The Relic Quests are a great example of poor game design

I'm not talking about the Relic weapons themselves. I understand that DoM/DoW Relic weapons are usually one step behind the current raid tier (e.g., currently 500 for the Relic vs 505 for the Edenchoir weapons), and that's fine because it rewards those who raid. I have bigger issues with the Skysung tools as you can simply make or buy Aesthete's weapons from the Market Board and then pentameld it and have something that's better than the Relic DoH/DoL tools. But this also is not my main issue.

My main issue is the fact that in order to do these quests, you have to have - for every single class/job - an "alternative" weapon/tool on you to even do these dumb quests. For example, to upgrade your Resistance Relic weapon in Gangos, you have to talk to the NPC as the relevant DoM/DoW class/job but without the Relic Weapon for that class/job equipped. This means that you have to have some random extra weapon for that class/job on you for the sole purpose of upgrading your Resistance Relic weapon. The same thing goes for the Skysung tools - you cannot talk to Nimie to have them upgraded with those tools equipped, and so you have to have some other tool on you for that same class/job (fortunately, I think most folks will have Aesthete's, but it's still annoying that they did it this way).

The biggest issue with this approach is that the Armoury Chest can hold only 35 weapons/tools, but there are 29 classes/jobs in this game. As a result, you literally don't have enough space in your Armoury Chest to carry even 2 weapons for each job/class. Having more retainer/inventory space would be nice, as would having a much bigger glamour dresser with additional glamour plates. However, something else SE needs to fix is the size of the Armoury Chest as it's currently ridiculously small.

I was just talking about this with some friends yesterday since I got all of the skysung tools in about 3 days, if I didn’t already have my aesthete tools I would have had to buy low level tools in order to turn in my relics. It’s definitely an issue that needs to be fixed, you need 28 different mainhands from your relics in order to augment each item. We should be able to accept the quest on the job we want it for but be able to turn in on any job.

Lock the class, OR make make the weapon required to be spare in the inventory, but not both.

Seriously, it's like they are just admitting that they think of the relic as glam that won't actually be used or equipped.

I keep a ton of weapons for glam on my retainers so I just used the bell at the doman enclave and teleported to gangos using the aetheryte that is right next to it.

I don't think you can unequip a weapon completely anyway so to change this would probably be more complicated than it seems at a glance.

You can buy a lvl 1 weapon/tool for like 60 gil and sell it after you upgrade your relic. You don't need to hold 2 of everything

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Originally Posted by ICountFrom0

Lock the class, OR make make the weapon required to be spare in the inventory, but not both.

Seriously, it's like they are just admitting that they think of the relic as glam that won't actually be used or equipped.

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I've had a similar complaint; the weapons have a use (to a point), but its weird how they're handling the Tools though I'm being told its not the final step for it, so we will see what is going on.

But if they make another green gear alongside the final step then yes I think that is BS.

In order to upgrade the weapon, the game removes it from your inventory and replaces it with a new one. If you are equipped with it, you are then not equipped with any weapon. The game does not allow you to not have a weapon equipped. Based on what I have observed, that is the reason this happens.

I agree that the Amory chest should be increase, but its becuase we know SE will add new jobs and I'd like the space to have at least one weapon on hand for each class.

The relic thing could be addressed by making it so that having the relic equipped counts then replacing the equipped weapon after the cutscene, though I suspect that technical limitations are in play for that.

I have the Anima weapon stashed in my saddlebag, mostly because I find it amoral to trash these specific weapons (you know due to having a soul in them) but they do come in handy for these sort of transitions (though I still have to get weapons for 4 other jobs)

Is there any reason they can't allow us to hand in the quest to upgrade a specific relic as any class? If you (for example) handed in a BLM weapon as a SAM, you'll always get an upgraded BLM anyway so it doesn't matter, then the quests after can go back to being BLM only.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

Is there any reason they can't allow us to hand in the quest to upgrade a specific relic as any class? If you (for example) handed in a BLM weapon as a SAM, you'll always get an upgraded BLM anyway so it doesn't matter, then the quests after can go back to being BLM only.

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They can, or have done so in the past, but its not as big of an issue, as having to disequip your best(and probably only)weapon for a job to complete said quest. Even if theres easy workarounds(buy a cheap weapon, keep a replica in your inventory, etc) I 100 percent agree with OP that having only just enough space to hold 1 weapon per job, is a bit assinine. So what if they make bank on retainers, theres no reason for such limited slots for job equipment(especially rings, rings are the worst slot)

I just grabbed the Yo-Kai weapons out of the armoire for a few minutes and threw them back when done.

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Originally Posted by Toesocks

You can buy a lvl 1 weapon/tool for like 60 gil and sell it after you upgrade your relic. You don't need to hold 2 of everything

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I understand that you can do this, but you shouldn’t *need* to do this.

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Originally Posted by ADVSS

They can, or have done so in the past, but its not as big of an issue, as having to disequip your best(and probably only)weapon for a job to complete said quest. Even if theres easy workarounds(buy a cheap weapon, keep a replica in your inventory, etc) I 100 percent agree with OP that having only just enough space to hold 1 weapon per job, is a bit assinine.

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Not sure if you missed what I was saying, I agree with the OP. If they allowed you to hand in the specific quest that upgrades a relic, as any class, it would create a fix to the issue without being a problem for the spaghetti code. You want to upgrade your BLM weapon. You switch to SAM or ARM or whatever, your BLM weapon is now in your armory and good to go. They could remove the requisite class lock just for that upgrade step.

The weird thing is that I'm pretty sure a couple of the quests allow you to perform the upgrade while equipped with it.

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Originally Posted by DoH

IMy main issue is the fact that in order to do these quests, you have to have - for every single class/job - an "alternative" weapon/tool on you to even do these dumb quests.

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Yeah the mandatory "you HAVE TO equip a weapon you can never unequip" is a really awkward design choice.
I get it: they used the weapon to code in the class identity, so we will never see it go away.

Personally, I would prefer a systems change to class crystals. Expand the job crystals, make a crystal for every class/sub class and make the weapons work like every other item in the game, e.g.: you get an error when trying to equip an unsuitable one instead of auto-changing the class.

Not sure whether such a deep level code change is possible at this point though it would make sleeping much more comfortable. *hugs her chainsaw*

Part of the reason IMO is because the cutscenes have a vibe of turning in the weapon to upgrade and the wielding the upgraded weapon, which is also why I think the best solution would be to code it so that new weapon is auto-equipped.

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Originally Posted by Adeacia

In order to upgrade the weapon, the game removes it from your inventory and replaces it with a new one. If you are equipped with it, you are then not equipped with any weapon. The game does not allow you to not have a weapon equipped. Based on what I have observed, that is the reason this happens.

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The problem is more that the current turn in step requires that you be in the correct class/job which requires that you be equipped with an appropriate weapon/tool so that you can turn in your relic for upgrade.

The first two steps of the Skysteel/Dragonsung tools had you exchange them at a shop which you could do as any class/job. This was a lot less aggravating.

I 100% agree. It is annoying to get done with the relic quest steps, then forget you have to have a secondary weapon. Then you have to backtrack just to get a secondary one to turn it in. Just let us keep the weapon equipped and let Gerolt work on them.

Also more glam spots please in glam dresser!

Can't upgrade any gear or weapon with them equipped it's been like that for ages. It's not just relic that requires it so why blame relic quests?

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Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur

The problem is more that the current turn in step requires that you be in the correct class/job which requires that you be equipped with an appropriate weapon/tool so that you can turn in your relic for upgrade.

The first two steps of the Skysteel/Dragonsung tools had you exchange them at a shop which you could do as any class/job. This was a lot less aggravating.

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The game tracks relic quests as job quests, which requires you to be that job to complete it. And the game tracks your job by your equipped weapon. So to complete a job quest, you have to have that job's weapon equipped.

The early Dragonsung steps weren't considered quests at all, so there was no need to track it. It's a different system.

Nah, this convoluted design is a way around how outdated certain areas of the game are. Simply put, FFXIV can't handle upgrading an item or is very taxing for the system to do it (since with can customize relics secondary stats), what we really do is exchanging ours for a new one. Other MMO's don't have this problem and all you need to do is apply the upgrade without losing something like materia/glamour.

Same reason they need to add a new version of an existing item to remove glamour limitations.

It's annoying having to do that for all jobs. If inventory is an issue just make or a buy a piece of junk to use temporarily and then pitch it. It would be cool if it can just be upgraded while it's equipped, but it's not something I would consider to make the system as a whole poorly designed.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

It's annoying having to do that for all jobs. If inventory is an issue just make or a buy a piece of junk to use temporarily and then pitch it. It would be cool if it can just be upgraded while it's equipped, but it's not something I would consider to make the system as a whole poorly designed.

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Take a look at all the hops we need to do in order to upgrade crafted gear for example, then compare it to other MMO's that at most will be two clicks.

By now I'm just used to it, still, from an objective point of view is not a good system. Devs know it, that's why we got better vendors for new players with the items already upgrade.

Buy the cheapest weapon for your Job in the Marketboard. Problem solved. (Then sell It after you don't need It, since you'll never use it)

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Originally Posted by lolicon09

Buy the cheapest weapon for your Job in the Marketboard. Problem solved. (Then sell It after you don't need It, since you'll never use it)

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Still an irritation. Need to find the correct vendor and travel there, then back again. Difficult? No. Expensive? No. Annoying? Yes. That's why it's bad design. There's no reason you should need to jump through those hoops, easy though they might be, and yet we must, all because the game was not designed to allow equipped items to be traded or upgraded. Hence, bad game design, the accusation made by the original player.

The fact that there's a workaround, and that it's an easy workaround, doesn't change the fact that we NEED a workaround. If you need a workaround, that's bad design, practically by definition.

lol the number of responses saying “just go buy a cheap weapon and then sell it / go grab a weapon from your retainer or armoire and then put it back” are completely missing the point. Yes, this is also what I do (or, for my DoH/DoL I simply equip my Aesthete’s). However, that doesn’t change the fact that this is poorly programmed and requires you to have a random extra item unrelated to the quests to even do these quests. As LineageRazor said, this is by definition poor design.

Just as an example, the first time players go to Gangos to upgrade their relic weapons from 485 to 500, there’s nothing that tells them that they need to have an extra weapon for the relevant class/job on them. So you go to the Doman Enclave, teleport from there to Gangos, and then realize this problem; from there, you can either go back to the Doman Enclave (if you have a spare weapon for the relevant class/job on your retainer) or teleport to a town with a cheap weapon and then come back to the Doman Enclave and then Gangos again. It’s annoying / poorly designed, and I don’t understand the apologists here who say otherwise.