ARR S ranks NEED to be made harder!

I experimented today with a level 50 to try an S rank. It died in less than 5 seconds due to the overwhelming number of level 70s attacking at once and I got only 10 allied seals despite me hitting it from the start.

They need to be made harder. I know they're there for level 50s but here's the reality, level 50s aren't getting any or very little benefit and the level 70s aren't giving them a chance. Most the time it's only level 70s showing up to them.

I don't know how much more I can emphasize the necessity for harder S rank fights. There's no point in keeping them easy when lower levels aren't even bothering to show up and would rather hit level 70 first.

So party up with the level 70's.

If you're in a party, you get party credit as long as you get 1 hit in.

When I first started doings hunts (around 4.1-4.2 ish) I was level 50 partying up with 70s and getting full credit. Party Finder if it's a PF server or ask for an invite.

Just clarifying, I'm not against the idea. I personally would love if ARR and SB hunts got beefed up, but if the issue is not getting enough credit for full rewards, that's what partying is for.

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Originally Posted by Squintina

So party up with the level 70's.

If you're in a party, you get party credit as long as you get 1 hit in.

When I first started doings hunts (around 4.1-4.2 ish) I was level 50 partying up with 70s and getting full credit. Party Finder if it's a PF server or ask for an invite.

Just clarifying, I'm not against the idea. I personally would love if ARR and SB hunts got beefed up, but if the issue is not getting enough credit for full rewards, that's what partying is for.

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Whether you are with level 50s or level 70s it still dies in 5 seconds. Its not player level that is the problem, the OP was just identifying that this is a problem FOR level 50s when the dev team has stated that they are keeping it the same for level 50 players to participate.

I think Hunts in all zones should have their HP either increased to the SB amount or implement an HP scaling system where the more people there are in the zone when it is engaged, the more HP it has (but that’s probably not possible).

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Originally Posted by MartaDemireux

I think Hunts in all zones should have their HP either increased to the SB amount or implement an HP scaling system where the more people there are in the zone when it is engaged, the more HP it has (but that’s probably not possible).

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Or turn them all into Eureka style fates

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

Whether you are with level 50s or level 70s it still dies in 5 seconds. Its not player level that is the problem, the OP was just identifying that this is a problem FOR level 50s when the dev team has stated that they are keeping it the same for level 50 players to participate.

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Yes I know they still die within 5 seconds. I didn't say I was against the idea, I even clarified I wasn't.

But it still doesn't change that if the OP is only getting 10 seals, that particular part of his problem can be easily remedied by partying up with 70s because when you party you get everyone's credit (as long as you get 1 hit in). When I was 50-69, I was getting full credit most of the time because the 70's in my party carried my credit because their increased stats generate more enmity, which generates more party credit.

they should scale with the max level of who ever spawned it
so if a lvl 50/60 wants to spawn a S rank in there respected Area then thats fine
but if level 70 spawns it then its not as easy to kill

i think the hunt system should get a re-haul really or buff Most recent A ranks or replace them mid to late expansion

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Originally Posted by Duskane

they should scale with the max level of who ever spawned it
so if a lvl 50/60 wants to spawn a S rank in there respected Area then thats fine
but if level 70 spawns it then its not as easy to kill

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I think maybe you don't quite understand spawn conditions. Some are on a literal timer, guaranteed spawn during time/weather window. Some spawn via treasure maps, which players under 50 could do. Many take a genuine group effort.

More than that, you could easily create a situation where players intentionally use a lower level job while "spawning" just to make things easier.

On topic, while I don't disagree with making the hunts more of a challenge, I do disagree with the idea of making them nearly impossible if a group of friends at level 50 happen to want to try some out for themselves. An unlikely situation, but I'd still rather not see anyone's contribution at 50 to be even less than it is now.

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Originally Posted by Hasrat

I think maybe you don't quite understand spawn conditions. Some are on a literal timer, guaranteed spawn during time/weather window. Some spawn via treasure maps, which players under 50 could do. Many take a genuine group effort.

More than that, you could easily create a situation where players intentionally use a lower level job while "spawning" just to make things easier.

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oh i know how they are spawned and the timer (never really said anything that i didn't)
and on the lower level spawning i did say there max level so even if they are trying to spawn bosses with there lvl 50 nin if they have a lvl 70 SCH it will scale to the SCH lvl rather then the nin

Just make all S ranks lvl 70 and leave A/B ranks as is. Most if not all hunters are max lvl (ik some people start hunting before max lvl but that is an extremely small percentage). S rank get melted regardless just because so many more people show up to them as apposed to A ranks so I don't see an issue making them all lvl 70(or for future expansions, max lvl).

Turning S ranks into FATEs that scale down to a level appropriate for their expansion would be the best move, since they've expressed that they want lower leveled players to have a fair chance at fighting them.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

Turning S ranks into FATEs that scale down to a level appropriate for their expansion would be the best move, since they've expressed that they want lower leveled players to have a fair chance at fighting them.

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This is probably the best way to do it

I do wish there was a way to know you spawned it successfully like a message that pops up in the text box or something

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Originally Posted by Squintina

So party up with the level 70's.

If you're in a party, you get party credit as long as you get 1 hit in.

When I first started doings hunts (around 4.1-4.2 ish) I was level 50 partying up with 70s and getting full credit. Party Finder if it's a PF server or ask for an invite.

Just clarifying, I'm not against the idea. I personally would love if ARR and SB hunts got beefed up, but if the issue is not getting enough credit for full rewards, that's what partying is for.

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Why are people assuming I'm doing them solo? I was in a party when I got nerfed rewards, usually because people are pulling whilst others are still shouting for an invite or they're nearly dead by the time I get there even if I tp'd as soon as an announcement was relayed.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

Turning S ranks into FATEs that scale down to a level appropriate for their expansion would be the best move, since they've expressed that they want lower leveled players to have a fair chance at fighting them.

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That's the thing, lower leveled players don't have a fair chance anymore. Whether it's your mount isn't the fastest because you don't have the map unlocked yet, you're having to dodge mobs aggressive to your level, or some level 70s got itchy trigger fingers you will get nerfed or no rewards at a lower level unless you're already there and in a full party before it gets pulled because they're dropping so fast to overpowered level 70s. Maybe FATEs are the only way around this as the only other option would be to increase the difficulty of the hunt, unless SE could modify the hunt so it scales specifically to the player attacking it (level 50 hunt appears as 70 to a level 70 player whilst still remaining 50 to a level 50 player.)

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Originally Posted by geekgirl101

Why are people assuming I'm doing them solo? I was in a party when I got nerfed rewards, usually because people are pulling whilst others are still shouting for an invite or they're nearly dead by the time I get there even if I tp'd as soon as an announcement was relayed.

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Because if you were in a party when you got nerfed rewards, that would mean the entire party got nerfed rewards, not just you. So if your point is that low levels can't get credit, and you were in a party with 70's and still didn't get full credit, then it means that even if you had been high level, you probably still wouldn't have had the chance to get full credit.
So your level being 50 hardly mattered.

Truth is, all levels (50 and 70) are affected by the ARR S ranks (and HW S ranks) having such low health. Because even 70's have a hard time getting full rewards if they are in a party that arrived late, due to the rewards for the entire party being based on enmity generated, and thus faster death = less time for smaller/late parties to generate enmity.

So while I agree they need to do something about it, I don't think stating the low levels is a particularly good reason. It just needs to be done overall because power creep is making these too quick to kill for everyone of all levels. They need a fate-like level sync (with ilvl sync).

The only real issue I can think of with doing a FATE level-scale style system would be that it means there's a time limit on the monster, unless they implemented some sort of system where a FATE could last indefinitely until it was completed. I guess for most servers it's not much of an issue since S-ranks often go down within minutes of being spawned, but there are S-ranks which spawn on their own or can be spawned by accident and which could effectively just be lost if they happened to spawn at a bad time of day. I do think there should definitely be some form of scaling though, and I'd also like it if S ranks were invincible for a few minutes after being spawned to actually give people a bit more time to get there.

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Originally Posted by PangTong

The only real issue I can think of with doing a FATE level-scale style system would be that it means there's a time limit on the monster, unless they implemented some sort of system where a FATE could last indefinitely until it was completed. I guess for most servers it's not much of an issue since S-ranks often go down within minutes of being spawned, but there are S-ranks which spawn on their own or can be spawned by accident and which could effectively just be lost if they happened to spawn at a bad time of day. I do think there should definitely be some form of scaling though, and I'd also like it if S ranks were invincible for a few minutes after being spawned to actually give people a bit more time to get there.

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time isnt much of a isssue when even fates like ixion can be done with just two or three groups

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Originally Posted by Duskane

time isnt much of a isssue when even fates like ixion can be done with just two or three groups

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It's not that I don't think the monsters will be killed before the time limit expires if there are groups there to kill them, but rather it's possible that an S rank could be spawned by accident or on its own, without anyone hunting it, and if no one realizes it has spawned in the 20-30 minutes the FATE is active, then the monster vanishes and everyone has to wait another 3-5 days for it to spawn again. This could be avoided if they allowed it to be spawned multiple times consecutively until the FATE is completed, or if the FATE simply does not expire until it's completed, but my experience with boss FATEs like Ixion and stuff is that there are often times where they spawn, but no one is around to do them, so they simply expire and no one gets to do them until the respawn timer is up again.

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Originally Posted by PangTong

It's not that I don't think the monsters will be killed before the time limit expires if there are groups there to kill them, but rather it's possible that an S rank could be spawned by accident or on its own, without anyone hunting it, and if no one realizes it has spawned in the 20-30 minutes the FATE is active, then the monster vanishes and everyone has to wait another 3-5 days for it to spawn again. This could be avoided if they allowed it to be spawned multiple times consecutively until the FATE is completed, or if the FATE simply does not expire until it's completed, but my experience with boss FATEs like Ixion and stuff is that there are often times where they spawn, but no one is around to do them, so they simply expire and no one gets to do them until the respawn timer is up again.

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Make it a 24 hour timer.

Agree, takes like 2 seconds to die.

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Originally Posted by geekgirl101

Why are people assuming I'm doing them solo? I was in a party when I got nerfed rewards, usually because people are pulling whilst others are still shouting for an invite or they're nearly dead by the time I get there even if I tp'd as soon as an announcement was relayed.

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The clear answer would be to get there faster.
Others did.

ARR A and S ranks should be level synced. This way they cant be butchered as quickly by 1 or 2 people. It's easy to early pull if you know you can solo the mobs. To be honest I think HW should to.. This way it gives people a chance to get to these hunts.

make them like fates, scale them like they did with eureka so it doesn't die instantly.

but why not? Because lazy

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Originally Posted by Squintina

Make it a 24 hour timer.

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The timer should be made indefinite due to the fact that they are going to have to make it a separate system anyway. Fates at the moment show on your map, and I'd rather keep the searching aspect of hunts intact rather than an actual fate spawning on my minimap.

The only way I can think to keep the current fate system without extra system changes would be to have an NPC trigger gating the hunt which could end up being weird and clunky

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

The only way I can think to keep the current fate system without extra system changes would be to have an NPC trigger gating the hunt which could end up being weird and clunky

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The system already supports fates that don't show up on the big map, even if they still show up on the mini map. It's how the coeurlgina fate works, Odin, Ixion, and I think (but I'm not sure) Foxy Lade fate work, and all of those have multiple spawn points which means people have to search for them. Considering the small size of the minimap, people would still have to search for hunts if they got converted to this non-big-map "fate" system and kept all of the possible spawn points.

Indefinite timer would be fine. No arguments there.

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

Or turn them all into Eureka style fates

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Do this. Please.

Didn't SE mention something about looking into Sync options outside of FATEs and Duties? I seem to recall they did...

I'm not part of a hunt linkshell so if I happen across an A-Rank in ARR or HW I tend to solo it rather than try to get the word out. Barring some mechanical challenges (had to run from the goblin in Hinterlands today, his damage buff builds too fast) it's not too hard to solo them with the help of a Chocobo. I'd give an S-Rank a try in ARR but there's a lot more work involved in spawning them than A-Ranks... Unless I'd spawned it with the help of others for the explicit purpose of soloing it I'd assume I'd stolen it and feel terribly guilty.

I shouldn't be able to solo them. No one should. They die so fast to groups that I might not get full credit after waiting 5-10 minutes; it's simply not worth the effort of letting people know and waiting until they're ready.

I agree the ARR S ranks need to be buffed in some way (A ranks too, imo). Low-level players may not have the increased mount speed and even if they arrive in time, they are probably going to get scant rewards. It would be nice if S ranks were up long enough that you could arrive in the area a few seconds after the pull and still get credit.
Leaving S ranks weak just so a party of level 50 players can kill one unaided, is hurting the majority of people who do the Hunt. Some form of level-synch would make a lot more sense.

Personally I think they are fine. I come from a server that it's not a problem though. We self police our linkshells and call out people who abuse the the pull. We give x mins for pull and shout for if people are coming.

Or, maybe, they could just make them more abundant and significantly decrease their respawn timers.The Tome rewards would have to be reduced, though. And, if you guys want to have more challenging contents: they can just make more trials like the rathalos

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Originally Posted by Zephanoa

Personally I think they are fine. I come from a server that it's not a problem though. We self police our linkshells and call out people who abuse the the pull. We give x mins for pull and shout for if people are coming.

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It won't be fine next expansion when they die in 1-2 seconds and half the group misses the kill for typing in party or blinking.

Making them level synched hidden Fates would be the perfect option imo. Nothing major changes except they can't be zerged solo and will last more than a few seconds if ep'd. I can't see any negative point to this.

everything needs to be made harder.....

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

The timer should be made indefinite due to the fact that they are going to have to make it a separate system anyway. Fates at the moment show on your map, and I'd rather keep the searching aspect of hunts intact rather than an actual fate spawning on my minimap.

The only way I can think to keep the current fate system without extra system changes would be to have an NPC trigger gating the hunt which could end up being weird and clunky

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Many special fates are NOT shown on the map unless you get close enough. Odin, Fox Lady, Ixion, etc.

Here's a small suggestion. We leave the B/A marks alone, however the S ranks get completely revamped. I think instead of making them like fates, we visit an old idea from FFXI. Item popped NMs. You would take an item, that was either farmed/crafted, and traded said item to a "???", which would pop the NM. How could we make that work here? Well, we have these unstained mark logs that the A.R.R. hunts still drop. (As well as other logs.) and currency that I'm sure the majority are using for aether tickets or ventures. Well, why not take those old, dusty logs and use them as an item you trade in for a pop item for a specific S rank? Then, you put yourself up in PF looking for members, get a full 8/8 party, go out and find the "???" to trade the pop item and boom. There's your S rank.

Now, to prevent people just bombarding the ???, you can add a cooldown to them similar to what the savage raids have. (Weekly cool down timer.) Can even toss in a system where you can't pop an s rank if another member of your party has already killed the mark for that week. This will pretty much level the playing field in terms of S ranks, and help get rid of the toxic cloud hanging over the hunting community.