Why do "you" want an auction house?
Why would it help?
What would it make easier?
Why do you want an Auction House? (discussion)[dev1019]
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03-22-2011, 06:26 AMESARWhy do you want an Auction House? (discussion)[dev1019]
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03-22-2011, 06:40 AMEvangela
AH is the best marketing system in the MMO at this moment
better ask "why don't you want an auction house?" -
03-22-2011, 06:42 AMCairdeas
I don't.
The Marketward does everything a traditonal auction house does without having the long winded auction system. "Oh I have to wait 7 days to see if I won." when most players just put the lowest bid to start as the least they'd accept its not really an auction its as "How much extra do you want to give me for an item you really want." -
03-22-2011, 06:47 AMEvangela
no need to auction everytime becuase you have an option to purchase immediately
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03-22-2011, 06:57 AMMolly_Millions
no, market wards do everything that an AH would
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03-22-2011, 07:02 AMKimowar
an AH would connect all sellers, most other games AH have a buy it now function, but would eliminate the need to travel differnt wards and cities looking for an item, my suggestion if the devs are dead set against an AH, which was se's invention btw, I say the use a broker similar to what soe does for eq2, basiclly it would connect all retainers and could instantly buy from the broker for a small fee instead of hunting down the retainer
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03-22-2011, 07:05 AMShneibel
the 34580358395834583530853th about AH, and pls dont talk like hunting down retainer is a paint in the ass when the ward already tell the retainer loc, retainer name + mark with a red star
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03-22-2011, 07:07 AMCeeKay
Market Ward is fine, its different and does basically the same thing.
Its neat, I like it! -
03-22-2011, 07:08 AMKimowar
its funny, people whine change , change , change, but afraid at the smallest changes like jump and ah,
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03-22-2011, 07:08 AMDreamer
I don't want an AH, at least in the traditional form. The way it has been implemented in other games makes it more like a glorified NPC merchant than anything else. Plus, you can't really add this type of AH without destroying the window-shopping aspect of the market wards, which some of us enjoy.
The worst part, however, is that selling items on an AH is a royal pain in the rear compared to an AH. With the market ward, I can generally have my retainer throw up whatever I want to sell, then forget about it for a few days. With an AH system, you have people constantly undercutting you and then other people undercut them, the net result of which is that prices get driven through the floor. At which point the only people making any semblance of profit are the farmers.
The bottom line is that an AH benefits buyers, while market wards benefit the sellers. I would personally have the latter. -
03-22-2011, 07:21 AMKaiKatzchen
I don't, as others have said the wards basically do what an AH does and it's a different spin on an AH. Though if they put one in, even though I don't see the point, I'm sure it would be used. I just don't see the point in having both...
If I had to choose between Ward and AH:: Ward Please, Thank You. -
03-22-2011, 07:23 AMCorrderio
Main reason: I want to see a universal system where I can buy/sell in any town instead of having to go to Ul'Dah for everything.
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03-22-2011, 07:23 AMCairdeasI think you have that wrong. Most of the people who like the Market Wards do not want jumping >.>Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimowar
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03-22-2011, 07:23 AMMega
I want to be able to:
-Find items
-Buy items
-Sell items
I can now do this within the market wards.
There is still room to improve such as organizing weapons/armor in order of class or rank.
I would be interested to know what the OP's definition of an auction house is so we can all discuss the subject with the same frame of reference. -
03-22-2011, 07:27 AMviionWhat? Have you even used an auction house in an mmo or know what one is?Quote:
Originally Posted by Cairdeas
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03-22-2011, 07:31 AMMegaPlease tell us.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
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03-22-2011, 07:42 AMCairdeas
An Auction House operates two ways.
Blind Auction where you bid low until you hit what the player put as the lowest bid. Prices are not present except in a history. So you might spend up to an hour trying to bid on an item to make sure you got the best price for it. (FFXI)
Or A Silent Timed Auction where you put your bid down and the bid is public and who ever has the highest bid after 7 days wins (WoW)
The Marketward gets rid of both of those and allows for instantaneous purchasing instead of waiting around to make sure you won. -
03-22-2011, 08:09 AMjavid
I have been through a few threads about AH. And I have yet to see someone state a legitimate reason, aside from over paying for an item (sellers advantage), that CAN NOT be implemented in the Market Wards...
Ppl complain "An AH is global!"
No, not all MMO AH are global, nor is that a feature limited only to AH. Also in the future SE may connected the wards for viewing purposes. Example: you are "item searching" in UL and you can see on the list items from GRID (specified by city).
Ppl complain "too much undercutting!"
Um, AH doesn't solve that problem either!
Ppl complain "The Wards have no price history!"
That is correct... maybe in the future they will address that.
PPl complain & complain & complain & complain
And have yet to state a solid argument for AH that could not be implemented to some extent with the Market Ward.
Lets be honest. Have um-teen threads on AH can we be certain that SE will not implement a AH b/c that would undermine the Market Ward they are working so hard to establish?! -
03-22-2011, 08:19 AMTaru_TwoPointO
Anti-RMT please. I like the wards. If they can implement and auction house element while still having to run around to get the item then thats fine.
The current wards stop from any type of RMT botting that can be done on most auction houses where the player can just stand there and access everything. No bot can search for an item and go purchase it with the current setup. -
03-22-2011, 08:34 AMMeenkieblade
Personally, I like the wards system now.
It's not hard to track things down when I need them.
The prices are fair in the sense it's what the seller thinks the item is worth (and not just based on what the average it's been sold for in the past).
My only real wish is that sometime in the future there's a sort feature that focuses on major stats like DEF or ATT. It's hard to find out what is best overall currently because you have to glance at every piece of gear in that ward type.
Oh, and maybe link the wards from all three cities. >.> Eventually. -
03-22-2011, 08:37 AMBelgianRoflThe auction house you are referring to is Eaby.com, not FFXI's Auction House.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cairdeas
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03-22-2011, 08:39 AMEpo
where the heck are you guys getting the idea Auction Houses on games never have a buyout? On every single MMO I've played that has an Auction House you either don't have an auction at all and ONLY have a buyout, or you have both. Seriously people, go play some MMOs and learn how the system works. For goodness sakes, just look at FFXI! And that's the most auction-yish type system I think there is in ANY MMO.
Why I want to see an Auction House is because the ward system, like someone stated previously, has all the conventions of an Auction House...however, even if they have these conventions, it is not optimized. Why should I have to look for a freakin' star next to players with my item instead of just buying it at the window that says it's there? It's not necessary. Now the biggest reason I want an auction house is because, notice all the wards. Battlecraft, Magiccraft, Crystals, etc. So if I have a weapon I wanna sell, I have to go through the hassle of going into the battleward, setting my weapon in a a retainer there, and then leave. The loading between all this, even on a fast computer, is just just not not needed. Especially when I realize, I still have crystals to sell, and a magic weapon oohhh yeah, not just a melee weapon! I gotta go to a whole new ward for a magic weapon. So I go to that ward, set up a retainer, then set one up in the Crystal ward for my crystal. Phew, done. . . . Oh wait... I forgot my armor. Okay! Time to find out if my armor goes in lower, mid, or high, then deal with all that.
It's just a bunch of unneeded, tedious crap. I admit, back in a lot of other MMOs this system would be fine. Such as many free to play that don't have an auction house. But FFXIV ain't gonna be free to play forever, and it's a heckuva lot better than a free to play MMO anyway. There's no reason for it to not have an optimized marketing system that even it's predecessor by 8 years even has. Yes, it is a different system, but don't fix what isn't broken. There's a reason every MMO has an auction house nowadays. It's because it's the best marketing system out there, and just 'cause you have an auction house doesn't make you similar to another game.
Different for the sake of different is rarely good. -
03-22-2011, 08:42 AMDarkRain
This is my view of the AH.
I would like to have one because you wouldent need to STAY in one city ( Ul'Dah ).
If the AH was like that in 11 it would be just fine.
Bad thing with an AH is RMTs this is where thay make 90% of there gil to sell. We buy items thay save the gil some lazy bastard spends 20$ just for 1~3mil ( no idea what the going rate is ) And the circle is never broken.
But haveing said that if you goto the wards now you can see RMTs all over there. There in the Crystal wards. All the RMTs now are Alch/Fishers/Botonest What thay do is gather fish or bugs and squish them in to crystals and shards. Then people who are crafting non stop go and buy the shards/crystals from the wards. Again never ending Circle. ( if you notice 3 or 4 retainers with the same names like crystalxx , crystalxxx,crystalxxxx...ext)
You will never stop RMTs there is only one true way to stop rmts and that is make , farm , and gather everything yourself. And hope you score the NM before thay do and get the drop . If you dont feed the RMT gil ( buying crystals for example) thay will eventualy go away. Also if anyone is buying FFXIV gil you really are one lazy ass lol . Gil is SOOOOOOO easy to make in the game and mats drop all the time if you craft so there is really no excuse to buy any gil.
Ok Sorry whent off on a rant there lol ( I HATE RMTS )But more or less we could use a AH and use the retainers like we did in 11 .
How did we use retainers in 11 you ask? Well we just parked our arses outside Jeuno and whent to sleep or work came back to see if anything sold. Retainers could be useing like this along with your AFK selling. But retainers are allways there even if you log out. So your AFK selling just not loged in but you could do that also. -
03-22-2011, 08:43 AMZkieve
I dont like or dislike wards in particular.it is functional.It could definitely be better.But there are few thins that is no reason to love /hate it imo;
-it does not stop RMT.
-It is not the most user friendly system.
-It does (for the most part) everything an AH would.
I dont think is a priority.I also believe that it will be implemented because is what the majority wants.
I never fully understood why not make a global AH .In the end 90% of the players will use the most used place , or at least is what i have experienced. -
03-22-2011, 08:49 AMGail
An AH is only as good as its functionality and facility, wards at the present work. That doesn't mean any AH would necessarily be better.
Take for example XI and WoW, the AH are only as good as how they are linked.
In the end you'll probably end up going to the same AH to sell your stuff be it Jeuno, Al'zhabi, Stormwind, Orgrimmar, or our equivalent in XIV, Ul'dah.
I think its always good in a game for there to be some outside markets away from the main circle anyway.
Usually you can find some specialist items and sometimes cheaper.
No AH doesn't bother me at the moment, its not make or break for the game. -
03-22-2011, 08:50 AMShadowskill
I honestly don't see the need for an AH. The wards just need few minor tweaks... then most importantly a server that can handle them (Crash way to much) other then that. I find it nice to be able to search for the item in question. shop around through the search function, when locate the Retainer. walk up and purchase it. Sure having an AH doing the exact same thing would take one step out of this.. since the Wards are in place. work fairly well (minus the crashing) either would work. I just like the feeling of going up to a Retainer then buying my item.. probably old fashion in a way.
They could add an Auction House so to speak. where players can have open bids on hard to get items. make it a true Auction. highest bidder gets rewarded with what ever item they can afford.
I cool feature they could add to the existing Wards.. a world search function, allowing players to search other wards, to look for the cheapest deal. (would still need travel to said ward though) help with traveling around wasting Anima just to find the first ward was cheapest. also help crafters to find a suitable town to sell their goods. -
03-22-2011, 08:53 AMDarkRain
Im going to start my own Auction when the game is live again (tomorrow) im going to stand in Ul'Dah and say For sale 50 fire crystals. Lets start the bidding at 300gil !! and see what kind of reaction i get
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03-22-2011, 09:01 AMTheplatter
I overall preferred the AH in FFXI; sure Wards perform a similar function but the constant crashing and resetting of wards makes it an inferior system. However, if SE were to replace the Wards with an AH, they'd also need to add the Mog Houses (which would be awesome).
Funny though that people say they'd prefer the AH over Wards since they don't want to have to travel to get what they want, when FFXI had a series of independent AH's for each of the major towns that sometimes crossed over/tied with other areas. -
03-22-2011, 09:12 AMChory
AH is much easier to navigate/sort and faster to purchase/check price than MW. Price history feature, no running, no loadings between zones, easier SELL LIST management. Only good thing about MW is gear display on retainer but honestly - it will be much better if items will start to actually work different instead of just look different.
Oh, and you're sooooooo wrong saying MW is an anti-RMT tool.
RMTs hardly speculate with prices. They usually focus on intense farming/gathering/NM camping and flood the market with stuff. Their activity usually lowers the prices. MW makes it harder for them at the same level it makes buying/selling harder for all players. It isn't more anti-RMT than it is anti-players. And seriously, SE should focus on making FFXIV playable instead of fighting RMTs. RMTs don't care much about FFXIV atm.
BTW: I prefer dealing with RMTs over dealing with SEs anti-RMT tools. Anti-RMT tools usually harm regular payers with collateral damage. The one and only good manner to deal with RMTs is to ban them. -
03-22-2011, 09:19 AMGod
Need an AH to save precious time.
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03-22-2011, 09:21 AMTaru_TwoPointOSeriously? You rather deal with on and off full economy inflation then walk a few steps? The reason RMT caused inflation in FFXI was due to camping the auction house, buying all of something and then selling it at the price they wanted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chory
How did they do this? Bots.
Sure they can do that now if they want. But its a shit load harder with all the running around.
It is really sad that you would rather deal with RMT then walk around for a few minutes.
I'm done with these dev threads. People dont think of the future they just want now now now. -
03-22-2011, 09:25 AMEpoRight.... a few extra steps are gonna stop a bot, when they have bots advanced enough to go level for you...Leveling doesn't require walking? wut?Quote:
Originally Posted by Taru_TwoPointO
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03-22-2011, 09:27 AMYarr
Like others, Id rather see this new system continue to grow into is own version of an AH.
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03-22-2011, 09:31 AMTaru_TwoPointOI sugget thinking before you talk.Quote:
Originally Posted by Epo
Enemies can be targeted and its a single number button to attack. Thats how easy it is to create a bot to level up.
1: There is no way a bot can shop with the market wards. It cannot read the screen explaining which ward the item is in.
2: You need visual identification to determine which retainer has the star on its head to go to it.
3: You need to be able to read the bazaar and choose the correct item in the listing to purchase said item.
I do believe there is no way to choose any of this in the computer memory with ffxiv due to it being server side.
Auction houses usually have static listings which can be macro'd via a bot of just a damn long macro editor.
As I said, please dont try to outwit someone if you don't have all the information. -
03-22-2011, 09:31 AMZkieveForgive me if im wrong , but didnt the inflation in 11 stopped when they started mass banning RMT?Around when they introduced the special task team (sorry i cant remember the exact name of it)Idk how it is now, but when i left ffxi the RMT were pretty controlled ,The most annoying were players using bots at HNMs.Not RMT.But anyways the point is it didnt had anything to do with AH or not.I could be wrong , my memory is not what it used to be.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taru_TwoPointO
Anyways i still see many rmt in 14 (pointless if you ask me )in wards and everywhere so if wards is a anti rmt measure, it has failed miserably. -
03-22-2011, 09:37 AMCairdeas
Buyouts are normally set to ridiculous prices or not at all, so do not use them as valid points.
I have spent more then enough time waiting for auctions to finish in games like wow Because someone put an item I could use now up for 7 days with no buyout and would refuse my in game tells asking for a speedy purchase. -
03-22-2011, 09:46 AMCommat
I don't care as long as it works.
Works in my mind means:
1. I can find what i want quickly.
2. I can unload my goods into the system without hassle.
3. The system fosters a fluid economy.
I feel right now the current system does 1 and 2 fine, and a larger player base would make 3 happen as well.
AH is great, but honestly with the new search function and larger item stacks its basically the same thing =) -
03-22-2011, 09:56 AMChoryYes. Price fluctuation is a part of economy. It is in real world (example: gas/petrol/diesel prices), and it is part of every MMO with or without RMTs. How much is Iron Haubergeon on your serwer atm? 50k? 100k? 150k? Whatever the price is, you want the item, you got enough gil - you buy. Then you sell it and you get most of your money back. If it will go up to 500k due to RMTs speculation (and like i said - RMTs rather lower the prices flooding the market with stuff than speculate) you will need more gil to buy it and you will get more gil selling it. If crafting material gets more expensive - item crafted with it will go higher too. No real harm to economy. Inflation is always way better then deflation. And even deflation caused by RMTs is just a part of economy. Running around Market Wards is always waste of time. And time > gil.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taru_TwoPointO
BTW: if you dont want bots (seriously ive never heard bout AH bots) to buy your stuff cheap - dont sell it cheap lol. -
03-22-2011, 09:59 AMEpoQuote:
Originally Posted by Taru_TwoPointO
You just said yourself you need visual identification to determine, and you need to be able to read the bazaar. Did you know... in FFXI, you need to read the prices of items? Did you know, that requires visual confirmation? Did you knows bots CAN do visual confirmation?! NOWAI.
And before you say that the bots just raised the amount of what they were trying to buy by xxx amount of Gil with the FFXI AH, no one said they had to use that out-dated AH either.
If you play just about any MMO, there AH is much more optimized than FFXI's, and such a bot would not work for that.
Did you also know that the majority of RMT-ers don't BOT around ? They hack into other people's accounts, and take their gil, or bot for farming, aka grinding the items they want then sell. RMT-ers very rarely buy then resell, as they're usually the ones selling at the lowest price.
How about you get your facts straight, buddeh? x) -
03-22-2011, 10:09 AMChoryWith buying/selling directly form item search menu, improved categorization (followed by 2% tax rate for all items), HQ items search option, and no market area crashes it would be similar to AH. At the moment it is far from the same. Actually only the search option makes MW look a bit like AH. All the rest is COMPLETELY different. Much worse to be clear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Commat