In Combat ilvl Check

There's been plenty of shenanigans involving people swapping out gear to a lower ilvl than what would normally be expected for an instance in the past, but when it comes to tanks (especially those doing this in pub groups) it brings an entirely new risk as a tank will suddenly become a lot squishier than a healer was expecting them to be.

What I'd like SE to do to fix this is do a check once combat starts for any players that are below the ilvl of the instance. If a player is below the ilvl of the instance, they are immediately booted from the instance with a one hour instance lockout.

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Originally Posted by Almagnus1

There's been plenty of shenanigans involving people swapping out gear to a lower ilvl than what would normally be expected for an instance in the past, but when it comes to tanks (especially those doing this in pub groups) it brings an entirely new risk as a tank will suddenly become a lot squishier than a healer was expecting them to be.

What I'd like SE to do to fix this is do a check once combat starts for any players that are below the ilvl of the instance. If a player is below the ilvl of the instance, they are immediately booted from the instance with a one hour instance lockout.

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And if it is a tank, which seems to be your main argument, then all the DPS have yet another long que timer to sit through instead of just trying to beat the thing they are on now.

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Originally Posted by Maku

And if it is a tank, which seems to be your main argument, then all the DPS have yet another long que timer to sit through instead of just trying to beat the thing they are on now.

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Being able to run an instance below the required ilvl by swapping in gear after the start of the instance is an exploit of the game systems, and probably should get players banned.

I know that sucks pretty badly for non-tanks if their tank is doing that kind of shenanigans, but that's also the example that's still fresh in everyone's mind.

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Originally Posted by Almagnus1

I know that sucks pretty badly for non-tanks if their tank is doing that kind of shenanigans, but that's also the example that's still fresh in everyone's mind.

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Honestly, the only thing I can think of in that regard are the STR accessories, which should be fine for every semi-competent healer, as the accessories don't affect how much damage you take (No defense on them and tenacity is completely negligible) and nothing hits hard enough to one-shot tanks wearing them.

I mean, I can understand it if someone is just randomly using gatherer equip, or switches his left side to level 50 stuff in expert or something, but that's about the extent to which I can see the issue here. And that, uh... hasn't happened to me, yet. And if it would, I'd probably just initiate a votekick.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

Honestly, the only thing I can think of in that regard are the STR accessories, which should be fine for every semi-competent healer, as the accessories don't affect how much damage you take (No defense on them and tenacity is completely negligible) and nothing hits hard enough to one-shot tanks wearing them.

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The issue isn't the healers ability to cover for it - it's still an exploit.

It's also a bad reason to say an exploit is "ok".

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Originally Posted by Zojha

I mean, I can understand it if someone is just randomly using gatherer equip, or switches his left side to level 50 stuff in expert or something, but that's about the extent to which I can see the issue here. And that, uh... hasn't happened to me, yet. And if it would, I'd probably just initiate a votekick.

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Why should we wait to deal with an exploit before it affects you?

Losing 25% of 50% when you only have 90% of the total attack power anyway isn't all that different from just losing 25% of 100%.

Vitality doesn't change the HPS you need to live, Strength doesn't change the Damage you're taking.

It seems like if you (and your group) have an issue with it there is already a tool in place. Can't you just vote kick? Then if the other members are ok with the ilvl they can still finish. I'm more in favor of giving the other part members the option, rather than auto-boot the tank and end the run all together.

And yet, dropping below the minimum ilvl intentionally for any reason can be considered to be in breach of http://support.na.square-enix.com/ru...2&tag=users_en

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2.1 Cheating and Botting. You may not create or use any unauthorized cheats, bots, automation software, hacks, mods or any other unauthorized software or hardware designed to modify the Game and gameplay. In addition, you may not take advantage of game system bugs and exploits during gameplay.

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So the better question is would the tank rather get banned for being reported for cheating, or would the group go without the tank and have a bad run?

It's a bad situation either way, but I'd rather have failed instances than have salty healers start getting tanks banned for exploiting.

There is a very valid reason to drop below min item level during a duty: Broken gear. People forget to repair at times after all :P
Further, it is possible that you have lower ilvl gear that is actually better than something that meets the minimum item level, for example you can try to get in something with normal quality crafted gear, and then switch to something HQ of a lower ilvl, that has superior stats.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

Honestly, the only thing I can think of in that regard are the STR accessories, which should be fine for every semi-competent healer, as the accessories don't affect how much damage you take (No defense on them and tenacity is completely negligible) and nothing hits hard enough to one-shot tanks wearing them.

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Tell that to most STR tanks dropping by 10k HP and thinking they can tank susano Ex without problem. They're dead on pull before you know it because Susano Ex unannounced buster in P1 just deals enough damage with the following AA to wreck any non full-VIT tank. It's an other story in raid groups who know each other and can coordinate better (rotating tank CDs and provoke after 2nd buster in susano's case to prevent retarded death as an example, + it gives more hate generation with shirk shenanigans), but in DF/PF/RF gimping yourself that much is just a big fat NO.

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Originally Posted by Almagnus1

There's been plenty of shenanigans involving people swapping out gear to a lower ilvl than what would normally be expected for an instance in the past, but when it comes to tanks (especially those doing this in pub groups) it brings an entirely new risk as a tank will suddenly become a lot squishier than a healer was expecting them to be.

What I'd like SE to do to fix this is do a check once combat starts for any players that are below the ilvl of the instance. If a player is below the ilvl of the instance, they are immediately booted from the instance with a one hour instance lockout.

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A hour is abit long but if all tank gear now includea accesories are role locked then why change from a higher iLV tank gear to a lower itLV tank gear?

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Originally Posted by Martin_Arcainess

A hour is abit long but if all tank gear now includea accesories are role locked then why change from a higher iLV tank gear to a lower itLV tank gear?

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accessories from 3.0 aren't locked. Which means tanks are trading 10k HP for 300 dps.

Tanks with lower ilvl are now more 'squishy' than before, in the sense that they take the same damage as they do with other accessories. i270 str gear lowers their max health, which is still more than enough to take any boss mechanic and dungeons comfortably as long as the healer does not want to afk for half of the pull. Every tank buster in Lak EX and Sas can be taken and still have over half of your hp available without trouble if you understand how to use your cooldowns as a tank.


The issue right now is SE is penalizing what is already the rarest role to fill by making the only benefit we get out of right sides as more healer insurance that does not at all help us do our jobs (hold emnity and pop cds for appropriate mechanics). STR helps dps 'dps', Mind helps healers 'mind', but Vit does not help us actually tank as no source of damage in 4.0 so far even begins to threaten a pool of 40K hp let alone 50K hp. And if future content does, then it does not begin to address the massive emnity issues this raises. Every ilvl tier, dps and healers will have 9 items increasing their generation of emnity while tanks will only have 5. What is the solution then? Keep bandaiding our emnity generating combos to generate more and more emnity while putting us in a position where we are spamming those combos and ignoring the interesting side of our classes and the rest of our mechanics? Or make the ninja a 100% necessary part of every raid team (just another type of band aid).

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Originally Posted by Kuwagami

accessories from 3.0 aren't locked. Which means tanks are trading 10k HP for 300 dps.

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300 dps or 480 ish emnity in tank stances. Tanks need this *now* to keep up with the best dps' emnity in high end groups. Imagine a few patches in when dps have 330 or 340 accessories and tanks still generate no additional dps/emnity from our right side? DK's, Wars and PLD's will be spamming our emnity combo more or less exclusively and ignoring the rest of our class mechanics. Great design square enix!