I'm a tank...but I think I may suck

I've had the game now for nearly 30 days. FFXIV is my first MMO and I chose tank because it appealed to me the most. I've thoroughly enjoyed the game thus far, but recently I've hit my first real bump in the road.

I think I may suck at tanking. This wasn't an issue until I hit the lvl 40+ content.

My biggest issue is that I don't know how to optimize the rotation for WAR. The other issue is managing aggro on larger mobs. I'll be totally honest here - I struggle to keep up with what's going on when pulling a large mob (like 4+). I find it difficult to keep up my various buffs, monitor health, and manage aggro on a lot of enemies. I know there is an aggro meter and an enemy list that shows whether you're aggro'd or not, but I still have issues as sometimes an enemy won't be in the list for some reason. I play on the PS4 and I have trouble cycling through the enemies as well - sometimes I end up inadvertently targeting an ally and can't target the enemy I want quickly. It doesn't help either when other players want to get through the content quickly (and understandably so since many people have done these dungeons countless times) and attack ahead of me and spread the mob's aggro, making me struggle to get it back.

In some of the 40+ dungeons, I've had other players get irritated with me because I pull smaller groups, slowing the content down. I always make it a habit of telling others when it's my first time in a dungeon - and several times people just abandon the dungeon after I say so. That is somewhat disheartening. I want to keep playing the game, but having others get mad because I lose aggro and/or die because I was solely focusing on aggro and not paying enough attention to my health isn't very fun.

tl;dr - I like tanking, but I want to be better than I am. Are there any hints or tricks to managing aggro and keeping track of everything (health, buffs, cd's, aggro, other player's health)?

Edit: My avatar still shows me at lvl 33 for whatever reason, but I'm 45 now.

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Originally Posted by Guolstyrm

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I'm a Warrior but its been a very long time since I've tanked at 40 esp with the new changes. Before we could use the Paladin's flash to help keep aggro. But in regards to people pulling let them pull and die. You are the tank. YOU decide what gets pulled. Accidents happen but obvious pulls are obvious. let them tank them. Don't worry yourself over it.

The Aggro list is your biggest tool. Always hit everything esp as a Warrior. I do understand PS4 targeting sucks, I used to play on it as well. It takes practice to get well. You do not suck. I think you just need more practice. Which is OK. So keep practicing. Also, take advantage of hooking up a mouse or using the touch pad to click on an enemy if you can't seem to target it through cycling. That helped me alot when I started before I got used to the PS4 targeting insanity.

Also people who abandon because youre new, youre better off without them anyways.

Add me in Lamia and I can help out if you'd like :D at least I'll never abandon you! ^.^ And I love running dungeons constantly, which I think is the best way to learn. :D

There are guides floating around the internet with rotations for Warrior that help. But the biggest thing that helped me was running dungeons alot, both with friends and randoms. Sometimes the best way to learn and try things out, is just by doing. Also I have this friend who is an insane aggro stealing BLM to help me learn how to hold aggro, not by choice..... >.>

I'm still learning the trade myself, so I won't try to offer you advice on the mechanics of tanking, but I'll say that if people get attitudes and leave look at it as a positive. You don't have to put up with their crap anymore, and they're really just hurting themselves. It's like a kid who refuses to eat because he didn't get his way. It's not mom and dad who are going to be hungry later, just like you're not the one who's going to be stuck in a lengthy lockout or queue. What they've done is a reflection on their own personality flaws, not your tanking skill.

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Originally Posted by Guolstyrm

I've had the game now for nearly 30 days. FFXIV is my first MMO and I chose tank because it appealed to me the most. I've thoroughly enjoyed the game thus far, but recently I've hit my first real bump in the road.

I think I may suck at tanking. This wasn't an issue until I hit the lvl 40+ content.
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The issue wit warrior is that it attacks n a cone shape, while the others do not, if the prob continues Id try pali see how you like them dont give up and always be ok with accepting advice

I think the best advice would be to keep at it. With more practice you will get better. As far as rotations there are some good guides on youtube. Really you can never go wrong in hitting overpower a few times in the mobs you are trying to control. Also steel cylcone is a good ability to use for controlling hate on groups.

I'm on ps4 as well if you press L1 + O it will change your targeting to Enemies only and then using left and right on the d-pad will not Target your allies. The way that I switch though is if you're holding R2 or L2 you can use R1 and L1 to cycle through your enemies. Try and watch whatever enemy has the least amount of health because that's the one that's most likely going to get ripped off you unless you see you clearly have enmity just cycle through and see if any are close to being ripped off

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Originally Posted by AlisonDilaurentis

Try and watch whatever enemy has the least amount of health because that's the one that's most likely going to get ripped off you unless you see you clearly have enmity just cycle through and see if any are close to being ripped off

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I want to add to this, ones with most amount of health is usually ripped off by healers. Least amount of health, dps.

Thanks for the replies, guys. :3 Just felt a little discouraged this morning for whatever reason so I appreciate the words and advice.

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Originally Posted by silverlunarfox

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Hey, another Lamia person. ^_^ I'll def add you! Probably be the end of next week since I'll be out of town soon. I will try to find some newer 4.0 guides online! I might try the mouse method...I hadn't thought of that.

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Originally Posted by Camiie

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You're no doubt right. I'm sure that the dungeon runs are better off without people who would abandon just because of a newbie. Still kind of a sucky feeling.

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Originally Posted by mrt617

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I actually just unlocked Steel Cyclone yesterday so I need to play around with it and see if it helps. It looks very useful for larger mobs since it's not cone shaped.

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Originally Posted by AlisonDilaurentis

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Thanks for that tip about targeting especially! I had no idea. That should help A LOT.

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Originally Posted by Guolstyrm

Thanks for the replies, guys. :3 Just felt a little discouraged this morning for whatever reason so I appreciate the words and advice.


Hey, another Lamia person. ^_^ I'll def add you! Probably be the end of next week since I'll be out of town soon. I will try to find some newer 4.0 guides online! I might try the mouse method...I hadn't thought of that.

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I am on nights and weekends typically! ^.^ if you use discord you can find me there too at Loki#0140.

Also that mouse method was a life saver esp for rolling on items quickly. I had hooked up a keyboard/mouse wirelessly to the PS4 and didnt think I'd use the mouse, but it worked better than I thought it would.

I'm not a tank, but I did used to heal on console and what I learned quick was also the fact that I can target party members by hitting up and down on the d-pad while targeting enemies with left and right. It might be a thing I set up and forgot about in Character Config, because it does have a targeting thing somewhere in there so I'd take a glance at that if you want. =D

Also a PS4 player here. A long time ago in my character configuration changed to my target cycle filters when my weapon is drawn. I only target enemies, objects and NPCs. Thus, my left and right D-pad 99% is only cycling through enemies.

Overpower is your biggest friend :)

When I play with newer tanks as a regen-based healer, what I often find is that they will tag all of the enemies once (or worse, aggro them by running at them but not actually hit them with their enmity skills) and expect everyone to attack the main target together in an organised strike. That means that as soon as I start healing the tank (or an AoE job starts using area attacks), the aggro from that will rip the rest of the enemies straight off the tank and they'll run at me, causing a lot of stress for the tank (if they notice) or for me (if they don't).

When enemies appear mid-fight, they won't go on your aggro display until you have hit them with something which is a bit annoying. The healer will generally notice them right away because they'll passively aggro them just through healing - so you need to keep an eye on this and prepare to intercept. A couple of Overpowers should pick them up and then you can keep an eye on the additional enemies normally.

But in general, if people leave as soon as they hear you're new they're just jerks. Let them go. It's not your fault they have attitudes, and the fact that you're taking your performance so seriously shows that you have what it takes to be a really good tank.

Hey,

I believe warrior is the best tanking class right now (besides meta calling paladin and dark knight), but thats my call.

You can get group aggro pretty simple, you just need the right positioning. Optimally, the best thing to do would be to dictate kill order using the marks panel.

Overpower is a cone in front of you, so your best bet is to line all of the mobs first, and overpower then once or twice. After that, you'll have all enemy emnity in you. Now you need to pick the lower health mob around, which is the one that your DPSes are attacking.

Use your one target combo to keep emnity on that target until it dies. If you keel like it, use overpower once after two one target combo.

The rest is up to you. Put your personality in it, and you'll be your type of tanker.


Have this guide for you, shall it be useful. Skill names and some other stuff have changed since it was first created, but the basics should get you covered big time.

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Originally Posted by Guolstyrm

I play on the PS4 and I have trouble cycling through the enemies as well - sometimes I end up inadvertently targeting an ally and can't target the enemy I want quickly.

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I'll leave it to others more experienced at tanking to give you Warrior advice, but I can at least offer some about targeting. If your controller is set to the mode where you have to hold R2 or L2 to activate the crossbar (which I think is the default), that frees up the D-pad (without R2 or L2) for targeting:

Up/Down cycles through the party list (which is more helpful for healers), but L1 + Up/Down cycles through the enemy aggro list, which is generally where you'll see which mob just got pulled off of you, so that's really useful while tanking.

Left/Right cycles through targets in front of you according to whichever filter is currently active. This is where it can help to do a bit of setup ahead of time in:
Character Configuration -> Control Settings -> Filters
This tab has two sections, Target Filter Settings, where you can select "Enable Target Cycling", and Filter Customization where you can select "Enable Customization". The first of those will automatically change your filter between two settings whenever you draw or sheathe your weapon. The later will let you change it manually to any of four settings by pressing L1 + any of the four right side buttons of the controller. You should choose one of those two patterns, enable it, and disable the other, since with both enabled they can interfere with each other.

(Personally, I like the Filter Customization that gives me four filters and manual control over switching between them. That extra control is especially helpful for healers or those who alternate between multiple jobs so don't always want the same type of targets during combat. If you plan to stick more exclusively to tanking, then maybe the weapon drawn/sheathed pattern would be enough.)

Whichever type of filter switching you choose, you can then set up what you want the filters themselves to include or not include. Each of the two or four filters has a set of checkboxes where you can select what type of targets you want left/right to cycle between, or there are some named presets like "Friends", "Enemies", or "All" to quickly set some of the most popular combinations. (Another advantage of the named presets: your current filter name is shown just above your character's HP Bar. Filters with any of those named presets will display that name. Any other combination of checkboxes will display as "Custom", which can get confusing if you have two or more customized filters.)

Basically, after all that, as a tank during combat you're usually going to want your filter to be set to "Enemies" mode. That way, your left and right buttons will only cycle between mobs and not be inadvertently targeting your allies.

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Originally Posted by Serilda

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Yeah, that bit about enemies not showing up in the list until they've been hit threw me off at first. There has been a couple of times I thought I had everything under control and then suddenly see two enemies not on the list.

I've been using overpower quite judiciously. Haha. ^_^ My strategy is usually to run through the middle of the mob and use overpower twice and then single targets from there. Thanks for the healing aggro info because that is exactly who reinforcements go after first! Now I know why.

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Originally Posted by mtPrimo

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Thanks for the advice and the guide! I'm a more visual kind of person so that helps a lot! :D

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Originally Posted by Niwashi

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Thanks so much for that detailed explanation! I am definitely going to play with those setting later tonight! That will definitely help with some of my targeting woes, especially when it's kind of chaotic and hard to tell who you're actually targeting.

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Originally Posted by silverlunarfox

But in regards to people pulling let them pull and die. You are the tank. YOU decide what gets pulled. Accidents happen but obvious pulls are obvious. let them tank them. Don't worry yourself over it.

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This is at once both good and bad advice. Your job, like anyone else's, is to speed up the run. You have sacrificed raw potency, including the tremendous potencies of curative magics, to do that—through added mitigation and enmity. As a tank, you shouldn't be thinking narrowly about who does what, but rather what the team can accomplish in particular windows, based on their toolkits, and how short you can make the run as a result. Never play games of pride around some preconception of your "role". Your role is your toolkit—no more, no less. Sadly, figuring out what to best do with that toolkit, given the varying behaviors of your surrounding members, requires an incredible amount of game (and almost sociotypical) knowledge. As a tank, you are in by far the best position to make calls of pace and pull size. You waste time at any point you stop to talk about this and in most cases where you might let the DPS pull. Because face pulling does have very real value, you want to be the first thing enemies see. It will compensate in the situations where you're unable gather all at once without diverting from the quickest path to the gather destination (or, say, without sacrificing valuable MP, TP, or a bit of uptime better spent after the gather). That's not to say that DPS or healers can't, or absolutely shouldn't, pull, but if or when they do, they'd best be thinking in terms of ease of gather and facilitation of uptime, same as you would. A healer might Regen both you and theirselves, and hang just far enough behind you to gather mobs through your Flash or Unleash, or run ahead with a Swiftcast Holy at the ready to hold everything at bay while you easily supply your enmity and their Regen and Asylum (placed in the GCD gap) tick them back to full.

As for pulling in the sense of ripping hate, try not to let it happen whenever there's no advantage for the team. (Easier said than done, I know.) See who's hitting what. If they're single-target direct-damaging separate enemies, mark, and insist, so long as it doesn't take so long typing these things out as to contradict the only point you'll have—that "it's faster" this way. Such times will include pulling for the next AoE while a mobile DPS finishes off the last enemy, now on them, when a Monk needs uptime for their Greased Lightning mechanic, and probably some ten other things that will escape me until I'm tanking for their relevant compositions.

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tl;dr: Think like a strategist. Role is your toolkit. You're generally the pack leader; the responsibilities ought to bury whatever pride you'd feel in that position. I'd also suggest you try out a couple different DPS when time allows and try to perfect your gameplay on those. Tanking starts to make a lot more sense, especially when you're DPS are fighting in a logical manner, once you know who you're tanking for.

Also, hopefully the Overpower and Skull Sunder enmity buffs will have helped.

Note: I have no tank leveled yet, so im merely passing along what ive heard - any mistakes are my own. Couple tips i didnt notice anyone mention but that ive heard really help. Use your tank stance, do your tomahawk, do your overpower, overpower more then once if in doubt. Once you get to the combo portion of your rotation, it can help to switch targets in between hits so that you get enmity boosts on more then once target. Should help multi-target pulls go smoother with an AoE heavy party. And when dodging big telegraphed attacks from bosses(or whatever), they tend to hold still while winding up. Once the AoE marker on the ground disappears its usually safe to move back into that spot, which makes the boss move and rotate less which makes it easier for your melee friends to stay in the correct position to do their best damage.

Always pull the group size you feel comfortable with. Never let others tell you how many you should pull.

As added info to the person who posted about speeding up the dungeon; that only applies to older dungeons like the HW and below ones. The SB ones actually have every trash mob hit harder than before so you have to be more careful than you usually would.

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Originally Posted by Guolstyrm

In some of the 40+ dungeons, I've had other players get irritated with me because I pull smaller groups, slowing the content down.

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Just don't care about them. Better safe than sorry.
And as a main tank I walk slowly and clear path in order to avoid backups.
And I like my healer to be rested and calm in a full mana.

But maybe this because of some years as a healer in WoW.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Your job, like anyone else's, is to speed up the run.

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Undergeared tank receive a huge amount of damage after sastasha.
And even with my crafted HQ gear up to level I don't like to aggro everything.

You need to learn proper positioning for overpower. In big pulls watch the health of the enemy, if you see one that's getting lower faster then the other then most likely someone is using single target dmg on that one. If that's the case use your enmity combo on that target. Sometime when both of your dps is doing single target to multiple targets you might have to use skull sunder on one and butcher's on the other one. That's the getto way but do what you got to do.

Focus on keeping enmity once you got that down. Work on proper position of yourself the monsters and bosses in a way that your party can dps and heal comfortably. Then work on your dps rotations and optimise.

Paladin is a good stepping stone, you are not very far in to the game yet so it's not too late to do the switch

It's always important to know the basic before taking on more complex job that you are unable to handle

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Originally Posted by Silingfasi

Undergeared tank receive a huge amount of damage after sastasha.
And even with my crafted HQ gear up to level I don't like to aggro everything.

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I remember getting my butt kicked when I first tanked stone vilge and Wearing full set level 40+ armor HQ and I get shredded to pieces lol

No advice for you on aggro especially knowing Maurader can't use flash now(i havent played in over a year), but i usedto play on PS4 as well. And cycling through enemies with the D-pad made it much easier to select an exact target rather than having to mouseover+click an enemy(especially when they overlap). Thats the one feature i do miss about PS4.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Your job, like anyone else's, is to speed up the run.

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False.

You have no obligation to speed up a run. Especially if undergeared or with a lack of confidence in party and self.

With the constant AOE nerfs in DPS damage, it falls in line with Yoshi's thinking in this as well, whether we agree with it or not.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

This is at once both good and bad advice. Your job, like anyone else's, is to speed up the run. .

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Originally Posted by silverlunarfox

False.

You have no obligation to speed up a run. Especially if undergeared or with a lack of confidence in party and self.

With the constant AOE nerfs in DPS damage, it falls in line with Yoshi's thinking in this as well, whether we agree with it or not.

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Double False As a tank it is your job gauge your party, to ask if big pulls are ok, and if the healer is ok with it. While speeding the run is always a plus unable to gauge your group would make you a poor tank. If people complain they can atleast state their case, however everyone needs to work as a team and communication is the key. DPS and healers should at a minimum gauge their tank after the first set full pull has been done and ata minimum try to make the tanks job easier and attack one main target or at a minimum understand how the enmity bar works, healers should know the basic of not casting while pulling and not have regen dots active.

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Originally Posted by ManuelBravo

False also it helps, as a tank it is your job gauge your party, to ask if big pulls are ok, and if the healer is ok with it. While speeding the run is always a plus unable to gauge your group would make you a poor tank.

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Which is where confidence comes into play. It is not your job to speed anything up. Not one bit. If a tank wants to pull slow when I heal, so be it. I speak from a tank and healer main perspective. Also as a DPS things will die just as fast pulled small or large if you know what you're doing.

But for sake of argument, I leave this to the OP and happily bump his post for other constructive input in aggro holding.

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Originally Posted by silverlunarfox

Which is where confidence comes into play. It is not your job to speed anything up. Not one bit. If a tank wants to pull slow when I heal, so be it. I speak from a tank and healer main perspective. Also as a DPS things will die just as fast pulled small or large if you know what you're doing.

But for sake of argument, I leave this to the OP and happily bump his post for other constructive input in aggro holding.

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It's not a matter of confidence, people have lag, are under gear, are sprouts, first time runners ect. Unless they have been farming gear, mounts , ect they need to build up confidence. Remember not everyone is a hardcore gamer or have have the self esteem to take a chance. Deepening on which tank you go as they have different ways to grab enmity. Some are harder than others, have limitations, ect.

a useful tip to practice getting agro on a group, use tomahawk, this will agro everything to run at you, run through the pack turn around and use overpower. because its a cone with you being the point positioning is key. once you get steal cyclone that can help as its a circle aoe like flash, and looks cool to use lol

FYI, I am still reading all of these but I am currently on vacation! I tried several of the suggestions here before I left, and the targeting advice helped tremendously in selecting enemies only.

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Originally Posted by silverlunarfox

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Hey, if you noticed a random add on discord last week, it was me. :3

I play on a PC and keybound the number marks by dragging them to the action bar. I also made Provoke a mouseover, so that I didn't have to drop my current target until the loose mob is within punching distance. I'm not the best tank or the fastest, but these little things made my job so much easier.

Well keeping aggro on WAR is bit challenging because TP is everything for a WAR. Let assume that you are using the optimum gear at lv 40 range. The best advice I can give is to Tomahawk, overpower x2, heavy swing, skull sunder (2nd target), butcher's block (3rd target),the point is to alternate your enmity combo amongst all targets. If you are not sure if you hold aggro or not just use Overpower. At lv45 you get Steel Cyclone. So you start with Infuriate, Steel Cyclone, Overpower, the rest are focus on building gauge in order to Steel cyclone or use inner beast. Hope this help in a way .

When you pull a mob and more follow, as they run to you hit the first one with overpower. This should hit all the mobs following. Also as for role actions, the ones you put in the bar at bottom first you get at earlier levels. So make sure you have provoke and ultimatum in first spots.