Dps que times

I think they should add a 3rd dps slot to the party makeup in Stormblood. This would shorten que times and make it easier to carry low dps players.

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Originally Posted by bonez

.....and make it easier to carry low dps players.

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Uh, what?

Adding a 5th person to your party means they'd have to rescale the dungeons according to that as well.
Aka: adjust health amounts of packs and bosses.

Also you're assuming that this one extra dps slot is gonna be a GOOD dps player whos gonna carry the low dps players?
You do realize the odds are more in favor of having an ADDITIONAL low dps player who needs to be carried, right?

I can carry 2 bad dps fairly well with my healer dps...I dont know about 3.

Might pose an issue with older content that was tailored towards 4 players. And do we increase full parties from 10 to 8? That would likely pose some issues to the old raid content built around 24 players. Not to mention extremes. There's also the added stress on healers and tanks to consider, and it increases the likelihood for mistakes by players.

Its not a bad idea though. They would just have to go back and re-balance every dungeon. Imagine running them all with an extra DPS as they exist right now. Dungeons would be only in 5 minutes.

I was saying just stormblood content and only for the small party dungeons.

Because queue times aren't a problem in other games that have 5 man groups?

DPS queue times are not something that can or will change. They will always be longer. If the queue times were shorter, those who play tank or healer for the specific reason of shorter queues, would switch back to dps when the queues are acceptable to them and the queues would go back up. If you want shorter queue times, level one of each and be flexible. Don't expect a massive overhaul of party system that won't fix anything anyway.

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Originally Posted by bonez

I was saying just stormblood content and only for the small party dungeons.

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That's still a significant number of dungeons that would need to be re-balanced for 3 DPS instead of 2. However, its still not a bad idea.

I que war for dailys but I do want to level the new dos jobs and some older ones. Fate grinding is so boring.

So a tank and 3 DPS keeping themselves alive? Or a healer and 3 DPS with one of the DPS tanking?
I don't really see this working out for Light Party content, which is likely going to be the majority of "problematic" queues given that there's going to be two shiny new DPS classes to level through the SB story before people get to the Full Party content.

For Full Parties this might work but then I already see PF groups taking an additional DPS for content that can be healed or tanked solo so the only thing this would really effect is DF matchmaking.

Unless we see our parties getting expanded I think it highly unlikely they'd change the matchmaking.

Not sure if your serious. I said 3 rd dps spot not remove tank or healer.

running dungeons with more people sounds fun, but what isn't fun is if all the dps sucked nuts. as the first person says, everything will be upscaled so it makes carrying more harder :(

This would not help queue times at all i don't think.
People may very well just level in Palace of the Dead come Stormblood.

Study on a field that's known to have a high unemployment rate and then curse about being unemployed. End up demanding government to create more jobs on the said field instead of retraining on a field that has high employment rate. Optionally blame those studying in the employable field for stealing your job.

Woops, that was talking about Real Life.

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Originally Posted by Astrus

So a tank and 3 DPS keeping themselves alive? Or a healer and 3 DPS with one of the DPS tanking?
I don't really see this working out for Light Party content, which is likely going to be the majority of "problematic" queues given that there's going to be two shiny new DPS classes to level through the SB story before people get to the Full Party content.

For Full Parties this might work but then I already see PF groups taking an additional DPS for content that can be healed or tanked solo so the only thing this would really effect is DF matchmaking.

Unless we see our parties getting expanded I think it highly unlikely they'd change the matchmaking.

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No...

A a party with 5 slots. 1 tank, 1 healer, 3 dps.

This is what most other games have, and it wouldn't require all that much re-balancing like people say, it'd just require bosses to have 20% more health, if they even decided that they needed to adjust them since they're old content, and for dungeons with 4 things that people need to step in, they'd add a 5th one.

People who say it wouldn't help queue times don't understand math, and the actual proportions of tanks and healers to dps. It probably wouldn't shorten them to like 5 minute queues, but it'd be a more consistent wait time

This was at the last eorzea census

http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/tekitou_m...1/810b43c8.jpg

These proportions would favor a 1 tank, 1 healer, 3 dps composition. And it'll only get more skewed towards dps in stormblood with Samurai and Red Mage

I think its the other way, we need to encourage more players to play different roles and more DPS players to play Tanks or Healers. Adding a 3rd DPS spot to help with low damage will be pointless, if all 3 DPS players are doing low damage. We need to find a solution for our Tank shortage and DPS players that like to underpreform.

Other MMORPG's where you have 1 (Tank), 1 (Healer) and 3 (DPS), have already shown us that adding one more DPS wont do much.

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Originally Posted by Maero

This would not help queue times at all i don't think.
People may very well just level in Palace of the Dead come Stormblood.

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It would help queue times for populated content at least. The queue times arise from imbalances in the T:H: D ratio due to the overpopulation of DPS, which would be somewhat lessened by increasing the required number of DPS.

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Originally Posted by bonez

I think they should add a 3rd dps slot to the party makeup in Stormblood. This would shorten que times and make it easier to carry low dps players.

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tank life is the best life

Dunno in other servers, but got fair times with dps those days. About 15'.

Once I got an instapop and were thinking "omg I queued tank not my dps" but happened only once.

So in some other words, improving queue wait times by adding an additional DPS, which might need to be carried, even though the game isn't that hard. hmmm Even if new areas are a bit harder a four man team would still be ideal. I'm tired of having to carry DPS at times and an extra one would just be a pain. Besides queue wait times aren't that bad. Now you can have companion out and do something else while you wait.

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Originally Posted by Averax

No...

A a party with 5 slots. 1 tank, 1 healer, 3 dps.

This is what most other games have, and it wouldn't require all that much re-balancing like people say, it'd just require bosses to have 20% more health, if they even decided that they needed to adjust them since they're old content, and for dungeons with 4 things that people need to step in, they'd add a 5th one.

People who say it wouldn't help queue times don't understand math, and the actual proportions of tanks and healers to dps. It probably wouldn't shorten them to like 5 minute queues, but it'd be a more consistent wait time

This was at the last eorzea census


These proportions would favor a 1 tank, 1 healer, 3 dps composition. And it'll only get more skewed towards dps in stormblood with Samurai and Red Mage

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And yet in most other games you see the same suggestion despite them already having larger parties than our 4 man Light Party.
The minor impact a move to a 5 man composition would have wouldn't outweight the hassle of retooling the way the entire party system works.
On the EU datacenter, with joining in-progress enabled, I already have queue times averaging 7 minutes as a DPS main, unless I'm queueing outside of my server's prime time or for a specific content nobody likes doing via the DF, that obviously bumps things up. Adding a fifth party member to fit a third DPS would reduce that to what, 5 minutes? Four? Hardly worth the resources the change would take.
I'm actually used to queues of 45 minutes and more as a DPS in games with 5 man parties.

Now what I could see them doing is just foregoing Light Party content in the future and simply go with Full Parties for everything, even the leveling dungeons which would then be designed with that in mind from the start.
That would be really interesting to see and wouldn't require them to change the way Light Parties work in older content.

Queue times(for relevant content) aren't that bad and two new DPS won't change it nearly as much as people are browning their britches over. Healers and tanks get so nettled over there being two new DPS because they're gonna heal and tank- that means the base is largely going to be the same percentage as before, with a little dropoff as people try new classes. And that's gonna balance out after the initial rush anyway- people are always gonna play the role they like.

Working as intended.

I think something like this is a lot harder to do technically than people realise. The games grouping system is built around parties of 4 or multiples of 4. Ignoring the rebalancing issues involved, just from a coding perspective, simply increasing the number is probably a hell of a lot of work.

From a personal standpoint the idea doesn't appeal to me since I usually heal and more players means a higher chance of having to heal stupid. Healing mechanics is satisfying. Healing stupid is frustrating.

Its certainly something they wouldn't be able to do with just over a month till the expansion launches.

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Originally Posted by Laerune

I think its the other way, we need to encourage more players to play different roles and more DPS players to play Tanks or Healers.

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So, uh... why exactly should we encourage players to play a role they don't want to play in the first place?

I'd rather encourage people to play a different game instead. Quit subbing until SE has managed to find a way to allow you to play the job you want to play without large queue times. Blows to the wallet are the most effective when it comes to business.

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Originally Posted by ManuelBravo

So in some other words, improving queue wait times by adding an additional DPS, which might need to be carried, even though the game isn't that hard. hmmm Even if new areas are a bit harder a four man team would still be ideal. I'm tired of having to carry DPS at times and an extra one would just be a pain. Besides queue wait times aren't that bad. Now you can have companion out and do something else while you wait.

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Do what else tho alot of people have their jobs maxed or the jobs they are gona play maxed , your forced to do the story to get to the good stuff in the game its literally nothing else to do but sit around and wait on that 20 min que or ask your friends to save you.

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Originally Posted by bonez

I think they should add a 3rd dps slot to the party makeup in Stormblood. This would shorten que times and make it easier to carry low dps players.

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This would require the entire game to be re-balanced, which is why it will not happen.

Supply and demand. In general, people like to play DPS more than Healers or Tanks because things in society like TV, Movies, Literature, and other games ingrain in our minds that it's cooler/stylish to be offensive rather than supportive or defensive. Main characters are rarely a healer or a defender, they're usually running into the thick of battle and killing dragons or severing heads. Being a DPS feels like you're affecting the enemy's death directly. So, psychologically, players of video games almost always want to be a DPS character. Devil May Cry's main character has 2 guns and a big sword. How lame would it be if you just played as a Healer and you run around healing Dante instead of BEING Dante? Exactly. Blame psychology and social reinforcement for your long DPS queues. Or, play outside of the mold by playing a healer or tank and enjoy fast queues.

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Originally Posted by Jonnycbad

role assumptions

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I actually play MCH and MNK because I like fast and frenetic combat styles. I also play WAR, but I only do it for friends because I find them too slow for my tastes. It's not about "I wanna do the KILLING BLOOD BLOOD BLOOD" or whatever, it's about comfort in what I'm playing. Give me a tank with a bunch of OGCDs and a skill speed of more than wading through mud, and we'll get along fine.

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Originally Posted by bswpayton

Do what else tho alot of people have their jobs maxed or the jobs they are gona play maxed , your forced to do the story to get to the good stuff in the game its literally nothing else to do but sit around and wait on that 20 min que or ask your friends to save you.

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Could Join a Tanking community LS. and there is always something to do. Card Games, relic items ( sells nicely ), Find missing logs, Gold Saucer ( some events ) Scouting the Market board, Raise your companion ( If not maxed ) Workshop, Gardening, ect
Most of my Jobs are 60 and focus on getting all relics so I always have plenty to do. Let's face it NOT too many players have it all at 60 or to their full potential.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

So, uh... why exactly should we encourage players to play a role they don't want to play in the first place?

I'd rather encourage people to play a different game instead. Quit subbing until SE has managed to find a way to allow you to play the job you want to play without large queue times. Blows to the wallet are the most effective when it comes to business.

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It's not SE's fault that you want to join a saturated market...

If you want to be in demand, go for something that's in demand.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

So, uh... why exactly should we encourage players to play a role they don't want to play in the first place?

I'd rather encourage people to play a different game instead. Quit subbing until SE has managed to find a way to allow you to play the job you want to play without large queue times. Blows to the wallet are the most effective when it comes to business.

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It's not SE fault players are mentally challenged for other roles. They aren't forcing anyone and you can play as you like. However encouraging other players to play something else is plain tacky. It's call a game, a new role is a new challenge to some. If you know how roles work they help you become a better player being you have an insight on how they work. Hence can help you make tank or healers job easier. Not for everyone but hey, I found it challenging and now I love tanking as an alt :P. You're a well rounded player, it seems so I'm surprised. Maybe work on your DoH or DoL while waiting?

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Originally Posted by Sida

Study on a field that's known to have a high unemployment rate and then curse about being unemployed. End up demanding government to create more jobs on the said field instead of retraining on a field that has high employment rate. Optionally blame those studying in the employable field for stealing your job.

Woops, that was talking about Real Life.

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They think it's bad now...

https://i.warosu.org/data/lit/img/00...4905334537.gif

Adding a 5th slot wouldn't change anything. I played all three roles in WoW, where the group is 1 tank, 1 heal, 3 DPS, and the queue times were exactly like they are in FF14. Tanks pop instantly, healers almost instantly, DPS wait 5-20 minutes.

Nobody wants to tank/heal and take abuse from the playerbase, which they will, when things go wrong, which they always do. That's why DPS queues always suck.

If you don't like DPS queue times, then play a tank or a healer. And if you won't be a tank or healer, ask yourself why not. The answer is likely the same or very similar for the vast majority of the playerbase.

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Originally Posted by bonez

I think they should add a 3rd dps slot to the party makeup in Stormblood. This would shorten que times and make it easier to carry low dps players.

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I can't take this seriously. I'm sorry, I just can't

I only like playing Tank personally. I don't think dps is fun to play not sure why so many people play it. When I was leveling my dps jobs to 60 I was like I wish I could be playing tank.

Two ways to fix this. Find a friend that plans to tank the start of SB. Second there was an LS I was in at the start of HW of motivated players and it was easy to toss in there need a what ever job for running X dungeon and there would always turn out to be a bunch of people would need it. It worked well and we got to 60 really fast. I doubt I used the df once on my first job to 60 as a sch.

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Originally Posted by ManuelBravo

It's not SE fault players are mentally challenged for other roles.....

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I don't think it's that they are mentally challenged for other roles per say. It's just that the ones playing tanks and healers are way more noticeable. The party being dead (which is what you get with bad tank/heals) is a whole lot more likely to get someones attention than mobs dieing slower.

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Originally Posted by DaikiKiyoshi

I don't think it's that they are mentally challenged for other roles per say. It's just that the ones playing tanks and healers are way more noticeable. The party being dead (which is what you get with bad tank/heals) is a whole lot more likely to get someones attention than mobs dieing slower.

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I have runs where the tank does all the right things, healer does the right things, but the damages just can't kill the things before tank runs out of CDs and healer runs out of mana. On a pull that is not impossible or even awfully hard. Whose fault is it then that there is a wipe? Surely it's not the dps's who coudln't figure out how to use their skills in even remotely feasible fashion. I've had runs where me and the tank combined do more damage than the dps players together. Problem is, in aforementioned case, the dps players moan that the tank just pulled too much so the healer couldn't keep up. Conveniently passing any possible blame from their own less than splendid performance.

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Originally Posted by Atlaworks

Give me a tank with a bunch of OGCDs and a skill speed of more than wading through mud, and we'll get along fine.

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They gave us that tank.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

I only like playing Tank personally. I don't think dps is fun to play not sure why so many people play it. When I was leveling my dps jobs to 60 I was like I wish I could be playing tank.

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I main DK/Pal and I can say that FFXIV had a very outdated approach for this role (relative long defensive CD).

This is like someone getting a college degree in something that isnt in high demand, then complaining when it takes a long time to find a job for their field or they have to move across the country when they would rather stay close to home.

I have no sympathy for dps and your queue times. I took 3 characters to 60(a whm, a ninja and a pld) and dealt with the wait for msq content i needed when on my ninja. Learn to play other roles. Too many dps never branch out and get out of their comfort zone and then want the game changed to cater them.

The game is fine the way it is.

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Originally Posted by DaikiKiyoshi

I don't think it's that they are mentally challenged for other roles per say. It's just that the ones playing tanks and healers are way more noticeable. The party being dead (which is what you get with bad tank/heals) is a whole lot more likely to get someones attention than mobs dieing slower.

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Key words "Per say" I think you mean "Per Se "... Tanking takes practice and most players now a days really get frustrated. As a Tank , secondary , there is a bit more of a challenge and is even more of a pain when people don't listen. Even when tanks ask politely some DPS don't like to help out by sticking to mechanics,or targets , and rather go their own way. Sad but true. If party wipes they either blame the healer or tank. If Tank over pulls it's their fault. If They don't over pull, it's their fault. So your right. They aren't mentally challenge...( Per Se = Per se is the phrase to use when you want to refer to a particular thing on its own. It is not this Latin phrase, per se, that is important, but rather the concept it represents.)