I’ve seen this pop up a lot in the vent thread.
It also happened to a friend and me.
More than once.
Please, if you don’t know a fight, don’t join a clear party. Join practice runs and watch a video or get the fight explained by somebody who knows if you don’t want to go completely blind and go from there.
Especially with Suzaku now, there are so many practice runs or PF’s that SAY they came to this and this mechanic and want to practice. It’s really not that hard.
Even if you don’t find one, you can easily make one, many people want to learn the newest primal.
Clear party: Mostly say, KNOW MECHANICS. They know the mechanics well enough but didn‘t get a clear yet. This happens. So they search for people that HELP. And a lot of people are willing to help. Be it that they just want to get one clear for a totem or whatever, that doesn’t matter.
Wipes still happen sometimes int hose parties, yes. Snowballing can happen very fast. I for one can literally have little panic atatcks in Suzakus Simon Says phase for no real reason. But you can still see when people actually know what they were doing and just got unlucky and died. Or whatever and enrage. Happens.
Farm Party: usually go with the „you can only join if you cleared this fight“ option. So people that have no clue don’t get in. Usually. Some forget, then it can happen. Some people were maybe carried and just think this is the case again.
Practice Parties: Either they do rpactice runs or not. They are labeled as such though. Like i already said, they mention that they still practice specific phases or mechanics. What better place is there to learn it? I do wonder.
So please, why do people that do not know ANYTHING about the fight join clear parties or even farm parties? I know it’s a thing now to write „no salt“ in the PF but i’m PRETTY sure that means accidental wipes. Not tolerating people that join even though they have no clue what tehy were doing.
I wanted to help with a Tsuku-Ex clear for somebody but didn’t get it after… hours because people that didn’t know the fight kept joining and kept wiping us. I needed to rescue the other healer to his spot for spears/meteors. They said they knew. They clearly didn’t…
Even when you ask if everybdoy knows, everybody shuts up and just choses to not write. Even PS4 people CAN write. Takes a bit, but they can. Especially if the person that asks waits…
And the problem to that ist hat you feel really bad for kicking those people, even if they clearly waste everybodies time because they don’t know anything and joined the wrong party.
I should just learn to kick them fort he sake of everybody but still..
Don’t join when the description says: KNOW THE FIGHT and you don’t know the fight.
Just wanted to get this off my chest.
I don’t apologize for typos because I’m at work and I need to type fast. May correct typos later.
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10-08-2018, 08:41 PMCheremiaFor everybody: Don’t join Clear- or Farmparties if you don’t know the fight!
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10-09-2018, 01:23 AMCorbinDallas
What grinds my gears is people creating and joining "farm" parties when they've only got a single kill under their belt. Just because you've got one kill doesn't make you farm ready. For all I know you scraped through that kill or got carried and you're no where near optimised enough to farm. Stick to practice/kill groups.
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10-09-2018, 01:26 AMDuskTS
Welcome to FFXIV end-game PF enjoy your stay.
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10-09-2018, 02:48 AMJijifliUnless you actually do know what you're doing.Quote:
Originally Posted by CorbinDallas
It's really awkward going 20+ attempts with clear parties and consistently being the only person to not die to melody, colors, or 180 degree knockbacks.
I got lucky though. I found people willing to take me through who already cleared. And I got 0 deaths and 0 vun's.
I think if you got through your clear party with no vuns or deaths, you're ready for farm. Specially when you still had really high uptime. -
10-09-2018, 02:52 AMLissandraI have this sort of thinking too, and I almost never join farm groups after clearing once unless I am confident I know the fight well.Quote:
Originally Posted by CorbinDallas
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10-09-2018, 02:54 AMVahlnirI've had enough experience that I would be comfortable farming Suzaku...if I could actually get a clear. It's like the OP says. People are simply joining clear parties for practice, when there's plenty of practice runs already being formed. Clearly they just want a carry and are wasting the time of people who are taking this seriously like myself.Quote:
Originally Posted by CorbinDallas
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10-09-2018, 02:57 AMSerLuke
Skip soar or disband, disband or skip spar
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10-09-2018, 04:05 AMLastelli
You don't pay their sub. Therefore, they can join your party even if they don't meet the requested requirements. And if you're not ok with that, congratulations, you're toxic.
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10-09-2018, 05:20 AMTranquilmelody7I'm assuming this is satire.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lastelli
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10-09-2018, 05:41 AMJijifliThat post? Yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tranquilmelody7
The actual words? I wish. -
10-09-2018, 08:13 AMAomine1992I understand your way of thinking and am inclined to agree but if someone has a kill do you really expect them to go to another one of the many bad clear parties to get more kills lol ain't nobody got time for that!Quote:
Originally Posted by CorbinDallas
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10-09-2018, 08:31 AMDirwenJust wanted to say your post made me smile even if it wasn't your intention.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jijifli
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10-09-2018, 08:46 AMKuroka
But how am i supposed to get my carry then? Q_Q
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10-09-2018, 09:32 AMBerteaux_BraumegainI wiped on Suzaku EX so many times in clear parties that by the time I actually cleared, I was able to write a dissertation on the fight and its mechanics.Quote:
Originally Posted by CorbinDallas
That's the good thing about clear parties, I guess. You're going to wipe so often that you will know mechanics by the end. Hopefully. -
10-09-2018, 09:39 AMKurando
You know only gets sad when despite the multiple runs, no progress is made at all. I mean if you go in to a farm party with little experience but you know your mistakes and fix them pretty quickly then it ain't too bad, but constantly stubbling on different things and showing few signs of improving then that's when it becomes a problem.
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10-09-2018, 09:59 AMKABESSA
How about you just put duty complete on Pf? Tired of these lv 70/60 that don't know how to use party finder. Btw how about the scrubs who live pratice parties after one run and put ''I thought that was a farm pt...''. People need to start read the pf and descriptions.
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10-09-2018, 04:12 PMCheremiaThe thing is, you usually can‘t do this for clear parties. Clear is different from farm.Quote:
Originally Posted by KABESSA
But clear is also different from practice.
Some can just forget for farm parties but they usually do have that requirement.
So many practicerungs and people choose to go into the one that says „got to enrage multiple times, know the fight“.
Also mistakes happen, you don‘t look and join the wrong party but... i‘m pretty sure some people do it on purpose and expect s carry because other people know.
It‘s just starting to get real bad and i guess i‘ll have to go toxic if that is what it takes to get a clear when I don‘t have 5 hours to teach others. -
10-09-2018, 05:16 PMIzVale
2 of my fc members joined a "kill" party yesterday. From what I gathered, their group died a lot in the first Phase.. never checked if they ever cleared it.
I mean, I get the idea of joining an actual Kill group, to learn and see how it's done - but that requires the majority of the party to actually know and survive the fight. So I am wondering how many peeps start a party with the tags clear/farm without even self having enough knowledge and movement about the fight? -
10-09-2018, 06:48 PMDuskane
i have never joined a clear group that actually clears
i always clear it with the later practice groups that sticks together for ages that ends up clearing it -
10-09-2018, 06:51 PMYui_Tenshi
I do wish people did read for farm party that they must know the mechanics. You aren't farming if you wipe ~80% of the time.
I normally run practice parties to learn each individual phase. And then I join clear parties until I've cleared several times in them and fully understand each phase. Then I join farm parties when I'm confident I won't die and just want to farm weapons and mounts. And if everyone knows their stuff, you can get several runs in a few hours with no wipe. That's only happened once for me and it was for Tsukuyomi EX: we all got a weapon we wanted in a few hours and a few lucky ones even got the mount. First time I had a good solid PUG run. -
10-09-2018, 06:58 PMBourne_EndeavorSadly, I do not. It would be nice, however, if people recognized parts they still struggled with and either joined clear parties or made one themselves specifying what part they want to brush up on. For example, I'd seen enrage on Suzaku but still didn't have colors down as consistently. So I listed my PF as "Practice! Second Phase. Please know colors decently!" Likewise, despite having cleared Shinryu EX numerous times. I did join learning parties when I wanted to tank him just to get experience from that perspective. And even when I had a good grip on everything, I still hopped in a few.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aomine1992
You'll often find people are far more tolerable if they're given a heads up about your prog level. I've had plenty of veterans join my parties because I list them accordingly. It's just common courtesy. -
10-09-2018, 07:44 PMYuiipuru
I had someone join our seph ex farm and we got a bonus. We thought okay np, maybe it's an alt or they know mech but haven't cleared. We cleared once and then wiped 3 times because one person kept dying and not grabbing tethers, and it was only until after I asked if anyone had questions about mechs that they spoke up.
Their response was
"Lol but I thought I was doing pretty good"
/facepalm -
10-09-2018, 11:15 PMRakiemSo tell me... i have seen so many O10S 1% Wipes now... i can do this fight nearly blind with no mistake. Anyway i still dont have my Kill, cause mostly other peoples in "Kill" Groups are just to bad or dont know what to do...so u tell me... after i got my Kill, i still have to stick with all the "Garbage" Healers/Tanks/DDs who dont know what to do or panic like chickens if a bit more happens on the screen? No Sir... totally not.Quote:
Originally Posted by CorbinDallas
Once i got the Kill... its "Weekly" Time and O11S Practice from Beginning time ^^ -
10-09-2018, 11:47 PMGarnetiferous
What I don't appreciate is people joining farm/clear parties on classes they barely know how to play. Like, if you've cleared 40 times on bard, that's great. You're not qualified to do this on healer. It was a major problem when I was trying to clear God Kefka, and I still see it happening in Suzaku. I ended up just booting people who told me that type of stuff.
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10-09-2018, 11:50 PMGurney
Clear Party = Learning
Farm Party = Clearing -
10-10-2018, 12:03 AMDeceptusSo put a duty completion requirement on it? Seems like an easy solve.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuiipuru
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10-10-2018, 01:19 AMalphaproto
It's really the worst with Shinryu. People just want to be carried, but in a fight like that EVERYONE has to be on top of it. It's frustrating as hell.
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10-10-2018, 01:29 AMvan_arnPeople tend to overestimate their own ability. If you're comfortable joining farm parties feel free, but if you've overestimated your own ability you earn every kick and blacklist you get.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rakiem
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10-10-2018, 02:09 AMJijifliWhen it goes long enough that you're consistently being the only person not dying, it's probably time to move on.Quote:
Originally Posted by van_arn
In seriousness with Suzaku, I kept joining clear parties where the off tank would die like 5 times. I wouldn't even die once. While keeping my uptime going.
While some can overestimate, there's some situations where it's kind of obvious. Doing every mechanic in Suzaku to the 48% enrage while having enough uptime that you're 3rd in threat, even with diversion/lucid, can't really argue that the lack of dps from everyone else dying is the issue. If they just stayed alive...
Specifically, I got lucky with 7 people who did clear who helped me with mine. 1 shot. EZ. Nobody died. It was glorious. -
10-10-2018, 02:40 AMRakiemSome do... some not. I dont think i overestimate my own abilitiys. Im SMN...4 Days in a row... 2-3 hours per day try to get the Kill in O10S. 90% of all the groups i stayed in i was top dps. 95% no mistakes from my side. But i always see healers who died to exaflare cause they Panic. Tanks with Doom all the Time or SAM/NIN/DRG with about 4k dps??? Maybe its time for a Static and i need to stop Party Finder Raiding -.-Quote:
Originally Posted by van_arn
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10-10-2018, 04:00 AMvan_arnI don't disagree with you, but the problem you're running into is a result of square failing to gate the extreme content from people that have no business being there. Not only can they get in without doing something like SSS, they suffer no consequences from joining content they lack the expertise to ever clear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jijifli
And then, if they manage to get straight up carried to a win, there's no mechanism in place to block them from joining parties that require duty completion even though their "clear" was unearned. -
10-10-2018, 04:10 AMJijifliThe chain this starts with is about someone saying you need to do it in multiple clear parties before you're allowed to join a "farm" party (Quotes, because y'all keep leaving after 1 go)Quote:
Originally Posted by van_arn
I agree, if you were carried into the clear, don't go to farm. On the other hand though, if you've literally mastered the mechanics, you are ON FARM. -
10-10-2018, 04:46 AMKurandoThe worst thing about this is if you pre-form a party with a friend, you can then set requirements or say it's a farm party via the PF, but in actual fact you can queue with whatever requirements you want afterwards as no one in the party can see whether the friend has cleared or not until the duty starts (and it states one or more party members are new etc).Quote:
Originally Posted by Deceptus
One thing that could help fix is the issue is for the duty window that pops up when the instance is ready actually shows the current requirements for entry, so Duty Complete, Loot, Practice etc. If a player doesn't fit the requirements then the window wouldn't pop anyway but if it did, then least everyone in the party can see the situation and can decide whether to accept/decline or stay/leave the party.