FFXIV 2.0 sounds good but...

Am I the only person who believes that nothing but a full reset/reroll of all data and not just a one time gender change makes sense considering the hefty changes that are coming to FFXIV...???

It does make sense from a development perspective -- However from a community perspective people will be complaining non-stop so they want to avoid that. This is why I'm not fully hopeful over 2.0 the more I think about the fact we'll retain our data, because that means they aren't fully overhauling the foundation for the better, they're only doing it on a surface level in order to allow us to keep our data intact.

Would I like to completely restart a game I've been playing for months and have no say in the matter? If they were to delete characters and completely change the system they might as well just shut down XIV and release it as XV.

I am hoping that 2.0 is little more than a major patch, some geography and interface changes with maybe a restructure of skill trees etc. but I do not want a complete reset - If my character was rolled back to 0 I would miss her, I find myself more attached to my character in XIV than other games such as WoW.

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Originally Posted by Allistar

Am I the only person who believes that nothing but a full reset/reroll of all data and not just a one time gender change makes sense considering the hefty changes that are coming to FFXIV...???

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while i agree the game would of turned out better if this happened. it should of happened in a form of shutting down all servers till the game was ready. they already promised that they wouldn't do this. if it did most would probably be looking for a lawyer lol. they are adding servers that will not have any high levels in it from the start though so those servers will be perfect for new players and people who want to just reroll and start all over again.

but i agree, starting at 2.0 and not have played all this year would of made 2.0 all that much more better. really a good way around not data wiping us is this. ...just make the rank 1-50 soooo easy it would only take a few weeks to max out all your classes and sub jobs. (ohh wait lol) but seriously making 1-50 really feel like rank 1-35 in ffxi sounds like a good plan, then add a cap raise for 2.0 that pushes the slop of dificulty in terms of getting from 35-75 in ffxi. i'm actually praying this is what is gonna happen. still hoping that when the cap raises slow down or stop that if you wanted to go 1-max that it will end up taking months to a year like in ffxi. and ...course hope after rank 50 power leveling like it is ..is gone or removed even from rank 1 but that is a diff story.

A whole new life...a new world...a brand new begining...we'll never get the full experience of 2.0 if we're allowed to bring all our old baggage from this version of the game...but thats just my opinion.

I seriously think it's more likely a brand new game and they are basically going to be converting our characters over to it.

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Originally Posted by Pyretta_Blaze

I seriously think it's more likely a brand new game and they are basically going to be converting our characters over to it.

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That saddens me, am I the only person enjoying the game as is? If so I find it hard to understand why I see so many people around - they can't all be bots.

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Originally Posted by Pyretta_Blaze

I seriously think it's more likely a brand new game and they are basically going to be converting our characters over to it.

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Well he did say it's not a "new" game perse, but if you look at the foundational changes in the pdf:

-New Graphical Engine
-New Motion system
-New AI system
-Redone Character Creator
-New Servers
-New Client

That stuff would generally call for a character wipe, because you'll still be retaining a lot of older data if you just port things over -- Beyond content creation it seems it would be much more efficient to do a wipe since they would have no worries about "going the extra mile", but I guess this is why at the least they'll let you remodel your character and reset your quest progress to 0 for non-completed ones.

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Originally Posted by Dibria

That saddens me, am I the only person enjoying the game as is? If so I find it hard to understand why I see so many people around - they can't all be bots.

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Nope, I enjoy it, but it was for the most part unfinished when it got rushed out (rightfully so), but the changes are mostly on the foundation level, anything in terms of content they could have done now, but the current client and server setup wouldn't have made it an enjoyable experience.

We wont know much either way until the 2.0 is closer to release.

They could just be tracking our character data and converting it over over the course of a few weeks before 2.0

(Warning any progress beyond this point doesn't matter character data is being converted from ___date.)

Or the game will smoothly translate into the new engine, and our character data will read in the new engine as it did in the old. It's a rather technical question and I doubt we will really know until 2.0. On another note SE only stated out character progress will be retained they haven't said anything about items/money have they?

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Originally Posted by Allistar

Its almost like saying I'll get remarried...but I still want to sleep with my ex-wife...??? A whole new life...a new world...a brand new begining...we'll never get the full experience of 2.0 if we're allowed to bring all our old baggage from this version of the game...but thats just my opinion.

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There will be new servers introduced upon PS3 launch where EVERYONE will be starting a brand new character, fresh data for all. Go play there if this is such a concern for you. Problem solved.

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Originally Posted by Jynx

On another note SE only stated out character progress will be retained they haven't said anything about items/money have they?

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Not to my knowledge, I would assume information will be forthcoming as they start teasing 2.0 to try and entice new players, I see it going one of two ways; either the equipment system changes and they give people stock equipment based on their skill level in each area or the equipment system stays the same but we lose everything labeled as 'dated'.

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Originally Posted by Dibria

That saddens me, am I the only person enjoying the game as is? If so I find it hard to understand why I see so many people around - they can't all be bots.

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Oh! I think my comment was read as a negative thing. I think it will be the same game in spirit but with the current the technical limitations removed with the new graphical engine, servers, etc.

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Originally Posted by Pyretta_Blaze

Oh! I think my comment was read as a negative thing. I think it will be the same game in spirit but with the current the technical limitations removed with the new graphical engine, servers, etc.

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yeah probably same game or at least same direction it has and will keep moving but without the limitations they had with this old server or software, w/e the terminology is lol. if it feels like a fully new game it's probably cause right now it's so limited that we are getting garbage for content with what they can produce.

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Originally Posted by Allistar

Am I the only person who believes that nothing but a full reset/reroll of all data and not just a one time gender change makes sense considering the hefty changes that are coming to FFXIV...???

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I don't know if you are the only person, but from my perspective can I give this a big NO. I have put a lot of time and effort into my character and deleting all or most of that is just about the only thing which would make me quit FFXIV. I am not going through all that again.

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Originally Posted by Dibria

That saddens me, am I the only person enjoying the game as is? If so I find it hard to understand why I see so many people around - they can't all be bots.

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You are not the only person, I am still enjoying the game. I am especially enjoying it tonight as Ifrit was kind enough to drop a weapon :D

The best thing for the game would be a wipe but the backlash on SE would be pretty huge. The 25k of you guys still playing dont really matter in the long run so i dont think its really about alienating the current community. I think its more about the fact we were promised by the current leader of the project there would be no wipe.

They do a wipe and SEs credibility would be shot to crap. Could you imagine the feeding frenzy the gaming media would have with that.

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Originally Posted by Allistar

Am I the only person who believes that nothing but a full reset/reroll of all data and not just a one time gender change makes sense considering the hefty changes that are coming to FFXIV...???

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I'm sorry but did you drop on your head? If they did a complete wipe it will piss alot of ppl who have stayed while SE try to fix this mess. What's the point of playn now if you know everything you have done was all for nothing. I'm about to pay just so my character can be wipe at 2.0 really? GTFO.

If they were going to wipe our character what would be the point of staying now? Why would I be paying to play a character that's only going to get deleted?

Yes, I agree. I only have 3 jobs at 50, but I am really proud of those jobs. I really wouldn't mind a server wipe, but I'd feel a bit annoyed at being just another noob again lol.

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Originally Posted by Searious

If they were going to wipe our character what would be the point of staying now? Why would I be paying to play a character that's only going to get deleted?

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You know you could still just as easily start up and play FFXIV when it relaunches...right? The game isn't being shut down lol. I get what you mean, but really think about it.. "what would be the point of staying now?"....You'll still be playing the game you obviously like while waiting for it's relaunch which you can then begin playing that since they added items for you if you played FFXI (hermes sandels) they can easily give people who played till 2.0 their special mounts and etc mentioned even in the event of a wipe.

I too have stayed the course and have been playing since beta...but I'm just looking at what has been stated about SE intention as far as 2.0...I have enjoyed most of the changes thus far and believe me I'm not complaining...I have no problem starting on a new server or starting over from scratch...I'm just curious as to who else would support a wipe if it were ever seriously considered...

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Originally Posted by ereskigal

I'm sorry but did you drop on your head? If they did a complete wipe it will piss alot of ppl who have stayed while SE try to fix this mess. What's the point of playn now if you know everything you have done was all for nothing. I'm about to pay just so my character can be wipe at 2.0 really? GTFO.

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All I really cared about was your opinion on the matter...if you would support it or not...I understand that the majority of the playerbase will be up in arms...but I'm just thinking...if they wipe and lose 15k but gain 40k wouldn't they still benifit...like I said it is my opionion...

We'll get to keep our characters, items, and gil. Think this was stated in the 2.0 pdfs as well as some Yoshida interviews that were translated.

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Originally Posted by Allistar

All I really cared about was your opinion on the matter...if you would support it or not...I understand that the majority of the playerbase will be up in arms...but I'm just thinking...if they wipe and lose 15k but gain 40k wouldn't they still benifit...like I said it is my opionion...

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Yeah, I get the attachment to your character but sometimes the benefits far outweighs the losses, not to mention back when I had my main character it was a grind to get to even rank (at the time!) 10, now it takes only 1 leve and a few mobs to kill, so honestly..

For the sake of the people who have spent ages playing this game and building up their character, I would hate for all of that to have been a waste of time.

I don't think it's fair for some people to have to restart their characters because someone with one class at level 11 thinks there should be a reboot.

If you want a reboot, delete your character and remake it~

Plus it wouldn't be very fair to tell everyone they've changed their mind and are going to wipe all the characters, after they said they wouldn't.. not to mention that this whole P2P period would be a complete waste of money.

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

It does make sense from a development perspective -- However from a community perspective people will be complaining non-stop so they want to avoid that. This is why I'm not fully hopeful over 2.0 the more I think about the fact we'll retain our data, because that means they aren't fully overhauling the foundation for the better, they're only doing it on a surface level in order to allow us to keep our data intact.

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Not necessarily, you should consider the fact they are building the new engine from the scratch and have full data on the old engine, meaning they're fully capable of creating an entirely new foundation and creating a tool that would allow them to transfer base stats over, they could change the way the entire combat system operates, down to the very core, and still retain all your stats without problems.

I can not find it right now, but did it not say something like "you will retain your progress in a way" or it was worded in a similar fashion. If someone could pull up the quote about 2.0 and our transfer, I need to go do bed ;p

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Originally Posted by Allistar

Its almost like saying I'll get remarried...but I still want to sleep with my ex-wife...??? A whole new life...a new world...a brand new begining...we'll never get the full experience of 2.0 if we're allowed to bring all our old baggage from this version of the game...but thats just my opinion.

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Seriously? How can you even came up with this analogy is beyond me... Releasing version 2.0 is not like getting remarried and still wanting to sleep with your wife. If anything it's like taking your wife in for a boob job, nose lift, tummy tuck and the likes. The foundation of your relationship is still there.

If they wiped character data after version 2.0 I'd quite in a heartbeat. I've spent time, energy, money on the development of my character, who are you to turn around and say, to bad, so sad, you'll lose everything.

I love playing the game as it is now, I've got a ton of things to still keep me busy. When 2.0 rolls around, I'll still get the full experience, because not everything will be new. It's the same game, just going to be after a cataclysmic event that reshapes the world at it's very core.

I'm excited.

A full reset/reroll makes sense in terms of allowing "fairness" for players who have just started playing. It would also create an easier learning curve for existing players.

However, the learning curve for me is not that extreme that a player can not figure out what to do if the system has changed on them. Such as, would it benefit you as an existing player for them to have a full reset/reroll everytime they've changed the battle system or crafting system? Or a more familiar experience for some, would you have a lot more trouble picking up a FFXI max level job you haven't played before, oppose to playing it at level 20? Maybe you would or maybe not.

At the moment, I'm assuming they are trying to ease us into the new system. By the time the 2.0 comes out it wouldn't be too different from the existing game play. Wiping everything now or later would not benefit my game play at all, only punishes me to spend a lot more time to replay everything once again. At least that's how I honestly feel.

Take a look at other games who wipes progress on new games+. Most of them offer you some sort of benefit or illusion of benefit from previous progress. No one wants to feel like their previous progress meant nothing.

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

It does make sense from a development perspective -- However from a community perspective people will be complaining non-stop so they want to avoid that. This is why I'm not fully hopeful over 2.0 the more I think about the fact we'll retain our data, because that means they aren't fully overhauling the foundation for the better, they're only doing it on a surface level in order to allow us to keep our data intact.

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Actually, all of the character data we have are just inventory data, customization data, quest data...all stored information in a database. You just need to convert that data to a compatible format for 2.0 and you're good. The entire backend is probably getting overhauled, but being programmed with an eye on ensuring backwards-compatibility with the old database.

I know this because I've experimented with private servers in the past, and they are often done using emulators that make use of mySQL databases to track all of the appropriate information.

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Originally Posted by SilvertearRen

Actually, all of the character data we have are just inventory data, customization data, quest data...all stored information in a database. You just need to convert that data to a compatible format for 2.0 and you're good. The entire backend is probably getting overhauled, but being programmed with an eye on ensuring backwards-compatibility with the old database.

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I'm pretty sure this is what she was referring to that they're not doing everything they could possible if they want to keep things working between the engines, since instead of fully overhauling it they're doing it while being mindful of old data, instead of focusing on completely new assets, the latter obviously being overall better.

Though as for private servers, this purely depends on what you're regarding because eathena for example was more of a emulator, the one for TERA as well is more of a emulator and not necessarily the same tree or software that is used on official servers, like there's no way to know SE would be using the exact same setup otherwise FFXI and XIV would already have private servers even ignoring Playonline which is all but phased out for the most part.

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Originally Posted by Kailea_Nagisa

I can not find it right now, but did it not say something like "you will retain your progress in a way" or it was worded in a similar fashion. If someone could pull up the quote about 2.0 and our transfer, I need to go do bed ;p

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Even then that's probably talking class levels :)

I wouldn't really care that much if we lost all our gear, but we were given gear to make up (for the appropriate level of your class) for the loss of gear we had :)

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Originally Posted by Elexia

I'm pretty sure this is what she was referring to that they're not doing everything they could possible if they want to keep things working between the engines, since instead of fully overhauling it they're doing it while being mindful of old data, instead of focusing on completely new assets, the latter obviously being overall better.

Though as for private servers, this purely depends on what you're regarding because eathena for example was more of a emulator, the one for TERA as well is more of a emulator and not necessarily the same tree or software that is used on official servers, like there's no way to know SE would be using the exact same setup otherwise FFXI and XIV would already have private servers even ignoring Playonline which is all but phased out for the most part.

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Emulators notwithstanding, one thing is for certain: A database is being used to store and parse character data. The database is basically the heart of the MMORPG. You cannot run an MMORPG without a database. Without databases, you would have clunkier and inefficient options for updating, storing and using character data. Some MMORPGs use their own proprietary database code and backends, while others use solutions such as mySQL.

The principle is still the same. Our character data is being stored in a database, all you need to do is build a program that properly converts the old data to the new format for 2.0.

Let's say you have 10 lines of data in the table for Character "X" on version 1.0 to track character name, race, etc. Version 2.0's database uses 20 lines of data for your character information. You'd need to convert the database table for Character X from version 1.0 to 2.0, and then finalize that data in the new database format. There is a possible problem, however:

See, during the conversion, the new lines of data in the database would be either left blank or with a null value, which can cause complications, so you'd need to process that character with choices made by the player to ensure that those values are properly filled. Hence the possibility that we'll get a character re-make option at 2.0's launch. However, I doubt this will affect the database's veracity and integrity. Database information is VERY easy to do all sorts of things to: convert, store, back up, update, rewrite, etc.

Frankly, the discussion about character data being in danger are just unfounded fears. If the new 2.0 database is radically different from the old database, they can just set up a program that will convert 1.0 to 2.0's format by shifting the data around to their appropriate places in the table.

Example: 1.0 database has your race data compiled on the 3rd, 4th and 5th lines of data; version 2.0 would have your race data be on the 5th, 6th and 7th lines of data - the program would just simply copy the information from the 1.0 database and paste them to their appropriate locations in the 2.0 database. Problem solved.

TL;DR - Managing Character information such as levels, inventories, names, and so on are the EASIEST part of an MMORPG for a developer to work with, so stop worrying!

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

the fact we'll retain our data, because that means they aren't fully overhauling the foundation for the better

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BS ^

Redesigned classes.
Removed BR, brought combo in.
Made pretty much all gear in the game into trash (dated).
Et cetera.

The fact that we get to keep our levels, gil and items doesn't seem to be preventing SE from changing stuff. Guess you are just whining because you are a masochist who would love to have to grind everything all over again.

http://troll.me/images/treebeard/thi...hief-to-me.jpg

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TL;DR - Managing Character information such as levels, inventories, names, and so on are the EASIEST part of an MMORPG for a developer to work with, so stop worrying!

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QFT ^

Migrating data is just ridiculously simple.


They could turn the whole battle system into an FPS and it would still not matter that we keep our levels and items, it simply means we don't need to grind and save up again.

When will people take the hint when se repeatedly had said it's going to be a landscape tweak with few extra features because of the divided zones. You're just setting yourself up for disappointment thinking it'll be a completely new game.

I don't know how it works or the restrictions behind it, but I remember players of FFXI asking at the announcement of FFXIV if their character data could be transferred to the new game. The answer was no, because it was a totally new game and it would be impossible to do so. Have we gotten any word from SE one way or the other on transferring character data?

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Originally Posted by Xoo

I don't know how it works or the restrictions behind it, but I remember players of FFXI asking at the announcement of FFXIV if their character data could be transferred to the new game. The answer was no, because it was a totally new game and it would be impossible to do so. Have we gotten any word from SE one way or the other on transferring character data?

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For XI? I'm guessing it's the same as what has been said before.
For XIV? Yoshi-P has said multiple times that our data will be intact upon release of 2.0.

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Originally Posted by Xoo

I don't know how it works or the restrictions behind it, but I remember players of FFXI asking at the announcement of FFXIV if their character data could be transferred to the new game. The answer was no, because it was a totally new game and it would be impossible to do so. Have we gotten any word from SE one way or the other on transferring character data?

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Yeah but ppl wanted thier actual characters transferred over. Since the game has no nin, cor, pup, kirin osode, mog house, monster signa, joytoy, etc etc etc this could not be done. They also wanted lvls and gil and everything to transfer, again since we cap at 50 its kindda hard to bring lvl 99 chars in. As they said its a whole new game. They would have had to literally recreate xi in xiv for this to happen.

If they would have just ported the chars in with maybe the gil (which would have thrown the game economy for an absolute loop from day 1) ppl would have RAGED they were left with lvl 1 and no gear.

If ppl wanted their characters to switch over they could easily recreate them on Eorzea since all the hair styles and what not we got are basically updated versions of xi's. Thats actually what I did since I liked my xi char so much. ^^

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Originally Posted by Kailea_Nagisa

I can not find it right now, but did it not say something like "you will retain your progress in a way" or it was worded in a similar fashion. If someone could pull up the quote about 2.0 and our transfer, I need to go do bed ;p

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Famitsu Interview:

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"Players have a lot of memories wrapped up in their characters; wiping that out would be unthinkable. It's possible that we'll make adjustments that dramatically redefine skill ranks and player levels, but if so, we would allow players to reroll their parameters."

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You can just Google FFXIV Yoshida Wipe, and you'll find countless interviews in which he repeatedly stated there will be no wipe no matter what.

As it was said earlyer in this thread.

If you want a totally fresh start come 2.0 the best thing to do is go on hiatus now and then join one of the newly formed servers once they go up around the ps3 launch.

You get to be part of a fresh world building all over. We get to keep the fruit of our misused time. Every body's a winner.