Why do people save LB till the end of the fight?

Especially in like very easy trails/raids.

In dungeons too. Like why not use caster/range lb3 on a large group of mobs instead of saving it for the boss, the lb would do more damage to a large group of mobs than it would do on a single target.

In most cases, not really "saving it" as much as "not really thinking about it." They shave off a few seconds, a minute tops. Hardly worth the consideration most of the time.

I use it all the times I can as a caster if the tank pulls a large group. Keep using it if you have it. It doesn't do anything good collecting dust. :D

If I'm in a dungeon playing a caster, and my fellow dps does not use it after a certain point, I will end up dropping it on a large group of trash, multiple times if possible. Period. Never seen anyone complain. :p I usually hold off on using it if my co dps is a caster and I'm a dps for that reason, because it is a bit more common to do so. But like I said before, if they don't use it, someone has to. I'll hit a boss with it if necessary. Otherwise it is wasted. If it's a raid, sometimes it is best to make sure the clear is in the bag before nuking the boss. That way if something does go wrong and a healer is still standing, they can use it themselves to all but guarantee the clear even after a series of unfortunate events. This usually happens when the group is sort of...unsure of one another. You can tell when a group knows their stuff and if confident, so using a LB3 when it pops up is a non issue regardless of when.

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Originally Posted by MPK

In dungeons too. Like why not use caster/range lb3 on a large group of mobs instead

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Because it doesn't exist in those situations. At best you have LB1

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Originally Posted by Avatre

Because it doesn't exist in those situations. At best you have LB1

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You're one of those type of people huh

I remembered when I was fresh few weeks into the game, I ran Brayflox matched with a ranged DPS who used the LB on packs. This infuriates the tank for some reason. Said something like: “Always save for melee! Keep using LB like that and prepared to get kicked from parties.”

Of course I learnt that THAT’s not true at this point. Anyways, they either don’t consider using it or simply forgot that LB button exist. Or worse, never even think about attaching it their hotbar.

"The DNC just wasted a LB3 that a melee could have used! Kick them!"

is why I don't LB ever.

Because at any point after lb3 if the healers can’t stay alive, and keep in mind they love dying in normal modes, you’ll get blamed for the wipe.

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Originally Posted by MPK

You're one of those type of people huh

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Same can be said about you:

You're not wrong about LBs. Not using them is indeed a total waste out of a lot of damage.

She is not wrong about you. She corrected your clause because it is clearly incorrect.

Both of you feel compelled to correct something you find to be erroneous.

Anywho... I have another correction, and that is in most content where players melt the opposition, the LB bar never fills up so it isn't going to be available in ezpz trials and raids anyway. In 8-man content where the threat level is high enough for the LB bar to fill as normal, it can be risky to use as it locks you in place for several seconds. Animation lock is a huge killer in this game. LB3 can sometimes be held onto in case a healer needs to erase a lot of bad very quickly. As for dungeons I will agree it is frustrating to see a slow to build resource just get wasted, but I don't make a big deal out of it. Bigger fish to fry.

I usually do use the LB1 on a large group pull, but I've had runs where I've used it and was scolded for it.... Only to not even need the LB at the end anyway.

I have often found that anything less than a LB3 is a waste of DPS as many jobs, if properly played, do better DPS than a LB2.

The limit break system needs to be overhauled to make it more useful.

In the case of trials/raids, often there's at least 1 mechanic that can easily wipe most of the raid if people mess up, and LB3 is often saved for such moments as a recovery from those circumstances. Example, just yesterday in Puppet's Bunker LB3 was used immediately by a DPS, and shortly after the boss proceeded to do the pod attacks. The safezone was on the other side of the field, witnessed for the first time (I thought there were multiple safe zones). Everybody died but a handful of us. Because the LB3 was gone and he began charging his stack markers, I couldn't rez enough people in time and we wiped.

Saving LB3 for healers except when the boss is about to die is for moments like that, when one thing goes wrong and everything starts going downhill. Had an LB been on the backburner, we probably could have saved that attempt. Not that I blame the DPS, it was the first time I've ever seen that happen, and I was laughing more than anything because of the jokes from the alliance.

Most of the time the ranged/caster LB won't make much of a difference in whether the group wipes/kills the pack of mobs.

Personally I only ever touch the LB button if the tank is making a really risky pull like the wall to wall pull at the end of Anamnesis Anyder.

If the tank is wiping the group pulling 2 groups of mobs in the newest dungeons then either the tank is bad, the healer is bad, or both are bad.

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Originally Posted by MPK

Especially in like very easy trails/raids.

In dungeons too. Like why not use caster/range lb3 on a large group of mobs instead of saving it for the boss, the lb would do more damage to a large group of mobs than it would do on a single target.

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For trials/raids
LB3 sometimes is used for mechanics such as tank LB3. It is also saved to be used by healers when learning the fight. Caster/Ranged LB is sometimes used if there is more than 1 target. Melee LB3 is usually used at the very end of the encounter when none of the things I mentioned before are needed.

For dungeons
Caster/Ranged LB is better used on large pulls. Melee LB can be used on bosses or single target door mobs if it's up.

Most people don't use LB in dungeons, sometimes the dungeon is cleared without ever using LB. I think the reason for this is because people are not used to seeing other people using LB while doing dungeons. If LB was frequently used in the situation I mentioned above it will be the norm and more people will remember to use it.

I rarely get the chance, Alisaie is all over them like a policeman on doughnut.

I feel like its just good for ranged jobs now on big pulls.

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Originally Posted by Hyperia

I have often found that anything less than a LB3 is a waste of DPS as many jobs, if properly played, do better DPS than a LB2.

The limit break system needs to be overhauled to make it more useful.

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Yeah... no

Ranged/Magical LB1 is 1650 pot
Ranged/Magical LB2 is 3600 pot
* and this is on every single enemy (no reduction based on # of mobs like with many of their AoE skills)

Melee LB1 is 2400 pot
Melee LB2 is 5250 pot
* of note here, grab your favorite melee job and combine the total potency from your entire opener, and then compare it the LB2 number here.

How exactly are you going to make it more useful when so many players are already ignoring these potencies?

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Originally Posted by MPK

Especially in like very easy trails/raids.

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I use it as the situation dictates. Like today against Ishgard's High Priest/Thoadan God and his band of primal wannabes. My SMN dropped it when most of his knights were surrounding him and he was at less than 30% HP. All his knights vaporized and he dropped another chunk of HP where we promptly nuked him. I'll save it if I know we'll need it during a burn phase or I'll use it if it's up when the tank takes on a mob or 3 more than they were capable of handling. Speaking of...IIRC (as a main tank player) Aggro cap is limited to between 10 to 15 enemies, maybe 12. I've not tested it out enough to know the exact number. There's always an aggro cap for which the tank has to maintain enemies around them. You'll know when he has too many when they turn on you or the healer (for using an AOE heal). It's at that point I drop the LB on them.

:rolleyes: OP has cleared savage and is asking this question.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

:rolleyes: OP has cleared savage and is asking this question.

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I think it is precisely players with such experience would ask this question. It mystifies them why there are players who would not know or possibly, ignoring the good golden LB button.

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Originally Posted by MPK

You're one of those type of people huh

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It's a correction for you, no need to go Karen over it.

The game does a terrible job of training people to use it . The game doesn't tell people that LB is per party after the new patch so multi raid parties have one of their own to hit the boss with now. Few read patch notes.

Many people think that you need to save it for LB3 in a dungeon by not using it at all until the last boss which is a waste as the LB is limited by rank depending on the encounter so it will not charge past that rank until the final boss (trials are a single final encounter so wil go to 3 from the get go). Many dont know that in certain duties the LB2 you have accumulated is scrubbed the moment you attack the first boss ( MSQ Nero for example)

Also:

Everyone needs to help rid the crummy myth that LB is for bosses only in dungeons and that it does more damage if the Boss HP is under XXX percent its incorrect on both counts . If you see players spouting this nonsense please kindly inform them of their error.

Also because people are hesitant to use it. You know, just like that last piece of chicken on the plate, no one will take it.

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Originally Posted by Peace-Division

The game does a terrible job of training people to use it . The game doesn't tell people that LB is per party after the new patch so multi raid parties have one of their own to hit the boss with now. Few read patch notes.

Many people think that you need to save it for LB3 in a dungeon by not using it at all until the last boss which is a waste as the LB is limited by rank depending on the encounter so it will not charge past that rank until the final boss (trials are a single final encounter so wil go to 3 from the get go). Many dont know that in certain duties the LB2 you have accumulated is scrubbed the moment you attack the first boss ( MSQ Nero for example)

Also:

Everyone needs to help rid the crummy myth that LB is for bosses only in dungeons and that it does more damage if the Boss HP is under XXX percent its incorrect on both counts . If you see players spouting this nonsense please kindly inform them of their error.

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I looked into LB generation, and what goes into it is definitely not taught to players. Things like tanks interrupting mob abilities, DPS using their mitigation role skill, and healers actually letting the tank drop to crit HP are some of these. When you look at the list, it can all be summed up to, "Just do your job." The game does teach us the limit gauge is shared, and contributions from the entire party fills it, and each bar of the gauge uses a more powerful version of the previous. That is really all they need to know in order to fill the gauge at a reasonable rate.

However, a lot of things about LB I have learned in the game from other players. Some examples are slower gauge generation when two or more of the same job are present, and that boss aggro erases whatever amount of gauge previously accumulated. Limit break is not alone in the fact that the devs have relied on outside resources such as content and guide creators to provide this information to players as they uncover it themselves. I think this approach is fine in certain cases; as is the case with LB.

I would actually surmise that the reason why a lot of players don't use it is because of the knowledge that is provided by the game. It does let us know it is a shared resource, and finally getting a player to break the mold and use it can be extremely difficult as they don't want to toss a giant spotlight on themselves. It is a necessary step though if a player wishes to progress.

Just to make things more clear.
caster/range LB 1 does on 3 Targets more dmg then a melee LB 2

And because you will never fill a LB 3 in a dungeon, it is always better to use the caster/ranged LB 1 on a big trash pull.

Also, never ever use a tank or heal LB1/ 2.
They nearly useless and have no real use in any Dungeon.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

Yeah... no

Ranged/Magical LB1 is 1650 pot
Ranged/Magical LB2 is 3600 pot
* and this is on every single enemy (no reduction based on # of mobs like with many of their AoE skills)

Melee LB1 is 2400 pot
Melee LB2 is 5250 pot
* of note here, grab your favorite melee job and combine the total potency from your entire opener, and then compare it the LB2 number here.

How exactly are you going to make it more useful when so many players are already ignoring these potencies?

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Your potencies are outdated/ incorrect: https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...m_source=share

There are some situations were you could do more by not LBing such as when youre in your burst phase

My favorite is the fights that break out over it.

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Originally Posted by BloodRubyXII

It's a correction for you, no need to go Karen over it.

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...but then you had to give a Cecilia response.


(Im kidding)

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Originally Posted by Gemina

Yeah... no

Ranged/Magical LB1 is 1650 pot
Ranged/Magical LB2 is 3600 pot
* and this is on every single enemy (no reduction based on # of mobs like with many of their AoE skills)

Melee LB1 is 2400 pot
Melee LB2 is 5250 pot
* of note here, grab your favorite melee job and combine the total potency from your entire opener, and then compare it the LB2 number here.

How exactly are you going to make it more useful when so many players are already ignoring these potencies?

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I mean yeah but a dps opener makes more sense at 5% than an attack that takes 50 years to actually do the damage.

I always use lb3 ASAP. Then I cross my fingers that healers do their job or I will get blamed for the wipe.

I remember when I told my brother to use lb1 on mobs in a copper bell dungeon to clear them faster. I was tanking. Then the other dps flips out that lb needs to be saved for the last boss. Full Internet rage mode from that one and refusing to understand that lb does not increase if the bar is already filled and its just waste of dps by not using it

I use it whenever it's up, especially if I feel by using it we can get another LB in the rest of the fight duration.

I've had people moan but I pay no attention. It's normally a dungeon or something that it makes very little difference in anyway, so may as well use it if it's there.

something something MPK thread something something Bait something something Troll

It's amazing how consistently they manage to pull this off.

LB doesn't scale with our gear, so in content we're all synched for using it doesn't really save much time. I'm guessing most of the time people just don't care enough to use it.

Some people, however, may be saving it for the rare situation where both Healer and Tank are down; DPS are fading fast; boss is almost dead; Need to squeeze out as much DPS as possible to finish the fight before we wipe... I've seen LB actually make the difference in a close fight before, so there's some logic in saving it just in case.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

LB doesn't scale with our gear, so in content we're all synched for using it doesn't really save much time. I'm guessing most of the time people just don't care enough to use it.

Some people, however, may be saving it for the rare situation where both Healer and Tank are down; DPS are fading fast; boss is almost dead; Need to squeeze out as much DPS as possible to finish the fight before we wipe... I've seen LB actually make the difference in a close fight before, so there's some logic in saving it just in case.

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LB's do scale, they scale with the average item level of your parties equipment mainhand weapon, so they should still be effective when synced.

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

LB's do scale, they scale with the average item level of your parties equipment mainhand weapon, so they should still be effective when synced.

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That's interesting, with how little damage they seem to do I guess I kind of assumed they didn't.

Like in MSQ how people like to open on Nero with LB for some reason. The tiny amount of damage it does is less than a few seconds of the fully synched party attacking him, making it a complete waste of time.

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Originally Posted by Hyperia

I have often found that anything less than a LB3 is a waste of DPS as many jobs, if properly played, do better DPS than a LB2.

The limit break system needs to be overhauled to make it more useful.

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LB2 does more against 5 enemies than MCH aoe rotation does. Not sure about 3.

But on a single target boss it’s a huge dps drop and i have no idea why any range use it even if there’s no melee/magic.

Troll OP poster. Don’t feed them.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

:rolleyes: OP has cleared savage and is asking this question.

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Outside of prog, you pretty much never hold lb3 til the end lol. You find a good spot in your rotation and make sure the boss won't immediately kill you (lol) and pop it asap, and start potentially generating another one. Some strategies wanna hold it for certain phases, but none this expansion to my knowledge and pretty much none of them are at the end of the fight.

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Originally Posted by Yeol

Most people don't use LB in dungeons, sometimes the dungeon is cleared without ever using LB. I think the reason for this is because people are not used to seeing other people using LB while doing dungeons. If LB was frequently used in the situation I mentioned above it will be the norm and more people will remember to use it.

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It can also depend on WHEN you get LB1. If the party is skilled and you're going through the dungeon fast, you may not see LB1 until you're halfway done or completely done with the 2nd boss, at which point you may end up forgetting that you even had the ability to use it to begin with.

Really should look at LB from a raider standpoint. It can also be a personal DPS loss.

Like in savage raids, you want the NIN to do it over the MNK, SAM, or DRG. But they also may want to ensure they are not in a trick attack window (party-wide DPS increase because of debuff on the boss) to limit break so there is always timing, boss going away, and benefit ratio (enrage is coming). Like there are windows where LB1-3 are perfect for and if you miss them, it's probably better to hold off. it's not an LB3 is up and go, do it now thing.


Now in casual content, it doesn't matter too much. Unless hitting an enrage like Titania where a ranged/caster LB tends to be a good for the tree adds since that still tends to be a slog for most of duty finder this expansion.