Unpopular Opinion: SE Is Not Obligated To Add New Jobs Every Expansion

Basically what the title says. While new jobs are cool, if 7.x expansion adds no new jobs that wouldn't be the end of FF14.

They aren't obligated, but they have set a precedent for it. For that reason alone it wouldn't be surprising at all to see some disappointed players should new jobs not be added with an expansion.

They have already warned us that while they'd like to, they can't keep adding new jobs forever.
And iirc they implied that in 7.0 or 8.0 they might move to 1 new job per expac.

I'm fine with them not adding jobs after 6.0. At a point, it simply becomes too annoying to balance everything, plus, theres only so many themes.

I'll go even further: SE doesn't have to add new buttons to every class every expansion.

New skills, sure, but the total number of buttons doesn't need to keep increasing.

I've recently made the decision to minimize the number of jobs that I play (ideally to one, but I'll play two if I feel that it'll work better for me that way). So I'm not concerned if they ever stop adding a new job, and might even prefer it since that's less of a chance of being tempted to try out a new job.

That said, a new job is an easy way to gain interest for a new expansion, but if they do it right, they can also thrive without adding more jobs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Equitable_Remedy

I'll go even further: SE doesn't have to add new buttons to every class every expansion.

New skills, sure, but the total number of buttons doesn't need to keep increasing.

---

And some current abilities need to be combined with each other (like Blizzard II being changed to a long range spell and evolving into Freeze)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Equitable_Remedy

I'll go even further: SE doesn't have to add new buttons to every class every expansion.

New skills, sure, but the total number of buttons doesn't need to keep increasing.

---

Has the number of buttons really been increasing? They tend to prune out old skills and then add new ones, as well as started having upgrade skills replace older/weaker versions on the hotbar. I haven't felt that the number of buttons pressed have really been increasing with each expansion. But maybe I haven't really notice.

i feel like this is a none issue//.... Like i have not seen one person say it was an obligation.....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Delis

Has the number of buttons really been increasing? They tend to prune out old skills and then add new ones, as well as started having upgrade skills replace older/weaker versions on the hotbar. I haven't felt that the number of buttons pressed have really been increasing with each expansion. But maybe I haven't really notice.

---

I haven't really noticed much of a difference from Stormblood to Shadowbringers, but from Heavensward to Stormblood there was...a lot to process with some jobs.

They don't have to add anything except the stuff they want to; which just so happens to normally be stuff people ask for other the years.

Why is this even a conversation? Where'd this come from all of a sudden?

I'd actually be okay with them skipping adding jobs for now and fleshing out more character creation and race options for Viera/Hrothgar, etc.
But then its two different dev teams that likely work on these differing aspects.

I'm not sure if people will buy the new expansion if there are no new jobs.

It wouldn't be a big problem as long as they set expectations ahead of time.

Like if they announce the next new job and say "this might be the last new job" or "we're thinking about not adding jobs for the next expansion" so that we don't go into it expecting more jobs next time, then that's fine. But if they didn't do that then people would be expecting jobs, and would be rightly upset if they tried to surprise us with bad news.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fawkes

It wouldn't be a big problem as long as they set expectations ahead of time.

Like if they announce the next new job and say "this might be the last new job" or "we're thinking about not adding jobs for the next expansion" so that we don't go into it expecting more jobs next time, then that's fine. But if they didn't do that then people would be expecting jobs, and would be rightly upset if they tried to surprise us with bad news.

---

They gave everyone a heads up that Hrothgar and Viera can only wear certain headgear and would have limitations as such and every week or news update there are people complaining how they are "unfinished". Do you think people will have a better reaction to this? Any perceived issue will be met with "they canceled making a new job for THIS!?!".

Honestly I'd be happy if they skimped out on adding new jobs if they worked on restoring the class identity to every job akin to how the current iteration of BLM is everything the job is meant to be while also being powerful and getting a mitigation tool it doesn't deserve.

But then again they wouldn't give us a new healer until after they finished gutting the current ones, so maybe it's best to not expect competence from SE when it comes to job design

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hank_Hotspur

They gave everyone a heads up that Hrothgar and Viera can only wear certain headgear and would have limitations as such and every week or news update there are people complaining how they are "unfinished". Do you think people will have a better reaction to this? Any perceived issue will be met with "they canceled making a new job for THIS!?!".

---

The problem there was that they didn't say "Hrothgar and Viera will NEVER be able to wear headgear", and also after they initially announced that most headgear wouldn't work they went and made a bunch more work. They did not properly manage expectations.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hank_Hotspur

They gave everyone a heads up that Hrothgar and Viera can only wear certain headgear and would have limitations as such and every week or news update there are people complaining how they are "unfinished". Do you think people will have a better reaction to this? Any perceived issue will be met with "they canceled making a new job for THIS!?!".

---

To be fair, when you become complacent in accepting laziness from a company, you get the current iteration of Pokemon where even though it's the worst game they've put out so far, it's also one of their best if not their best selling game.

It's one thing for them to set expectations, but it's another for them to set low expectations so that they can get out of making completed products/content while also reaping the monetary rewards of said incomplete product, which is where the 1 gender and no hat Viera and Hrothgar fall.

Without what feels like major compensation (may read as obvious gains from loss) for the lack of new jobs then I think I'd be rather unimpressed if they chose to not add new jobs. To add... Limited jobs, to me, are not a satisfactory replacement concept (advanced, aka both- fit of course). Assuming blue concept doesn't continue to evolve. The premise itself, not speaking levels as that's obvious- PF focus designed jobs is a thumbs-down from me, fine to make here and there for diversity of content, but I won't be excited to see them either and so if they act as the replacement of full jobs in the future I'd not be happy about.

Fair if FFXIV enters maintenance mode though and a new MMO is to be out.

There are also a few more job concepts I'd like to see in this game (or at least in some future FF mmo). Assuming it's not the next one coming... Which it could be lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hank_Hotspur

They gave everyone a heads up that Hrothgar and Viera can only wear certain headgear and would have limitations as such and every week or news update there are people complaining how they are "unfinished". Do you think people will have a better reaction to this? Any perceived issue will be met with "they canceled making a new job for THIS!?!".

---

To be fair, they also said they intended to work on it throughout the expansion to increase the amount as time went on. They haven't, which is why people keep bringing it up. They have a habit of saying things in a roundabout manner or saying things they ultimately don't deliver on. Just look at the Glamour Dresser. We're still waiting on plates working outside sanctuaries, adding more of them altogether, increasing the storage space (again) and making it a housing item. And we've been waiting well over a year now without a single mention of it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fawkes

The problem there was that they didn't say "Hrothgar and Viera will NEVER be able to wear headgear", and also after they initially announced that most headgear wouldn't work they went and made a bunch more work. They did not properly manage expectations.

---

Not exactly. They didn't say "most wouldn't work" then added more; they said nothing would work to begin with, then they put in work so that some things worked.

They haven't made a clear statement to confirm or deny it, but the future compatibility they promised in the initial announcement (when nothing was going to work) may be entirely covered by the extra work they put into glasses and hairpins.

It's always been their statement that hats won't work due to their head design. They're not doing a great job of managing it and it's clear that they don't outright like saying no, but their statements and actions (eg. new gear not being made compatible) indicate that it is intended as a permanent no.

Yes, they promised more hairstyles but they have never explicitly promised hats.

Of course they don't have to add new jobs. It's one of many things they do to create excitement. Excitement keeps people excited about the game generally, which helps sell the expansions.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SecretIsland

I'm not sure if people will buy the new expansion if there are no new jobs.

---

I still would but new classes have never been a reason for me to buy an expansion for any game. I'm more interested in the story, new zones, new bosses, etc.

Personally I'm more tempted by new races than new classes, but I still would be fine with an expansion that had neither. Assuming the expansion itself is great of course.

I can see SE reducing it to one new class at some point because we already have a lot as it is.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Iscah

Not exactly. They didn't say "most wouldn't work" then added more; they said nothing would work to begin with, then they put in work so that some things worked.

---

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme..._with_yoshida/

Quote:

---

Q: With the two new races' unique heads, how will their headgear work?

A: It won't be displayed, because those face parts wouldn't work in FFXIV's system if headgear were involved. Even Viera ears would've had to be moved down to where Miqo'te ears are. It would've been meaningless if you couldn't go all-out creating characters from these new races, so we decided that helmets wouldn't be necessary. You can equip them, but they won't be displayed. However, things that replace the head are OK, like the snowman head, fat chocobo head, etc. No glasses. Basically, the default is that it won't be shown, and only things that replace the head are ok. We'll make more things compatible over time, bit by bit, but they won't be compatible at launch.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fawkes

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme..._with_yoshida/

---

So, Yoshida's plan was to make more (not all) things compatible, over time, bit by bit, and definitely not at launch of Shadowbringers. Then the devs decided to work overtime and added 540+ items in one go. I think that probably covers Yoshida's plan, as Iscah mentioned.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by linayar

So, Yoshida's plan was to make more (not all) things compatible, over time, bit by bit, and definitely not at launch of Shadowbringers. Then the devs decided to work overtime and added 540+ items in one go. I think that probably covers Yoshida's plan, as Iscah mentioned.

---

:confused:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Iscah

Not exactly. They didn't say "most wouldn't work" then added more; ; they said nothing would work to begin with

---

Quote:

---

However, things that replace the head are OK, like the snowman head, fat chocobo head, etc.

---

He said what I said he said.

They should stop adding more and more jobs just for the sake of it. Some of the existing jobs became too simplistic and boring and others lost their identity.
Balance is very hard to maintain with that many jobs.
I would rather see more depth to the current ones and allocate resources on adding more content.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItMe

They have already warned us that while they'd like to, they can't keep adding new jobs forever.
And iirc they implied that in 7.0 or 8.0 they might move to 1 new job per expac.

---

Would be absolutely fine with this, to be honest. I just hope that whatever new jobs they add are entirely new.

If, at some point, the devs say they can't add new jobs... I'm fine with that, too. Been playing this game for nearly 8 years. I can't bring myself to even begin to muster the energy to get mad at X or Y development decision at this point.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Fawkes

:confused:





He said what I said he said.

---

Sure. I was simply commenting on the article you posted and then referred to this part of Iscah's post outside of the parentheses:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Iscah

They haven't made a clear statement to confirm or deny it, but the future compatibility they promised in the initial announcement (when nothing was going to work) may be entirely covered by the extra work they put into glasses and hairpins.

---

The point that I think is more relevant is that not all head gears (in the majority even if not all) would work and that Yoshida only planned to make more (not all, maybe not even the majority) compatible over time, slowly, and not necessarily/explicitly new ones either.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hazama999

Would be absolutely fine with this, to be honest. I just hope that whatever new jobs they add are entirely new.

If, at some point, the devs say they can't add new jobs... I'm fine with that, too. Been playing this game for nearly 8 years. I can't bring myself to even begin to muster the energy to get mad at X or Y development decision at this point.

---

I played WoW long enough that I saw Blizzard become the very monster they originally hated. When you're as jaded as I am it's pretty easy to call bull on certain decisions. lol Even so, if they decided to stop adding new jobs...I probably wouldn't care too much, so long as they allocated such resources to refine something else.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vahlnir

I played WoW long enough that I saw Blizzard become the very monster they originally hated. When you're as jaded as I am it's pretty easy to call bull on certain decisions. lol Even so, if they decided to stop adding new jobs...I probably wouldn't care too much, so long as they allocated such resources to refine something else.

---

Yeah, I think it'd be great if they allocated those resources on other stuff, if it gets to that point. Far as the jadedness is concerned, I think that I've come to develop what I would term a "healthy" amount of apathy towards... well, video games in general at this point. Don't get me wrong, I still enjoy them, and I still disagree with some decisions dev takes. I just don't think I have it in me to go barking at them or dive deeper into X or Y discourse... and that's alright for me.

From what I understand it would mostly be the gear/weapons that hold back new jobs in future. They're already struggling to keep up with new designs, really shows with gnb and dnc. That being said I suppose if new jobs ended up just sharing weapons and such, then maybe they could continue well into the future.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ForteNightshade

To be fair, they also said they intended to work on it throughout the expansion to increase the amount as time went on. They haven't, which is why people keep bringing it up. They have a habit of saying things in a roundabout manner or saying things they ultimately don't deliver on. Just look at the Glamour Dresser. We're still waiting on plates working outside sanctuaries, adding more of them altogether, increasing the storage space (again) and making it a housing item. And we've been waiting well over a year now without a single mention of it.

---

Not only working on hats but also promising new race exclusive hairstyles for these two races..another point that never happened. And imo you cant blame it on Covid.

Also alot of the discussion comes from them not including hats for seasonal events that can be worn by the new races or making it the only true reward of it and also barely including new hats in new content...people might have been fine with no older hats but there is imo no reason why most of the new stuff does not work with the new races, especially since they already lose out on hairstyles too...

@OP: Yes they dont need to add a job at every new expansion but then the people also dont have to like that and it can cost them some money, especially if they dont have something else to show for it.

Would prefer they actually strip some away and instead further extend current jobs with more ways to go

I wish jobs had more buttons to press.

Especially if they end up limited

I'm fully expecting only 1 new job in 7.0 onwards, not including Limited Jobs.

I would strongly prefer them using 1 expansion to do a huge overhaul of the game. Take all of the resources that would normally go into new jobs + the huge story quest chain, use that time instead to improve the stuff we already have.

Graphics engine update, more hats and hair for viera/hrothgar, fixes for ARR stuff including Praetorium, maybe updates to squadrons and chocobo companion system, etc. Just fix and enhance all of the stuff they usually don't have time for because they keep prioritising adding hundreds of new quests. Bring the lighting and visual effects up to current gen spec.

That stuff would make me more interested in the game again than dozens more hours of poorly animated cutscenes and solo battle instances that are pretty much reskins of old fight mechanics and are never repeated after first clear.

They also don't have to add new content. But they have to make our sub worth it. If not, players will stop paying. Simple as that.

They don't need to add new skills or skill replacements either, they don't need to add new mounts or new minions either.
It's all about value, what are they going to replace not adding new jobs with? Are they going to update the character creator? add missing genders? add DX12? Rework the physics engine? Add more character options like more faces, voices, etc?

It's not about whether they have to add new jobs, it's more about what would they replace that with? The msq alone can't sell the expansion.