'Retro' aestethics on role actions

TL;DR: Bring back our old unique role actions/animations! Add new ones to GNB.

Since patch 4.4 role actions were not limited, and since 5.0 role actions have been revised as normal leveling abilities - well, more or less... essentially.

Now that this limitation has been lifted, I wonder why not just revise them to the old abilites, e.g. Shadowskin instead of Rampart on DRK?
I will be honest... Rampart doesn't fit the other tanks, Low Blow doesn't fit PLD either. Also, I miss those cool old animations on WAR and DRK.

What I would like to see...
...for
WAR:
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...sight_Icon.png Foresight instead of Rampart

https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...Swing_Icon.png Brutal Swing instead of Low Blow

DRK:
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...wskin_Icon.png Shadowskin instead of Rampart

https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag..._Blow_Icon.png Low Blow old icon and animation (apparently used more effect particles)

GNB introduce new animations and/or icons. e.g. a hit with the stock/grip of your gun as a stun, and an aether-impured shot for 'rampart' (similar to HoS).

PLD:
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...mpart_Icon.png use 3.x animation on Rampart (apparently used different animation, the current one is a removed PvP skill animation)

https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag..._Bash_Icon.png Shield Bash instead of Low Blow?
They could revise Shield Bash into an oGCD stun. I don't see any use of Shield Bash as a GCD right now. Is is needed in a quest or in certain encounter? It feels like a noob trap skill, as it breaks your combo, spaming it way too often causes the target to get immune to stun, and it has hilarious low poentcy. Am I mistaken? Please prove me wrong!

https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...Swipe_Icon.png Shield Swipe instead of Low Blow

It could be a more 'unique' stun with 6s duration on 25/30s recast.

With the exception of PLD stun, nothing would effect balance.
Those are only aestethic changes I would like to see.
Have you any more suggestions for changes? Would you welcome such changes or rather keep the current one?

Bonus for healer actions Esuna:

SCH:
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...eches_Icon.png Leeches

AST:
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...iment_Icon.png Exalted Detriment
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...ether_Icon.png Luminiferous Aether instead of Lucid Dreaming?

WHM:
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...Esuna_Icon.png Esuna old Icon (and animation? - current Esuna simply uses Leeches icon in blue)
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...aints_Icon.png Shroud of Saints instead of Lucid Dreaming?
(They are essentially the same with different coloring... did it use a different animation, too?)

Bonus for melee stun: (17th Sep)

MNK:
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...Punch_Icon.png One Ilm Punch
or
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag..._Peak_Icon.png Steel Peak
Both actions used to stun before they got changed/removed. One Ilm Punch even used to remove a buff from the target, so I think Steel Peak would be more suitable for a stun? No clue which animation would be better.

NIN:
https://ffxiv.gamerescape.com/w/imag...ulate_Icon.png Jugulate
In 3.x Jugulate used to stun or silence depending on your current weapon buff. In 4.x it just silenced. Fitting for it so get revived as a stun, right?

DRG already had Leg Sweep to begin with, SAM would need a new action (Ageha?).

I want the old Howling Fist instead of Hadouken.

Current Rampart on PLD doesn't even have the animation it use to have when it was PLD-specific. The weapon-up animation it currently has was pulled from something else, I think PVP skills?

The whole point of role actions is so that every time they make a new job they don’t have to make the same mandatory skills again with a new animation. If anything they should take it a step further and make sentinel and raise tank and healer role actions.

If these moves were to come back it should be as a new move with unique effects not just copy paste of the same move again. Make the role actions a foundation for all jobs of the role to have necessary skills for the job and have job actions be things that add unique flavour to the job.

For example if they removed vengeance and made sentinel a role action then vengeance could come back as a move that just adds counter attacks feeding into wars dps tank identity, bulwark could come back as a move that doubles block strength feeding into plds mitigation tank identity and so on.

I completely agree and fully support this! Gods, Rampart's been bugging me since the start of Stormblood when it was introduced for all tanks. It's so akward!

There's probably a couple of other skills that should be glammable, another one I can think of would be old Reprisal for DRK (Though I'll admit, it's animation and sound effect would definitely be too chunky and satisfying for a skill that does no damage). Also, Low Blow on DRK had unique sound effects and particles as well, so that would be nice to have- although, that'd also be getting into the too-impactful-no-damage zone I feel.

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Originally Posted by Cabalabob

The whole point of role actions...

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I disagree. Some role skills (Ahem Rampart) feel very akward in my opinion. The jobs are already quite similar (ahem Dark Warrior :I) with only slight differences in gameplay, visual flavour is probably the next thing you could assign a job it's "feel" to. Also, since these animations and sound effects already exist and are unused, it'd be little work for SE to get them back in- you could call it unfair for GNB if they were available for use, but it (was) kinda the same thing for SMN/SCH, since Scholar couldn't use the carbuncles glamours. What I mean is, something is better than nothing.

I support this, I always appreciated the extra flavour each job had in its own way, having different animations for essentially the same skills, certainly made them feel more unique, would like to see them return to this.

I would love to see a lot of cut actions make a return in some way as well, whether by some sort of "action glamour" system or gradual reintroduction of old skills refurbished for the games current state.

Peloton already has different animations based on class, I don't see why other role abilities can't, especially if it helps add more unique flair to the jobs.

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Originally Posted by Xenosan

Current Rampart on PLD doesn't even have the animation it use to have when it was PLD-specific. The weapon-up animation it currently has was pulled from something else, I think PVP skills?

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Originally Posted by SummerScorcher

[...] Also, Low Blow on DRK had unique sound effects and particles as well, so that would be nice to have- although, that'd also be getting into the too-impactful-no-damage zone I feel.

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Thank you for the insight. I started FFXIV during the last few patches in 3.x, and I even tho my first job was PLD, I can barely remember the differences in the animation of 3.x Rampart or Low Blow (DRK my 2nd/3rd most played job).
I will edit the entry post.

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Originally Posted by SummerScorcher

[...] visual flavour is probably the next thing you could assign a job it's "feel" to.

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Originally Posted by Tizzy_Tormentor

I always appreciated the extra flavour each job had in its own way, having different animations for essentially the same skills, certainly made them feel more unique, would like to see them return to this.

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I can somewhat understand SE decision changing Rampart and Low Blow to role actions, just as Esuna for healer role actions. Giving players the freedom to chose between actions based on duty.
Their first problem was, they probably felt to force themselves to do 10 role actions, and you can choose 5 of them. Similar to HW cross class/job system, every class/job had 10 actions to choose from - while classes could take them all, jobs only could take 5. But most weren't mandatory and just a bonus.
FUN FACT: Classes could take all 10 role actions before 4.4 hit, too.
The second problem was that many role actions were mandatory, e.g. Rampart (a must-have! no exceptions), Protect, and Esuna in certain duties. It destroyed the whole concept of role actions, because there were so few to actually choose from.
It's good they changed it 'back' in 5.0, but they should have gone further in re-introducing old 'role actions' for job aethetics.
If they had the time, they could do complete new actions/animations with the same effect because we are not limited. We actually wouldn't need role actions anymore.

Imo I am not fond of the idea of actions glamours just yet. It might work for some tank and healer actions because they got their kits changed by a lot more than DPS job' ones. And... well, yeah, that's the problem... DPS jobs wouldn't make use of this glamour system because there aren't any (or many) skills that were removed or reworked. e.g. SMN Outburst vs Tri-bind, but none for NIN.
On the other hand... yeah, I miss old Delirium and Butchers Block weapon animation :(

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Originally Posted by Decraven

Peloton already has different animations based on class, I don't see why other role abilities can't, especially if it helps add more unique flair to the jobs.

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Peloton animation on MCH is actually the old 'Place turret' animation, Tactican also uses that very same animation. DNC uses a unique animation for Peloton (...I think?!?) Shield Samba has a unique one for sure!
They did rework MCH gameplay-wise, but since 4.0 they are still missing actual (new) animations!

I can understand that it takes extra work to come up with new animations and names for abilities that functionally do the same thing. But when you invest effort into creating an animation like Shadowskin, making ARR's Rampart standard feels like a downgrade. Shadowskin and Shadow Wall are beautiful to watch. Imagine replacing Shadow Wall with Sentinel's animation out of a desire to standardise the 30% DR cooldowns. No thanks.

When you have better looking, newer animations already in game, don't replace them with ugly 7+ year old ones.

Can anyone remember what the bloodbath animation was back when it was a WAR action?

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Originally Posted by ArianeEwah

Imo I am not fond of the idea of actions glamours just yet. It might work for some tank and healer actions because they got their kits changed by a lot more than DPS job' ones. And... well, yeah, that's the problem... DPS jobs wouldn't make use of this glamour system because there aren't any (or many) skills that were removed or reworked. e.g. SMN Outburst vs Tri-bind, but none for NIN.
On the other hand... yeah, I miss old Delirium and Butchers Block weapon animation :(

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NIN had a really cool combo finish called Dancing Edge, it was really nice and I would love to use that instead of Aeolein Edge, a couple of other cool abilities like Mutilate also got axed off, you could use that to replace the animation of something like Mug.
For MCH, you could bring back cool skills from HW like Rend Mind and Suppressive Fire to replace stuff like Gauss Round or Heatblast, I remember people preferring the old unheated shots too, could bring those back for the 1-2-3 combo.
Just a few idea off the top of my head, I feel as though its a thing that should be explored, we have a lot of cut actions, many of which looked fantastic, would be nice to see them return in some way.

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Originally Posted by Lyth

I can understand that it takes extra work to come up with new animations and names for abilities that functionally do the same thing. But when you invest effort into creating an animation like Shadowskin, making ARR's Rampart standard feels like a downgrade. Shadowskin and Shadow Wall are beautiful to watch. Imagine replacing Shadow Wall with Sentinel's animation out of a desire to standardise the 30% DR cooldowns. No thanks.

When you have better looking, newer animations already in game, don't replace them with ugly 7+ year old ones.

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This. The work was already done. It took additional work to undo it. And for what?

I suspect at this point it was just to add momentum to the idea of Role Actions as a foil to Cross-class actions, rather than any individually practical consideration.
"We sincerely apologize for Cross-class actions and for certain jobs' skills being reskins of former tools. From here out we'll be more honest, and just copy the former skills verbatim, all as a part of our new system, Role Actions!"

I want rampart to have different animations for all 4 tanks so bad. You don't know how stupid it is to use and see rampart while on DRK.

There are quite a few animations I really liked that were sadly removed. Biggest one is Wide Volley, it was one of my favourite Bard weapon skills lol, so I’d love to see it return someday.

That said, I get why quite a few abilities were put into the role skills, like Lucid Dreaming or Rampart. It is a bit strange for every job in a role to have different skills with the exact same effect. That said, isn’t this still present in quite a lot of forms? Like the level 38 tank cooldowns, all being the same 30% damage reduction skill with a bit of added flavour. Likewise, Ranged DPS have Troubadour / Shield Samba / Tactician, which all have the exact same effect and even the same cooldown, with the additional effect of being unstackable. Wouldn’t it make more sense for these abilities to just be role skills?

I feel like role skills should all have different animations depending on the job. I know it would be a lot of work, ranged DPS already have Peleton as a role skill that has different animations depending on the job

Beside Role actions square seems to take alot of the best looking rotation skills away, like rage of halone(past 60),spinning slash scourge,delerium(heaveansward),powerslash,butchers block, heavy thrust and impulse drive.

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Originally Posted by Joshieboy

Beside Role actions square seems to take alot of the best looking rotation skills away, like rage of halone(past 60),spinning slash scourge,delerium(heaveansward),powerslash,butchers block, heavy thrust and impulse drive.

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Yeah it's said that this was done for the grace of making game easier and less skills on hotbar, but instead, I think they should put the combos as it is in pvp (pressing the sequence, same button) and keep the former unique animations.
Gawd, how I miss mch grenade! Would happily overwrite that nonsense aoe for the granade.

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Originally Posted by Tizzy_Tormentor

NIN had a really cool combo finish called Dancing Edge, it was really nice and I would love to use that instead of Aeolein Edge, a couple of other cool abilities like Mutilate also got axed off, you could use that to replace the animation of something like Mug.

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Oh yeah, I forgot about that one skill that no NIN wanted to use - ever :D
(and that's why they wanted to have a WAR in party)
Mutilate instead of Mug is an interessting idea. While they were never used for the same purpose, it could work.

It might only be accessible to 'old' jobs (for now) - tho it would make them more appealing and interessting.

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Originally Posted by Joshieboy

snip

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My favorite was Ring of Thorns ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

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Originally Posted by Brightmore

Gawd, how I miss mch grenade! Would happily overwrite that nonsense aoe for the granade.

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Aww man, MCH Grenado Shot... and BRD Wide Volley - they had it right there - AOE rotation for BRD and MCH... such a missed opportunity.

Added melee stun alternatives in the OP.

I may add range DPS actions next, still not certain 'bout it...

(yes, this is a push for an edit :x )

Yeah, I miss my neat little sword twirl for rampart...

Not seeing why that was changed.