fast I can choose it.

There isn't anything wrong with action RPGs but they are just not for me.

aCTION BASED RPG AL-LA dRAGON AGE AND sKYRIM in my mmo?

yes please.....

Wait skyrim is action rpg? If it was it sure failed cuz that shit was boring >_>

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Originally Posted by indira

i dont think terra will be a threat being a korean mmo = grind & gear dependant like crazy.


alot of lag in this game is people hardrive reading too slow, i have zero lag with a ssd. but 2.0 should run hell of alot faster if its gonna work on a ps3.

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I think you may be misinterpreting the issue....
It is internet latency (Which is pretty unavoidable) couple with server lag
I switched to an SSD 4 months ago... I know what an SSD gives...

Get 2 computers side by side with 2 copies of the game... on the same server, in the same location...

With character A, run perfect circles around character B
On Character B's screen you see the person zig zagging and stuttering all over the place, and their location will be about 3 seconds behind where that person thinks they are....

Its not hard drive related at all...
We've played enough modern games to know what it feels like when you rotate the camera and it responds instantly....
My characters movement and the camera movement are responsive and quick....
But my communication to and from the server... piss poor

It's not that you're not experiencing it... I think it's the fact that you can't recognize it

Yeah, it's not hardware issue on my end, either. Running 2 SSD's, other's for Windows and it's programs, the other's solely for games. Apart from them, the rest is overclocked and watercooled. Only my location (north Europe) could be anyhow relevant to a "hardware issue", having a constant ping of 200-400.

What it comes to Tera, i didn't mean to post it as a ... um ... possible threat as a competitor, but mainly for the mechanics. The battlefield there lives all the time, and you can dodge enemies attack "in real time" by actually hitting a separate dodge button. It's kinda more like ... Let's say Elder Scrolls in third person, but online. Fighting and is more about collision detection, rather than straigthforward target-to-target algorithms.

As we all can agree, FFXIV not a [fast-paced action MMO] like the previously posted Phantasy Star Online 2 & TERA and it's definitely not a [turn-based tactical strategy] like, Magic the Gathering-card games or Warhammer tabletops. It's more like a combination of both. The battle has a generally slow pace, compared to many games on the market that offers PvP. Take a look at Aion, WoW, Runes of Magic, the above PSO2 and Tera. The movement there is much more smoother and "faster paced".

The issue with the current mechanics in FFXIV is kinda simple.

It doesn't yet seem to know, which category it falls into. They're adding a lot of stuff that requires fast decisions during a slow-paced battle, but at the same time, they prevent players from turning their decision to action with a horrible animation locking. How many times has a player died on Ifrit's eruption, just because he just did a short WS at the wrong time, or the lag killed him, even when s/he claims to be out of the plume's radius?

I totally understood when they wanted to remove casting while running. I can totally learn to compensate the lag issues between when a players stops, and when s/he is supposed to start casting, so that server doesn't claim that s/he is still moving. I have no problem counting seconds and estimating when Ifrit pops his next WS, in order to fire off mine, but what i cannot handle or understand, is why we have player's lock into one position with every goddamn skill they use?

On top of that, SE keeps making their dungeons and achievements based on how fast you can clear content. I mean, there are clearly major conflicts between how we are supposed to perform, and how we are allowed to perform. No wonder the successful speedruns are scarce. They require just a bit too much luck, talent, and a good group who preferably communicate over a VoIP software in real time.

I was not asking to make this game an Action RPG, i was implying into add some features based on action rpgs.

Want an example?

1.-Jumping, swiming, climb walls; yes i know people has been asking for it long time and there is too many discusion about this, and im not debating about implement or not, my point about it in this post is this such of features can be considered from an action RPG, and alot of others MORPGS have it implemented without fall into the category of action rpg, a morpg is a morpg.

2.-A fight that dont be on the ground.- batles while swiming, fallin midle air, floating on an unknown dimension, wathever, is there a law i dont know about MORPGS that restrict their battles to be only on ground? and by the way... Im amazed at the way gamers want this game beign super realistic and have no fantasy... when its even on its name FINAL FANTASY when talkin about this subject in general.... we can fly over ships instead helicopters, ride birds instead horses... but we cant have battles that dont be in ground cause it be way too much "fantasy"?, seriously....

3.-Vehicles with other uses than transportation or use of special suits.- we could take control of vehicles to move around inaccesible enviroments such as midle air or underwater, or use special suits with special characteristics to lets say, walk in the surface of a well known moon that is gona crash us, or dont have to go so far, maybe even just to walk on a land intoxicated with overflow of aetherite energies such like the home dimension of our beloved avatars.

4.-Use of devices to control machines.- like go to a control room of some advanced imperial base, lets say a airship base.

There might be alot of examples other than this ones, and while im aware some of the examples i just gave in this post are ridiculous or go way too far, my point was just that ; THEY ARE ONLY EXAMPLES, i only want give an idea of what an Action RPG feature could be used for this game.

And proper targeting mechanics.