I Hope SE Learned Their Lesson From Eureka And Bozja

Relic weapons should not be tied to exclusive content, they should be able to access via common content, like FATEs, Dungeons, Non-Extreme Trials, and various other casual content. I think HW did it best.

Maybe I'm just reading your post incorrectly, but how is an area everyone has access to just for doing story "exclusive" and not "common?"

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Styrmwyda

Relic weapons should not be tied to exclusive content, they should be able to access via common content, like FATEs, Dungeons, Non-Extreme Trials, and various other casual content. I think HW did it best.

---

Yes making special content is good for relic. Running the same old tired stuff is what we got because people complained about it. The new raid dungeon is a beautiful example of new content that is different and worth running. Running Syrus Towrer, Void, and Rab sure isn't what i call fun.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItMe

Maybe I'm just reading your post incorrectly, but how is an area everyone has access to just for doing story "exclusive" and not "common?"

---

By common I mean that people would continue doing it and it would be easy to find players to do it with you. Daily Roulettes, for example. Meanwhile, if lets say if someone who started Eureka recently, well, most people have already gotten their relics for that, so, people have less reason to do that content again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Yes making special content is good for relic. Running the same old tired stuff is what we got because people complained about it. The new raid dungeon is a beautiful example of new content that is different and worth running. Running Syrus Towrer, Void, and Rab sure isn't what i call fun.

---

I was more refering to the exclusive zones like Eureka and Bozja. Dungeons/ Trials/ Raids unlocked for the Relic weapons is ok, as those can be added to roulettes, and can continue to be relevant even when stuff like Eureka and Bozja die.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

The new raid dungeon is a beautiful example of new content that is different and worth running.

---

It's worth running now. What about a year from now when it may be literally impossible to find 23/47 other people?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brightamethyst

It's worth running now. What about a year from now when it may be literally impossible to find 23/47 other people?

---

47 people for what? Eureka has been nerfed into the ground you can spawn and kill NM's with 3 people. I'm sure they'll find a way for the new relic as well. Castrum need s to go DF like Delubrum. I'd rather see them drop relic all together than continue to just use old content as a filler and call it something special.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ItMe

Maybe I'm just reading your post incorrectly, but how is an area everyone has access to just for doing story "exclusive" and not "common?"

---

Give it a few weeks then tell us all how easy it is for everyone to access Castrum and DR.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Goji1639

Give it a few weeks then tell us all how easy it is for everyone to access Castrum and DR.

---

Lets be sure to listen to the same old doom and gloom crowd who said Eureka Anemos would be dead after the first wave of people got to level 20.

Don't you only have HW OP

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Goji1639

Give it a few weeks then tell us all how easy it is for everyone to access Castrum and DR.

---

DR has a weekly quest and tons of stuff people want in there for themselves or to sell that wont drop in price anytime soon itll be fine for some time

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Lets be sure to listen to the same old doom and gloom crowd who said Eureka Anemos would be dead after the first way of people got to level 20.

---

Or we could listen to common sense, as we all very recently watched Castrum die almost immediately after it was released.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Goji1639

Or we could listen to common sense, as we all very recently watched Castrum die almost immediately after it was released.

---

Sure i have more faith in the developers to make adjustments if necessary than listen to you. Heard the same old same old for Eureka and it turned out pretty well.

I don't think SE would learn that lesson. They don't care if we like the content or if we're happy or if we finish our relic or not, only that we spend X amount of time trying to do it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Brightamethyst

It's worth running now. What about a year from now when it may be literally impossible to find 23/47 other people?

---

What I find funny is that people deliberately forget that nothing is set in stone, especially in an MMO. CT is like a million years old and people still run it to this day. How do you explain that. Who's to say we won't get it added to DF with a nice reward further down the line?

And I'm happy we a starting more and more to see new stuff and not always the same boring stuff. I appreciate Ocean Fishing, Bozja and the Emerald Weapon fight. It's high time to at least break free a little from that tired old formula.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Sure i have more faith in the developers to make adjustments if necessary than listen to you. Heard the same old same old for Eureka and it turned out pretty well.

---

I wasn't around for Eureka, but from what I've heard people don't sound very happy with it. The way Eureka turned out seems to be the reason everyone was so pessimistic about Bozja, and so far Bozja isn't off to a very reassuring start.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Goji1639

I wasn't around for Eureka, but from what I've heard people don't sound very happy with it. The way Eureka turned out seems to be the reason everyone was so pessimistic about Bozja, and so far Bozja isn't off to a very reassuring start.

---

Well maybe you ought to try it. Was some of the most fun content for me and for many others. Perhaps not the time to give it a go given everyone is doing the new content right now but I somewhat recently took an alt through it and got her an Hydatos WHM relic. I'd love to do BA with her at some point.

That's not to say there weren't people unhappy with it but hey that is what makes the world go around. I will say that I am far from thrilled having to run ST, Void and Rab and somehow call that special relic content.

We can certainly agree that Castrum has it's issues and it's beyond me why they haven't adjusted the rewards there significantly but that's not to say they won't if they are forced to have to do it at some point.

If I'm being perfectly honest I think I might actually prefer eureka when there's 20-40 people in a zone as opposed to 144. I feel like the people who are complaining about eureka being dead or empty haven't actually gone into eureka. Or they went in once, didn't see a train, assumed it was literally impossible and left.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Styrmwyda

access via common content, like FATEs

---

I've actually had enough of FATEs, NMs, skirmishes, and CEs. These kinds of "open world content" are just not for me. I prefer instanced battle contents that I can queue into any time I want rather than contents that make me try to spawn enemies or wait for them to spawn by themselves, often at an inconvenient time (like when I'm watching a cutscene or doing other things).

In fact, I don't know of any open world content in any MMO that I've ever liked except possibly for guildleve, and again, that's because I can choose when to start a guildleve.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Well maybe you ought to try it. Was some of the most fun content for me and for many others. That's not to say there weren't people unhappy with it but hey that is what makes the world go around. I will say that I am far from thrilled having to run ST, Void and Rab and somehow call that special relic content.

We cam certainly agree that Castrum has it's issues and it's beyond me why they haven't adjusted the rewards there significantly but that's not to say they won't if they are forced to have to do it at some point.

---

Eureka has been fun for the most part (Pagos I was really not a fan of which is a shame because I love snow zones), but yes I agree that running ST, Mhach, and Ivalice is not thrilling content and you kind of are forced to run these because the alternatives CEs and Fates have such a low drop rate its not even worth your time grinding on them and that seriously needs to be buffed.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Duskane

Don't you only have HW OP

---

Yes, which is why I am concerned by the time I get Shadowbringers (or the latest expansion) stuff like Eureka will be even harder to find people for.

always find people in all Eureka zones during peak hours
either spawning fates or Rabbit fates.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by linayar

I've actually had enough of FATEs, NMs, skirmishes, and CEs. These kinds of "open world content" are just not for me. I prefer instanced battle contents that I can queue into any time I want rather than contents that make me try to spawn enemies or wait for them to spawn by themselves, often at an inconvenient time (like when I'm watching a cutscene or doing other things).

In fact, I don't know of any open world content in any MMO that I've ever liked except possibly for guildleve, and again, that's because I can choose when to start a guildleve.

---

Ok, maybe not FATEs, at least, not specific FATEs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Payadopa

What I find funny is that people deliberately forget that nothing is set in stone, especially in an MMO. CT is like a million years old and people still run it to this day. How do you explain that. Who's to say we won't get it added to DF with a nice reward further down the line?

---

Because CT has actual incentives to run it? CLL has no incentive and some pretty glaring disincentives. There was a glimmer of hope that CLL would be doable for a couple weeks on the assumption people were interested in getting to the next step. Big nope.

Square's had ample opportunity to course correct CLL and they did nothing. Maybe they like being embarrassed. Will they get around to fixing this? I sure hope so but I've lost what little faith that they even care.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Styrmwyda

Yes, which is why I am concerned by the time I get Shadowbringers (or the latest expansion) stuff like Eureka will be even harder to find people for.

---

you don't really need a lot of people tbf. Eureka was adjusted enough for a small group of people being able to do everything with no issue - find 2-3 friends who're up for some farm and you're fine. There's a very high chance that it will be the same with Bozja.

The only really concerning part is dungeons like Baldesion and Litore/Delubrum. They should eventually add them to normal DF, maybe even dedicate a separate Daily Roulette for that cuz that's the only part of Eureka and Bozja that can noticeably die out (though people still run Baldesion to this day).

Yeah I don't think you should assume content "dies" after its current expansion like it does in other MMOs, populations dip but not to an extent that it can't be completed.

I prefer Bozja/Eureka over the HW method, tbh.

I'll agree that they probably shouldn't have required Castrum and DR, without informing the playerbase prior. But I do think Castrum/DR ought to be the premier methods to advance the relic steps, above to doing LoTA ten minute runs.

Stuff like Castrum/DR'll last so long as there's incentives for it to last. Baldesion Arsenal is still done, to this day, mostly just for the Ozma mount and partly for the cosmetic drops inside.

They can make the most fun fight in the game, but ultimately, if there's no incentive no one will do it. Castrum struggling to fill has more of an issue with its rewards vs. it's risks (20 coins and some actions vs. potentially 20-40k mettle loss pending how frequently someone dies).

That said, Castrum fights aren't that hard relative to even other 24 man fights baseline. Some minor coordination, and 1 group functional enough to do the Lyon portion of the final fight... but mechanically speaking, they're... about the same as most 24 mans. Just with the added benefit of being able to make them easier via Lost Actions.

DR itself isn't really that rough, either. Mechanics in there are pretty intuitive to figure out, and again, Lost Actions make it all the easier.

Doom can be rough I spose, but tbh, pop on a re-raiser if you need to and have someone carry around Lost Arise. But ultimately, aside from a minor mettle loss, dying there isn't that big of a deal (and if you have 0 intention to do it again, then the mettle you lose in there, at that point, literally doesn't matter).

I agree with decoupling the mandatory aspect, but I disagree with removing Exploratory Content entirely from a relic grind, especially if it's done alongside a more traditional HW-style.

I much prefer Bozja than outdated fates.

My biggest fear on the announcement showcase? That they will proudly announce they have doubled-down on their Eurekan Mistake.

So I've got mixed feelings on having an exclusive zone. On one hand, it could be very fun to go through the zone-specific lore with an engaging story line where they can do some new things. On the other hand, if you can only ever go there, you start feeling a bit isolated. You may still have daily things you wanna do but, nope, gotta grind here. I felt that very much going through Eureka.

The other issue place where things come to a head is the zone caters to only a certain type of player. That player likes to jump into the content, grind continuously, jump into something like CLL, grind that, and then hop on to something else. Which is fine if players who don't have that mentality never have to deal with it. Then SE can make that a zone that is rich and rewarding to the players who like that.

However, now after giving outside Bozja options in the first step, they tied to the relic to it. So they're trying to drag people who aren't their target audience kicking and screaming into the zone by locking an item that those people are intended audience for behind having to deal with the zone. This is exacerbated by the idea that they didn't listen to the pro-zone folks on improvements, so they didn't make the zone rich and rewarding so those pro-zone folks can keep things alive for the anti-zone folks.

If they really want to do this, they have two options. Make the quest line for the relic zone-agnostic. Allow updates at equal rates both outside and inside their special instanced zone, so people can choose the level they interact with it. The bonus here is that presented with the choice, many may get curious and try some things out and find something they actually enjoy there.

The second option, and in my opinion the better option, is do things to make the zone appealing to both sides. For Bozja specifically, make normal mobs, daily quests, and the challenge log give mettle. Keep all the special other drops because those could turn into those "hey I really liked this part" for the anti-zone folks. Make the relic quest line a solo quest line with an option to group. So if they want to top an arc with a group instance, have a group instance and a Trust version. Take things like CLL and DR and make them optional challenges. Make them worth doing. I think I see a lot of folks saying if they weren't just a mettle sink but if completion helped you get that mettle back or gave you a boost or rewarded you in some other substantial way, they would be a lot more willing to tackle that challenge.

I think if SE just put in a bit of effort to entice with the carrot instead of prod with the stick to do their content, they'd see a significant improvement of participation, at least among their NA audience. And they would boost the morale of the player base, because there wouldn't be so many who were just doing the content through gritted teeth. They would want to be there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alaray

I'll agree that they probably shouldn't have required Castrum and DR, without informing the playerbase prior. But I do think Castrum/DR ought to be the premier methods to advance the relic steps, above to doing LoTA ten minute runs.

---

They did though, literal months ago.

"Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal
2 upgrade steps and you can customize the substats during the 2nd upgrade" ~ Yoshi-P, 11/27/2020, liveletter from the producer LXI.

The Bozja story includes castrum; they gave extremely advanced warning to go get Castrum done.

I do agree however Bozja should have been the premier choice for advancing the relic.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Styrmwyda

By common I mean that people would continue doing it and it would be easy to find players to do it with you. Daily Roulettes, for example. Meanwhile, if lets say if someone who started Eureka recently, well, most people have already gotten their relics for that, so, people have less reason to do that content again.

---

(Hot damn I looked away for a few hours and this thread already has 3 pages?)
Ah, I understand the distinction you're trying to make. Thanks for clarifying.

As long as Boz has juicy rewards people keep coming back for the content can stay healthy enough to survive. Eureka is one of the best places to farm poetics, so this week (while working on my HW relic ironically enough) I've spent hours in eureka engaged in spawning and calling out NMs.

Though I do hope that they're done adding "public dungeon access zones" after this, because having 2 (one of them being 4 zones) is already kinda stretching things pretty thin.

And you're def right, the cards are stacked against it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daeriion_Aeradiir

They did though, literal months ago.

"Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal
2 upgrade steps and you can customize the substats during the 2nd upgrade" ~ Yoshi-P, 11/27/2020, liveletter from the producer LXI.

The Bozja story includes castrum; they gave extremely advanced warning to go get Castrum done.

---

Problem is their English audience has to rely on unofficial translations of those Live Letters and you can find five or six different answers with no official statement for the English audience to go by. I went looking a few days before patch and still couldn't find anything definitive, just various suppositions from different sites. They really need to make sure we get official statements on this sort of thing. Especially because they have seen (or should have unless they're just outright ignoring us) the confusion and questions over the past few months and did nothing to definitively clarify.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Problem is their English audience has to rely on unofficial translations of those Live Letters and you can find five or six different answers with no official statement for the English audience to go by. I went looking a few days before patch and still couldn't find anything definitive, just various suppositions from different sites. They really need to make sure we get official statements on this sort of thing. Especially because they have seen (or should have unless they're just outright ignoring us) the confusion and questions over the past few months and did nothing to definitively clarify.

---

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...812-06-2020%29

They put up official digest translations of their liveletters in a very official manner. Even in this digest, they reference this:

"The normal version of Delubrum Reginae will be required to complete story quests, and is similar to alliance raids in terms of difficulty."
"Players can upgrade their weapon after completing all 5.45 quests."

Considering the liveletter talks about new story quests in Bozja....it's impossible to interpret it any other way.

Even beyond that, the reddit discord has extremely powerful translators that not only do live translating, but also go back and solidify the translations later to clear up any doubt. bozja's story being required to progress the relic has been telegraphed for literal months now, both in an official and non-official manner. Anyone needing to have information cleared up has both an official source and non-official source both saying the same thing in 95% of cases.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daeriion_Aeradiir

They did though, literal months ago.

"Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal
2 upgrade steps and you can customize the substats during the 2nd upgrade" ~ Yoshi-P, 11/27/2020, liveletter from the producer LXI.

The Bozja story includes castrum; they gave extremely advanced warning to go get Castrum done.

I do agree however Bozja should have been the premier choice for advancing the relic.

---

The problem with this argument is that you knew you had to do it because you did it. If you went off the only translations we get for a lot of this, you could have been left in the dark. We were told the weapon could be completed outside of the exploratory zones, and after we completed the first trial, everything else could be done elsewhere. It caught a lot of people off guard to learn that now they had to get to rank 10 in the exporatory zone and complete 2 24-man raids before they could even start on the next step. It was not telegraphed well, and the translations we recieved gave no indication that you'd still have to advance in the zone even if you did your entire weapon elsewhere.

Additionally, I feel like forcing people to advance the exploratory zone in order complete the weapon runs counter to the concept of the relic, which had previously been something you could work on solo, even just with just an hour a day. Now you have to spend extra time in another zone to do additional content to just get to the quests, and have to do it in a scenario where you're unable to use duty finder to progress. When I'm in game, I don't want to try to type to talk to people. It's inconvenient on PlayStation, and I don't want to be chatty with other players.

So while I do think that the exploratory zone being popular with those who enjoy that kind of content should still be an option for the relic, it shouldn't be mandatory. Giving people options was a very good choice, but it just feels like a betrayal to be told that now you must go do content you didn't enjoy if you want the weapon.

Edit: with regard to your other link, this still wasn't "literally months ago" that post was from December 20, and is one line only that, unfortunately, wasn't broadcast out there the same way as the message of "you can do this outside of Bojza" was. But even if you did catch that, it only gave you a couple weeks to get ready, not months.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daeriion_Aeradiir

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...812-06-2020%29

They put up official digest translations of their liveletters in a very official manner. Even in this digest, they reference this:

"The normal version of Delubrum Reginae will be required to complete story quests, and is similar to alliance raids in terms of difficulty."
"Players can upgrade their weapon after completing all 5.45 quests."

Considering the liveletter talks about new story quests in Bozja....it's impossible to interpret it any other way.

Even beyond that, the reddit discord has extremely powerful translators that not only do live translating, but also go back and solidify the translations later to clear up any doubt. bozja's story being required to progress the relic has been telegraphed for literal months now, both in an official and non-official manner. Anyone needing to have information cleared up has both an official source and non-official source both saying the same thing in 95% of cases.

---

That only mentions the story, though. That doesn't say anything about the story being required for resistance weapons, like where you linked. The first quest we get outside that zone. That's the problem I think. I definitely saw a lot of confusion where people asked "Is the Bozja story going to be required now?" and similar. The second sentence could be interpreted that you could get your upgrades in Bozja once you finished that story and you wouldn't see them there until you did if you got them in Bozja.

I think if they had used the terminology from your other posts ""Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal" then that would have cleared up a lot of confusion. People would still be angry, but not feel they hadn't been informed properly on top of the change.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

That only mentions the story, though. That doesn't say anything about the story being required for resistance weapons, like where you linked. The first quest we get outside that zone. That's the problem I think. I definitely saw a lot of confusion where people asked "Is the Bozja story going to be required now?" and similar. The second sentence could be interpreted that you could get your upgrades in Bozja once you finished that story and you wouldn't see them there until you did if you got them in Bozja.

I think if they had used the terminology from your other posts ""Your resistance weapon can be upgrade in 5.45, but you need to finish the story including Delubrum Reginae normal" then that would have cleared up a lot of confusion. People would still be angry, but not feel they hadn't been informed properly on top of the change.

---

Yeah, they weren't very clear. Communication hasn't always been their strong suit though, at least outside of Japan. There are also times when the player base is pretty vocal about wanting something, then when Yoshi P is asked about it he seems genuinely surprised. I think a lot of feedback and requests just don't reach him.

I dunno folks, these have the normal "content unlock quest icon" thing going on and the development team prioritizes plot integrity, hence making crystal tower mandatory and all that - is it really so surprising the bozjan resistance weapons created for bozjan resistance fighters in the bozjan warfront would require doing the bozjan story? I'm trying to think of any other content that you can otherwise skip the story quests for and get the items on the other end and I'm coming up blank.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wereotter

The problem with this argument is that you knew you had to do it because you did it. If you went off the only translations we get for a lot of this, you could have been left in the dark. We were told the weapon could be completed outside of the exploratory zones, and after we completed the first trial, everything else could be done elsewhere. It caught a lot of people off guard to learn that now they had to get to rank 10 in the exporatory zone and complete 2 24-man raids before they could even start on the next step. It was not telegraphed well, and the translations we recieved gave no indication that you'd still have to advance in the zone even if you did your entire weapon elsewhere.

Additionally, I feel like forcing people to advance the exploratory zone in order complete the weapon runs counter to the concept of the relic, which had previously been something you could work on solo, even just with just an hour a day. Now you have to spend extra time in another zone to do additional content to just get to the quests, and have to do it in a scenario where you're unable to use duty finder to progress. When I'm in game, I don't want to try to type to talk to people. It's inconvenient on PlayStation, and I don't want to be chatty with other players.

So while I do think that the exploratory zone being popular with those who enjoy that kind of content should still be an option for the relic, it shouldn't be mandatory. Giving people options was a very good choice, but it just feels like a betrayal to be told that now you must go do content you didn't enjoy if you want the weapon.

Edit: with regard to your other link, this still wasn't "literally months ago" that post was from December 20, and is one line only that, unfortunately, wasn't broadcast out there the same way as the message of "you can do this outside of Bojza" was. But even if you did catch that, it only gave you a couple weeks to get ready, not months.

---

Well, you’re a bit behind because you followed some assumptions. You know what’s required now.

You don’t have to do it, anyway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TurtlesAWD

I dunno folks, these have the normal "content unlock quest icon" thing going on and the development team prioritizes plot integrity, hence making crystal tower mandatory and all that - is it really so surprising the bozjan resistance weapons created for bozjan resistance fighters in the bozjan warfront would require doing the bozjan story? I'm trying to think of any other content that you can otherwise skip the story quests for and get the items on the other end and I'm coming up blank.

---

It makes perfect sense. They just weren't very clear on the matter beforehand. This caught a lot of people off guard since weapon progress hasn't required Bozja completion until 5.45 outside of the introduction stuff.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vahlnir

It makes perfect sense. They just weren't very clear on the matter beforehand. This caught a lot of people off guard since weapon progress hasn't required Bozja completion until 5.45 outside of the introduction stuff.

---

I’ll agree the first steps needed to be a little more soulcrushing to weed some people out at the door, but Square said what they had to say and the forums ran off into the blue yonder with it. That’s hardly square’s problem.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TurtlesAWD

I dunno folks, these have the normal "content unlock quest icon" thing going on and the development team prioritizes plot integrity, hence making crystal tower mandatory and all that - is it really so surprising the bozjan resistance weapons created for bozjan resistance fighters in the bozjan warfront would require doing the bozjan story? I'm trying to think of any other content that you can otherwise skip the story quests for and get the items on the other end and I'm coming up blank.

---

The thing here is that the quest for the initial weapon took place outside of the exploratory zone with a trial you had to do, also outside of the zone. So it's fair to assume that, like the Heavensward weapon, the story would be tied to the strengthening of the weapon, but not required to advance the story on the frontlines.

As was stated, it just wasn't well communicated. Yes I'll give you your logic of having to do it, but you also have to see that if you're going off what you were told that you do and don't have to do, then you could have thought it was okay to take a pass on the content. This is especially true for those of us who didn't enjoy the exploratory zone content. You see the announcement you don't have to do it to strengthen your weapon, and so you skip it, only then to be blindsided when you find out this optional content is actually required. (Think Tetra Master in Final Fantasy IX. It was optional the entire game, never telegraphed to be required, then out of no where you have to win first place in the card tournament in Treno to advance the story. This wasn't a problem if you chose to play the card game leading up to that point, but was a major stumbling block for players who did not.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alaray

I prefer Bozja/Eureka over the HW method, tbh.

I'll agree that they probably shouldn't have required Castrum and DR, without informing the playerbase prior. But I do think Castrum/DR ought to be the premier methods to advance the relic steps, above to doing LoTA ten minute runs.

---

They actually did tell us DR would be required in the last LL and the one before that i believe