Is my story lore-friendly?

I'm a relatively new player to FFXIV (First time on these forums) and I fell in love with Coerthas, I like the medieval theme, the music, and the rich amount of strife and conflict there.

Despite being new, I have spent more time looking up lore than leveling so far as well as making a few friends who have deep knowledge of it.

They told me this would work but I am still not confident, I would appreciate it if I could get either some reassurance or tough love on whether it is acceptable or no:

The main character in this story is an Ishgardian Elezen named Fleurent de Gisoreux but I’m not sure its a good name and might change it. Fleurent is a knightly and very martial lesser noble of a small house who has long since disagreed with the ishgardian justice system and eventually goes against it. He does this in a similar vein as dark knights however without dark arts. (He does sort of what Haurchefant does in the MSQ) Fleurent is then witch hunted for his interference but before he is caught he leaves Ishgard entirely to become an adventurer and continues following his own sense of justice.

He would adventure to many lands and take part in numerous conflicts, eventually joining the Eorzean Alliance in Carteneau and miraculously surviving the bloodshed that followed. In the wake of the calamity, Fleurent did his best to help whoever he could but he soon felt the need to return home. In Ishgard, he would redeem himself in the eyes of the holy see on the field of battle as he aided the Ishgardian war effort against the Dravanian horde.

After some time and various displays of rekindled faith and martial courage he was permitted to return to his lands and resume his life in Ishgard. Despite his heroics, Fleurent was still disliked by nearby nobility and the enemies he has made did not forget…

Mixed race relationships are frowned upon in many, if not most places, let alone ishgard...but although ishgardian nobility would never take part in such contemptuous behavior, this knightly noble was an adventurer for many years. This eventually helped in giving Fleurent a different perspective on things and he was already a bit of an oddity compared to his counterparts even before he left.

During his adventuring days he fell in love with a Miqo’te refugee and had promised to one day take both the woman and her daughter off the streets of poverty. Fleurent had the pair brought to his land in Ishgard where he and the lady embraced a secret love life. To the people who knew, the Miqo’te maidens were naught but two lowly servants he bizarrely picked up during his adventures. Only a few would know of their existence and even less so his secret...

If this is deemed acceptable then I would like to expand this story and write in greater detail.

I wanted to create a situation that made playing a Miqo'te character in Ishgard plausible but with consequences. This seems very controversial so please give me reassurance or tough love.

Firstly, welcome to Eorzea! :D

Your story sounds very interesting and as far as I can see is well and truly within the lore so don't be concerned! The only possible question mark though is a miqo'te being in Ishgard - apparently miqo'te shun the Holy See simply due to it's climate, it's considered far too cold and thus most miqo'te don't stay long in Coerthas if they can help it, preferring to depart for much warmer climes if possible. Having said that, there is nothing stopping a miqo'te from living there, just it's not very common. And that is the thing with the game's lore and setting, it is remarkably vague enough that a certain amount of writer's license can be used to do something a little different but still be in keeping with the lore and setting. :)

Either way, good work on your backstory, you've done a lot of research and it's apparent in your description. So well done! :D

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

Firstly, welcome to Eorzea! :D

Your story sounds very interesting and as far as I can see is well and truly within the lore so don't be concerned! The only possible question mark though is a miqo'te being in Ishgard - apparently miqo'te shun the Holy See simply due to it's climate, it's considered far too cold and thus most miqo'te don't stay long in Coerthas if they can help it, preferring to depart for much warmer climes if possible. Having said that, there is nothing stopping a miqo'te from living there, just it's not very common. And that is the thing with the game's lore and setting, it is remarkably vague enough that a certain amount of writer's license can be used to do something a little different but still be in keeping with the lore and setting. :)

Either way, good work on your backstory, you've done a lot of research and it's apparent in your description. So well done! :D

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Yay! Thank you for the helpful comment and warm welcome, I'm happy to be among Eorzea's denizens. :D That is very true that Miqo'te generally don't like the cold climate so I'll try to keep that in mind.

While Coerthas is very cold now, prior to the Calamity it was temperate. It's entirely plausible that Mi'qote tribes lived there prior, which could be a source of refugees.

Your story is fine, I'm just trying to throw out more possibilities.

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Originally Posted by Cilia

While Coerthas is very cold now, prior to the Calamity it was temperate. It's entirely plausible that Mi'qote tribes lived there prior, which could be a source of refugees.

Your story is fine, I'm just trying to throw out more possibilities.

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Oh wow I never thought of that, thanks for the interesting idea/possibility. :D

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

Mixed race relationships are frowned upon in many, if not most places, let alone ishgard

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I wonder how true that really is. It's definitely true in Ishgard (especially for the nobility), and probably within some of the miqo'te tribes, but we don't really see evidence of it elsewhere in game. We see a number of interracial relationships and romances play out in game and other NPCs don't think anything of it.

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Originally Posted by Brightamethyst

I wonder how true that really is. It's definitely true in Ishgard (especially for the nobility), and probably within some of the miqo'te tribes, but we don't really see evidence of it elsewhere in game. We see a number of interracial relationships and romances play out in game and other NPCs don't think anything of it.

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That's true as well, hmmm maybe I was a bit harsh saying that.

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

Fleurent is a knightly and very martial lesser noble of a small house who has long since disagreed with the ishgardian justice system and eventually goes against it. He does this in a similar vein as dark knights however without dark arts. <...> Fleurent is then witch hunted for his interference but before he is caught he leaves Ishgard entirely

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Nothing wrong here. For many in Ishgard, what has mattered most over the years has been the appearance of conformity with the law; the appearance of righteousness. Even the nobles blatantly went against the system, but did so by manipulating narratives and appearances in long-running socio-political games. Even if your character was simply unable to control the narrative of his own refusal to obey the laws of Halone, a rival would obviously turn the narrative of disobedience on them in a way that secures them a one-up position, and the trial /inquisition might not go so well. It might be better to just haul out of there.

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

He would adventure to many lands and take part in numerous conflicts, eventually joining the Eorzean Alliance in Carteneau and miraculously surviving the bloodshed that followed.

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Still good, though you might want to get an idea of how/where they fought, just for the sake of it. Did they join one of the three Grand Companies uniting to fight the battle? If so, which banner did they fight under? If not, how did they get there and where did they fight? The Grand Companies each have a unit of enlisted adventurers, called upon in times of need but otherwise allowed to pursue their own means and ends. These units were given priority in the retreat, with full-time enlisted soldiers defending the rear. If you weren't one of the Echo-blessed, primal-slaying, Darnus-killing elite adventurers standing with Louisoix, it's not to hard to write escaping Carteneau without going into the rift.

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

After some time and various displays of rekindled faith and martial courage he was permitted to return to his lands and resume his life in Ishgard. Despite his heroics, Fleurent was still disliked by nearby nobility and the enemies he has made did not forget…

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This would be the most tricky part to write, I'd think. His flight from Coerthas would almost assuredly be interpreted and presented as admission of guilt to whatever he was accused of (and likely without him there to defend it, these enemies would heap some extra ones on the pyre). How does he bridge this gap? Did someone "hold the fort" within his house in the county and give him a way to take back his story in a "redemption arc" narrative? Does he come as a stranger to a family in another county and gain valorous attention there before admitting who he is and trying to turn the tide of his reputation? Does he embrace the socio-political games and start moving rivals of rivals against one another to re-write what "really" happened? Did he make his entrance with such a grand gesture that it was impossible to deny hearing him out? It's up to you!

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

Mixed race relationships are frowned upon in many, if not most places, let alone ishgard...but although ishgardian nobility would never take part in such contemptuous behavior, this knightly noble was an adventurer for many years. This eventually helped in giving Fleurent a different perspective on things and he was already a bit of an oddity compared to his counterparts even before he left.

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Originally Posted by Brightamethyst

I wonder how true that really is. It's definitely true in Ishgard (especially for the nobility), and probably within some of the miqo'te tribes, but we don't really see evidence of it elsewhere in game. We see a number of interracial relationships and romances play out in game and other NPCs don't think anything of it.

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It's true, just not invoked very often. In Eorzea, many are ...traditional... about this, but there's a continuum to it just like in real life. You have your progressives, you have those who offer offense and violence, but most are probably in that "I'm not racist, but..." gray area where they say things like, "Right, but why can't you marry a nice [insert race here] like yourself?" Perhaps it goes back to the middle of the Sixth Astral Era in this case, since many of the races/clans went disproportionately to specific city-states mid-era.

Adventurers just tend to have zero time for this stereotype / distrust nonsense. All that matters in the world is who really has your back, who really helps you survive, and that you live your life to the fullest because your next adventure could be your last.

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

During his adventuring days he fell in love with a Miqo’te refugee and had promised to one day take both the woman and her daughter off the streets of poverty. Fleurent had the pair brought to his land in Ishgard where he and the lady embraced a secret love life. To the people who knew, the Miqo’te maidens were naught but two lowly servants he bizarrely picked up during his adventures. Only a few would know of their existence and even less so his secret...

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If you focus on where she was a refugee from and to and how they met and fell in love, you can work that into the story in a way that just becomes more salient than that she ends up in Ishgard for most of the people who'd analyze it. As far as anyone in Ishgard is concerned, there could be a thousand excuses for her arrival. Maybe they're the wife and daughter of a man who saved your life. Maybe you're righteous for taking care of them. They don't know. They just need to mind their own business and expect the Fury's justice if anything happens to them.

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Originally Posted by Enkidoh

apparently miqo'te shun the Holy See simply due to it's climate

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Did we ever find a citation for this one? I've heard it a few times but without a quotation or something my mind immediately knee-jerks to, "Says who? Is it logical? Sure! But so is that over 70% of Ishgard's population is descended from that first group of Elezen, and 20% on top of that is Midlanders who piled into Eorzea whilst the proto-Ishgardians were yet pretty much the only people back from the floods. That leaves 10% of Ishgard to be anything else. Why is it specifically that Miqo'te hate the cold. Don't see many Lalafell in Ishgard. Does that give me carte blanc to blame it on their mass to surface area ratio making it too dangerous to live in the cold? Or that their natural tendency to be first in line to get eaten by anything and everything just drove them into extinction in a war against dragons?"

I know, I know, I'm picky and weird. But I'm also an archivist! And ... I forget if we archived a citation for that one. >___>

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

Is it logical? Sure! But so is that over 70% of Ishgard's population is descended from that first group of Elezen, and 20% on top of that is Midlanders who piled into Eorzea whilst the proto-Ishgardians were yet pretty much the only people back from the floods.

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That's my take on it too. Ishagrd isn't inherently inhospitable to everyone else, it's just that no one else bothered to settle there before the elezen dug in.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

Still good, though you might want to get an idea of how/where they fought, just for the sake of it. Did they join one of the three Grand Companies uniting to fight the battle? If so, which banner did they fight under? If not, how did they get there and where did they fight? The Grand Companies each have a unit of enlisted adventurers, called upon in times of need but otherwise allowed to pursue their own means and ends. These units were given priority in the retreat, with full-time enlisted soldiers defending the rear. If you weren't one of the Echo-blessed, primal-slaying, Darnus-killing elite adventurers standing with Louisoix, it's not to hard to write escaping Carteneau without going into the rift.

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Thank you for such an informative post! You have given me many ideas and directions to elaborate Fleurent's story, I think his adventures would have him questing around Thanalan and fighting alongside The Immortal Flames at Carteneau.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

This would be the most tricky part to write, I'd think. His flight from Coerthas would almost assuredly be interpreted and presented as admission of guilt to whatever he was accused of (and likely without him there to defend it, these enemies would heap some extra ones on the pyre). How does he bridge this gap? Did someone "hold the fort" within his house in the county and give him a way to take back his story in a "redemption arc" narrative? Does he come as a stranger to a family in another county and gain valorous attention there before admitting who he is and trying to turn the tide of his reputation? Does he embrace the socio-political games and start moving rivals of rivals against one another to re-write what "really" happened? Did he make his entrance with such a grand gesture that it was impossible to deny hearing him out? It's up to you!

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You are right about this, his reputation and his house's name would be severely shamed, almost irreversibly so for most. I would like to write this so he makes his first reappearance during a pretty desperate, potentially losing battle against Dravanians and he fights in a way that inspires Ishgardian troops and slays/helps to slay a significant foe. So it happens in a way that kind of makes it impossible to deny hearing him out, he boosts the moral of some of the men, and garners an overwhelming amount of witnesses of him killing Dravanians which would help to dispel the notion of him being a heretic. As an NPC in Camp Dragonhead named Belmont says "I tell you, the high and mighty around these parts don't even see in black and white. They see in "dragon" and "not dragon," you know of what I speak."

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

It's true, just not invoked very often. In Eorzea, many are ...traditional... about this, but there's a continuum to it just like in real life. You have your progressives, you have those who offer offense and violence, but most are probably in that "I'm not racist, but..." gray area where they say things like, "Right, but why can't you marry a nice [insert race here] like yourself?" Perhaps it goes back to the middle of the Sixth Astral Era in this case, since many of the races/clans went disproportionately to specific city-states mid-era.
Adventurers just tend to have zero time for this stereotype / distrust nonsense. All that matters in the world is who really has your back, who really helps you survive, and that you live your life to the fullest because your next adventure could be your last.

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Thanks for clearing this up.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

If you focus on where she was a refugee from and to and how they met and fell in love, you can work that into the story in a way that just becomes more salient than that she ends up in Ishgard for most of the people who'd analyze it. As far as anyone in Ishgard is concerned, there could be a thousand excuses for her arrival. Maybe they're the wife and daughter of a man who saved your life. Maybe you're righteous for taking care of them. They don't know. They just need to mind their own business and expect the Fury's justice if anything happens to them.

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The daughter is going to be a character I want to RP as so it is a pretty important part of the story but yes I want to emphasis the hellish realities of poverty, the loss that people suffered due to the Calamity and on the mother's love story with Fluerent. I really really like the ideas of Fluerent appearing or at least spinning it in a way of him being righteous for taking care of them and everyone should mind their own business and expect the Fury's justice if anything happens to to them.

I learned a lot from this post thanks. c: (had to divide my post in half because for some reason I hit a text limit)

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

I would like to write this so he makes his first reappearance during a pretty desperate, potentially losing battle against Dravanians and he fights in a way that inspires Ishgardian troops and slays/helps to slay a significant foe. So it happens in a way that kind of makes it impossible to deny hearing him out, he boosts the moral of some of the men, and garners an overwhelming amount of witnesses of him killing Dravanians which would help to dispel the notion of him being a heretic. As an NPC in Camp Dragonhead named Belmont says "I tell you, the high and mighty around these parts don't even see in black and white. They see in "dragon" and "not dragon," you know of what I speak."

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Well thought-out, imho! Just need to make the convenient coincidence not stick out like a sore thumb, but with how thin Ishgard was stretched last year and how many attacks they suffered, that shouldn't be very hard! And Thanalan gives you plenty of opportunities for a Miqo'te to fall on hard times.

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

had to divide my post in half because for some reason I hit a text limit

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Edits don't count, so just write whatever you want to write - copy/cut it out of the post - and then just post EDIT INCOMING, edit your post, and paste your wall of text. Annoying circumvention but better than some of the alternatives!

Best of luck with your new journey, and don't feel like you can't come back to (or necro) this thread any time!

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

Edits don't count, so just write whatever you want to write - copy/cut it out of the post - and then just post EDIT INCOMING, edit your post, and paste your wall of text. Annoying circumvention but better than some of the alternatives!

Best of luck with your new journey, and don't feel like you can't come back to (or necro) this thread any time!

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Ohhh, haha that is very clever! Thank you sincerely for your help so far but can I ask for assistance in determining if another story piece is acceptable and/or fixing it if it's not? When I made this post I was not sure whether it would be best to post here or on the FFXIV roleplayer forums so I posted it on both, I've gotten much more comments here but the few I did on the other were slightly more on the tough love side of things than reassuring. I would appreciate if you could read the comments there and tell me what you think of my second post which contains the next part in this Ishgard story. I would just copy it here but maybe its important to see the opinions there as well.

https://ffxiv-roleplayers.com/topic/...lore-friendly/

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

I've gotten much more comments here but the few I did on the other were slightly more on the tough love side of things than reassuring.

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Ha. Different cultures, I suppose. Lore forum tends to be focused mostly on "Is it truth?" "What is the evidence for that truth?" "Is that evidence in question?" "What can we theorize based on the knowns?" Roleplayers have more opinions. [spooky fingers]

Teadrinker makes a point; roleplayers can be intolerant and stodgy about their idea of the lore. Though imho, that's asinine; most of the misconceptions and entrenched falsehoods about the lore can be sourced back to bad roleplayer assumptions and headcanon creeping its way like an ivy into Tumblr, FFWiki, Reddit, etc. - though a fair amount come from YouTube gurus, too. (Don't look at me like that, Balmung, hard truths cut both ways.) Thems just the breaks when it's necessary to both know and bend the lore for your purposes. Some people forget what was only made up to justify their hooks, if they understood it in the proper context in the first place.

I'd stick to Merenary's point of view. Do what you want to do and RP with the people who gravitate towards it. Don't worry about the rest.

I don't think you even explicitly said this Miqo'te would try to continue on as Ishgardian nobility, or even technically an Ishgardian citizen, did you? She would simply have incidentally grown up in Ishgard and taking a shine to an Ishgardian's worldview before going out on her own adventures? And you want all of this in place before you sew in the "RP Hooks," yes?

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

Teadrinker makes a point; roleplayers can be intolerant and stodgy about their idea of the lore. Though imho, that's asinine; most of the misconceptions and entrenched falsehoods about the lore can be sourced back to bad roleplayer assumptions and headcanon creeping its way like an ivy into Tumblr, FFWiki, Reddit, etc. - though a fair amount come from YouTube gurus, too. (Don't look at me like that, Balmung, hard truths cut both ways.) I'd stick to Merenary's point of view. Do what you want to do and RP with the people who gravitate towards it. Don't worry about the rest.

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Yay, thanks for the advice! I think the three of you make a compelling point about not trying to please everyone and to just RP with people with the right people, I'll try to do just that.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

I don't think you even explicitly said this Miqo'te would try to continue on as Ishgardian nobility, or even technically an Ishgardian citizen, did you? She would simply have incidentally grown up in Ishgard and taking a shine to an Ishgardian's worldview before going out on her own adventures? And you want all of this in place before you sew in the "RP Hooks," yes?

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Yes, pretty much exactly that. She wouldn't dare try to claim herself a place among nobility and isn't really a citizen, especially after she goes out to live an adventurer's life. I wanted to make sure I had a coherent story as a foundation before I moved on to Rp hooks and the RP itself.

I have a few questions I'd like to ask to get a better understanding, related but not directly related.

After the end of the Dragonsong War and Ishgard becoming part of the alliance, is House Fortemps still known to employ sell-swords and adventurers? Have any other of the main houses changed their stance?

Would the Warrior of Light be allowed to live in Ishgard/Coerthas if they asked, or would they be denied for being an outsider still despite their deeds? What about to a far lesser degree, an adventurer who has proven their worth having slain a dragon? Also is it true that there is some social mobility in the sense that should a peasant slay a dragon, they may become knighted and socially advance?

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

I have a few questions I'd like to ask to get a better understanding, related but not directly related.

After the end of the Dragonsong War and Ishgard becoming part of the alliance, is House Fortempts still known to employ sell-swords and adventurers? Have any other of the main houses changed their stance?

Would the Warrior of Light be allowed to live in Ishgard/Coerthas if they asked, or would they be denied for being an outsider still despite their deeds? What about to a far lesser degree, an adventurer who has proven their worth having slain a dragon? Also is it true that there is some social mobility in the sense that should a peasant slay a dragon, they may become knighted and socially advance?

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While Ishgard has been painted as being on the cusp of change, very little has been stated as far as SPECIFICS of those changes. The only thing I can think of that has been flat-out stated is that Ishgard is now a member of the Eorzean Alliance, and no longer keeping itself neutral in the conflict with Garlemand. To my recollection, nothing has been stated as to whether any House, including Fortemps, has changed their stance on the employment of adventurers and sell-swords.

As for whether the Warrior of Light would be allowed to live within Ishgard/Coerthas, again nothing specific is stated, though it is noteworthy that the guard to the Steps of Faith STILL has the same text blurb indicating that they are allowing you access due to the fact that you're a ward of House Fortemps. Does this imply that you would NOT be granted access, if you were no longer a ward? It's hard to say - but the WoL is pretty much a celebrity in Ishgard, now, and close buddies with the acting leader. I'd guess that if the WoL were to make a request of Ishgard, they would take it very seriously, and if in their power, grant it. Having a home there seems like a pretty small favor to ask. (And if the gate guard WERE to turn the WoL away for some reason, it would likely be a hilarious political faux pass.)

As for social mobility due to dragonslaying, a lot of this is covered in the sidequests at the Convictory in Coerthas Western Highlands - but, unfortunately, it's been too long and I do not remember any details, or whether they'd answer your questions in that regard. Note that the benefits of dragonslaying may be scaled back (ha, "scaled") going forward due to the new peace Ishgard has forged with the majority of dragons. There's still the remnants of Nidhogg's brood to cause trouble, but that's about it. If the peasant or adventurer picked up their dragonslaying cred before the events of Heavensward, though, they could apply.

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Originally Posted by LineageRazor

As for whether the Warrior of Light would be allowed to live within Ishgard/Coerthas, again nothing specific is stated, though it is noteworthy that the guard to the Steps of Faith STILL has the same text blurb indicating that they are allowing you access due to the fact that you're a ward of House Fortemps. Does this imply that you would NOT be granted access, if you were no longer a ward? It's hard to say - but the WoL is pretty much a celebrity in Ishgard, now, and close buddies with the acting leader. I'd guess that if the WoL were to make a request of Ishgard, they would take it very seriously, and if in their power, grant it. Having a home there seems like a pretty small favor to ask. (And if the gate guard WERE to turn the WoL away for some reason, it would likely be a hilarious political faux pass.)

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I see. Well from what I have read, I would be very very surprised if WoL was not given a house without second thought.

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Originally Posted by LineageRazor

As for social mobility due to dragonslaying, a lot of this is covered in the sidequests at the Convictory in Coerthas Western Highlands - but, unfortunately, it's been too long and I do not remember any details, or whether they'd answer your questions in that regard. Note that the benefits of dragonslaying may be scaled back (ha, "scaled") going forward due to the new peace Ishgard has forged with the majority of dragons. There's still the remnants of Nidhogg's brood to cause trouble, but that's about it. If the peasant or adventurer picked up their dragonslaying cred before the events of Heavensward, though, they could apply.

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Haha that makes a lot of sense, dragons shouldn't be nearly as big of a threat anymore. I will endeavor to seek out and play the sidequest you mentioned.

A few things that stand out to me:

If Fleurent is a noble, his name should probably be Fleurent de Gisoreux.

It sounds improbable that - in cramped Ishgard and amongst gossiping nobles - he could keep two people a complete secret. Even more so when they're an 'exotic' foreign race that will stand out. Rumours will certainly spread.

I haven't played the dark knight quests, so that description doesn't tell me much - and I'm not really sure what you're meaning by "what Haurchefant does" either. What happened? What did he do? It feels like too much of a handwave - "this really important thing happened but I haven't worked out what it was".

Also, from what I can get out of the lorebook, it sounds like Fleurent would be facing trial by combat for [whatever it was], so you could maybe work that into his redemption. (Also have a look at the MCH Lv50-60 quests, where the guild basically got accused of trying to start a revolution, and had to undergo trial by combat against a dragon...)

And what are these particular ideals and concept of justice that he's passing on to Lana? Because that's a big part of understanding how your character is going to think and act.


(Also a nitpick from your linked post on the other site: the Ishgard expansion is titled "Heavensward", ie. 'towards the heavens', not "Heaven Sword".)

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

After the end of the Dragonsong War and Ishgard becoming part of the alliance, is House Fortempts still known to employ sell-swords and adventurers? Have any other of the main houses changed their stance?

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House Fortemps (no second 't' in the spelling) is most likely still employing foreigners. At least, there's no indication that Artoirel would change it.

There's also the Lv50-60 miner quests where you're working with a group of mercenaries hired by the vaguely-defined "Count Fortemps" - by the way time usually works in the game, we probably should assume that's Edmont even if you're doing the quests post-Heavensward, but nevertheless it's written so it could work regardless of who is count at the time.



House Haillenarte also seems to be open to employing foreigners, even before the end of Heavensward.

Most prominently (though not so useful for indicating the overall stance of the house) Stephanivien hired a Lominsan to work for the machinists' guild as marksmanship instructor.

Some levequest descriptions indicate that there is an Ul'dahn pugilist training knights "as part of a military arts exchange facilitated by House Haillenarte".

And they are also in charge of the Diadem, which is (more-or-less theoretically at this point) specifically recruiting adventurers post-Heavensward.

Emmanellain and Laniaitte also turn up in the start-of-Stormblood Lv60 weaver quest in Ul'dah, apparently specifically to show off the High House costumes, so presumably trying to promote foreign trade.



And the lorebook profile for the Count de Durendaire is prettymuch all about his stance on foreigners - originally sharing Edmont's "desire to open Ishgard's borders and welcome foreign influences", but he became more conservative after the loss of his son. Now with the shifting situation in Ishgard he is supporting Aymeric "in a pragmatic bid to retain influence and preserve the status quo".



House Dzemael is (as always) the mystery card because we really don't hear much about them. Tarresson (the ex-count and a major character in the Moogle crafting questline) seems like he'd be open to it, but then he seems to have little interest in returning to Ishgard. Beyond that, they tend to be the designated antagonists, and the closest we got to an opinion on foreign trade was the Lv60 botanist quest where someone from House Dzemael tried to sabotage the Haillenarte botanist growing foreign crops at Camp Cloudtop... more likely due to petty politics between the houses, but that's all there is to go on. I don't think we've heard anything of them since the end of Heavensward.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

If Fleurent is a noble, his name should probably be Fleurent de Gisoreux.

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You are right, thanks for the correction. I'll make some edits right away.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

It sounds improbable that - in cramped Ishgard and amongst gossiping nobles - he could keep two people a complete secret. Even more so when they're an 'exotic' foreign race that will stand out. Rumours will certainly spread.

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I'm thinking his land would be located elsewhere in Coerthas, not in the cramped city itself.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I haven't played the dark knight quests, so that description doesn't tell me much - and I'm not really sure what you're meaning by "what Haurchefant does" either. What happened? What did he do? It feels like too much of a handwave - "this really important thing happened but I haven't worked out what it was".

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Sorry if this came across as a hand wave. I want to rewrite everything in much greater length and detail soon. I used Haurchefant as an example because he directly goes against the authority of an inquisitor, even openly drawing his sword on temple knights to stand up for what he believed in (Francel's innocence). I used Dark Knights as reference because they often clash with Temple Knights and for similar reasons too. I want Fluerent to be put into a comparable situation but I just do not know the how or the why yet. It's an important moment that I need to get right.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Also, from what I can get out of the lorebook, it sounds like Fleurent would be facing trial by combat for [whatever it was], so you could maybe work that into his redemption. (Also have a look at the MCH Lv50-60 quests, where the guild basically got accused of trying to start a revolution, and had to undergo trial by combat against a dragon...)

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That is very interesting! I will investigate these quest and see what I can take from them.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

And what are these particular ideals and concept of justice that he's passing on to Lana? Because that's a big part of understanding how your character is going to think and act.

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Indeed, this is a crucial part of my character and like Fluerent's predicament, I want to put more thought into it.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

(Also a nitpick from your linked post on the other site: the Ishgard expansion is titled "Heavensward", ie. 'towards the heavens', not "Heaven Sword".)

House Fortemps (no second 't' in the spelling) is most likely still employing foreigners. At least, there's no indication that Artoirel would change it.

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Ack, I really shouldn't be misspelling these two, especially not Fortemps. It shall not happen again!

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Originally Posted by Iscah

There's also the Lv50-60 miner quests where you're working with a group of mercenaries hired by the vaguely-defined "Count Fortemps" - by the way time usually works in the game, we probably should assume that's Edmont even if you're doing the quests post-Heavensward, but nevertheless it's written so it could work regardless of who is count at the time.

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That's a fine example of Ishgardians employing outsiders, awesome.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

House Haillenarte also seems to be open to employing foreigners, even before the end of Heavensward.

Most prominently (though not so useful for indicating the overall stance of the house) Stephanivien hired a Lominsan to work for the machinists' guild as marksmanship instructor.

Some levequest descriptions indicate that there is an Ul'dahn pugilist training knights "as part of a military arts exchange facilitated by House Haillenarte".

And they are also in charge of the Diadem, which is (more-or-less theoretically at this point) specifically recruiting adventurers post-Heavensward.

Emmanellain and Laniaitte also turn up in the start-of-Stormblood Lv60 weaver quest in Ul'dah, apparently specifically to show off the High House costumes, so presumably trying to promote foreign trade.

And the lorebook profile for the Count de Durendaire is prettymuch all about his stance on foreigners - originally sharing Edmont's "desire to open Ishgard's borders and welcome foreign influences", but he became more conservative after the loss of his son. Now with the shifting situation in Ishgard he is supporting Aymeric "in a pragmatic bid to retain influence and preserve the status quo".

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Thanks for the helpful information, I had no idea there were military arts exchanges like that. I'll definitely investigate this Diadem and I look forward to meeting Aymeric whom i hear good things about.

Overall I greatly appreciate the informative post, cheers. I will try to post greater details in the future!

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

Yay! Thank you for the helpful comment and warm welcome, I'm happy to be among Eorzea's denizens. :D That is very true that Miqo'te generally don't like the cold climate so I'll try to keep that in mind.

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May I interest you in a Glacial Coat?

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Originally Posted by Canadane

May I interest you in a Glacial Coat?

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I would love to have a warm cozy coat!

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

Thanks for the helpful information, I had no idea there were military arts exchanges like that. I'll definitely investigate this Diadem and I look forward to meeting Aymeric whom i hear good things about.

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Ohhh - I hadn't realised you aren't actually up to Heavensward at all yet.

There's no sign of the military arts exchange going on beyond those levequest descriptions.

And there's not too much to investigate about the Diadem - I don't think there's any story linked to it. I only got in once and there were lots of FATEs but nothing to specifically do, although I was there for the "gathering" missions rather than the "battle" missions. Anyway, once you'll get to Ishgard you'll see there are a few NPCs at the airship landing, though you can't do anything until you've cleared the Heavensward MSQ. The guy in charge is Aurvael de Haillenarte, second son of the count and one of Francel's older brothers. (Quest script for unlocking access: here)

You'll probably need to organise a trip with FC members if you want to get in, as people don't normally queue for it.



Also, once you get to Ishgard, I guess you'll want to pick up the job quests there - but I'd recommend leaving AST for the moment. I don't know if you've been looking through the discussions here for Ishgard lore, but I'd posted about inconsistencies in the quest timeline - and now we have an official response that some critical facts were mistranslated, and should be fixed in patch 4.5. So it's a good idea to wait until then so you get the corrected version of the story. (Not relevant to your story concept, but just for pursuing Ishgardian lore in general.)

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Originally Posted by Princess_Cassandra

Sorry if this came across as a hand wave. I want to rewrite everything in much greater length and detail soon. I used Haurchefant as an example because he directly goes against the authority of an inquisitor, even openly drawing his sword on temple knights to stand up for what he believed in (Francel's innocence). I used Dark Knights as reference because they often clash with Temple Knights and for similar reasons too. I want Fleurent to be put into a comparable situation but I just do not know the how or the why yet. It's an important moment that I need to get right.

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If it's just a placeholder, that's okay then - it just didn't sound like you're still working on it. (I'll admit my own character concepts are in a similar state!)

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Originally Posted by Iscah

There's no sign of the military arts exchange going on beyond those levequest descriptions.

And there's not too much to investigate about the Diadem - I don't think there's any story linked to it. I only got in once and there were lots of FATEs but nothing to specifically do, although I was there for the "gathering" missions rather than the "battle" missions. Anyway, once you'll get to Ishgard you'll see there are a few NPCs at the airship landing, though you can't do anything until you've cleared the Heavensward MSQ. The guy in charge is Aurvael de Haillenarte, second son of the count and one of Francel's older brothers. (Quest script for unlocking access: here)

You'll probably need to organise a trip with FC members if you want to get in, as people don't normally queue for it.

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Ahh ok, oh well. At least I can still use these parts as evidence of Ishgard working with foreigners.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Also, once you get to Ishgard, I guess you'll want to pick up the job quests there - but I'd recommend leaving AST for the moment. I don't know if you've been looking through the discussions here for Ishgard lore, but I'd posted about inconsistencies in the quest timeline - and now we have an official response that some critical facts were mistranslated, and should be fixed in patch 4.5. So it's a good idea to wait until then so you get the corrected version of the story. (Not relevant to your story concept, but just for pursuing Ishgardian lore in general.)

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Ah ok interesting, thank you for the fair warning and I am pleased to hear this is going to get sorted out soon!

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Originally Posted by Iscah

If it's just a placeholder, that's okay then - it just didn't sound like you're still working on it. (I'll admit my own character concepts are in a similar state!)

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Oh yeah, it is certainly a place holder for now. I want to work on it in earnest after i reach level 60 and don my proper lvl 60 Ishgard esque glamour that my friends helped me create. :D

With the issues you first mentioned dealt with, does everything else in my concept look acceptable to you?