Warrior Off tanking dps

Hello, I just wanted to ask what the best rotation to do for Off tanking is. I found some and have been doing Storms path with eye up to get the fell cleaves off more. is that the best to keep dps up? or should it switch between Storms path and block? etc?

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...ion_miniguide/

I broke it up into a more readable format (for myself at least):

OPENER:
HS (infuriate) > maim (thrill) > eye >
HS > maim (inner rel/berserk> > path (onslaught) >
FC (upheaval) > FC >
HS > maim > path >
FC (onslaught) > FC >

BASIC ROTATION:
eye combo > path combo > path combo

TRIPLE CLEAVE
HS > maim (berserk) > FC > FC > path (onslaught) >
HS > maim (infuriate) > eye > FC (upheaval) >

HEXACLEAVE
(thrill) HS (inner rel/berserk) > FC (onslaught) > FC (infuriate) > maim > FC (upheaval) > FC > path > FC > FC (onslaught)

The best rotation varies from boss to boss. Depending on what you're fighting, you might want to skip on the Onslaught at the start and just go straight into your 4 Fell Cleaves. The important thing is that you don't hold on to your Inner Release and Berserk for too long. As long as you get off 4 Fell Cleave and an Upheaval at the start of the fight, you should be pretty good. What you do from there and the next Inner Release won't really matter so much. Just make sure you're able to get off 3 Fell Cleaves during the next Berserk window.

The combo above should provide you with a good starting template to work with, but you're better off figuring out what the best thing to do is during each fight.

I'm curious what sort of dps people are pulling in 1-3 savage as OT. I seem to hit about the 3k mark on average(no pentamelds, i326), some pulls are smoother than others. And I usually go tank stance if I cover for MT flopping for whatever reason (cough critical hit).
Curious both from a self reflection point of view but also wondering how greatly certain gear choices are affecting us. I'm of the mind that tena left side with DH melds.

Melds won't make that much of a difference overall (especially if you're comparing pentamelds with normal melds). Same with food. The difference will be there, of course. But ultimately the decisions you make during the fight are what will account for high DPS numbers at the end. Things like how often you're out of tank stance, being able to land all your attacks correctly, etc.

The biggest factor I've noticed though, is how often you land critical and/or direct hits. For example, I've noticed when I'm killing Exdeath, sometimes I'm able to hit 3k DPS at the second Desicive Battle, without food or pots. Then other times I'll use food and pots, yet I'll be at 2.8k (with the same party). Granted, I'd probably have been at 2.6k without the pots in that situation, but this just to show you how volatile your DPS can be based on whether the right attacks crit or not. This is evident at the start of the fight too, where my DPS ranges from 3.2k to 3.8k before the first Decisive Battle.

In V3S, things are harder to measure based on whether you get stunned or not at the start. But even taking that into account, I noticed sometimes I can hit 3.5k at the first Mind Jack, while other times I only get 3k. My rotation is exactly the same, the same freakin' thing every time. And yet here we have this huge disparity.

Basically what I'm trying to say is, it's useless to just look at DPS figures and draw conclusions out of it. Those top parses you see on fflogs are often hard to recreaten even by the same player, and do not reflect reality in any way.

For people who are curious about rotations or especially openers, you can check fflogs for replays of the fights. It'll show you what each player used during that fight so you can get an idea of what you might wanna do. It's quite interesting, especially when you see players at the top doing things that are clearly not optimal, yet they still end up with the highest DPS. But I guess that doesn't matter much when your AST opens up with double Balance and your first 4 Fell Cleaves happen to be critical direct hits. :p

So I have a follow up question for this topic, why is it that no one seems to use the BB combo in dps rotations. In terms of sheer potency it does more than the eye combo and you shouldn't need to use eye more than once every 30 seconds yet many rotations go without it in dps tersms. Is there something hidden from the numbers that makes it a bad idea?

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Originally Posted by Spartan926

So I have a follow up question for this topic, why is it that no one seems to use the BB combo in dps rotations. In terms of sheer potency it does more than the eye combo and you shouldn't need to use eye more than once every 30 seconds yet many rotations go without it in dps tersms. Is there something hidden from the numbers that makes it a bad idea?

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Potency per beast gauge. There's some math somewhere but I couldn't tell you where!

Unsurprising bluexbird. I have thought things varied a lot for little reason of what I'm doing. I guess that's what happens when you dump all your eggs in one basket for that big dps window (which we have to) - if you get those big meaty repeated 21k + fel cleaves compared to your white/ heavy swing getting a !! There's going to be quite a difference!

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Originally Posted by Paiyne

Potency per beast gauge. There's some math somewhere but I couldn't tell you where!

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I'd be curious to know if anyone has this math available. It seems counter intuitive unless there's some rotation trick I'm not using that would never require me to use BB combo.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spartan926

I'd be curious to know if anyone has this math available. It seems counter intuitive unless there's some rotation trick I'm not using that would never require me to use BB combo.

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10 gauge has a minimum value of 50 potency, bb is only 20 potency more than path combo. Literally the only time it would be a dps gain is if you have both onslaught and upheaval on cd and are in a situation that would result in wasted gauge.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Spartan926

I'd be curious to know if anyone has this math available. It seems counter intuitive unless there's some rotation trick I'm not using that would never require me to use BB combo.

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It's flat out better to just dump 20 gauge on a 100 potency onslaught every now and then (when you're gonna over-cap on gauge) than sacrificing 10 gauge for just a 20 potency gain. It's as simple as that.

Warrior is a very rigid class and it's important you learn how to schedule things apporpriately.
A good thing to remember is that 100 gauge = approx. 30s at least, 37s at most

MT Opener
Butcher's Block Combo x3
Onslaught x2
Upheaval x1
Switch to DPS stance.
Build up to IRzerk window ASAP.

OT Opener
Heavy Swing > Infuriate > Maim/Storm's Eye
Storm's Path Combo > Upheaval
Storm's Eye Combo.
Heavy Swing > Berserk > Inner Release > Fell Cleave x2 > Maim > Storm's Path > Fell Cleave x3 > Infuriate > Fell Cleave x2

Extremely rigid and even half a second of downtime will cause you to drop the last cleave, so use Onslaught to mop up the remaining 20 gauge so you can stay on schedule if it happens.

IRzerk Window
Heavy Swing > Berserk > Inner Release
Fell Cleave > Onslaught > Fell Cleave > Upheaval
Maim > Storm's Path > Fell Cleave > Infuriate
Fell Cleave > Fell Cleave > Onslaught > Fell Cleave

The Upheaval can be delayed if you have low HP.

Berserk Window
Heavy Swing > Berserk > Fell Cleave
Now here you can just do the following in whatever order (use your brain and don't do something like use Infuriate at 70 gauge though):
Butcher's Block Combo x2
Upheaval x1
Onslaught x1
Fell Cleave x2
Infuriate x1

Normal Rotation (between both Windows)
Storm's Eye Combo.
Butchers Block Combo.
Upheaval (may not be off CD yet but use ASAP)
Storm's Path Combo x2
Storm's Eye Combo (make sure Upheaval has been used)

If you are behind schedule by more than 6-7 seconds, then skip the Butcher's Block + Upheaval.
If the delay happens AFTER the Butchers Block, use Onslaught to dump the gauge instead of Upheaval.

Why would you go BBx3 for the MT opener? With how you open you take like 1 min to start doing dmg
And why even BBx3 without having path up

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Originally Posted by Baci

Why would you go BBx3 for the MT opener? With how you open you take like 1 min to start doing dmg
And why even BBx3 without having eye up

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I like to establish a strong lead so that there's less chance of having to dip back into tank stance later on in a fight.
Eye is ignored there because the an entirely new SS/BB should generate more emnity than an eye-buffed SS/BB, if my understanding is correct.

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Originally Posted by Lumadurin

I like to establish a strong lead so that there's less chance of having to dip back into tank stance later on in a fight.
Eye is ignored there because the an entirely new SS/BB should generate more emnity than an eye-buffed SS/BB, if my understanding is correct.

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This is how you actually pull on WAR

Just kidding. Seriously tho, 3x BB is too much. Enmity is party duty and not tanks alone. Ask your OT to shirk you, or DPS jobs to use diversion, then enmity is no concern.

Yet your opener should look like this or this if you need more enmity.

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Originally Posted by ArianeEwah

Yet your opener should look like this or this if you need more enmity.

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Huh, interesting. Especially that second one.
I use Equilibrium as a poor-man's flash when tanking dungeons, but it never occurred to me to use it as supplementary aggro during the opener for some strange reason.
I'll give em a shot next time I'm running stuff. But typically the only time I'm MTing is in pubbed content anywho (Ex primals, omega normal, etc.), and you can't trust randoms to manage their emnity. =w=)a

6 Fell Cleaves is cute and all, but you're actually hurting yourself in the long run. Just use IR + Berserk on your second combo and go with 4 + Upheaval and an Onslaught.

Here's what I use for Exdeath when I don't have a Ninja in the party, and need to hold enmity. Starting in Defiance:

Tomahawk + Equilibrium + Deliverance
Heavy Swing (Infuriate) -> Maim (Thrill) -> Storm's Eye
Heavy Swing -> Skull Sunder (Berserk) -> Butcher's Block (Inner Release)
Fell Cleave (Onslaught) -> Fell Cleave (Upheaval)
Heavy Swing -> Maim -> Storm's Path (Holmgang)
Fell Cleave (Rampart) -> Fell Cleave
Heavy Swing -> Maim (Convalescence) -> Storm's Eye (Reprisal)
Heavy Swing (Onslaught) -> Skull Sunder (Infuriate) -> Butcher's Block
Heavy Swing -> Maim -> Storm's Path (Upheaval)
Heavy Swing*
Heavy Swing -> Maim (Onslaught) -> Storm's Eye

* You will end up with a free GCD at the end, but it's better to end with Storm's Eye so that the buff is still up after Flare. This could be a Fell Cleave, but Berserk will be up after Flare too and it'll be better to use it there.

Now this here is overkill when it comes to enmity, but it guarantees I still have a big lead regardless of party composition, and also makes sure I end up with 80 points on my beast gauge.

With a Ninja, the combo changes towards the end. Instead of using another Butcher's Block, I just use Storm's Path and swap the two Onslaughts for an extra Fell Cleave, again leaving me with 80 points.

So you see, there's no need to stay in Defiance, OR to use a repeated number of Butcher's Block combos, just to get an enmity lead.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lumadurin

OT Opener
Heavy Swing > Infuriate > Maim/Storm's Eye
Storm's Path Combo > Upheaval
Storm's Eye Combo.
Heavy Swing > Berserk > Inner Release > Fell Cleave x2 > Maim > Storm's Path > Fell Cleave x3 > Infuriate > Fell Cleave x2

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I'd just like to mention, that you have 10 globals (approx. 25 seconds) before you throw up Zerk and IR. You've missed every raid buff under the sun delaying that long. Compare this opener to DRG's opener for example, by the time you put up your buffs, the DRG in your party has finished their opener.