warrior melding for twinbolt.

ive been practicing savage and I often (not always) die to twin bolt. I switch to defiance and if its ready activate vengeance for the hit. often defiance is enough but not always. id like to down savage 1 before the reset on Tuesday and cant improve my gear before then other than melding. I cant afford penta-melded accessories. ive read the forums as I'm thinking melding tenacity might give me the extra little bit I need. but theres a lot of argument over it and I really confused. the most successful group I had hit enrage at 11%. as a war the damage I do isn't substantial and I cant see direct hit making up on that lost 11%.

please advise!

as I said before my biggest problem is dying once a fight usually to twinbolt

eat food if you don't have and use reprisal on twin bolt as that helps a lot. It happens every 60 seconds so the timing is perfect and you can even rotate between the tanks in case you need to reprisal raid aoe or stack mechanic. I usually holmgang the charybids + twinbolt combo just in case I'm not topped off but you really shouldn't be dying if you pop a cd and use reprisal. I only had 45k hp in deliverance when I cleared it in the first week and at most I drop to about 8-10k hp with rampart.

I think it is more of a CD management problem but tenacity melding would give you some DR but I believe Direct hit is the best right now for all tanks. As long as you have active mitigation up such as rampart, vengeance and combo it with an inner beast or reprisal you should be fine and shouldn't have to switch anything around. Being in defiance and using thrill of battle will probably keep you alive as well if you are topped.

Defiance won't do anything. Defiance on its own does not increase your HP when you switch to it, and it doesn't make you take less damage, so it won't help you in this case at all.

Also it shouldn't be a case of "if vengeance is ready". It should be either vengeance or rampart for twin bolt, there's no reason for you not to have at least one of them for every twin bolt. Vengeance for one, Rampart + reprisal for the next one (and honestly reprisal isn't neccessary either, you can save that for raidwide damage if you'd like).

In case of emergencies you have holmgang or thrill of battle + rampart/vengeance if you're too low before the cast finishes.

You've basically been taking naked twin bolts, that's why you're dying.

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Originally Posted by Praesul

Defiance won't do anything. Defiance on its own does not increase your HP when you switch to it, and it doesn't make you take less damage, so it won't help you in this case at all.

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If you use defiance preemptively it gives your healers time to get you topped and a larger health pool to survive the hit as well as access to inner beast as well if you don't have active mitigation. Also thrill of the battle will also give you even more health since it gives you 20% of you HP. Just giving all the options available to him if he is having trouble surviving ^^

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Originally Posted by Kyrph

If you use defiance preemptively it gives your healers time to get you topped and a larger health pool to survive the hit as well as access to inner beast as well if you don't have active mitigation. Just giving all the options available to him ^^

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In this instance defiance won't solve anything. He's switching to it right before the twin bolt cast (or during) so unless he receives a heal he gets no benefit. You could pool gauge and use inner beast if you really have to but again, that's unnecessary.

You could use defiance beforehand and ask your healers to heal you but why would you? It's worse than staying in deliverance and A. not needing to be healed and B. not lowering your damage dealt.

I just want it to be clear what he's doing wrong and what defiance actually does.

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Originally Posted by Praesul

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I agree but I was also giving advice of using it preemptively not switch right before the hit. You wouldn't be in defiance really that long and wouldn't lose that much damage using an inner beast. Also you could use equilibrium right as you switch to gain the health if anything since gaining TP isn't really needed ever in that fight.

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Originally Posted by Praesul

You've basically been taking naked twin bolts, that's why you're dying.

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Pretty much this.

Gear won't help you. You should just stay in Deliverance and pop Vengeance or Thrill or Rampart, + Reprisal, if you die with this, it's either because you weren't full HP (which means that your healers were slacking), or you had a vulnerability debuff from another mechanic, in which case you should switch to Defiance and use Inner Beast on top of the other CDs for safety. And pop your CD at the beginning of the cast, not at the end, otherwise it won't register in time and you'll take the full damage.

For twinbolt you should be using cool downs, rampart or vengeance, and if neither are up swapping to your tank stance should keep you alive.

I'm able to take a twin bolt to the face in my dps stance and typically survive with about 3 to 5k hp. (With tenacity set) but I will floor tank in DH gear if I don't use a cool down.

I'm not sure if tenacity plays a huge part or not, but my "tenacity set" sits at approx 1725, whereas my "Direct hit" set has me around 1250ish.

Either use vengeance or rampart and you should be good.

In v3s our pld keeps trying to Sheltron critical hit [without awareness] and wonders why he dies when a melee forgets to feint. Hint: Crit>Block priority.

#gladimnotahealeranymore

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Originally Posted by Rawrz

In v3s our pld keeps trying to Sheltron critical hit [without awareness] and wonders why he dies when a melee forgets to feint. Hint: Crit>Block priority.

#gladimnotahealeranymore

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So you just sat there and didn't explain why?

#gladidontraidwithelitistsnobs

I don't use Defiance for twinbolt, cooldowns are enough.

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Originally Posted by Tanthalas

ive been practicing savage and I often (not always) die to twin bolt. I switch to defiance and if its ready activate vengeance for the hit. often defiance is enough but not always. id like to down savage 1 before the reset on Tuesday and cant improve my gear before then other than melding. I cant afford penta-melded accessories. ive read the forums as I'm thinking melding tenacity might give me the extra little bit I need. but theres a lot of argument over it and I really confused. the most successful group I had hit enrage at 11%. as a war the damage I do isn't substantial and I cant see direct hit making up on that lost 11%.

please advise!

as I said before my biggest problem is dying once a fight usually to twinbolt

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There is no amount of any stat you can meld in this game that would give uou any noticable help with a buster like that. Its a cd issue. You just need to re plan your cds.

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Originally Posted by Tanthalas

as I said before my biggest problem is dying once a fight usually to twinbolt

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"Tanks should use cooldowns as necessary". MTQ said on her guides, whenever it highlights a tankbuster.
It's for a good reason. You need that Rampart / Vengeance / Thrill of Battle / Reprisal, any mitigation skill that gives you a better chance to survive the hit, while also have one in reserve for the next buster. This is called CD management, and it is important in Savage raids and you'll find more of these as you go.

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Originally Posted by DacienSanderon

So you just sat there and didn't explain why?

#gladidontraidwithelitistsnobs

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Oh you mean like the time I did in a5s when he did the same thing for the shanti add and I was the healer? Or you know like the times Ive asked when he plans to use hallowed or Sentinel or bulwark during the fight[answer:idk, at some point = never]? I'll stick to just addling. That's about as much as i can help. Poor whm always carries the tbs with DB at this point.

thanks for the replies. I don't know why but I didn't even have rampart set as one of my skills and I assumed (wrongly I know) that reprisal would be as useful as shake it off. which has Never shaken anything off. ive always used thrill of battle as a way to regain hp instead of mitigation but look forward to trying it on my next practice run. i'll love it if I can survive in deliverance, I cant remember if I had used vengeance or not in that instant I just know that the party told me to switch to defiance the first time I got downed by it in deliverance.

There is no tank swap in the fight you can use 2 cds per twinbolts.
Rampart+thrill
Vengeance
Inner beast+ convelance+ equilibrium
but also you need to memorize when they gonna happen, if you don't you will have problems getting rdy for it, since we don't have more penalty on stance dance ,change to defiance until you get better gear .
Food an max potions help.
Also don't stay too close to MT.

As said above, you don't really need Defiance. When I'm offtanking on my PLD, I never really leave Sword Oath either. Just make sure you pop a cooldown, you have enough to cycle through and you should do fine.

But op is using a cd, not sure if doing it late or is low hp, but for some reason is dying.

If theres a tank buster u need to use CDs to mitigate damage. This isnt dungeon bosses. Rampart Reprisal Convo and Provike are must haves

had a few more practice runs and I don't die anymore. thank you so much for all your advice. with any luck I might try savage 2 today :)

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Originally Posted by vigioX-Sun

But op is using a cd, not sure if doing it late or is low hp, but for some reason is dying.

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Defiance isn't a CD.

I mt this fight in Sword Oath, and this is what my group does:

I use sheltron or rampart, whichever is available.
Cotank uses rampart if up
Cotank uses Blackest Night on me
I use Intervention on Cotank.

Responsibility for the tb can be shared - consider asking your cotank to use intervention if they're a paladin, since they'll be rolling in gauge if they're tanking in sword. Absolutely reprisal the tb.

fwiw, it does ~55k unmitigated. At absolute bare minimum ilv to enter, you have like, what, 48k minimum? You shouldn't need more than one cooldown, and as ot, you should have a lot of them.

Don't bother with defiance, it's not worth it and is a waste of an ogcd.

(fwiw, shirk is god-tier if you don't have that slotted, you will want it for 2s)

EDIT - and if you have an mDPS, ask them to addle twinbolt.

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Originally Posted by Pells

Defiance isn't a CD.

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Is not but allow him to use equilibrium an go right back to deliverance.

Just use rampart and gg what ilvl are you? Full 320 you dont die with ranpart only and deliverance on

If you're paired up with a PLD, ask them to use intervention. Since they have to pop a cd anyway, that intervention will be stronger.