Heal more instead of dpsing

I’m so sick and tired of the fools who tell to me to, “Heal more instead of dpsing”. If I let the tank die in a leveling dungeon, fine, feel free to to tell me that. When I use benediction when the tank is at 20%-30% hp, that is planned, not panicked. When I’m in a leveling dungeon and I let the tank drop to 40%-50% hp to combine an afflatus spell with an OGCD and get the tank back to full that is not me panicking. If the tank spams clemency or a red mage vecure, because they don’t want him near 50% hp, I’m still going to wait for the tank to drop down to about 20%-30% to bene him. That’s the tanks and dps’s choice to not trust their healer. Wait until someone dies to start berating the healer, seriously.


Ironically a physical ranged DPS set me off and not a tank or a red mage. Props to the tank who pm'd me afterwards to tell me he appreciated me after I left. Sorry for the thread, I just really needed to rant.

How dare you know your kit well to dish out damage while being able to keep an eye on hp to give efficiently timed heals.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ftail

I’m so sick and tired of the fools who tell to me to, “Heal more instead of dpsing”. If I let the tank die in a leveling dungeon, fine, feel free to to tell me that. When I use benediction when the tank is at 20%-30% hp, that is planned, not panicked. When I’m in a leveling dungeon and I let the tank drop to 40%-50% hp to combine an afflatus spell with an OGCD and get the tank back to full that is not me panicking. If the tank spams clemency or a red mage vecure, because they don’t want him near 50% hp, I’m still going to wait for the tank to drop down to about 20%-30% to bene him. That’s the tanks and dps’s choice to not trust their healer. Wait until someone dies to start berating the healer, seriously.


Ironically a physical ranged DPS set me off and not a tank or a red mage. Props to the tank who pm'd me afterwards to tell me he appreciated me after I left. Sorry for the thread, I just really needed to rant.

---

For a while, at least last expac--didn't really see this in ShB as much, many healers prioritized damage over healing because that was basically the expectation. I had quite a few tanks ask me flat out (as healer) to please keep them healed and they were grateful for the assurance that I prioritized healing over damage. As a dps, I can't tell you how many times an over-pull in a leveling dungeon ended in a wipe. A lot of people get nervous if they see the tank low or see-sawing--whether you have control over the situation or not.

However if no one died then there's really no cause for complaint. Their nervousness is not your problem but I would have probably thrown them a heal as rdm as well because low tanks in leveling dungeons especially are just asking for a wipe.

The worst is when ranged phys dps(almost always the mch) constantly stand faaar outside the group and the healing aoes, and complain when they die to raid wides.

I've actually developed a bit of a bias against ranged because of it, i feel like alot of people flock to the role thinking they can have less responsibility because they have no positionals or cast times. And for some reason they think they don't need to position themselves properly for heals and use their mitigation to help out the healers.

I even had a mch static member in E3s, who sat in melee spot because we had 3 ranged, and forced our poor BLM to do all the moving for black smokers, no joke.
And of course he complained in E4S because he kept dying due to not being topped off after he stood away from my earthly stars and our sch soils.

It got so bad that i just stopped bothering to beg him to move in and just started rescuing him lol

If it's a random group, they don't know you and what you can do. We show them that by the actions we take and by showing that we can be depended upon. You're showing that you don't have their back and that they have something to be nervous about.

Take your ego out of the equation and just heal them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

If it's a random group, they don't know you and what you can do. We show them that by the actions we take and by showing that we can be depended upon.

---

^ This.
Honestly, if you can pull off an efficient healing while dishing out DPS, that is wonderful. But randoms are simply...randoms. And sometimes they don't quite understand how powerful healer's kits & pushover the incoming damage in some dungeons. Having never played any healer/tank classes may also explain their anxiety.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Valkyrie_

It got so bad that i just stopped bothering to beg him to move in and just started rescuing him lol

---

One of the merits of playing with premade groups is how easy mistakes like this to be fixed by... a simple communication.
If it's with randoms, 1-3 first tries (i.e. single target heal them or with [Rescue]) are usually my limit before I switch to "You ain't coming here? No heals for you >:U".
One would say that a simple communication with randoms may also fix the problem. While that might be true, personally I'd not do that to avoid the possible 'you don't tell me what to do!'-attitude.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ftail

Ironically a physical ranged DPS set me off and not a tank or a red mage. Props to the tank who pm'd me afterwards to tell me he appreciated me after I left. Sorry for the thread, I just really needed to rant.

---

Yes yes. We tanks tend to not care as long as you're keeping us alive above all else, we even will work with you in giving you dps time via CDs. I mean that's the whole point of them.

Any role say that to me, they lost their healer for that dungeon.

Yep, screw people like that. I've been lucky enough to only get people who use Clemency and Vercure but that's still infuriating, I'd imagine someone going off on you or anyone else for doing what you did would make the healer enraged as that is what you are supposed to do with 5.0 healers, minimize heals and maximize dps, you can literally go 80 dungeons without using a single afflatus spell as WHM. Leaving was perfectly justified and understandable.

As much as I prefer healing I agree with the OP. Need to spice up them cures. haha

I completely agree. Far too often I see Vercure or Clemency being cast when the tank falls near 50%. I have so many tools as a SCH to bring your health back up quickly. And at level 80, I am intimately familiar with them all. People should trust their healers until something goes wrong.

This is especially an issue when fighting against bosses. For most of the content, I have bosses pretty well memorized. AoE coming...tankbuster...etc. I know when it is impossible for a dps to take damage and when there are lulls for tanks. I use those times to damage, position for the next attack, or shield those who are actually in danger. Your health bar at 80% can wait.

While I agree with you 100% OP, you still have to understand that you're running content where such optimization is not only not required, it can be outright shunned in many groups. This doesn't mean that you should change up your playstyle to appease others, or to say that anyone is right or wrong in this situation. What I do want to say is that you still do have a choice. You don't have to roll with these kind of players if you don't want to, and you can abandon the duty. I know you're venting, and it totally sucks to be grouped with players of an opposing mindset, but I feel taking the penalty to be a lesser punishment than dealing with strong adversity for any longer than a couple of minutes. If you are the kind of player that does a lot of other things, then I strongly recommend this if it does happen again in the future.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gemina

While I agree with you 100% OP, you still have to understand that you're running content where such optimization is not only not required, it can be outright shunned in many groups. This doesn't mean that you should change up your playstyle to appease others, or to say that anyone is right or wrong in this situation. What I do want to say is that you still do have a choice. You don't have to roll with these kind of players if you don't want to, and you can abandon the duty. I know you're venting, and it totally sucks to be grouped with players of an opposing mindset, but I feel taking the penalty to be a lesser punishment than dealing with strong adversity for any longer than a couple of minutes. If you are the kind of player that does a lot of other things, then I strongly recommend this if it does happen again in the future.

---

I didn’t stay to argue with the guy and potentially get in trouble with a GM, I just left.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

If it's a random group, they don't know you and what you can do. We show them that by the actions we take and by showing that we can be depended upon. You're showing that you don't have their back and that they have something to be nervous about.

Take your ego out of the equation and just heal them.

---

I disagree. The fact of the matter is that healing is binary, if they didn't die, the healer did fine. If nobody died (ignoring people who did stupid things like stood in AEs), then the healer is adequate. It doesn't matter that people are "worried" about dropping low in health, they need to get over it. It's not like dying in this game means that you lose anything but a few minutes to get back to where you were.

Now, if the tank died or the DPS died (again, outside of standing in avoidable damage), THEN they have the right to request to be healed more. But requesting to be healed because you're scared that your health is too low is not ok.

Newbie thinking: Healer job is to keep everyone at full health all the time. Healer has failed if anyone dies for any reason except for OHKO situations. Healer attacking is unnecessary and distracting.
What I would settle for people thinking: Healer job is to keep everyone above what I think the raid-wide damage threshold is at all times. Sweat profusely if tank uses invuln. Good run, felt like I did more damage than usual.
What I want them to think: No one doing the mechanics correctly died. Oh hey, that was actually a pretty fast run; maybe it was the Holy spam.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

If it's a random group, they don't know you and what you can do. We show them that by the actions we take and by showing that we can be depended upon. You're showing that you don't have their back and that they have something to be nervous about.

Take your ego out of the equation and just heal them.

---

That isn't having their back. It's kowtowing to how they perceive you should play. You aren't showing them anything except how "right" their stance was. It isn't a question of egos but someone else dictating how you should perform. Your job as a healer is to keep the party of alive and DPS otherwise. So long as you accomplish that, you've done your job. It doesn't matter if the tank dropped to 20%, 55% or 90%. They lived through the pull and we continued onto the next. Them being nervous isn't my problem nor do I have to adjust how I play to accommodate said nerves.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

If it's a random group, they don't know you and what you can do. We show them that by the actions we take and by showing that we can be depended upon. You're showing that you don't have their back and that they have something to be nervous about.

Take your ego out of the equation and just heal them.

---

Idk man, sounds like you're trying to enforce a playstyle, which is apparently a punishable offense under the current ToS btw.

i think it was Cinder Drift NM but some random RDM complained saying "I guess I'll heal myself" when they were 75% HP, which they did. I just responded paper cut. There isn't another AoE for another minute so you wait for lily, and not this whole full-at-all-times these newbies have in their heads.

Eventually they died on their own accord to some other mechanic, so that was that.

This goes all the way to end game like savage, DPS tend to be the biggest chads to healers, bar none. Outside of heal range, not standing in bubbles kind of things.

“Heal more”—makes me want to heal less, and often I do.
Vercure/Clemency—makes me want to heal less, and often I do.

The most annoyed I have been recently was when Memoria Ex came out. The DPS/heal/tank check between phases, we had a tank whose controller died so we died. A DPS immediately blamed me. “Heal more, you’re only casting Glare.” Well, yes. Because you’re already under both Asylum and Medica II, and all my subsequent heals are instant. Do you not see the Plenary and Rapture procs? That’s me...

The other healer was an Astro and wasn’t majorly healing at all because they were just sitting under their CU. When the tank came clean, there was no apology.

It’s players like this that make me not want to heal. If you call someone out on their healing, and least know their class enough to know that they truly aren’t healing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BlueMageQuina

“Heal more”—makes me want to heal less, and often I do.
Vercure/Clemency—makes me want to heal less, and often I do.
If you call someone out on their healing, and least know their class enough to know that they truly aren’t healing.

---

Personally I tend to react positively if whoever pleading for more healing or planned healing would mention the spell/abilities name, like: "Can you use [Essential Dignity] for <insert part>" ; "Can you save [Benediction] for <insert part>" ; "Can you take out seraph at <insert part>".
Simply asking for more healing, especially if I'm actually already doing the most fundamental healing requirement would just deter me from healing.

As a healer main, I normally agree. However, I was running Matoya's as a DNC, I kid you not, she did not heal anyone. I stayed on half health and healed myself for a majority of the boss fights (which also led me to die once due to having to get a vuln stack since she refused to move for something and I had to change directions.) She would let the tank ht maybe 10k health on pulls before she'd stop casting DPS spells. Sometimes, honestly, stop DPSing and heal more.

~ Sincerely, a healer since 2016.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gmot

As a healer main, I normally agree. However, I was running Matoya's as a DNC, I kid you not, she did not heal anyone. I stayed on half health and healed myself for a majority of the boss fights (which also led me to die once due to having to get a vuln stack since she refused to move for something and I had to change directions.) She would let the tank ht maybe 10k health on pulls before she'd stop casting DPS spells. Sometimes, honestly, stop DPSing and heal more.

~ Sincerely, a healer since 2016.

---

Well it’s not like the OP is anything close to this healer you were matched with. I do have to admit that Matoya’s Relict incoming damage is very pushover—even moreso than any previously released lv80 dungeon in my opinion. It’s quite hard to resist the temptation to -not- squeeze in every bit DPS spells possible before turning my attention to tank’s health, especially when the tank is also doing their job wonderfully. Besides the porxie suction phase & 1st day of 5.4, I don’t think I have ever seen any deaths in said dungeon.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gmot

As a healer main, I normally agree. However, I was running Matoya's as a DNC, I kid you not, she did not heal anyone. I stayed on half health and healed myself for a majority of the boss fights (which also led me to die once due to having to get a vuln stack since she refused to move for something and I had to change directions.) She would let the tank ht maybe 10k health on pulls before she'd stop casting DPS spells. Sometimes, honestly, stop DPSing and heal more.

~ Sincerely, a healer since 2016.

---

did you or anyone die?

Eh, honestly with these DF groups the only thing you can really do is make sure you're standing in bubbles or next to the healer, or at least near them if you want to be healed. If you miss the initial star, don't stand in bubbles, don't stand in range of medica or fairy regen, then any healing after that is pretty much the healer being nice instead of letting you die because you're being a nuisance standing too far away refusing to be healed.

That being said, I don't 100% trust DF healers so I tend to pop my own mitigation/heals when it looks like I'm going to die to raidwides or unavoidable damage, difference being that 95 times out of 100 it would have been fine regardless of if I popped anything or not, but I still prefer to play it safe out of habit

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jukebox12

did you or anyone die?

---

They literally said they died once.

My opinion, DPS, but don't let your party go below, lets say, 20% health. Basically, don't let them die.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jukebox12

did you or anyone die?

---

Why yes, I did. I even said so.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gmot

As a healer main, I normally agree. However, I was running Matoya's as a DNC, I kid you not, she did not heal anyone. I stayed on half health and healed myself for a majority of the boss fights (which also led me to die once due to having to get a vuln stack since she refused to move for something and I had to change directions.) She would let the tank ht maybe 10k health on pulls before she'd stop casting DPS spells. Sometimes, honestly, stop DPSing and heal more.

~ Sincerely, a healer since 2016.

---

Matoya is a bad example, given that the damage going out is so low, and it serves as the primary example of the problem. Warriors can solo heal the entire thing without breaking a sweat, and while this is doable in other dungeons, its particularly effortless in Matoyas.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kabooa

Matoya is a bad example, given that the damage going out is so low, and it serves as the primary example of the problem. Warriors can solo heal the entire thing without breaking a sweat, and while this is doable in other dungeons, its particularly effortless in Matoyas.

---

You can get by pretty easily with minimal healing on DRK as well, can't say much for PLD/GNB since I don't play those 2 much

For those who complain when HP drops below 50%, our healing toolkit is literally designed in a way that it rewards us for letting people get that low. Excogitation, Essential Dignity and Benediction all favour people whose HP has dropped.

Complain if they healer can't keep people alive, then you know their balance is wrong - or try to find out why they're struggling and help address it because we all benefit from an attitude of helping rather than one of scolding. If nobody dies, then they're doing a good job?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Valkyrie_

The worst is when ranged phys dps(almost always the mch) constantly stand faaar outside the group and the healing aoes, and complain when they die to raid wides.

I've actually developed a bit of a bias against ranged because of it, i feel like alot of people flock to the role thinking they can have less responsibility because they have no positionals or cast times. And for some reason they think they don't need to position themselves properly for heals and use their mitigation to help out the healers.

I even had a mch static member in E3s, who sat in melee spot because we had 3 ranged, and forced our poor BLM to do all the moving for black smokers, no joke.
And of course he complained in E4S because he kept dying due to not being topped off after he stood away from my earthly stars and our sch soils.

It got so bad that i just stopped bothering to beg him to move in and just started rescuing him lol

---

I feel this. I plan my Earthly Stars with the intention of letting people's health drop. It's the strongest AoE heal in the game, I'm going to want to see some health drop. It's more frustrating when it's the tank lol. Heal bubbles are put down for a purpose (as are DPS ones too). Given Earthly Star deals damage I need to put it down rather than reserve it and you can't always time it for when you really need it but you can let people's health drop so the heal aspect is not wasted.

I play a ranged job for DPS, but try stay within AoE heal range. But then as a healer, I know the rage lol.

Many in the game who really are not good generally have "life bar anxiety". So they come up with weird stuff like always being at 70% or even 90% HP+ non-sense when the mechanics don't dictate it. These include those weird clemency tanks who won't use holy circle on mobs. Cause that's the best mitigation in the game, when something dies faster.

It's worse when the anxiety is a healer because they keep you topped up so much that they overheal like mad, and don't trust things like Asylum when that's well over a 900+ potency heal and still pop a medica 2 for some unknown reason. Next thing they realize they are out of MP for some reason, cause of overheal.