Bloodspiller should be an oGCD.

It doesn't really seem all that powerful as a GCD. It's usage is a very minor dps increase because of the way our kits work, and because it delays our regular combo it might not even be worth it in some situations depending on if you need MP for burst windows.

As it stands, bloodspiller feels like a replacement for scourge that does less damage per button press but happens more frequently.

We also lost Low Blows and Reprisals which added to the speed/responsive feel of playing DRK, and the increased cost of dark passenger makes it not spending mana on during single target, making us lose another oGCD.

The class will feel extremely boring.

But as an oGCD, you could do some interesting things. It could be banked for burst windows without much detriment.

Damage can always be tuned so that this wouldn't be op but I've always enjoyed the speed at which dark knight was played, with all it's oGCDs. The immense slowdown just increases the similarity we have to 3.0's paladin.

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Originally Posted by BlackironTarkus

As it stands, bloodspiller feels like a replacement for scourge that does less damage per button press but happens more frequently.

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Bloodspiller is our Fell-Cleave-that-works-even-in-Grit :p

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Bloodspiller is our Fell-Cleave-that-works-even-in-Grit :p

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I really hope you're kidding...but I didn't see the "/s"

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Originally Posted by Decederes

I really hope you're kidding...but I didn't see the "/s"

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How would you call a 500+ potency GCD that cost 50 of our specific job gauge ?

From what we know, I'd say leave BS/Q on GCD but add Delirium's BP/BW duration extension to them. Also..

..Reduce Delirium's MP restore and remove recast, rename Blood Price to Dread Spikes and buff it so it has a built in damage reflect (30% chance to inflict 75 potency counter), add 20second +20 evasion to DA'Dark Mind, introduce the new UI gauge @ lvl45 (at least part of it) & have it provide a visual representation for stacks of Dark Arts (let DRK stack up to 3).

Buff the Dark Arts enmity effect of Power Slash, or +140 potency (seems to be the DA motto of SB), or change it to a DoT - something anything to make it viable. Change Souleater absorb so it doesn't require Grit, but in Grit the amount of health restored increases with the lower the DRK's HP (up to 2x the amount of damage dealt). Replace Blackest Night with Doom Spikes, thematically the same skill, but with guaranteed 75 potency damage counter on each hit received while barrier is still up. Trait for Salted Earth that adds a 30% chance to reset bubble's duration every time Dark Arts is used.

I'll believe Sole Survivor has TA utility when I see it. Danced to this tune before, not getting fooled again.

whew got that out of my system.

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Originally Posted by Decederes

I really hope you're kidding...but I didn't see the "/s"

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That's literally what it is. it's a high damage ability that costs resources and ignores damage debuffs from the tank stance.

EDIT: I'm an idiot, thought TDN was on the GCD lol
While I would enjoy it off the GCD, I would accept it as a GCD, due to being able to blow 2 in a row for bursts.

But The Blackest Night really needs to be oGCD, as it stands, it "almost" removes the DPS loss by giving 50 blood, but is a DPS loss, making BS feel less like a spike in dmg, but rather a means to play catch up after using TBN.
(Either oGCD, which is cooler, less MP cost by a small %, or give extra blood, like 5-10 more.)

EDIT: Dark Passenger might now cost as much as a Dark Arts, but Dark Arts only grants +140 potency to ther 3 GCDs.
Dark Passenger will grant a 150 potency attack. (w/o DA if i remember correctly, and 240 with DA, making it a +90 potency with DA, being the most useless outside of AoE)

So its technically still worth using when its up, and has higher priority to use the MP for it over the GCDs.
Only Carve and Spit is the higher priority over Dark Passenger, having a +350 potency from DA.

EDIT: actually, in 8man, with slashing debuff, GCDs are worth the DA more than dark passenger. save it for AoE or bursts.

Aside when you have slashing debuff

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Originally Posted by Bhearil

Aside when you have slashing debuff

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Ah, good point, I forgot about that. That does mean it gains lower priority.

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Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

Ah, good point, I forgot about that. That does mean it gains lower priority.

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Yeah, using it on GCD weapon skills nets +154 ish potency, not 150, assuming slashing is up. A small difference, though.

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Originally Posted by Claire_Pendragon

But The Blackest Night really needs to be oGCD, as it stands, it "almost" removes the DPS loss by giving 50 blood, but is a DPS loss, making BS feel less like a spike in dmg, but rather a means to play catch up after using TBN.
(Either oGCD, which is cooler, less MP cost by a small %, or give extra blood, like 5-10 more.)

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Where are you getting that The Blackest Night is GCD? Its a Instant Ability (not Weaponskill or Spell) on a 15s recast with a cost of 2400 MP at 70.

If the strength of Bloodsplitter is that it ignores the damage penalty from Grit, it's worth noting that, at 30 lower potency, Inner Beast ignores the damage penalty of Defiance, gives you 20% damage reduction for 6 seconds, 100% self healing, and a back massage. Now, that's a bargain. Outside of defensive stance, there's not really a comparison when you look at things like Holy Spirit or Fell Cleave. It's probably meant to be used more frequently, but at a lower potency.

I think DRK is going to be more difficult to balance, simply because of the way that it generates resources. Of the five methods of blood generation, three ramp up very quickly with more mobs present. So tuning the single target resource generation can throw off the resource generation in AoE, and vice versa.

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Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur

Where are you getting that The Blackest Night is GCD? Its a Instant Ability (not Weaponskill or Spell) on a 15s recast with a cost of 2400 MP at 70.

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Honestly havent found a good spot to check on the abilities, so ive been going off of memory.
But now that you mention it, I've been doing calculations with it being oGCD, while claiming its GCD. I'm an idiot lol.
but thanks for pointing that out for me.

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Originally Posted by Lyth

If the strength of Bloodsplitter is that it ignores the damage penalty from Grit, it's worth noting that, at 30 lower potency, Inner Beast ignores the damage penalty of Defiance, gives you 20% damage reduction for 6 seconds, 100% self healing, and a back massage. Now, that's a bargain. Outside of defensive stance, there's not really a comparison when you look at things like Holy Spirit or Fell Cleave. It's probably meant to be used more frequently, but at a lower potency.

I think DRK is going to be more difficult to balance, simply because of the way that it generates resources. Of the five methods of blood generation, three ramp up very quickly with more mobs present. So tuning the single target resource generation can throw off the resource generation in AoE, and vice versa.

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I dont think blood price should have affected it, despite being labeled a "blood" ability.
TDN should have been the main means to gain it in tank stance, and in case its not, be built up before each pull, to have the gauge up for starting AoEs.

You get about 40 Blood every 30 seconds from Souleater spam alone. Thats 80 per minute...
If you get 14-15 procs in BW thats 42-45 more, or roughly 132 every 2 minutes, we'll say an average of 66 per minute, about 150-159 factoring in Delirium's effect.
Salted Earth is an average of about 9.1 per minute, about 18ish over 2 minutes.
-50 for Delirium's use...

Just using some napkin math, you can use Bloodspiller at least 5 times per minute before even touching TBN, and that's after using Delirium, and tank swapping has zero effect on its usage. I'm fine with it being on the GCD. If you use TBN conservatively (say once every 30s) while OTing, that's 9 Blood spillers over 2 minutes which is around how many Fell Cleaves and Holy Spirits WAR/PLD will get in the same amount of time (considering WAR wants to save its gauge for zerk windows). Honestly its not too bad. I'm far more annoyed that they removed Scourge instead of simply putting it where Delirium used to be.

Does salted earth give ticks of blood based on how many enemies it is damaging, or is it simply a flat amount that you get regardless of how many enemies it hits?

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Originally Posted by whiteblade89

Does salted earth give ticks of blood based on how many enemies it is damaging, or is it simply a flat amount that you get regardless of how many enemies it hits?

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According to LaylaBell on Mogtalk #107, it depends on the number of enemies, but it still can change.
On a sidenote, he also said that Blackest Night gives 50 blood even if the shield is not destroyed.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

According to LaylaBell on Mogtalk #107, it depends on the number of enemies, but it still can change.
On a sidenote, he also said that Blackest Night gives 50 blood even if the shield is not destroyed.

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I would hope SE would at least be smart enough to make it scale with the number of enemies. Anything less and it would kinda defeat the purpose of having it build blood at all. And TBN will just have to wait till we can see it with our own eyes. I'm remaining optimistic until early access.

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Originally Posted by whiteblade89

And TBN will just have to wait till we can see it with our own eyes. I'm remaining optimistic until early access.

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If it works that way, it's only stranger than WAR being able to pre-build Beast is such a huge deal that they made Infuriate useless outside of battle...

I feel that DRK and WAR are pretty well balanced right now actually. As long as SE dials back their ridiculous PLD-overtuning, things might actually have a happy ending.