Ever since FFVII, gorgeously rendered FMVs have been one of the defining staples of the FINAL FANTASY franchise. Since the days of the PS1, each new game in the series has brought with it a multitude of breathtaking cinematics and beautiful, pre-rendered cutscenes using the latest in CGI technology. These dazzling videos have always helped to draw players into the narrative of the game and its world, not to mention worked wonders as unparallelled promotional material to catch the eye of potential customers... ;)
FFXIV has its share of impressive cutscenes using the in-game engine, but sadly we have been graced with only one pre-rendered FMV. I know FFXIV is an MMORPG, but why should that mean the game be limited to just one of these amazing videos? All of the offline FF games have multiple pre-rendered FMVs, and I see no reason why FFXIV, if it is to be branded with a number and stand as part of the main series, should not as well.
SE's first MMO, FFXI, only ever had a single solitary FMV, and that was always something that made me just a little sad whenever I thought about it. I don't want that same thing to happen to FFXIV. I want FFXIV to rise above FFXI and be a bigger, better, and bolder experience. I want to see FFXIV soar to magnificent heights, the likes of which FFXI could only dream of. And a new pre-rendered FMV is one of the things that will help get us there.
At the very least SE should do what Blizzard does with WoW, and give us one new pre-rendered FMV for each expansion pack that comes out, as well as a special one specifically for Version 2.0.
After all, once FFXIV relaunches with Version 2.0, SE is going to need some powerful imagery to make people forget the original launch and help pull in new sales. A new FMV is just what Version 2.0 is going to need to help cement in the mind's of customers that FFXIV has been reborn, that it has been given new life.
Besides, the old FMV puts the spotlight on Guildleves, which are officially no longer the central focus of the game. Version 2.0 needs a new FMV that really emphasizes what makes FFXIV a unique and exciting experience. Version 2.0 needs to provide a new window into Eorzea for the whole community -- not just the FFXIV community, but the entire gaming community at large.
Version 2.0 needs to have a fresh and exciting new face that can wash away the bad taste that the original launch left in the mouth of the general public. Version 2.0 needs to have something that critics can point to and say, "Look at that! Isn't that amazing? The game really does look different now! It's not the same as it was at launch! Maybe I should give it a second chance after all..."
And a new, pre-rendered FMV that prominently displays all the new features and improved gameplay of Version 2.0 will be able to do just that.
Please do this, SE. The game needs it too much not to.
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02-22-2012, 05:42 PMRhianuSE should make a new pre-rendered FMV cinematic for Version 2.0.
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02-22-2012, 05:55 PMElexia
Sometimes I can't tell when people are being serious or sarcastic, especially about stuff SE already confirmed they'll be doing.
XI had quite a few of them actually, two were pure CG (Intro/ending) and the rest using the in-game engine.Quote:
SE's first MMO, FFXI, only ever had a single solitary FMV
With XI's expansions and add-ons they gave us a trailer, so I'm pretty sure this will continue with XIV.Quote:
At the very least SE should do what Blizzard does with WoW, and give us one new pre-rendered FMV for each expansion pack that comes out
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02-22-2012, 06:01 PMRhianu
FFXI didn't have a pre-rendered FMV for the ending (in fact, FFXI didn't even have an ending). The only pre-rendered video that FFXI ever had was this one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTWiqKHqJ5g
Also, the trailers SE that made for each of FFXI's expansion packs were all rendered using the in-game graphics. They were not pre-rendered like that opening cinematic I just linked.
No offense, but perhaps you should check your facts first next time? -
02-22-2012, 06:02 PMMrfox0707
Pretty sure is says on the road map to 2.0 an FMV will be shown at E3 this summer.
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02-22-2012, 06:03 PMCoglin
Fact is its already comming. Shouldn't you have checked that fact beforw jumping other for fact checking.
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02-22-2012, 06:11 PMRhianu
http://wdl.square-enix.com/ffxiv/dow...Roadmap_EN.pdf
The roadmap only says "2012 E3: New Trailer." It does not say that this trailer will be a pre-rendered FMV. That's the whole point of this topic: to say that Version 2.0 needs a new pre-rendered FMV, not something that was rendered using the in-game graphics. -
02-22-2012, 06:32 PMMurugan
I would like a new intro also, but I would rather the trailer they show at E3 to be in-game footage that impresses. That is what this game needs more to get positive publicity. A new pre-rendered scene will not help in that regard one bit.
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02-22-2012, 06:37 PMRhianuWell actually, they both have the potential to be impressive and generate publicity, but a pre-rendered cinematic more so than a video that utilizes the in-game engine. There's a reason Blizzard makes a new cinematic for every expansion pack they release for WoW. Pre-rendered footage just flat out looks more impressive than in-game footage, and as such it works better for promotional purposes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Murugan
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02-22-2012, 06:38 PMRau
Whatever they do, I hope they don't make them like SWTOR, where the trailers are barely reminiscent of actual game runtime...
Atleast in FF, some art style is retained from prerenders to ingame. -
02-22-2012, 06:43 PMviion
If they showed a CGI trailer at e3 people will just laugh, it will be v1 release all over again, with a trailer that had less than 5 seconds of gameplay out of the 5 min trailer? lol
SE need to show gameplay, they need to show ingame cinematic and show off their NEW ENGINE and NEW MECHANICS not "oo look at our pretty cgi", SE is good at that, they've made movies from it, we dont need that.
On release sure have one then, but for an advertising combat trailer? no. -
02-22-2012, 06:43 PMMuruganNot really, WoW is generating hype for an already popular game. FFXIV has to convince people that the game has improved.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
Some pre-rendered cutscene does not do that. -
02-22-2012, 06:56 PMHokSevenThis.Quote:
Originally Posted by Murugan
While the OP is right about the need for a new FMV it should not be what is shown at E3, period. E3 have to show in-game stuff. But leave that to SE, I'm sure they know what they are doing.
About the new FMV, yes it must be done. Mainly cause the previous was focused on Leves, while the game is not anymore. Perhaps an FMV that shows what'll happen to Eorzea? -
02-22-2012, 07:03 PMRauShould be a mix of both. CGI for lore/story, and then flash to ingame battles, animation, scenery, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
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02-22-2012, 07:17 PMRhianu
No one's saying that SE shouldn't release any info about new gameplay mechanics, because obviously they should. But they should make a new pre-rendered FMV as well, so that critics and the general public have some kind of amazing visual imagery to associate with all the cool new changes to the gameplay.
After all, people generally don't buy anything based on intellectual facts or statistics, they buy based on emotion, and then justify with logic afterwards. Information about gameplay changes and improvements provides the logic side of things, but not the emotion. To get new customers interested in the product and convince them to buy, the product needs to evoke an emotional response in the consumer. For video games, that means eye candy.
Yes, SE needs to convince people that the game has improved, but they also need to generate hype as well. A pre-rendered cinematic generates hype better than a trailer with in-game graphics.Quote:
Originally Posted by Murugan
For the E3 trailer, sure. But I'm talking about more than just what SE is going to show at E3. I'm talking about creating a new opening cutscene, not just a trailer. Remember, during the original launch SE also showed this trailer using in-game footage:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rau
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNFXMbrn1o8
So a promotional trailer that uses in-game graphics is certainly something that is needed, it should not be considered a substitute or replacement for a totally new opening movie with pre-rendered CGI. -
02-22-2012, 07:33 PMMuruganYou can't hype something that people are convinced is terrible. People would laugh at them if they showed up to E3 with nothing but some new cinematic. That would be a wasted opportunity.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
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02-22-2012, 07:34 PMviionCount the amount of seconds that video shows Gameplay (not cutscenes).Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
If they have playable demos it might be OK, but that hyped XIV way more than it should which makes its launch a bigger failure than it should have been.
As I doubt we will get demo at e3 as it only says trailer, they have to show a lot more than a couple seconds of non ui'd gameplay. -
02-22-2012, 07:41 PMRhianu
There's no such thing as too much hype. The original dev team should have just lived up to people's expectations. But that's all the past now, so there's no use dwelling on it.
And honestly, most game trailers generally don't show footage with the UI or HUD turned on, so that's not really something we need to see in the trailer. We already know what the UI for Version 2.0 is going to look like, anyway. It's not important.
What are you talking about? Developers show up to E3 with nothing but a trailer all the time. It's not the least bit uncommon. Besides, I think you're forgetting that new information is still going to be released here in the forums as well as on The Lodestone. It's not like when the game was still in development and the only info we ever got was at conventions or in magazines.Quote:
Originally Posted by Murugan
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02-22-2012, 07:49 PMviionThey don't bring with them a title that just notoriously failed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
I think you're forgetting the media and community outside the game still laugh and use XIV as a example of failure and we know its not alone, other games have, but XIV is well known for it.
A flashy CGI trailer that even free MMOs do, is not going to prove to anyone that its back on track and going to be better. Look at the current one, XIV's Cinematic is epic, but the game doesn't live up to that in anyway. -
02-22-2012, 07:52 PMMuruganPeople advertising a new game do that, not people advertising a relaunch of a game that failed. The trailer should have in-game footage to demonstrate the difference between 2.0 and launch. Otherwise what is the point of showing a trailer? People aren't going to get hyped for the game again, not just because you show a scene of a child walking past Ishgard or something similar.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
The game already released once, people won't be fooled by a cinematic alone. -
02-22-2012, 07:56 PMRhianuCertainly, that's absolutely true, and I'm not saying that SE shouldn't present any new info at E3. I'm just saying that they shouldn't forget just how much hype a new pre-rendered FMV would generate.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
Relaunching and old game is no different from launching a new game. In fact, convincing the public that Version 2.0 actually is a totally new game is essentially what SE will have to do as they ramp up for the relaunch of FFXIV.Quote:
Originally Posted by Murugan
Also, you're drastically underestimating the emotional power of an exciting, action-packed cinematic. And yes, such cinematics do generate hype. This is because they evoke an emotional response from the viewer, something that info about gameplay can't do. The info still needs to be available, of course, but at the same time we should recognize the fact that info about gameplay changes doesn't get anyone excited except people who are already playing the game. If SE wants to spark the interest of potential customers and reel in new people, they need to give those people something they can understand and relate to. A new opening cutscene is the perfect thing for that.
It's not about fooling anyone, it's about grabbing people's attention, sparking their interest, and generating hype.
If SE wants to make a trailer that showcases gameplay and in-game footage, that's fine. There's nothing wrong with that. In fact it's a good thing. But it should be done in addition to a new opening cutscene, not instead of it. -
02-22-2012, 08:03 PMviionThat is the point, a new pre-rendered FMV wouldnt generate much, if any hype. Because it is what happened before, it would just be the same receipe as before, and i garauntee you now people will just start complaining about everything because in the end, v2.0 is to replaced flawed game mechanics and server issues, that is the main concern people have and they want to see these things fixed. CGI shows nothing. You are not paying monthly to play the game to watch the CGI over and over and over.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
If on the other hand they showed lots of gameplay and be like "look we fixed this, we fixed that, look at all this variety of things, your fave chars and how they now look in v2.0, the new char creation, the new environments, we did it", people would wet themselfs and it would bring back instantly all the attention it has lost.
It is all about that first impression that have to recover, the only way they can recover it is by showing that all the problems before are now gone. -
02-22-2012, 08:22 PMRhianuUh... yes, it would. Action packed trailers always generate hype. Always. And the flashier they look, the more hype they generate. And pre-rendered CGI always looks flashier than anything rendered with the in-game engine.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
Actually no, logical information like what's been fixed is what people will use to justify their decision after the fact. It will not get them excited in the first place. You're taking the attitude that existing players have and erroneously applying it to potential players. They are not the same. Potential customers are not excited by gameplay changes. Only existing customers are.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
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02-22-2012, 08:24 PMJinko
No thanks, I prefer in game graphics these days, I sure as hell don't want to see only CGI trailers of 2.0 at E3 this year.
Give us something in game, showing off the new graphics/game engine and new zones. -
02-22-2012, 08:33 PMRhianuNo reason why we can't have both... >.>Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinko
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02-22-2012, 08:34 PMElexiaGiven how you think 'FMV' is only a 'pre-rendered' standard, I can see why you'd say this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
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02-22-2012, 08:36 PMRhianu...Except I never said anything even remotely like that. Not once in any of my posts did I ever say that "FMV" could only refer to pre-rendered videos. I'm honestly not sure how you got the idea that that's what I was saying.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
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02-22-2012, 08:43 PMJinkoThis is true, although I think in this generation of gaming FMV is unnecessary, it was used in the past to show off dramatic cinematic scenes which would have been impossible to do using in game engines.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
With each generation of graphics cards the need for it is less and less.
If you have seen the final lvl 46 mission in this game you can see that CGI is not necessary. -
02-22-2012, 08:43 PMlordvr
cgi is the last thing SE should waste money on when this project is bleeding money.
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02-22-2012, 08:44 PMElexiaQuote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
Remember, all FMV stands for is 'Full Motion Video", meaning in-game or out of game rendering, which XI had plenty of in-game lol. Based on your OP and response to me, this is why I said you pretty much link pre-rendered as the only form of FMV.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
I can list at least 12 different scenes between CoP and WoTG that had FMVs, they merely weren't high polygon FMVs, they were rendered in-game.
Also it did have an ending, did you ever beat CoP? WoTG? ACP? Those are endings as they closed the story of the game just like any other RPG story ending lol.
The CoP one comes to mind because it's a lot more blatant:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeeqDADjIsM
CGI comes with the territory of using an engine specifically designed for HD graphics lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by lordvr
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02-22-2012, 08:50 PMviionI am sorry but you are soo wrong, just look around at any release and you'll see gameplay and such always gets more favour over some fancy CGI.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
This thread alone is enough to show that people dont want CGI and would much prefer IN GAME engine stuff, even if its an ingame cinematic.
I do not mind in game cinematics and gameplay combined, but if your trailer is 50% CGI, 48% Ingame cutscenes (of which most didnt even come to light, have you seen Titan yet? lols) and 2% gameplay it will fail like it did before. -
02-22-2012, 09:45 PMForerunnerAnother strat might be a kickass CGI trailer giving people an outline of how the story is going to pan out, at least until an expansion etc. followed by/intercut with various segments of the new and improved 2.0©®™ engine in it's full glory.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
If they do a straight CGI reveal it had better say "Look! I have risen from the ashes, and am reborn! Now get over to the Square-Enix booth and check my sexy updated graphical choice ass©®™ out!"
And the reviewers turned into fanboys... and Square-Enix saw that it was good.
/jokey post off -
02-23-2012, 03:00 PMRhianuYes, but I very clearly and explicitly stated PRE-RENDERED FMVs, of which FFXI has only one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
Well then clearly you should learn to read, because you obviously don't know how.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
Yes, those are all technically FMVs, but they're not pre-rendered FMVs, which was the whole freaking point of my post. -_-Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
Except FFXI doesn't stop after you beat any of those like an offline RPG does. MMORPGs do not have an ending. Individual questlines may have endings, but the game itself does not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elexia
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02-23-2012, 03:17 PMRhianuI'm aware that in-game graphics are much better than they have been in past generations, but I'll have to respectfully disagree with your assertion that pre-rendered videos are no longer needed in current generation games. Just playing through FFXIII and FFXIII-2 clearly demonstrates that pre-rendered videos are still superior to in-game graphics, at least for now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jinko
Maybe in like 2016 when the PS4 comes out, and there is no discernible difference, then we can say pre-rendered videos are no longer necessary. But for now, they should still be utilized whenever they're appropriate. And there is no time more appropriate than the complete relaunch of SE's flagship MMO.
SE has already spent millions upon millions of dollars on FFXIV. A little more to create a pre-rendered CGI video that will greatly increase publicity and generate more hype isn't going to break the bank. In fact, the loss of potential box sales if they don't do it would hurt much more.Quote:
Originally Posted by lordvr
I don't know what screwy upside-down world you live in, but everywhere I look pre-rendered videos always generate more hype than videos with purely in-game footage. Perhaps you're not paying attention? There's a reason why every new MMO always has a pre-rendered CGI trailer that coincides with its launch. New RPGs need the kind of publicity that only pre-rendered CGI can generate. And FFXIV is essentially relaunching as a totally new game with Version 2.0.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
Also, this thread is not an accurate barometer for what will or will not generate hype in the general public. Everyone in this thread already believes that FFXIV is worth paying a monthly fee for (otherwise you wouldn't be able to post here), which means you're already in a separate group from the general public, so your opinions cannot be used to gauge theirs.
(Not to mention the fact that only like ten different people have even posted in this topic, which is nowhere near a large enough group to get any kind of accurate reading for predicting the reactions of the general public and mass market, especially when we take into account that there is likely little to no variation in demographic among the posters here.)
And again, you're still operating under the assumption that SE has to choose between making a pre-rendered cinematic and making a trailer with in-game footage. I don't know how many times I have to state this, but SE doesn't have to choose one or the other. THEY CAN MAKE BOTH! SE is fully capable of making more than one trailer. They did it for the original launch, so I see no reason why they can't do it for the relaunch as well. -
02-23-2012, 03:39 PMAkira_Tenshi
I'd be so pissed if they showed a pre rendered video at E3. I want to see 2.0 gameplay.
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02-23-2012, 04:21 PMRhianuAgain, SE doesn't have to choose just one or the other. We can have both. How many times do I have to reiterate that point? -_-Quote:
Originally Posted by Akira_Tenshi
Though now that I think about it, E3 is in June, and Version 2.0 won't be finished until October, so there's a good chance that gameplay footage won't be ready in time for E3. -
02-23-2012, 10:10 PMDragon
Once upon a time, a Pre-rendered scene was impressive. That was in a time when even PC-hardware couldn't really handle such scenes being rendered.
Nowadays, pre-rendering is just laziness. That's all it is. -
02-23-2012, 10:23 PMAdvancedWindThis, a thousand times.Quote:
Originally Posted by viion
@OP
Yoshi-P already confirmed that the current opening CG will be changed. I just hope he's smart enough to not use it as the trailer. -
02-23-2012, 11:51 PMJinkoWell whatever fact is that making a CGI trailer would cost money, making an in game trailer would cost much less time and money as they already have the assets and game engine working.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
People don't want to see CGI they want to see in game, its been this way for a while now, to me if SE showed CGI at E3 it would say to me, we aren't ready to show the game off yet and would make me worried they were behind schedule.
The graphics engine was finished last month according to Yoshida, thats all you need to make an in game trailer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhianu
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02-24-2012, 01:14 AMLaf
FVM should consist solely of: lots of catgirls-in-skimpy-bikinis playing volleyball on the beach.
2 million copies sold. -
02-24-2012, 10:23 AMDragonOkay fine, you just got me interested into a FMV... tell me more, and I best get to be the topcat or else!Quote:
Originally Posted by Laf