Make Blue Mage a dps focused HEALER job.

I think everyone could agree with me on this that blue mage needs a complete rework and being made into a properly functioning job.

Since there is unbalance in the number of classes, what if we turn blue mage into a dps oriented healer?
Making it a pure healer wouldnt make a lot of sense from design perspective, so maybe SE should experiment with a healer that could do damage and heal at the same time?
With abilities similar to warriors nascent flash, where warrior deals damage and he heals other party member with it, blue mage could have something like that too and have some healing skills as well. Blue mage could also have some team mitigation tools or damage reducing spells too to make it all more diverse.
It will be something different to play and game would use some more healers.

Eh, to be honest, I don't think healers deserve or should get a recycled (re-purposed? refurbished?) job as their new healer job after waiting all this time for one.

I really don't want BLU as a healer. I want a brand new healer.
I can agree that BLU needs some serious help.
I thought they'd expand on it a little by now.
Preferably making it part of the team of legit DPS
and not this Clown Fiesta Circus Show they have it as lol.

At this point, I'll take any solution that involves Blue mage becoming a full fledged class TAT

It's a bit late for them to transform a class like this, no matter the idea. There's a few ghost achievements already tied to it, and we know SE won't touch anything that has an achievement.

stop trying to make blu happen, it's not going to happen

I'm not going to give up hope! ^O^/

Nah. I'd love for BLU to be more viable, but it really doesn't feel like a good fit for this kind of playstyle. BLU has always been about using monster spells, and for better or worse there aren't a whole lot of healing ones.

I think Blue Mage would be better as a full dps job and good new healers could be Geomancer, Necromancer, Chemist, etc.

A DPS oriented healer job in the current game would be very unbalanced. No one would take the other healers if a healer could keep the party alive effectively while bringing better dps.

I'm open for blu to be just about anything except limited.

As long as BLU is a functional real job, I'll take anything at this point.

I love BLU, but a healer it is not, even traditionally it had some powerful heals but nothing that actually replace a dedicated healer. The ideal pipe dream would be a BLU spec for each role, but i do not see that ever happening, if it must be something it would make sense to work it into a dps not a healer

BLU should just be reworked into a full functioning caster job. They have the spells they just need to actually make the job viable, and personally prune the amount of spells they have, mainly remove the CC spells as CC has never been a thing in this game.

Healers deserve an actual new job not a repurposed one. I for one am rooting for Chemist.

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Originally Posted by van_arn

stop trying to make blu happen, it's not going to happen

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Shut up Regina! :P

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Originally Posted by van_arn

stop trying to make blu happen, it's not going to happen

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This. All of this.

Have you been to the class forums lately? there's 3-5 threads in each whinging about "Job Identity", whatever the hell that means. It's a race to the bottom to see who can scream their bad idea the loudest to make their pet class "more in line with traditional FF (INSERT Class here)", even if it wont work within the games framework.

This is why they where nervous about Blue Mage. It just doesn't work within ffxiv's battle system, Where everyone is specialized into one of three roles, with very little overlap. And would you look at that, they where right to be nervous.

Blue has all the job identity you could ever want :)

Next healer job i would rather it be something new and hopefully unique.
Highly likely it could be Geomancer.. in 7.0 .
(bad joke i know but we all know next expansion will be more dps..)

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Originally Posted by Razard

This. All of this.

Have you been to the class forums lately? there's 3-5 threads in each whinging about "Job Identity", whatever the hell that means. It's a race to the bottom to see who can scream their bad idea the loudest to make their pet class "more in line with traditional FF (INSERT Class here)", even if it wont work within the games framework.

This is why they where nervous about Blue Mage. It just doesn't work within ffxiv's battle system, Where everyone is specialized into one of three roles, with very little overlap. And would you look at that, they where right to be nervous.

Blue has all the job identity you could ever want :)

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You need to be a real Job to have a Job identity. Real talk though, its been discussed so many times that FFXIV doesnt match Blues Job identity its unreal, so it doesnt bear repeating all of it. But a nice Sum up is BLU is historically used to support and compliment a party, something ffxivs cannot do

BLU hasn't ever been a healer and I'm equally confused about this as I was when people were hoping DNC would be a healer (it never was either). Any FF I've ever played never had Geomancer as a healer either. Where are folks getting these ideas about job roles? Or id this just some desperate grab for a 4th healer?

All healers are pretty much a dps focused healer job right now

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Originally Posted by ReiMakoto

You need to be a real Job to have a Job identity. Real talk though, its been discussed so many times that FFXIV doesnt match Blues Job identity its unreal, so it doesnt bear repeating all of it. But a nice Sum up is BLU is historically used to support and compliment a party, something ffxivs cannot do

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Looks like points where missed young squire. Do keep up.

The point is the same people advocating for Blue to be a "real job" are the same people who would have complained if it was a "real job". How many times have people said on this forum alone that "(Insert Class) doesn't feeeeeeeeeeeeeel like (insert class mentioned previously)"? And all the arguments I have heard from the "real jobbers" don't seem to answer the fundemental question.

How do you keep the essence of the Blue Mage while keeping it within the framework of the Holy Trinity? Because let me tell you as a Summoner player it's frustrating to see every single thread about my class being a countdown to the "Muh not real Summoner" post and subsequent 20 car pile up that ensues.

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Originally Posted by Kemiko

BLU hasn't ever been a healer and I'm equally confused about this as I was when people were hoping DNC would be a healer (it never was either). Any FF I've ever played never had Geomancer as a healer either. Where are folks getting these ideas about job roles? Or id this just some desperate grab for a 4th healer?

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My only experience with blue mage healing came from FFTA and even then...it was quirky as hell and easily outclassed at mid game by pretty much any other class with healing spells.

That being said....

I wouldn't object to it if it's what was SE decided.

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Originally Posted by Razard

[...] "Job Identity", whatever the hell that means.

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Are you serious or is this just a phrase?
GW2 underwent many changes with their "elite specializations" that this job identity has been watered down so much tha you don't even know what you are playing right now. Granted, I like(d) my Deadeye, but a thief was usually a close-to-medium ranged profession with stealing and stabbing in mind. Suddenly: A sniper. Stealth was only for Mesmer (I think) and thieves. Now all class have some sort of stealth, even the one that is the most "rational" one (reads as: Far off any magic): The Engineer (Scrapper/Holosmith to be more precise). When thieves have a long range and tinkerer gain access to magical abilites, you know you lost your job identity in your game.

Imagine Black Mages suddenly tank better than a Warrior because they gain a funky defensive black magic shield, or Monks are now shooting arrows with their hands by throwing them very, very fast.....or something like that. Don't drink and think.


And this is one serious and important thing to keep, else you will get a strange form of power-creep: Everyone will be a jack of all trades, and we are all homogenized.

But I am sure you knew that.....I hope at least.

Sincerely,

https://imgur.com/HTju1aB.png

No thanks. As a tri-healer main, I don't want this job as a new healer. DPS yes, but healer no.

However, in all honesty, I don't see SE ever giving us a new healer. I truly believe we're going to be stuck with the healers for the rest of the game's life, while DPS continue to get new jobs. Why? Well, it seems SE is truly clueless on how to balance them while making the majority of the population happy. It always feels like the majority of the dev time is spent on DPS, then tanks, and finally healers in a very last place.

When they do the next update to BLU, they should just allow it to reach 80, even if they don't have content past HW for it.

Then people can stop crying about the class as it'd be able to enter all dungeons, trials and 8-man raids...


Overall the limitations for the class just mean it can't do MSQ and join random parties.

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Originally Posted by Razard

Looks like points where missed young squire. Do keep up.

The point is the same people advocating for Blue to be a "real job" are the same people who would have complained if it was a "real job". How many times have people said on this forum alone that "(Insert Class) doesn't feeeeeeeeeeeeeel like (insert class mentioned previously)"? And all the arguments I have heard from the "real jobbers" don't seem to answer the fundemental question.

How do you keep the essence of the Blue Mage while keeping it within the framework of the Holy Trinity? Because let me tell you as a Summoner player it's frustrating to see every single thread about my class being a countdown to the "Muh not real Summoner" post and subsequent 20 car pile up that ensues.

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Thats a very broad generalisation, Im a person who advocates for an unlimited Blue and i couldnt give a rats ass if they squeezed it into the formula.

You keep the essence of BLU by being a party focus'd support dps that uses monster abilities, wether these are learned through job quests or overworld is irrelevant. It didnt need to be a tank, it didnt need to be a healer. BLU has the most flexible identity of any role in the final fantasy franchise, making it fit is not some slight to the class identity, in one game you ate monsters and had percentage based skills mostly, in one you get hit, in one your BLU magic was mostly physical and cast using cats. Very flexible identity.

Also not sure what you mean by "Looks like points *where* missed squire", I intentially left out points to avoid writing an essay like i have in other threads

i thought the point of BLU was to be able to do everything so they are a healer... of sorts.

With the current game design of FF14, DPS is the only real option.
With the 2.0/3.0 game design, tank would have been just on the edge of possible.
And MAYBE with 2.0 and 3.0, healer. (But with soem extra "features" required.)

There's no way they would put BLU as anything other than DPS, with the current design of making tanks and healers simplistic, in comparison to their prior selves.
So why make a healer/tank who is even more complex than 2.0/3.0 healer/tank? (While im fine with this, SE doesnt seem to be on board with making new complex classes, but instead, changing old ones into more complex playstyles, or more simplistic than their prior playstyles.)

Also, there's no way SE wouldnt make it a full job, just to cut corners in the future. It may be 5 expansions later, but sooner or later the game will be dying, and they think, "hey we already have a job with fully fleshed out animations, and 3d models, lets just repurpose that!"

I don't think BLU would fit the healer role. At all. It would make a far better magical ranged DPS than a healer, considering everything I've heard and read about the job.

I think the healers deserve a bit better than a repurposed, almost hand-me-down healer BLU. Given the teases last expansion about Geomancer (Swallow's Compass), and the distancing of WHM from Earth and Wind elements (Dia and Glare replacing Aero and Stone), I could see Geomancer being a healer.

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Originally Posted by Kemiko

BLU hasn't ever been a healer and I'm equally confused about this as I was when people were hoping DNC would be a healer (it never was either). Any FF I've ever played never had Geomancer as a healer either. Where are folks getting these ideas about job roles? Or id this just some desperate grab for a 4th healer?

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This.

Also, we already have a class that mixes potions. It's called alchemist. People can't talk about unique class identity and have both a class called chemist and alchemist.
:/

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Originally Posted by Razard

Looks like points where missed young squire. Do keep up.

The point is the same people advocating for Blue to be a "real job" are the same people who would have complained if it was a "real job". How many times have people said on this forum alone that "(Insert Class) doesn't feeeeeeeeeeeeeel like (insert class mentioned previously)"? And all the arguments I have heard from the "real jobbers" don't seem to answer the fundemental question.

How do you keep the essence of the Blue Mage while keeping it within the framework of the Holy Trinity? Because let me tell you as a Summoner player it's frustrating to see every single thread about my class being a countdown to the "Muh not real Summoner" post and subsequent 20 car pile up that ensues.

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(1) The "job identity" is usually possible, with rare cases its not. (only because of balance issues. No other reason should be preventing it.)
Just because they didnt do it, doesnt mean it wasnt possible.

(2) They didnt even get BLU job identity right either. Some weird mix of BLUs, based mostly on FFXI, then FFV, then FFVI. The most common trait out of what wasnt added, was being able to rely on their weapon when they dont have spells. In the case of FF14, weapons basic "Attack" option is replaced by Weapon Skills, and auto attacks. (Which BLU didnt get.) Only in FFVI did they not. (Which is why i mentioned it)

(3) They also dont need a 1:1 comparison to the older jobs, just get the generalized "feel" of the job, given the game its on.
If they make an action RPG, and put BLU into it, making it fit the action RPG mechanics, does that suddenly mean its not a real BLU? Only if it doesnt actually encompass the point of being a BLU.

Lastly (4) The people who are "mad they didnt fit its identity" dont exist yet, nor do you know if they would have, due to a lack of making a BLU either fit, or not fit, its identity. When the devs make a current job fit its identity, or semi close, most people dont complain, EXCEPT those who think only a certain game within the series represents what the jobs identity should be. Those people are in the minority. They may be a vocal minority, but still a minority. (Example: "RDM should be primarily a debuffer, with some good buffs like it was in FFXI!") A job that comes close would be PLD, and clemency in place of cures. Most people stopped complaining about PLDs lack of identity, and started only complaining PLDs self sustain is tied to the GCD w/o DPS attachment. (aka, make it oGCD) There are a few people who say it should have "Cure" instead, but its extremely rare. SMN is an example where SE didnt try to make it fit its identity (mostly because the job wasnt supposed to be SMN, it was supposed to be a necromancer like job, which was changed semi last minute.)
SMN always AoEed, and did burst dmg.
So if SMN spent more time BUFFING their pet, rather than using DoT (the playstyle could stay nearly the same with this) and building up to powerful burst AoEs from the pet (similar to how 4.0 SMN had low dps for 2mins, and then burst most of their DPS in that window) it would have felt like SMN. also, more focus on AoE dmg, even in their single target attacks. No reason that all jobs have to have single target rotations differ from their AoE ones. SMN should have been the exception.

SE already had the options to make "job identity" work with other jobs, but various last minute changes, and lack of foresight, led to the problems we have now.
They dont make plans for future jobs, so they dont reserve "playstyles" for future jobs.
We have PLD and WAR, lets make one -dmg taken% and the other is HP+healing.
Even though we will eventually make DRK, which usually used HP as a resource in other FFs. We shouldnt reserve the HP function of WAR for DRK. (Which was, and still is, salvageable, but the fix hasnt happened yet. Which is: when out of MP, the -MP abilities take up HP. So dont use up all your MP. (Plus minor fixes, to correct the balance issue this causes, which i wont go into))
But since XI used MP for spells, we'll go ahead and use MP, something PLD already does, out of the 3 tanks.
Lets give the tanks a mix of mitigation, rather than specialization of mitigation.
Lets give PLD: -all dmg received%, +healing received%, -STR of enemy, Blindness, RNG shield blocks on top of parry, +block RNG rate up%, -physical dmg received%, self heals, self HPshield, +defense, Stun/Silence incoming dmg. (Remind me if there are any more im forgetting about 2.0 PLD)
Lets give WAR: +healing received%, +MaxHP, Self Heals, +defense, +Parry Rate, -physical dmg received%, self HPshield(thrill of battle), stun, +increased self healing, Absorb (stacks with other absorbs, and non absorbs), +evasion. (Remind me if i forgot something about 2.0 WAR. This isnt including 2.1 changes with inner beast, holmgang, storms path, and tank stance)

In this example, WAR has a semblance of a theme. but PLD is all over the place. (Not to suggest WAR wasnt still somewhat all over the place)
instead of going with an identity, they just slapped things onto things.
This applied to DPS and Healers as well.