About Chemists and their potential use for FFXIV

So I'm looking at all these potions which some are not used anymore hardly like Blinding, silencing potions, etc.

Now Wouldn't be better if some of these potions became obsolete and turned into skills for a potential Chemist Job?

Now you're wondering whether it should be a DPS or Healer type, but why not both?

How is that going to work you may ask, well the solution is the Chemist can switch to DPS or Healer which will have their own separate skill sets.

Poison/Sleep/Blinding/Paralyze/Offensive Stat buffs+Strength+Dexterity+Intelligence can be regulated to Chemist-DPS Mode

While

Resistance/Healing/Ether Regeneration/Stat buffs+Mind+Vitality can be regulated to Chemist-Healer Mode

Chemist can be the first job to have a Dual Role Type that can be switched to fit the needs of the party.


I know the subject of Chemist was talked about before in the forums, but I was hoping there can be a renewed interest if we look at the job at different perspective by introducing a Dual-Role Job.

Dual role just isn't going to work in this game. Works in in WoW, but this game is really not designed to handle that and SE doesn't even want to do another sch/smn split. A full on dual role job, outside of limited jobs like blue mage as side content, just aren't going to happen.

A new job could bet debuffs themed after those old potions. But it wouldn't just be the actual effects of the old status potions. It would just be debuffs themed after them, but built to work with their current encounter designs.

There's pretty much zero chance they're going to give any status effects like blind and paralyze. They've been removing any form of those over the years, and any form that still exists (like sleep) has extremely limited situations in which it still works.

A dual role like you're talking about is probably never going to happen.

Also, Chemist as a healer is pretty much the most desired job at the moment.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bright-Flower

Dual role just isn't going to work in this game. Works in in WoW, but this game is really not designed to handle that and SE doesn't even want to do another sch/smn split. A full on dual role job, outside of limited jobs like blue mage as side content, just aren't going to happen.

A new job could bet debuffs themed after those old potions. But it wouldn't just be the actual effects of the old status potions. It would just be debuffs themed after them, but built to work with their current encounter designs.

---

Essentially this. The way they designed Arcanist was so bad that the only way they could potentially justify a split class again is to have the class split at Lv. 5 and under. Anything higher than that causes serious balancing issues that both SMN and SCH are still suffering from to this day. They're never going to make another split class sadly. No matter how nice it might be if they could actually implement it properly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

Also, Chemist as a healer is pretty much the most desired job at the moment.

---

And I do think that healer mains will stage a full on riot if it's turned into a DPS class at this point.

We already have a Dual Role job, Arcanist.
But that class is why we will never get another one, balancing it according to Yoshi has been very difficult. Highly doubt they will do another job that will cause that much issue.

And where ya been dog? Chemist has been talked about nermerous times, npt like interest died. There have been plenty of threads talking about the next jobs to be added. And lots have said Chemist Healer.

I would love an Alchemist Combat class as I'm super into mixing magic and physical combat. You ever seen the Alchemist class from Dragons Dogma Online? Pretty much my ideal combat chemist.

Chemist would be an amazing addition to the game and I think it’d be interesting to see how they translate item usage and things like Mix into an ffxiv job.

That said, personally I’d prefer for Chemist to be a standard mage / healer type job than a physical one. Maybe like, charging a flask with aether to make it heal or damage things, or having some kind of magic bag that automatically converts aether into a usable potion (though that would be pretty bizarre lol).

Chemist’s traditional abilities could have their effects adjusted to fit ffxiv while still making sense name-wise. Maybe like a Poison Flask just inflicts a special DoT rather than a universal ‘poison’, Blind Flask could reduce enemy damage and Paralyze Flask could stun the enemy.

As others have said dual role jobs unfortunately won’t ever work as standard ‘jobs’. Whilst it could be possible as a limited job, I’d prefer for it to be a normal one personally lol

I had thought I heard they attempted a gun-toting chemist healer for HW, but they couldn't figure out how to balance it so the mechanics were wrapped into a new job (AST) instead. If AST does part of what chemist was supposed to do, then I guess we'll never see it.

Why is chemist even cared about I mean really they are purely useless after you get like 5 abilitys and unlock black and white mage. beside we got a potion master in the game already but its in the crafters side. Just how I view it we don't really need it as we got alchemist for those who want to be that chemist ... just like we don't need any more swords. We really need the things we are completely missing or lacking in all aspects.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LolitaBansheeMeru

Why is chemist even cared about I mean really they are purely useless after you get like 5 abilitys and unlock black and white mage. beside we got a potion master in the game already but its in the crafters side.

---

I think part of it is 'we want a new healer, what's a classic FF job that could work as a healer?' But maybe I'm wrong and more people are excited for the idea of chemist outside of that context.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bright-Flower

I think part of it is 'we want a new healer, what's a classic FF job that could work as a healer?' But maybe I'm wrong and more people are excited for the idea of chemist outside of that context.

---

There's a few options be it, classic or not like Mascot although honestly dancer should have been a healer due to it being a support/medic with no range abilitys at all in the past games if it was a mele fighter id get why it wasn't but meha but honestly I could name a long list of possible healers if I brought up the page to rememeber them all.

I mean damn you could make make time mage a healer(bleach style) or ff5's necromancer,Oracle maybe

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LolitaBansheeMeru

dancer should have been a healer due to it being a support/medic with no range abilitys at all in the past games

---

This is varying degrees of untrue, as there have been several iterations of Dancer across the franchise. That's just semantics on my part, however.

I do feel like the people who expect Chemist are going to be horrifically disappointed, however. It's like as not that we won't get a healer again, because SE has no idea what to do with healers - and the game overall stretches the 'gimmick' of the three we have to their absolute limits.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Videra

This is varying degrees of untrue, as there have been several iterations of Dancer across the franchise. That's just semantics on my part, however.

I do feel like the people who expect Chemist are going to be horrifically disappointed, however. It's like as not that we won't get a healer again, because SE has no idea what to do with healers - and the game overall stretches the 'gimmick' of the three we have to their absolute limits.

---

the games dancers were in had 3 main uses outside of that they were pointless in the party 1'st helping the healer with dances to regen////heal/rez 2nd was to debuff enemys with negative dance and 3rd was to buff your party members with buff dances like sword dance this has been the same in every game they were in until the online ones.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bright-Flower

I think part of it is 'we want a new healer, what's a classic FF job that could work as a healer?' But maybe I'm wrong and more people are excited for the idea of chemist outside of that context.

---

It's also the fact that Chemist in past FF games was just pure fun to play and absolutely broken in FFX-2 due to the mix ability (see below). To the point that many strategies for cheesing that game revolved around the class. Likewise people want it as a healer because it's traditionally been a support class, sometimes erring on the side of doing more damage but usually having a healing or buffing focus to keep it to the original iteration from FFV. It can put out a lot of damage, see FFX-2, but generally that's not what it was known for which is why people have been automatically assuming it could be a potential fourth healer class.

And if people want to be pedantic about the name it also goes by Salve Maker in the Bravely Default series, so it's not like the fact that having an Alchemist crafting job would preclude them from adding it at all.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/ps2/56...map/7624?raw=1

Whatever healer we get, I hope it's something outlandish and not necessarily mage-like. Currently the most out-there healer we have in this regard is scholar.
It's one of the reasons I was excited for dancer potentially being a healer... the concept just seemed so out there to me.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bright-Flower

I think part of it is 'we want a new healer, what's a classic FF job that could work as a healer?' But maybe I'm wrong and more people are excited for the idea of chemist outside of that context.

---

We do need one more Healer to balance out the jobs, right now only Healer and Physical Ranged DPS needs one more to balance out as 4 types of Job within that role since all the other Role Types have 4 jobs currently (unless people don't really count Blue Mage).

If the next new Job is not a healer, there will be blood.

I think a Chemist could work. Think Ninja Mudras as a Mix mechanic.

Could be really fun.

I don't think they'd go with a Chemist job when there's already an Alchemist class in the game without some sort of really good explanation as to why an Alchemist can't just be a Chemist and vice versa. That said, they could put a magical spin on it similar to Gunblade where a Chemist's abilities stem from imbuing their concoctions with their aether in order to make them functional and this aetheric imbuing only functions on their specially formulated concoctions. Without the aetheric component, the Chemist's concoctions are worthless and they don't have the knowledge to make any other type of concoction. This would explain why an Alchemist can't just achieve the same effects by mixing something up, and why a Chemist isn't able to just mix up a bunch of glue or ink like an Alchemist. I.e. a Chemist relies on their aether to power their concoctions whereas an Alchemist relies on the concoction itself.

I know most people aren't familiar with the Alchemist from EQOA, but I envision a Chemist job behaving (at least superficially) like them: a ranged job actually flinging alchemical bottles around the battlefield that explode on contact either healing or doing damage depending on the concoction used and having a handful of resource heavy direct damage spells to weave in between potion throws for burst and stat increasing potions. In that game, Alchemists were predominantly a dps class tending toward being a hybrid solo healer depending on build and had to actually manually create their potions ahead of time. Due to the way ranged attacks worked in that game (they used a fixed percentage of your max power resource per shot instead of a scaled fixed amount like most abilities) they also had a similar mechanic to Black Mages where they would burn all their mana super quickly on incredibly high sustain single target or AoE dps potion bombs and then drinking a toxic draught that would incredibly quickly restore their mana at the cost of some HP to full effectively giving them unlimited resources as long as they came prepared with potions in their inventory. An EQOA Alchemist could create potions on the fly during combat if they ran low on potions, but it was a lot more button pressing and reduced the effectiveness of their potential burst since they had a handful of standard abilities they could use in between potion throws at the cost of power efficiency. It was not uncommon at all to see Alchemists just standing around Freeport spamming their potion creation spells.

Potion creation ahead of time wouldn't fly in FFXIV and the BLM mp resource thing wouldn't work well on a non-rotation based role like healer, but the thematic elements would work well in my opinion. I.e. a class that actually tosses aetherically infused cure-bombs with the occassional actual dps/dot/buff bomb and actual spell tossed into the mix. Traditional FF Chemist abilities like Mix or Stash would make obvious 30-120s cooldowns used to modify their concoction use.

^ It most likely would be as you describe, a special method of aetherically imbuing certain potions. After all, any healer would still have to be a magical caster role, so it'll use MP and cast times. The lore could be that it's a new Garlean method (ext expact could have us in garlemald) and like MCH and GNB, it uses technology derived from Ceruleum, but as the WoL we can use our own aether (hence the MP) to power it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaliesto

We do need one more Healer to balance out the jobs, right now only Healer and Physical Ranged DPS needs one more to balance out as 4 types of Job within that role since all the other Role Types have 4 jobs currently (unless people don't really count Blue Mage).

---

I really wouldn't count blue mage. It's side content, not a normal job. It may wear casting gear and be classified as a DOW dps, but its status as a limited job means that for all content other than blue mage exclusive content, it's not able to come along.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LolitaBansheeMeru

There's a few options be it, classic or not like Mascot although honestly dancer should have been a healer due to it being a support/medic with no range abilitys at all in the past games if it was a mele fighter id get why it wasn't but meha but honestly I could name a long list of possible healers if I brought up the page to rememeber them all.

I mean damn you could make make time mage a healer(bleach style) or ff5's necromancer,Oracle maybe

---

Dancer is a job I feel works in either roll. I think it would have been fine as a healer, but think it works fine as a ranged dps too with the current implementation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mhaeric

I don't think they'd go with a Chemist job when there's already an Alchemist class in the game without some sort of really good explanation as to why an Alchemist can't just be a Chemist and vice versa.

---

No need, you just need the most basic of explanations: a chemist and an alchemist are not the same thing. At all.

A chemist is a physician, a medicus, a doctor. Their purpose is to treat the ill and wounded. An alchemist is someone who studies a sort of mix of science and philosophy, with a purpose of trying to find the secrets of the universe, including but not limited to finding the cure to everything, even death.

This is only confusing to some people because "alchemist" contains the word "chemist" in it. In japanese the names of the jobs aren't even remotely close. Alchemist is Renkinjutsushi, while Chemist is Kusurishi, which is just a way of saying "Doctor" or "Pharmacist." I'm pretty sure there would be no confusion at all to the Japanese players.

EDIT: Actually I guess it's also confusing because job names are all over the place. FFX-2 has the "Alchemist" job that functions like Chemist; in Japanese that job is literally just called "Item shooter." And we have FFT with a job called Chemist, which in Japanese was called "Item User."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MomomiMomi

A chemist is a physician, a medicus, a doctor. Their purpose is to treat the ill and wounded. An alchemist is someone who studies a sort of mix of science and philosophy, with a purpose of trying to find the secrets of the universe, including but not limited to finding the cure to everything, even death.

This is only confusing to some people because "alchemist" contains the word "chemist" in it.

---

That's not a good analogy. A Chemist is a synonym for a Pharmacist in English. In the UK, local pharmacies are even called chemists. A chemist is a term that also encompasses anyone involved in the research and study of chemistry, for example, professors within university chemistry departments. The etymology of chemist is the same as alchemist so it is not enough to say that it's just confusion over containing the same string of letters. Historically, most scientific disciplines were highly saturated in religion and esotericism before the age of the scientific method came about and the transition from alchemy to chemistry is no different. I would also be willing to bet that the reason the job is called a Chemist instead of Alchemist in past FF games is that it's a shorter version of the word to be able to fit into 8 bit string limits. This is supported by the job actually being called Alchemist in X-2 with all of the same iconic Chemist abilities like Mix and Stash. Having them be 2 separate jobs in XIV would need some reason behind it beyond "ones a doctor and ones a pharmacist".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mhaeric

That's not a good analogy. A Chemist is a synonym for a Pharmacist in English. In the UK, local pharmacies are even called chemists. A chemist is a term that also encompasses anyone involved in the research and study of chemistry, for example, professors within university chemistry departments. The etymology of chemist is the same as alchemist so it is not enough to say that it's just confusion over containing the same string of letters. Historically, most scientific disciplines were highly saturated in religion and esotericism before the age of the scientific method came about and the transition from alchemy to chemistry is no different. I would also be willing to bet that the reason the job is called a Chemist instead of Alchemist in past FF games is that it's a shorter version of the word to be able to fit into 8 bit string limits. This is supported by the job actually being called Alchemist in X-2 with all of the same iconic Chemist abilities like Mix and Stash. Having them be 2 separate jobs in XIV would need some reason behind it beyond "ones a doctor and ones a pharmacist".

---

Except that it isn't called anything close to Alchemist in FFV, the game the job originated from. These jobs originated in a Japanese game, all the English names are just localization choices. And every iteration of Chemist after the FFV job has had a completely different name, not to mention that the FFT job isn't even the same job.

You also seem to have completely misunderstood what I wrote, because no, one isn't a doctor and the other a pharmacist. Alchemist is neither.

If you want examples of what a renkinjutsushi job would look like (which is what FF14's Alchemist is), take a look at some of the games like Final Fantasy Explorers and The 4 Heroes of Light. Those are Alchemist jobs. The FFV job, Chemist, is not.