How exactly does FATE credit work?

Title.

Mostly curious, as someone told me I may be hindering others' progress while doing FATEs.

I shudder to think at all of the bots I've hurt along the way.

More or less you need to kill enough enemies or generate enough enimity and participate at least at 50% of the fate to get the highest reward. I'm not that sure about the 50% for tanks or heals. Tank with enimity buff and heals with recovery buffs look to be able to generate enough enimity even if they arrive when it remains only 40% HP/progess.

I don't know exactly how many enemies you need to kill, as it seems it depends the number of players participating.

The consequence is if you are a HL player on a low level boss, low level players are sometimes unable to reach the highest rewards (mostly the late joiners).

Varies I’d think. I’ve done some boss fates where I’ve come in at 30% health left and got silver despit with taking a minute or so to kill.
Then I’ve doe. Some where I c one in throw one or two aoe on 5 mobs and get gold at the last minute.
I wouldn’t worry about it. Fates are weird anyway. Nobody wants to do them till someone starts them then everyone wants to join and moans when you kill it before they get there. If you didn’t do it they wouldn’t bother tho. Just keep going and they can join the next for full credit.

It works purely on aggro generated either as an individual or a group.

When Paladins used to have flash you could get full credit spamming nothing but that. I would come in late to many fates and go into tank stance and flash as much as I could and would often get gold only participating 30 seconds or less.

Now, when new people come into a fate if you want them to get credit you can hit them with the tank ability SHIRK which gives them a portion of your aggro.

Provoke does nothing to FATE mobs.

It's based on enmity generated and if in a party, the whole party's contribution is applied to every member, though you do need a certain minimum personal participation to be eligible for the whole party contribution.

Tank stance also seems to be at least mostly ignored since SHB, because that would just make it too easy. Enmity being the factor has also been a reason why provoke doesn't work on FATE and hunt mobs.

Mm.

I figured as much.

Basic scenario was I flew into a FATE, popped tank stance, pulled everything so things could be AoE, and the other guy there started going on about how I was making it harder for other people by doing that. I told him if he would AoE and not single target, he would be fine, but they seemed pretty adamant that wasn't how it worked and I had no idea what I was talking about.

I was fairly certain I was correct in what I thought I knew, but it doesn't hurt to ask.

I'll continue to pull everything!

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Originally Posted by Malmstrom

I'll continue to pull everything!

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I would suggest to avoid that if you are HL on low level fates. Low level players in levelling can have hard time to kill mobs fast enough to generate sufficient enimity. I've seen that happened : one character agro everything, low level player without aoe skill is forced to hit one by one and is unable to get the rewards since he wasn't in team (and it sometimes is really hard to find a party).

If it is at a level where players do have their aoe skills, of course it is another matter.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

Now, when new people come into a fate if you want them to get credit you can hit them with the tank ability SHIRK which gives them a portion of your aggro.

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Shirk won't do anything. You can't use it on people outside of your party and those grouped with you should already get their credit based on party's contribution, as long as they've hit the enemy once. That's how lowbies were power-leveled on NM trains in Eureka.

Something to note is also that Provoke's top aggro effect does not work on fates and hunts - it's to prevent people from griefing by voking and then pulling things out of range for reset.

F.A.T.E credit is super easy when you know how it works:

hand in at least 6 items for delivery for gold

hit at least 6 enemies that either die or are still engaged when the fate ends for gold

gain X amount of enmity during boss fates - however boss fates with adds you can apply the hit 6 rule for gold


source: over 10,000 fates completed

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Originally Posted by Malmstrom

Basic scenario was I flew into a FATE, popped tank stance, pulled everything so things could be AoE, and the other guy there started going on about how I was making it harder for other people by doing that. I told him if he would AoE and not single target, he would be fine, but they seemed pretty adamant that wasn't how it worked and I had no idea what I was talking about.

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There's definitely a factor here that makes it harder for other players if you're AOEing everything.

The first person to hit an enemy gets full credit for killing it.

Additional people can get credit if they did a certain percentage of damage to it. (I'm not clear on the exact percentage, but that's what the game tells you in some early tutorial text.)

So by grabbing every enemy, you're "taking more than your share" and making it harder for anyone else to get a first hit and thus get definite credit for a kill.

If you want to tank everything during a mob FATE, wait until another player has tagged an enemy first before trying to get its attention.

I don't really get why Provoke was made not to work in FATEs, to be honest. The system, being based on enmity generated, already extremely favors tanks, especially nowadays since tanks generate WAY more enmity than they used to. What's the point of completely breaking one of their abilities just to keep it from being even more wildly unfair than it already is?

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Something to note is also that Provoke's top aggro effect does not work on fates and hunts - it's to prevent people from griefing by voking and then pulling things out of range for reset.

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I really don't think that's the reason, because if "griefing" was the reason for making it not work, Rescue shouldn't exist as an ability. (I already think it shouldn't exist as an ability, but that's a whole other topic.)

Even if it was the reason, they could have fixed this by just make the leashing mechanics work better -- for instance, mobs could just lose their aggro to whoever is at top aggro at the moment if pulled outside leashing range -- rather than just going invulnerable, moving back to their spawn point, and then completely regenerating their health. It's really the full regeneration aspect that allows people to "grief" other people this way.

They could easily have made it so mobs only regenerate if they're leashed and also have no one left on their aggro list. This would have addressed the issue of anyone intentionally trying to leash a mob, not just people trying to do it with Provoke (which is hardly necessary for people to do this)

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

I really don't think that's the reason, because if "griefing" was the reason for making it not work, Rescue shouldn't exist as an ability.

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No, it is the reason that Provoke was changed to not work on S/A/B Hunt marks and FATE targets. During ARR's original release Provoke worked on FATE targets (and Hunt marks when those were later added in 2.2), but after a large number of publicized cases where Paladins and Warriors would use Provoke to reset nearly dead A and S ranks (Odin and Behemoth getting reset through Provoke shenanigans might have also happened) FATE Bosses and Hunts were made immune to provoke.

That's the equivalent of trying to kill a cockroach by nuking the house. It would very likely fail to kill the cockroach, too; appropriately enough, even after this update to Provoke you still see and hear about situations of hunt mobs getting reset maliciously. Guess actually fixing the core problem was too difficult for them.

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Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur

No, it is the reason that Provoke was changed to not work on S/A/B Hunt marks and FATE targets. During ARR's original release Provoke worked on FATE targets (and Hunt marks when those were later added in 2.2), but after a large number of publicized cases where Paladins and Warriors would use Provoke to reset nearly dead A and S ranks (Odin and Behemoth getting reset through Provoke shenanigans might have also happened) FATE Bosses and Hunts were made immune to provoke.

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Provoke has never worked on FATE targets, nor hunts for that matter.

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Provoke has never worked on FATE targets, nor hunts for that matter.

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I actually didn't remember a time where it worked, but 2.0 was long enough ago that I was willing to give the above poster the benefit of the doubt.

Theres been some changes to how it rates ppl, compared to before.
IDK when it happened, but recently, was the same level and gear level as my friends, and noticed i always got less exp (by 10-50%) as a tank in tank stance, than as healer or DPS. (comparing to my friends, and my own exp as the same level and iLv. on the same FATE.)
This didnt use to be the case, as tanks always maxed out more than others. But I guess the trade off, is that if you come to the FATE late, tanks build up to gold much faster than DPS/healers. You could hit the last sliver of HP, and get gold in tank stance.
But at the end of the day, you do get less exp over all as a tank, and will fall behind any friends you're playing with. (And when youre the DPS, watch ur tank friends fall behind)
No idea how it works now, as it doesnt make sense now.

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Originally Posted by Sove92

Provoke has never worked on FATE targets, nor hunts for that matter.

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Its in the patch notes for when it changed. And for the reason he mentions. [sarcasm] For source, Ill link you to the lodestone, where you can find it. [/ sarcasm]

That doesn't make any sense.

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Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

Its in the patch notes for when it changed. And for the reason he mentions.

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I can't tell if you are actually being serious about this. I checked, no such thing in the notes (neither on the lodestone nor the hotfix thread) for the relevant time period. I also remember the first days of 2.3. Provoke was used frequently, but it had nothing to do with resetting or enmity. Provoke does nothing on hunt and fate targets, it doesn't even pull them. It was used as a fakeout technique to goad somebody else in the crowd into pulling the mob when they react to the sight of something hitting the mob and getting the blame for the "early pull". A technique still used to this day, just not as frequently.

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It was used as a fakeout technique to goad somebody else in the crowd into pulling the mob when they react to the sight of something hitting the mob and getting the blame for the "early pull". A technique still used to this day, just not as frequently.

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Not going to lie; I still do this. People still fall for it, too.

I rarely attend hunts anyway, though. It's pretty much a "if I happen to be in the area" thing for me.

Ha ha. Yeah. The enmity thing is hilarious. I remember showing up to Tempest a FATE as a sub 80 GNB, putting my stance on, doing a few AOEs, leaving, and getting gold. Barely any participation.

Seems exploitable, but this is the most cost-effective way to evaluate things. In theory they could program some kind of system better at assessing contribution-- ressing the fallen should score well for example-- though what they have now is mostly fine. The game seems inclined towards giving tanks a little extra, with achievement mounts for example. Given we are helping out in FATEs rather than enjoying instant queues I suppose that's fair enough.

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Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

Theres been some changes to how it rates ppl, compared to before.
IDK when it happened, but recently, was the same level and gear level as my friends, and noticed i always got less exp (by 10-50%) as a tank in tank stance, than as healer or DPS. (comparing to my friends, and my own exp as the same level and iLv. on the same FATE.)
This didnt use to be the case, as tanks always maxed out more than others. But I guess the trade off, is that if you come to the FATE late, tanks build up to gold much faster than DPS/healers. You could hit the last sliver of HP, and get gold in tank stance.
But at the end of the day, you do get less exp over all as a tank, and will fall behind any friends you're playing with. (And when youre the DPS, watch ur tank friends fall behind)
No idea how it works now, as it doesnt make sense now.


Its in the patch notes for when it changed. And for the reason he mentions. [sarcasm] For source, Ill link you to the lodestone, where you can find it. [/ sarcasm]

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I've leveled every job to 80 and I can say with 100% certainty that the above is false. Tanks do NOT get less FATE Exp. That would be insanely stupid for SE to do.